RW: Big Dumb Objects

[Joseph]

OK, obviously the Ringworld itself is the star of the show here. And I confess I've always had a weakness for Big Dumb Objects. If you want to see other possible examples of BDOs, you could do worse than to check out Niven's essay "Bigger Than Worlds" (reprinted in his collection Playgrounds of the Mind and probably other places as well). Some of them are relatively small (Rama-sized) and others make the Ringworld look like a Tinkertoy.

[Michele]

I really enjoyed John Varley's Titan/Wizard/Demon trilogy, a lot more than I'm liking Ringword. And Crichton's Sphere was good too.

[Joseph]

There was also Roger MacBride Allen's Hunted Earth series which began with The Ring of Charon. That one did have genuine Dyson spheres. Unfortunately it was abandoned after only two books and ended on something of a cliffhanger, if I recall correctly.

[Bill]

Michele wrote: "I really enjoyed John Varley's Titan/Wizard/Demon trilogy, a lot more than I'm liking Ringword. And Crichton's Sphere was good too."

I have fond memories of Titan/Wizard/Demon as well. I read both Ringworld and the Titan series long ago, and I confused the two stories because I was puzzled why there weren't....

* SPOILER FOR TITAN/WIZARD/DEMON *

... lesbian Twins/Clones in Nessus' crew. (If I'm remembering correctly in the Titan novels.)

[Bill]

Speaking of Dyson spheres, I recently read the sample portion of the ebook Pandora's Star by Peter F. Hamilton and plan to buy and finish it after I finish Ringworld and House of Suns

And BTW, Reynolds' Pushing Ice is probably my favorite "Big Dumb Object" book.

[Joseph]

I need to read more Reynolds. The only one I've read is House of Suns, which I really enjoyed.

[Mark]

Bowl of Heaven is a nice half of a novel covering a BDO

[David Sven]

Bill wrote: "Speaking of Dyson spheres, I recently read the sample portion of the ebook Pandora's Star by Peter F. Hamilton and plan to buy and finish it after I finish Ringworld and House of Suns

And BTW, Rey..."

I loved Pandora's Star. Though Hamilton is a bit like Reynolds if he was infected with melding plague. Story arcs going in all directions. Grotesque but cool.

[Bill]

David Sven wrote: "infected with melding plague..."

Exactly! Love it!

To by honest, I read the first 1.5 books of Hamilton's Night's Dawn Books. And I loved how it started off, especially those...

* NIGHT'S DAWN SPOILERS *

...living, FTL ships. But I couldn't get into the Al Capone bit. Maybe because Al Capone made it just a bit too comedic. Could picture him like some stereotypical movie baddie, brandishing a tommy gun and chewing on a cigar saying "come and get me coppers..." Maybe if he had chosen a different, more subtle historical baddie, I would have continued with the series. Or a historical non-baddie that turned baddie because of trauma of death or the unique situation.

[Joseph]

Yeah, I did get through the entire Night's Dawn trilogy (well, all six volumes in US paperback) but I kept having weird moments of dissonance as we went from cutting edge hard SF to (view spoiler)[THE DEAD HAVE COME TO CLAIM THE LIVING!!!!! (hide spoiler)].

[Paul]

Joseph wrote: "I need to read more Reynolds. The only one I've read is House of Suns, which I really enjoyed."

I'd definitely recommend his Revelation Space books. They are excellent.

[Scott]

I loved Robert Reed's Marrow and Greg Bear's The Way series (Eon, Eternity, Legacy) They both feature some really mind-blowing BDO's.

[Ben]

Paul 'Pezski' wrote: "Joseph wrote: "I need to read more Reynolds. The only one I've read is House of Suns, which I really enjoyed."

I'd definitely recommend his Revelation Space books. They are excellent."

Absolutely, I love just about every Reynolds I've read but the Revelation Space novels are standouts.

[Nic]

I loved Iain M. Banks' Shellworld from Matter, his Orbitals (or Ringworlds) are similarly impressive too

[Neil]

Pandora Star is a much better book. I could not put it down.

[Matthew]

Would you consider the network (Otherland) in City of Golden Shadow a big dumb object?

[Joseph]

Matthew wrote: "Would you consider the network (Otherland) in City of Golden Shadow a big dumb object?"

I'm kind of leaning in the direction of no -- the network itself is certainly impressive, but a true BDO, I think, has to be some kind of independent physical structure.

(Now if you took all of the computers and cables from used by the network, ripped them off of the planet's surface and used them to create a hollow, planet-sized mesh, then that would qualify ...)

[Alan]

To be a BDO book, does the object in question have to be of non-human origin? That is, does it have to be a book at least in part about exploring this previously unknown object?

If it includes man-made contraptions, the Fullerene bubble that is the setting for
Sun of Suns and its sequels is the most recent BDO with which I've fallen in love.

[Joseph]

Alan wrote: "To be a BDO book, does the object in question have to be of non-human origin? That is, does it have to be a book at least in part about exploring this previously unknown object?

If it includes man..."

I'd say it can be man-made. At its purest I think the definition involves some kind of unknown origin (you may know the race of the builders but they're not around any more), but I think the definition has broadened over the years (and it may be that these days the preferred term is "megastructure").

So would the Death Star count?

[Ric]

There's a listopia on Big Dumb Objects found here:
http://www.goodreads.com/list/show/37...
So far Leviathan Wakes is on the top.

[Rick]

Ric wrote: "There's a listopia on Big Dumb Objects found here:
http://www.goodreads.com/list/show/37...
So far Leviathan Wakes is on the top."
Mostly because it's the most recent. People have notoriously short spans of what they know (this isn't just SF or even books. Sports fans are like this too).

I love that two of Varley's Titan Books are on there and the last in the series is higher ranked than the first. :)

[Trike]

I never finished the Gaea trilogy even though I'm a fan of Varley.

I don't know if it counts, but Jack Chalker's Well World series might be a Big Smart Object, since the Well World is essentially a giant planet-sized computer.

What about something like The Chronoliths by Robert Charles Wilson? The chronoliths are probably man-made, although I don't recall if their origin was ever explained. But they're essentially large mysterious towers that suddenly appear from the future. Is there enough aggregate mega for them to be a megastructure?

[Trike]

Oh, and Halo, of course. Both games and novels. Similarly, the Citadel from Mass Effect.

Pohl and Williamson's Wall Around a Star has a Dyson sphere that people on the outside of.

Ah, I found one I recalled but couldn't quite name: Sun of Suns by Karl Schroeder is the first book in the Virga series that takes place inside a "small" Dyson sphere about the size of the Moon.

[Rick]

If you want Big Smart Objects, Schroeder has another book you should read, Ventus. Outstanding book.

[Trike]

I've read that one. I enjoyed it.

[AndrewP]

I added Eon by Greg Bear to the list as it was an obvious omission (at least to me).

[Ric]

AndrewP wrote: "I added Eon by Greg Bear to the list as it was an obvious omission (at least to me)."
Good addition. I enjoyed that book.