The Rory Gilmore Book Club discussion
Music, Movies, & Miscellany
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Heath Ledger found dead


My heart is broken.
Kat's "10 Things I Hate About You"
"I hate the way you talk to me, and the way you cut your hair.
I hate the way you drive my car.
I hate it when you stare.
I hate your big dumb combat boots, and the way you read my mind.
I hate you so much it makes me sick; it even makes me rhyme.
I hate the way you're always right.
I hate it when you lie.
I hate it when you make me laugh, even worse when you make me cry.
I hate it when you're not around, and the fact that you didn't call.
But mostly I hate the way I don't hate you.
Not even close, not even a little bit, not even at all."
Kat's "10 Things I Hate About You"
"I hate the way you talk to me, and the way you cut your hair.
I hate the way you drive my car.
I hate it when you stare.
I hate your big dumb combat boots, and the way you read my mind.
I hate you so much it makes me sick; it even makes me rhyme.
I hate the way you're always right.
I hate it when you lie.
I hate it when you make me laugh, even worse when you make me cry.
I hate it when you're not around, and the fact that you didn't call.
But mostly I hate the way I don't hate you.
Not even close, not even a little bit, not even at all."

And Alison, that movie is what made me first fall in love with him. I love the quote.
How horribly, horribly sad.

It appears that the pills were sleeping pills and it is told that he took Ambien to help him sleep, but had publicly claimed that it only helped him for an hour at a time. While he did seem depressed due to the breakup of his relationship last year with Michelle Williams, and was known to be turning down roles recently, it seems that this could have been an accident.
People who go long term with sleep deprivation have been known to do things that aren't the wisest and it seems that he could have in a sleep deprived and frustrated cloud, just taken way too many pills with nothing more than the intent to sleep for more than an hour or two at a time. There have been cases of people whose judgement was skewed because of pain or sleep loss to do things that lead to their death, so while technically a suicided, death by their own hand, they may likely have not intended that to be the result, only the lessening of their symptoms!
As a survivor of suicide and a family member of substance abusers, I hesitate to jump to the conclusion to label anyone an OD or a suicide because this can be tremendously hurtful to the loved ones left behind.

Yeah he was found dead in a Budget Motel room with drug stuff. He apparently had gained a ton of weight (I think they said 260 pounds?). They mentioned that he taught skating to kids but that he had to rent his skates because he admitted that his had been stolen. The comparison to Will Ferrell in Blades of Glory had been made. Only I guess he wasn't bitter. It was just really really sad.


Is it horrible that I often think that when someone famous dies, that while horrible for the family, they are luckier than some of us who lose our NONfamous loved ones because they can always have the movies, cds, etc of their loved ones to keep? The saddest part of when I lost my brother is that I can't hear his voice anymore...Heath's family and friends can always see something that will show him with that twinkle in his eye, or that special grin or whatever.
I know that wouldn't be a consolation to them now, but one day I hope that they are able to appreciate that.


ETA: What I meant when I said it was during filming was that I believed he'd said this a while ago, and was not directly related to his death as far as I knew. But, like Dee said, the rumors are going and people are taking that quote out of context and inferring that he was so tormented by the role that it killed him.

It takes the body almost three days to die from an Ambien overdose. It's HIGHLY unlikely that's what caused his death. Not to mention the fact that the police stated they found him face down, stark naked, on his floor. That's pretty much near impossible for the human body to react that way from an Ambien or sleep medication overdose.
They found prescription medication in his apartment, yes, but it was not scattered all over the floor, it was not even NEAR the body, it was just IN his apartment.
A lot of you guys are basing your opinions off of stories from gossip sites. As of right now, the coroners official report is that it's inconclusive and it will take up to ten days for the full autopsy and work up. However, in most autopsies, one of the first things done is a tox screening (to check toxins in the system, drugs both prescription and otherwise), the fact that they haven't mentioned anything related to prescription medication or non prescription drugs means that most likely, it wasn't just ONE contributing factor.
Also, he was on intensely strong antibiotics due to a really bad bout of pnemounia. Anitbiotics are one of the prescription meds found in his home, it wasn't like he had bottles of Ambien all over the place.
I think the amount of gossip and wrong information going on about this, as well as peoples ridiculous comments (like Jack Nicholsons insensitive asshole remark) just fuel more fire and are completely disrespectful to not only his daughter, but his entire family.
Until anything is made official, the rumors will continue to fly but please keep in mind it's JUST that, RUMORS.
*jumps off soapbox*


I know that it is bad enough when someone we know personally dies, we jump to conclusions and make assumptions that we have no place making. I had a former coworker die this summer, and the way he was found everyone assumed that he had od'd when in fact it had nothing to do with drugs, he had simply and unfortunately had a heart attack.
I was personally bothered by all the reports coming out commenting on drugs and depression and so on and so forth. But here in this room I think mostly everyone was just expressing their dismay without a bunch of judgement. You are right about the respect to the family and loved ones, I think I mentioned that in an earlier post.
By the way, hadn't heard that about the antibiotics or the pneumonia, but I did just read that he was not in fact found on the floor, that he was found in bed, but moved onto the floor by paramedics.

Maybe it's cheesy to eulogize a movie star I never met, and wasn't even obsessed with or anything, but that one performance affected me so deeply that I want to write a goodbye somewhere, and here is as good a place as any. I guess the only way to look at such a death -- his or any other that seems so unfair, a life that seems to have been cut so short-- is simply to trust that his lessons here were done and it was time for him to move on. The best way to honor his memory is to try to hear what he was saying and carry the message of love that he was sharing. He gave an awful lot with that particular sweet and tortured performance in one powerful movie, and that's what he'll be remembered for.
Goodbye Heath Ledger.
*End of Cheesy but Sincere Eulogy*
What a great loss. My husband has been very excited about his upcoming role in the Batman movie. For some reason I'm having the same feelings as I did from the death of Brandon Lee from the Crow, I can't particularly say why there just appears to be a similar tragic connection. I hope that his family and friends will find some kind of peace.
Awwww. I'm tearing up, and I'm not kidding.
I have pretty much tuned out any of the press on this, outside of initially signing on to Yahoo yesterday morning and doing that thing you do...where you're just staring at the headline, and you're thinking, "Am I reading this right?" Just that shock and disbelief.
To me, the hows and the whys are not as important as, like said above, honoring the life that was, and Dear God, for once let's try to learn from these tragic mistakes. We have no idea what happened that day, but let's please be careful in taking medications. Even a simple combination of one or two can be lethal, especially when combined with alcohol...as few as one or two drinks. Let's be careful with the chemicals we put in our body (avoiding any that aren't necessary)..follow instructions and never make assumptions regarding safety. And the rule "if one is good, two are better" does not apply to most, if any drugs. As I said, I have no idea what was going on in regard to his mental state and have no desire to guess or pass judgement, but, let's just try our best to be good to our bodies.
I can't get this song out of my head all day..."You're just too good to be true. Can't keep my eyes off of you." (10 Things)
I have pretty much tuned out any of the press on this, outside of initially signing on to Yahoo yesterday morning and doing that thing you do...where you're just staring at the headline, and you're thinking, "Am I reading this right?" Just that shock and disbelief.
To me, the hows and the whys are not as important as, like said above, honoring the life that was, and Dear God, for once let's try to learn from these tragic mistakes. We have no idea what happened that day, but let's please be careful in taking medications. Even a simple combination of one or two can be lethal, especially when combined with alcohol...as few as one or two drinks. Let's be careful with the chemicals we put in our body (avoiding any that aren't necessary)..follow instructions and never make assumptions regarding safety. And the rule "if one is good, two are better" does not apply to most, if any drugs. As I said, I have no idea what was going on in regard to his mental state and have no desire to guess or pass judgement, but, let's just try our best to be good to our bodies.
I can't get this song out of my head all day..."You're just too good to be true. Can't keep my eyes off of you." (10 Things)

I really need to pick up The Bros Grimm sometime - wasn't critically acclaimed or anything, but I liked it. Heath also did well in Ned Kelly and The Four Feathers I thought. I still need to watch Monster's Ball.
what better tribute than a movie night, eh?




Someone mad a remark about Jack Nicholson making a comment that was not good -- could someone clarify either here or in a message? I love nicholson inspite of himself and yet would like to know what it was he'd said about Ledger's death.

Jack was notoriously angry about not being asked to reprise his role as the Joker. I guess he didn't get the memo that this is a YOUNGER version of the story.
Dottie, I have not read the story. We just all felt that when they first got together in the tent it felt more prison-sex-like than romantic. There was no build up of them falling in love. Just one day Heath's character was cold, went into the tent, and suddenly they're having violent and completely unromantic sex. It seemed like it was more about being cold and isolated than about being in love. I never got the "in love" vibe until the very end, in the scene with the shirt (won't say any more so I don't give it away for those who haven't seen it).
My gay friends remarked that this film was hardly "groundbreaking" as far as representing gay relationships. They pointed out several films they preferred, but the only one I can think of right now was Jeffrey.

Thanks -- for the quick response -- just Jack shooting himself in the foot again -- sigh.

He had come a long way, both literally and figuratively, from his birthplace of Perth in Western Australia. His middle-class parents - his mother a French teacher and father a racing-car driver and mining engineer - somewhat perversely, named him and his sister after Emily Brontë's tragic lovers in Wuthering Heights, Heathcliff and Catherine. He soon shortened it.

MSN did a really nice tribute to him. They brought up a movie that I would have to concur was much more poignant than say Brokeback Mountain. He played Skip in Lords of Dogtown (a skate boarding movie based on a true story). His final scene is a tribute to his talent as a performer.
It's interesting thinking back on all the movies I've seen him in. He sort of made himself out as this moody, stoic sort of guy. But when he smiled, man, could he light up a room! I think that's when I started my Heath crush, in 10 Things when he's smiling at Kat. It's this sincere smile tinged with a little bit of mischief.
Here's the article if you care to read:
http://movies.msn.com/movies/article....


That makes sense to me, too...he "warned him" about what a taxing role the Joker would be. If you watch The Dark Knight trailer, he does come off as evil incarnate (as he was supposed to).
I love him so much more now that I know he was named after my beloved Heathcliff!
Story alert: One day I was at work (I work in a hospital), and it was a Saturday, and very slow...just me, and the nursing assistant, and one patient, and I saw where 10 things was coming on TV, and I begged the nursing assistant to go in a room and watch it. I told her I would do her work and mine for two hours if she'd go see it (she never had). I KNOW it's a high school movie, but for anyone out there who doesn't know, it's a re-telling of The Taming of the Shrew, and it's very WORDY (much like our own beloved "Girls") and smart, and so, so romantic. And it made Julia Stiles & Heath stars, although Heath tried to veer away from such roles in the future. If anyone hasn't seen it, I highly recommend it.
I read Brokeback, but haven't seen it. It was one of those movies that sat on our kitchen counter for like a week, running up Blockbuster fees unwatched (because of time constraints) so that when I finally returned it, I could have bought it for what I paid to rent it. And that always leaves a bad taste in my mouth. But eventually I'll catch it on TV and TIVO it. I feel like I've seen it...there were so many spoilers around that Oscar season. If anyone's interested in the short story (or novella)...it's very short and could be read in a sitting.
And Heather, I didn't think your post was flippant. What better way to honor an actor's death than through his art? I'm sure that's the way he'd like it.
I love him so much more now that I know he was named after my beloved Heathcliff!
Story alert: One day I was at work (I work in a hospital), and it was a Saturday, and very slow...just me, and the nursing assistant, and one patient, and I saw where 10 things was coming on TV, and I begged the nursing assistant to go in a room and watch it. I told her I would do her work and mine for two hours if she'd go see it (she never had). I KNOW it's a high school movie, but for anyone out there who doesn't know, it's a re-telling of The Taming of the Shrew, and it's very WORDY (much like our own beloved "Girls") and smart, and so, so romantic. And it made Julia Stiles & Heath stars, although Heath tried to veer away from such roles in the future. If anyone hasn't seen it, I highly recommend it.
I read Brokeback, but haven't seen it. It was one of those movies that sat on our kitchen counter for like a week, running up Blockbuster fees unwatched (because of time constraints) so that when I finally returned it, I could have bought it for what I paid to rent it. And that always leaves a bad taste in my mouth. But eventually I'll catch it on TV and TIVO it. I feel like I've seen it...there were so many spoilers around that Oscar season. If anyone's interested in the short story (or novella)...it's very short and could be read in a sitting.
And Heather, I didn't think your post was flippant. What better way to honor an actor's death than through his art? I'm sure that's the way he'd like it.

"I warned him," Nicholson said, then added: "I told him so."
Later, at the film's premiere, Nicholson said: "I took Ambien once. I fell asleep and then got a call and almost drove off a cliff 50 yards from my house."
http://www.theage.com.au/news/nationa...


What's really weird (for me anyway) is that I think I'll always remember when I heard that he had died. The only other celebrity that I can say that about is Princess Di's death.



It’s interesting that no one has mentioned The Patriot. I don’t know why, but that is the first role I thought of… that and 10 Things.
Sarah, your "but why is it more sad because he had kids" post felt a tad harsh. I completely agree it's sad for his daughter to loose her father, but it is amazing how so much more grief seems to be outputted, it is expressed as somehow more sad, when the person has a child/children. I think it’s wonderful that he was able to enjoy fatherhood for even a time. What a blessing! Anyway, I wasn't going to bring it up until I saw your post.
I just think death is very sad and difficult for any family left behind… and sometimes more so for the friends because they don’t get the kind of support family does and may have been as close, or closer to the individual.
I completely agree with Erica when she said, “…I often think that when someone famous dies, that while horrible for the family, they are luckier than some of us who lose our NONfamous loved ones because they can always have the movies, cds, etc of their loved ones to keep...” I have to think that his daughter has something that other daughters who lost their father’s don’t… a way to see him at work after he died… to hear how he talked and looked and moved. That’s a heck of a lot.
This girl I used to hang out with in Italy used to tell stories about hanging out with Heath in London, and in every one he always sounded so truly kind as well as generous. So many actors that are met by the “average” person are condescending, rude, arrogant, or annoyed. I’ve met some that were tolerant, but often their self-importance shines. Because of my friend’s stories, I held Ledger in good regard. So for that reason I’m all the more sad.
Sarah, your "but why is it more sad because he had kids" post felt a tad harsh. I completely agree it's sad for his daughter to loose her father, but it is amazing how so much more grief seems to be outputted, it is expressed as somehow more sad, when the person has a child/children. I think it’s wonderful that he was able to enjoy fatherhood for even a time. What a blessing! Anyway, I wasn't going to bring it up until I saw your post.
I just think death is very sad and difficult for any family left behind… and sometimes more so for the friends because they don’t get the kind of support family does and may have been as close, or closer to the individual.
I completely agree with Erica when she said, “…I often think that when someone famous dies, that while horrible for the family, they are luckier than some of us who lose our NONfamous loved ones because they can always have the movies, cds, etc of their loved ones to keep...” I have to think that his daughter has something that other daughters who lost their father’s don’t… a way to see him at work after he died… to hear how he talked and looked and moved. That’s a heck of a lot.
This girl I used to hang out with in Italy used to tell stories about hanging out with Heath in London, and in every one he always sounded so truly kind as well as generous. So many actors that are met by the “average” person are condescending, rude, arrogant, or annoyed. I’ve met some that were tolerant, but often their self-importance shines. Because of my friend’s stories, I held Ledger in good regard. So for that reason I’m all the more sad.
So sad how drugs ruin lives.
ETA: They don't know what the drugs were, just that prescription pills were found near the body. They don't know yet if it was abuse or an accident.