And Then There Were None by Agatha Christie (Once Upon a Crime)

[Rachel, First Lady]

A new month, a new book, a new discussion. I'm very happy to see that lots of people are excited to read this book, so please discuss ahead!

Remember, hide your spoilers, kay guys?

I'll be starting this book soon, right after I finish Towers of Midnight. Hope to see lots of posts by the time I start reading And Then There Were None! :)

Happy reading you awesome people, you!

[Reza, The Curator]

How to hide your spoilers? I'll make it easy for you.
Just copy and paste this line in your comment:
<spoiler>Spoiler goes here</spoiler>

[Lynossa, Resident Connoisseur]

Goody! These are what I want to discuss:
1. What do you think about the plot?
2. Were you able to guess the culprit before the truth was revealed?
3. The original title of this book was Ten Little Niggers, based on British nursery rhyme before it was changed into what we know today due to racist term. The nursery rhyme itself was changed into Ten Little Indians. What do you think about this?

Let the discussion begins!

[Oon]

Lynossa wrote: "Goody! These are what I want to discuss:
1. What do you think about the plot?
2. Were you able to guess the culprit before the truth was revealed?
3. The original title of this book was Ten Little ..."

1. As an impressionable young man when I was reading this, the plot is superb! Having bored with Trio Detektif, STOP and Lima Sekawan, I decided to venture into a more mature detective story: Sherlock Holmes, Hercule Poirot and, of course, Detektif Conan. And then there was: "Sepuluh Anak Negro" with an intriguing, mildly spooky cover . Awesome!

Some of her novels tend to be boring and lack of some thrills/plot twist/ingenuous crime method/dramatic motives that make crime fiction enjoyable and page turning, but this one have all of that. Another masterpiece of hers is, of course, Murder on the Orient Express

2. As an impressionable young man when I was reading this, of course not.

3. I read the Indonesian version and at that time I didn't aware that Nigger or Negro (pardon) is a taboo word. But now, it's perfectly sensible, to prevent controversy and silly lawsuit, to change the title.

[Coqueline]

Lynossa wrote: "Goody! These are what I want to discuss:
1. What do you think about the plot?
2. Were you able to guess the culprit before the truth was revealed?
3. The original title of this book was Ten Little ..."

1. I love the classic locked room mystery, but the ending didn't really surprise me. I didn't really like how the last death was put into place, though. It's too easy.
2. While I guessed how the actual killer disguised oneself, I have to admit I failed to guess who the person was until the end.
3. The edition I read used 'Ten Little Soldiers' in the nursery rhyme (and Soldier Island as the name of the island). I have nothing against the original title, I don't think Christie was a racist, they were just not as politically correct as we are now (while it does mean Europeans of that time held more racist point of view as natural). I do understand why it was changed, and the change didn't remove anything from the essence of the book, so I'm fine with that as well.

Overall, good selection for the Club Read!

[Tomoe]

I actually finished this book in one sitting yesterday! It's a very light, easy and fun read (I think so anyway). Believe it or not, it is also the only Agatha Christie book I've read so far, so maybe I'm a bit more lenient to the plot than usual.

Lynossa wrote: "Goody! These are what I want to discuss:
1. What do you think about the plot?
2. Were you able to guess the culprit before the truth was revealed?
3. The original title of this book was Ten Little ..."

1) To be honest, I think it uses rather common tropes (view spoiler)[(locked rooms, wolf hiding among the sheep, etc) (hide spoiler)], but I still liked the way it kept me guessing on how the tricks and murders were accomplished.

2) Yes, I knew who the murderer was - even though I didn't know how they were doing it. If you think about it from a psychological perspective; motive-wise, personality-wise etc, it is fairly obvious who the strong candidate is.
Knowing who the "bad guy" is didn't make my reading experience any less fun, though, because as I said, I still kept guessing on how they were doing it, how (or if?) they were planning to get away, etc.

3) I was going to write up a review when I saw that on the goodread's book page. It kind of shocked me... I don't know what to think of it, really. I don't think Christie meant anything by it, though. People in those days used to use the word casually; not just to insult the race, but also just to refer to them in a neutral way.

[Lynossa, Resident Connoisseur]

Well, to be fair, Agatha Christie made it based on nursery rhyme and I think at that time, the n-word wasn't considered as derogatory.
However, I was surprised no one noticed it, the rhyme was changed from Ten Little Niggers to Ten Little Indians because of racism. Niggers, Indians, racism?

[Vera]

Hi, All!

The book is amazing! Well, for me among Agatha Christie's books I've read, this one is the best.

1. I like the way the author told the story, it kept me guessing that 'how to' and who's next.

2. I had no idea how the killer did it and also felt curious and nervous at the same time.

3. I didn't noticed it, I read the Indonesian version, but I don't think Agatha Christie meant anything related with racism.

[shanghao]

I was still in secondary school when I read this; it probably counted as one of my first Christie experiences (since I read this as one part of an Agatha Christie omnibus).

It really impressed me as well, I didn't expect it to end the way it did, (view spoiler)[with no survivors (hide spoiler)]..at that age I was expecting the normal detective hero!

Anyway, what I liked best was the visual imagery of each murder and how with every kill the subsequent punishment gets worse for the remaining people psychologically speaking.

I did guess who the culprit was but obviously I didn't have a clue how he/she pulled it off, so I stopped guessing when said character (view spoiler)[gets 'killed' (hide spoiler)]

Also, interesting that some motifs were repeated in other Christie novels: about gathering 'untouchable criminals' (Cards on the Table) and also playing persecutor and the implied justifications and ramifications (Curtain: Poirot's Last Case).

Coincidentally this work was mentioned in a mystery novel I'm currently reading which discusses murders based on rhymes or folk songs. It got me to check out the movie version of the other similar work mentioned.

Edit: Realised book title additions don't work when typed on a mobile. Have amended them.

[Rani Trisna]

And Then There Were None is definitely on my next-read list, as currently I'm still reading The Mysterious Affair at Styles :D

[Ellen]

I read this book probably 2 years ago. I don't remember much about the details but I remember that I kept trying to guess who the murderer was along with the stories. I kept guessing it wrong though. I was never a fan of crime story but this one got into me quite well. I was amazed by how Agatha Christie put the whole story together. Sure it's not easy at all, the more when it involves many characters with such tangled issues among them.

I found the plot itself was original and very interesting. I also acknowledged that this was Agatha Chirstie's bestselling book, so I am surely not the only one who enjoyed this book.

I read the Indonesian version, still with the title "Sepuluh Anak Negro". This title could be seen as offensive to many people but I think it was never an intention of the writer to offend anyone. That's why she changed the title to "And Then There Were None".

[Hayatun]

I also read this book, the translated one, when I was in secondary school. But due to our group read, I started reading the English version and even though I still remember who the culprit was it still gave me the same thrill!

I think the plot is very original and interesting, might be biased though because I love Agatha Christie and this was in fact, the first crime novel I read. And No, I was not able to guess who the culprit was at first. That's the beautiful thing about this book, it keeps you guessing and guessing. I didn't expect the ending at all! Like, who would have thought? I really like the end of this book.

I didn't know that it was originally titled Ten Little Niggers. But I bet Christie didn't know that it is a racist term. I'm fine with it. I think the title "And Then There Were None" suits the story better though.

[Rachel, First Lady]

So I finished this book a few days ago. I enjoyed it more than I thought I would. I felt crept out. And that's good.

1. I thought the plot was refreshing. When scary things are paired with childhood rhymes and myths, I think it gets all the more scarier? And I felt scared. My imagination tends to run wild and run wild it did.

2. No, I wasn't able to guess who the culprit was. I didn't really try though, I was just enjoying the ride to be honest. Although at the end when people were going through the evidence, when they mentioned that (view spoiler)[Walgrave was actually in the right (hide spoiler)], I knew. But that was already at the end, so I don't count that as guessing it correctly.

3. I also didn't know that it was originally titled Ten Little Niggers. And I agree with everyone, I don't think Christie purposely meant to be offensive. So that's that.

And I'm with Coqueline. I didn't really like how the last death was put into place. Yes, it was too easy. I think at that point it could have gone many different ways instead of that particular outcome. But overall, I thought the book was pretty amazing. I never would have picked out this book to read on my own and I am glad that this was our group read for April!

[Namida]

waow...everybody already read that book. i think i'll start soon after i finish The Book Thief.

[Lynossa, Resident Connoisseur]

Rachel, you should read her other books. My favorites (beside this one) are books with Poirot as the detective like Cards on the Table, Sad Cypress (you might like this one, there's a bit of romance in it), Orient Express of course (another masterpiece), ABC Murders, Death on the Nile.

I read somewhere that it was Christie who first wrote this style of mystery (view spoiler)[a group of people trapped in one place and one by one died and one of them is the culprit (hide spoiler)].

About the last murder, I agree with you guys, it was a bit weird, but to be fair, the murder admitted that it was a gamble. I wonder what the culprit would do if that failed...

[Rani Trisna]

I just finished this book and wow, what a suspense! Until now I am still amazed at how the murderer played with other people psychologic vulnerability and never missed with each of his experiment.

[shanghao]

Yay I'm so happy others are getting to know Christie.

Lynossa, I love the ones with Poirot best too! He's even funnier with Mrs Oliver.

[Lynossa, Resident Connoisseur]

The combination of Poirot and Mrs Oliver is awesome! Apparently Christie made Mrs Oliver based on herself. Mrs. Oliver's constant complains about her character, the Finland detective was actually based on her annoyance on Poirot (mostly on.how people kept sending her letter that Belgian didn't act the way Poirot acted, lol)

[Namida]

Just finished the book. Hm, i think the plot quite good. 10 strangers lock in the island and have nowhere to run. I like the suspense.
There're much twist in the story. . No wonder Agatha Christie known as the queen of mystery.

And the murderer is really a psycho! With all the arrangement and the research to find the victims..What an effort to do such thing.

[Alexandra]

Lynossa wrote: "Goody! These are what I want to discuss:
1. What do you think about the plot?
2. Were you able to guess the culprit before the truth was revealed?
3. The original title of this book was Ten Little ..."

Although I've read a lot of detective and mystery books, this is the first time I've read a book by Agatha Christie and I must say my mind was blown! No wonder she's one of the best selling author in history.

1. Like someone has said above, when mystery story combined with children rhymes, it gets totally creepy and awesome. I love how Christie made use of psychological state of each character and stayed consistent with the rhyme.

2. No, I wasn't able to guess who the culprit was. Though it was pretty obvious that the culprit was disguised as one of the 'victims'.

3. Eh, I don't think Christie meant anything derogatory or racist with that title. Any word could be considered derogatory according to the usage. Though I could totally understand why she changed the rhyme and title of the book because some people could be offended by this.

With that said, I can't wait to read more of Christie's bestseller books :D

[Dini]

Back in high school I found a stash of secondhand English books and magazines in my school library. Catcher in the Rye was among them, as well as lots of old editions of Reader's Digest, but most of the books were Agatha Christie mysteries.

I've already forgotten most of the details in the books but And Then There Were None stood out because of the lingering feeling I had when I read it. I was majorly creeped out. I was also an impressionable young woman back then and I couldn't guess the culprit at all, or how he/she committed the crime. When everybody died in the end, I was like... what?? How??

This is Christie's freestanding book that I enjoy the most. I like Poirot and Miss Marple books too, but I like it best when Poirot is with his impressionable friend Captain Hastings. I think the contrast between the shrewd Poirot and the often clueless Hastings is awesome. "The little grey cells, my dear Hastings!"

I will always regard Christie's books fondly as some of the books which helped me improve my English immensely. Those were good times.

[Femmy]

Finally, I have a chance to participate in a group read! I've read many Agatha Christie's books in translation when I was in junior high, but I never did read this one and I'm glad I got to read it at last.

I must say that I love the plot! I love that the murders follow the nursery rhyme closely. I keep guessing how the murderer would carry them out.

I think I've seen a movie with a plot similar to this one and also has the culprit (view spoiler)[working with a doctor to confirm his death to other people (hide spoiler)] so he/she must be the one with (view spoiler)[easily faked wounds (hide spoiler)]. Kind of ruined the suspense for me, but I still enjoy how the tension is developed with each murder.

[Amina]

Lynossa wrote: "Goody! These are what I want to discuss:
1. What do you think about the plot?
2. Were you able to guess the culprit before the truth was revealed?
3. The original title of this book was Ten Little ..."

1. Love the plot. Love the thrills. The one Agatha Christie book i finished reading in one night. My favorite, actually. Read it in junior high. Love every details and twists in this book. Love every tricks described.

2. No, I was not. I was so caught up in the plot, didn't really think about figuring out who the culprit was myself. In fact, i love the curiosity it brought in every turn. Each time i thought i could figure it out, i was wrong, and each time, i enjoyed being wrong, haha.. Amazing book!

3. I prefer the "Ten Little Niger" phrase. There's something original about it that i like. Never really thought it was racism at the first place.

[Sepsun Pasaribu]

Oon wrote: "Lynossa wrote: "Goody! These are what I want to discuss:
1. What do you think about the plot?
2. Were you able to guess the culprit before the truth was revealed?
3. The original title of this book..."

First, I want to say sorry because I was the one who suggested this book but haven't comment on this thread until now xD .

Second, I am sorry also for thinking that Conan Doyle's superior from Christie (I read and watch to many Sherlock and Detective Conan). This book make me want to read other Christie's novels.

1. What I think about the Plot? I think it is a great plot. Yes, this closed room murder, everyone is dying n the culprit is one of us kind of story have been used heavily. However, please remember that it was written in the 30's. It may be one of the pioneer for this kind of plot;

2. No. I just guess that there were probably more than one person who did it (either conspiring or got fooled);

3. I think the word Niger and Indian are racist. Especially if you think like this:

Niger/Indian = dark skin = dark = Evil

which is seem to symbolize all the ten evil people there. Although they are white but their heart is dark (I'm rambling hahahah)

One thing that I want to add, I really, really love the theme "Punishment for all sinners". (view spoiler)[As we know the judge is the culprit and as a judge he often give punishment to those who deserve it, however in the island, he is not in a court and therefor not authorize to give punishment. So when he murder those people one by one, even though they are guilty to a crime, he become one of them - a Murderer. In the end he commit suicide as a punishment to himself and his crime. Brilliant :D (hide spoiler)]

And that's all. I enjoy it a lot, Thank You :D

[Femmy]

Ah, finally there's something that we can discuss. Sepsun said that "(view spoiler)[In the end he commit suicide as a punishment to himself and his crime. (hide spoiler)]"

I disagree. I've already transferred my copy to my mom so I can't be sure, but I think it's mentioned in the epilogue that (view spoiler)[the culprit has a terminal disease. Maybe cancer or something like that. That's why he thought of arranging something like this, i.e. so that he would go with a bang, not in a pitiful deathbed somewhere.

Also, he doesn't think himself as a guilty murderer. He doesn't think he needs punishment. He kills himself because he only has a short time to live, and because he wants to confuse other people with this mystery.

I might be mistaken, though. Please CMIIW. What do you think? (hide spoiler)]

[Lynossa, Resident Connoisseur]

I agree with Femmy, (view spoiler)[in his letter he said that he had bloodlust and felt really excited whenever he killed something/someone, but he also had strong sense of justice (which combined together create God complex like Light Yagami in Death Note). That's why he became a judge. Toward the end he realized he was terminally ill and he had only few months before he died. The reason he did all those murders is because he wanted to do the final act; the best murder of all. He never felt guilty, imo. (hide spoiler)]