Vaginal Fantasy Book Club discussion
Mar 2013: Daughter Smoke & Bone
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Why Do You NOT Read YA?
I'm so glad for this thread. Since joining Goodreads and stumbling over it at every corner I thought a lot about what really defines this genre. I think I never read any YA novels except for Harry Potter and His Dark Materials. When I was an actual young adult I snobbishly thought I had to inhale as much world literature as possible and later on it was Fantasy and Sci-Fi to escape and short phases of excessive romance consumption. Never YA. Because I imagined it would be hard to identify with the problems of a 16 year old heroine maybe? But I just started Daughter of Smoke and Bone and it is beautifully written and the first paranormal romance that seems to really move me and I wondered where are the adult equivalents of it? I want them. Every adult PNR I have read so far was so much more silly or poorly written or offensive.
Looking through all the giveaways and first reads, it's just overloaded with YA. There's just so much of it out there that I'm burned out on it. Some YA is very well written and isn't always corny and immature. Some of it I get why it is popular, but it's so Mary Sue I end up hating all the characters. And it's not even that I don't want to read about young people. The Lovely Bones is about a young girl and it most certainly isn't YA. I still read Madeleine L'Engle books, and a lot of epic/high fantasy stories are about young characters, and those are great. But again, those aren't YA in that they aren't in that ... formula.
I don't think Vaginal Fantasy should be restricted to "sexy times"/romance. I think the tag is for books about strong female protagonists doing cool things. So I think the current pick works. I'm just not sure if I want to read it. I'll head to the UBS this weekend and if I find it, I'll do it, but I have about 500 other books to read in the meantime! :D
Tpring wrote: "I'm so glad for this thread. Since joining Goodreads and stumbling over it at every corner I thought a lot about what really defines this genre. I think I never read any YA novels except for Harry ..."haha I went through the "book snob" phase when I was in high school too lol. I think it was a defense mechanism because I was bullied so I was like "well you may be popular and pretty but I'm smarter than you so there".
I'm 25 now and I would still consider that a "young adult". I've only been out of school for 3 years, the majority of my life has been as a student, not a working adult. I think that's part of the reason why I like YA, because I still am one.
I really agree with what you said about DoSaB too. I think a lot of adult urban fantasy follows the same formula and is full of genre tropes. I think with YA authors are more willing to break the mold and try something new...largly because teens demand it.
I think teens aren't afraid to say when something sucks and they'll tell you when they're bored or if they think something is stupid.
This interview with Kami Garcia and Margaret Stohl (authors of Beautiful Creatures) talks about it and I think they make some great points.
Times Interview
I hadn't actually noticed, but I've pretty much stopped reading YA. I think it has to come highly recommended by adults before I'll give it a try. I like stories of kids discovering who they will be as adults - what place they will take in the world. Stories where they're growing into themselves. But I prefer romances where the protagonists already, on some level at least, know who they are. Plus as I get older (and I'm getting oooold), it gets harder to identify with anyone under, say, thirty at least.
First, I can go on for YEARS about books that I feel are incorrectly classified as YA. My YA days are long behind me. :) It is not the lack of sexy times - I actually prefer the closing the door and let the imagination do the rest variety. So, I can get on a very high horse and say that just because something does or does not contain sexy times does or does not classify it as YA.To *me*, what classifies something as YA, rather than a book that happens to involve young people, is the amount of teen angst. There is absolutely no other word to use (I know - I have tried!). But, the over the top drama . . . I just do not wish to relive those times. I do not, in any way, mind a story that happens to involve young people - especially if they grow up along the way.
As a matter of fact, I recently finished Beautiful Creatures and it pretty much defines what I do *not* like about YA. (And, their character, Marion, sums it up nicely, "Teenagers - everything is so apocalyptic.") To *me*, had that book been 100-200 pages shorter - with much less angst, it would have been much better. That being said, I am *not* the intended audience. I realize this. So, taken as is, I think it would more likely appeal to this for which it is intended.
But, to define something as YA, and therefore, by inference, unreadable simply because it does not contain sex or because the characters are in their late teens (which, btw, is NOT YA =D) causes us to miss out on some incredible stories.
I am not the target audience for this discussion thread because I actually read a lot of young adult books.However, I find that I sometimes have to defend my decision to read YA. When I tell a friend or a coworker that I read a lot of YA, I immediately get a look of "really?" and some eyebrow raising.
At 23, I think in some ways I qualify as the target audience for young adult (or more suited for this New Adult genre). Still, there is a prejudice against what is labeled as young adult. I agree with Sonja, there is a lot of mislabeling going on right now. I've read some YA lately that has me freaked out at the idea that its target audience is teenagers; with such adult content I wonder why it's labeled YA in the first place.
I think there is a perception that YA = poor writing, or writing that is made simpler for a less advanced reading audience. I think there is just as much "adult" books that are not written well to make that bad logic.
Additionally, just as with any genre, there are certain themes that are really prevalent that can get old depending on your tolerance. A lot of YA has teen angst, love triangles, cliffhangers, immature decisions, and sometimes a certain focus more on the action/plot than on character development. It can get old, and even someone who generally enjoys YA, I find myself annoyed by many books and have to take a break from the genre.
I think that the category has suffered from being named a category. I.e., there is a lot of fiction which is now classified as young adult now which wasn't written specifically to be young adult at the time. In many cases those books used to be considered adult, and in some cases for kids, and I think that the authors wrote to those much broader standards. A kid's book didn't have to have a more simplistic plot with relatively upbeat content and an adult book could be less dense and dark.So books like The Hobbit or A Wrinkle in Time are now shelved as YA books. But it's a completely arbitrary category which removes them from both the kids and "adult" sections of the library. For some books and authors I think that can constrain both the material and the audience. I also think that it diminishes the "adult" and kid sections of the library since the kid sections now get much less complicated plots and the "adult" sections get far less whimsy and room to not be as dark.
Also some authors now write specifically to this somewhat artifical age and content standard. If they aren't strong authors to begin with then I think that the quality suffers. When I browse through the YA section I can tell which authors are using the new category to give themselves leave to not be super "adult and dark", and consequently write a really good plot. And I can also tell which authors feel that YA is simply an opportunity to write scripts for the CW.
Philippa wrote: "I think that the category has suffered from being named a category. I.e., there is a lot of fiction which is now classified as young adult now which wasn't written specifically to be young adult a..."Completely agree.
Love triangles, cliffhangers, immature decisions (as mentioned by others), are the reason I, at times, run for the hills when I have to read a YA, but it doesn't bother me as much as the whiny and dumb protagonists... there is a limit to the stupidity that can be justified by youth.
I think part of the problem with me is that most YA books are about teenagers and I just can't relate to the main characters. In my experience (of course there are exceptions) YA stories are often coming of age stories and as Kamil said, love triangles, immaturity, etc. I like a nice bit of sex and violence in my books and YA just doesn't deliver. Everything seems so sugar coated. So for me, it's nothing against the genre, it's just personal preference. I know that I don't care for YA and I don't want to waste my time or money reading it.
Sonja wrote: "First, I can go on for YEARS about books that I feel are incorrectly classified as YA. My YA days are long behind me. :) It is not the lack of sexy times - I actually prefer the closing the door an..."So right Sonja. And I also greatly disliked Beautiful Creatures!
Since I work in a bookstore and am in charge of our childrens department, I tend to read quite a bit of YA, and while there is some real rubbish in there, there is also some pure gold reads aswell.
I think that if the author does it properly (just like how if normal fiction authors write well) you can be fully immersed in a fantastic story that can put you in the shoes of a strong and yet uncertain character who is growing before your eyes. Not every teenager girl was a vain, conceited eedjit who hated their parents, and so we should reasonably be able to find non angsty teen reads.
Personally I love YA, and I like to read them between my normal literary work picks, it's like giving my brain a chocolate bar when I've been dieting all week. At least, that's what I'm imaginging, as I've never dieted =/ I put them in the same category as what I call 'fiction fluff' like Marian Keyes; adult authors that require no exploration of worlds I haven't seen before, no inner thought processes or self reflection or grand epiphanies, or as happens a lot in literary fiction, no sitting there afterwards feeling despondent about humanity in general!
I've tried YA. It's not snooty or anything like you make it seem. I just don't like most of it. They're usually incredibly melodramatic, forced, with weird love triangles and immaturity that's supposed to come across as real.
Sonja and Kamil have nailed exactly why I really don't want to read YA. I've read a few books classified as YA that I like and I've read a lot more that I just don't. I loved Angelfall. I thought it was an amazingly well written book. So I have read a couple of YA novels I've liked but it's really rare.I do hope we don't choose more YA here. I belong to this group for a variety of reasons but the maturity of the subject matter is a big one. And by maturity, that doesn't have to mean sex, btw.
While my "young adult" days are definitely behind me, I can't say that I dislike YA as a whole, but I agree that I'm at a point in life where I can no longer relate to some of the pointless melodrama associated with adolescence. As mentioned above, teen angst, love triangles, and immature decisions are all things that I prefer to leave behind.However, regardless of the classification (heck, I'm currently reading a childrens' book!), if the book has a well-written plot, good world-building, and rich characters, I will be more than satisfied.
With regards to books selected by this book club, I mainly care that the female leads are strong, independent women, not necessarily perfect, but capable of learning and growing from their experiences in the story. To me, sexy-times are optional, and while sometimes fun, some of those encountered in a few of our books have been pretty cringe-worthy to me (Nina Bangs anyone?).
So whether it's marketed as "YA" or not, I'll read it and enjoy it if it meets my personal criteria for a "good book".
I agree with those stating that the melodrama days are far behind me, and o just don't want to read about that. I also don't really look back with any fondness on my own adolescence and teen years, so the last thing I want to do in my spare time is try and relive it. I would prefer more adult literature in this group, but I'm not against any book that is truly good in writing style and intelligence. I've enjoyed the poison study books, and they definitely seem more YA to me, but she's also struggling to become an adult and what that means for her, which is a mature theme IMO.
We can aggree with the fact we don't love YA plot tropes, but what if the story is an "adult romance" with a heroine that barelly stepped out of the YA age and is becoming who she was ment to be ?
I'd say that my reading is a blend of "Adult" books and "YA" books. I enjoy that blend because what I'm looking for is a good story, regardless of what labels have been applied to them. I often find quality writing, plot development & character building to be fantastic in the YA novels. My theory for a while now is that the YA author doesn't have sex to use as a crutch to carry the story. Because of that, it forces them to create actual emotion, actual depth within the story. Don't misunderstand, I like a good sexy time within the tale, but I don't have to have it to enjoy the book. Often the sexual tension works better in enhancing the story than several paragraphs describing the characters having sex.
I do find, as others have stated, that some of the YA books deal mainly with teen angst, contrived drama & a lot of whining. Those...I really don't enjoy.
When it's all said and done, I want to actually care about the characters. I want to have enjoyed following their journey, seeing their growth, & wishing them all the best in their fictional life. Rather than some characters who were so undeveloped that I couldn't care less if they had ended up impaled by a unicorn half way through.
I'm puzzled by some of the characterization of ya here. Is it more that people dislike ya romances, or ya in general? The Abhorsen series by Garth nix, the giver by Lois Lowry, the knife of never letting go, the seventh son series, these are some of my favorite books and I would be shocked to here any of these described as melodramatic. When people say they that they don't like ya because it's melodramatic, it makes me think they're not referring to ya, but perhaps ya romance? Is this accurate?
I'm picturing more books set in high schools where the protagonist is devastated to chip her nail polish, as opposed to Buffy, who's mildly annoyed that slaying a vampire caused her nail polish to chip. I don't actually read books that look like they might be like that, so I may be way off.
Anna wrote: "I'm puzzled by some of the characterization of ya here. Is it more that people dislike ya romances, or ya in general? The Abhorsen series by Garth nix, the giver by Lois Lowry, the knife of never l..."See - as I said earlier - it all comes down to your definition of YA. and YMMV. A book that merely contains a story of a person who may or may not be a YA is not necessarily YA. To me, the genre is identified by the inclusion of teenage melodrama.
Anna wrote: "I'm puzzled by some of the characterization of ya here. Is it more that people dislike ya romances, or ya in general? The Abhorsen series by Garth nix, the giver by Lois Lowry, the knife of never l..."The only one of those I've read is The Giver, but I would say it's melodramatic and just as tropey as YA romance. Dystopian books never really appealed to me after I read 1984.
My aversion to YA depends on the definition being used for YA. I have read books classified YA that I felt should have been otherwise and vice versa. For me, YA is any book that makes me feel like I am back to that painful emotionally immature stage. I reference Twilight a lot when having this particular discussion. While I enjoyed aspects of Twilight, the love from Bella's side at least felt very young and immature. Of course she was young and immature, so that is understandable. With so many books out there to read, I prefer to spend my time on books that appeal to me more when I read the blurb. This is one reason why I like this book club. I get to branch out into sub genres I would avoid on my own.
Sonja wrote: "First, I can go on for YEARS about books that I feel are incorrectly classified as YA. My YA days are long behind me. :) It is not the lack of sexy times - I actually prefer the closing the door an..."
The angst! It makes me want to bang my head against the wall. Too often it is the whiney girl with the "If he doesn't love me I will absolutely DIE!" attitude. Kills me.
The angst! It makes me want to bang my head against the wall. Too often it is the whiney girl with the "If he doesn't love me I will absolutely DIE!" attitude. Kills me.
Anna wrote: "I'm puzzled by some of the characterization of ya here. Is it more that people dislike ya romances, or ya in general? The Abhorsen series by Garth nix, the giver by Lois Lowry, the knife of never l..."
For me I would be referring to the ya romance as melodramatic. I read The Giver, which might be the second most depressing book I ever read.
For me I would be referring to the ya romance as melodramatic. I read The Giver, which might be the second most depressing book I ever read.
i am always afraid that YA will be full of unfulfilled angsty romance and a girl that cant decide who is she in love with, abusive dick or jealous dick.there are YA books that are good books without graphic sex, but it depends on labeling.
Martha wrote: "I'd say that my reading is a blend of "Adult" books and "YA" books. I enjoy that blend because what I'm looking for is a good story, regardless of what labels have been applied to them. I often find quality writing, plot development & character building to be fantastic in the YA novels. My theory for a while now is that the YA author doesn't have sex to use as a crutch to carry the story. Because of that, it forces them to create actual emotion, actual depth within the story. Don't misunderstand, I like a good sexy time within the tale, but I don't have to have it to enjoy the book. Often the sexual tension works better in enhancing the story than several paragraphs describing the characters having sex.
I do find, as others have stated, that some of the YA books deal mainly with teen angst, contrived drama & a lot of whining. Those...I really don't enjoy.
When it's all said and done, I want to actually care about the characters. I want to have enjoyed following their journey, seeing their growth, & wishing them all the best in their fictional life. Rather than some characters who were so undeveloped that I couldn't care less if they had ended up impaled by a unicorn half way through. "
I'm with you Martha! Every word!
Something I also appreciate about YA is that it often revolves around a person that discovers his or her first true love and doesn't really know how to handle it. The shy, insecure approach, the clumsiness - and later, the immense joy when the other person loves the character back, and the ability to embrace it.
I always loved a great romance. I still remember what it felt like when someone loved me back for the first time, and it is wonderful to read about how that happens to fictional characters.
I read YA, so I'm not sure that I'm qualified to answer the original question. I find much of it to be fairly bad - it's too simplistic and the characters are whiny and unlikeable (from my adult perspective).But then again, some of my favorite books are technically YA: Terry Pratchett's Tiffany Aching series, Harry Potter, and the Hunger Games series. If I refused to read YA, I'd have missed all of these.
Michelle wrote: "Philippa wrote: "I think that the category has suffered from being named a category. I.e., there is a lot of fiction which is now classified as young adult now which wasn't written specifically to..."Third-ed.
Some YA is amazing and I absolutely love it. (Boneshaker or anything else by Cherie Priest for example. Then again she didn't write it to be YA. She wrote it just as a steampunk novel and her publisher slapped a YA novel on it because the protagonist was young.)
I'm only 8 minutes into the audiobook of "Daughter of Smoke and Bone" and the lead character already used the words "mondayness" and "Januaryness". One reason not to read YA: You don't have to listen to bubbly, made up teen-speak the whole novel! I hope she doesn't talk like this the whole time.
Clayton wrote: "I'm only 8 minutes into the audiobook of "Daughter of Smoke and Bone" and the lead character already used the words "mondayness" and "Januaryness". One reason not to read YA: You don't have to list..."This made me wish Goodreads had a like button for comments, because I really have nothing to contribute here but completely agree. I hate when authors who don't know teens try to write like them. Like, totally.
Clayton wrote: "I'm only 8 minutes into the audiobook of "Daughter of Smoke and Bone" and the lead character already used the words "mondayness" and "Januaryness". One reason not to read YA: You don't have to list..."That always strikes me as Buffy-ish. When you reflect that when I was young the YA section was mostly Fear Street, Sweet Valley, Christopher Pike and LJ Smith, that makes current YA seem a lot better.
I am most definitely an adult and I certainly don't want to relive my high school/teen years (which is why I stayed away from watching Buffy for many years - fool that I am!), but I love a well-written story with characters with whom I can identify and care about. I read a lot of books that are considered YA, but most are fantasy where the main characters don't usually have time to be whiny!
I have the same issue with YA that has been previously stated many times above (Sonja & Kamil have expressed it quite well).Here is the deal, how many times do you try and dislike the cheesecake before you realize that maybe you would be better off ordering the pineapple upside down cake which is your favorite type of dessert, even though some restaurants get it wrong? (Ok, now I am hungry)
My point is that I KEEP trying to YA against my better judgement (mostly because it keeps getting picked for books clubs in which I participate). However, most of the time I feel myself being let down.
I have a HUGE want-to-read shelf. Authors keep writing high quality books that I want to read. I will never be able to read every book in which I have an interest. My time is a finite resource. I choose to spend it reading books that I suspect I will enjoy, rather than continuing to order the cheesecake.
***Disclaimer: No cheesecakes were harmed in the typing of this opinion. It is not the intent of the author to disparage actual cheesecake.***
Valerie wrote: "I have the same issue with YA that has been previously stated many times above (Sonja & Kamil have expressed it quite well).Here is the deal, how many times do you try and dislike the cheesecake ..."
now I want a cheesecake
Maybe we should start a thread on favourite cheesecakes :D(Sooo hungry right now...)
Clayton wrote: "I'm only 8 minutes into the audiobook of "Daughter of Smoke and Bone" and the lead character already used the words "mondayness" and "Januaryness". One reason not to read YA: You don't have to list...""Made up teen-speak" and other widely read lit is how our language as we know it grows and evolves. I'm not necessarily defending "mondayness" as a paragon of linguistic achievement, but even Shakespeare made up words off the top of his head to fit his purposes in writing.
Language is like Legos, some people have fun taking apart the pieces and turning them into new things. Some people prefer to curse when they step on a stray piece outside of the bucket.
The term YA makes me cringe a little. I tend to steer clear just because so many these days feature Twilight-esque love triangles (which I'm sick of) and aren't so well written. Of course, that's not all YA; I think we've listed some pretty good exceptions here. But in general, a lot of authors seem to be pandering to the idea of what they think young people want rather than focusing on building a really good story. I'll read anything that's well-written with a substantial plot and believable characters, regardless of what label it falls under.I remember really liking YA in high school because I felt that those stories treated my young emotions seriously. When you're that age, everything feels so intense. Just because something is melodramatic doesn't make the emotions less real for the people involved, and it's validating when a book treats you like a rational, intelligent individual rather than a naive child.
I think that the older we get, the harder it is to go back to that time of emotional vulnerability. Because we are very naive at that point, and that opens us up to a lot of hurt. I'm not overly fond of my teenage years, and it can be discomforting to relive them, even in fiction. But the best YA books don't feel YA. They feel timeless. So don't knock the whole genre because of a few (okay, a lot) of bad eggs.
Wow, that was a long comment. Too much? Oh well.
Molly wrote: "Wow, that was a long comment. Too much? Oh well."Not at all! But the YA genre contains Twilight. And yet Fifty Shades of Grey is considered adult. They're both not very well written, and Fifty Shades is thinly veiled Twilight fanfic. Classifying it as a "grown up" book isn't saying much. And there's more grown up fiction than YA fiction, which ups the chances of finding decent stuff in the mix.
Molly wrote: "The term YA makes me cringe a little. I tend to steer clear just because so many these days feature Twilight-esque love triangles (which I'm sick of) and aren't so well written. Of course, that's..."wow! That was a strawberry-shortcake kind of comment.
Kamil wrote: "Molly wrote: "The term YA makes me cringe a little. I tend to steer clear just because so many these days feature Twilight-esque love triangles (which I'm sick of) and aren't so well written. Of ..."Is there an ice cream cake kind of comment, because that's for me.
Lauren wrote: "Clayton wrote: "I'm only 8 minutes into the audiobook of "Daughter of Smoke and Bone" and the lead character already used the words "mondayness" and "Januaryness". One reason not to read YA: You do..."Somehow I don't think a lot of YA teenspeak is going to catch on, because most teens think it's stupid. Of my friends, four always read YA, and only one likes fake teenspeak, and only some of the time. I believe how Scott Westerfeld (?) writes it. Pretty sure that's it.
Anecdotal, but I think it sort of shows even the people who this is targeted at don't find it appealing.
Kathryn wrote: "Some YA is amazing and I absolutely love it. (Boneshaker or anything else by Cherie Priest for example. Then again she didn't write it to be YA. She wrote it just as a steampunk novel and her publisher slapped a YA novel on it because the protagonist was young.)"Coincidentally I finished Boneshaker last night just after listening to a recent Writing Excuses podcast where the YA label had been slapped onto one of the guest's books. I think this is a real problem of marketing and it's narrowing reading choices rather than being helpful.
I do feel there is something "YAish" about Boneshaker - maybe it's just the teenage POV character, maybe it's that his mother as the other POV comes across as very dour and hard to get to know. It's action-packed and has a detailed setting but there's less character interaction and depth compared with, say, Kushiel's Dart (which, ok, is a bit apples and pears because of the sheer difference in length so maybe I'm not being fair with that). There is very little cross-character tension, if you see what I mean, and I think that's the sort of more complex feel that would get a book marketed as adult rather than YA.
I don't know, it's so hard to put your finger on it when you then throw something like Hunger Games into the mix, which *did* have a lot more cross-character interaction but is squarely YA because all of the protagonists are teens.
but is squarely YA because all of the protagonists are teens.Young Adults are 18-25 not teens. that's what make YA as a genre so frustrating.
Harry Potter is simple fantasy book, starting with 9+ as the audience with first books, and ending with 13+ in last 2books. it doesnt make it kids book, nor YA.
considering YA is always with romance being main theme and never with sex... its a weird misnomer, nothing adult in the genre, its 14-17 appropriate
Maybe the genre is pitched slightly differently in different countries? YA to me seems to fall with protagonists around 14-19yo at the most and that's who it's aimed at when you look at sites like The Guardian's books section (eg here: http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/teen-...) which makes YA synonymous with "teen". The age group 18-25 doesn't have a section there or in any bookshop I've seen. I don't agree that the teen section of books doesn't have sex, though! The whole thing is a marketing gimmick, really. It must be kind of annoying for authors to get slapped with a label they didn't set out for.
I've read that books labeled YA as opposed to science fiction or fantasy tend to sell a LOT better. So authors often embrace the label.
I think that what defines YA is the way the main character is treated. YA mains have a lot of emotional conflict that is quite often the main conflict of the story, and the characters have a lot of... idk... innocence... in how they face the story themselves. I personally enjoy it, especially when authors who normally write for an adult genre tackle the YA style, it seems to me that they keep the depth of the plot without muddling it up with sex scenes, which, unfortunately, happens often in adult paranormal writing. Don't get me wrong, a well written sex scene is awesome, but sometimes... it kind of comes out of nowhere, possibly because the author realized, "Oh, wait, I have to have sex here to keep it in this category."Lily St Crow wrote a great series called Strange Angels that has a Supernatural tv series feel to it. Kelly Armstrong wrote The Darkest Power series, which was really great (side note: the main character in this is sooo not a strong empowered girl, she stutters and in the first few chapters literally pees her pants, it was great lol). Robin McKinley has quite a few amazing ones. Kim Harrison has the Madison Avery books, which were pretty interesting. And some old favorites: LJ Smith and Christopher Pike.
I don't know, I view books the same as I do music, I try to be pretty open minded, and will at least check out any book genre at least once. There's only been ONE book ever that I just despised...
At the moment I'm reading The Indigo Spell by Richelle Mead, which is the third book in the Bloodlines series, the spin off of the Vampire Academy books, and it is wonderful. But I was definitely an Adrian girl (although I still drool over Dmitri)
Marek wrote: "but is squarely YA because all of the protagonists are teens.Young Adults are 18-25 not teens. that's what make YA as a genre so frustrating.
That may be, but the young adult category in literature is marketed to 12-18 year olds. That could be part of your frustration, if you are expecting something aimed toward an older reader.
Lauren wrote: "..."Made up teen-speak" and other widely read lit is how our language as we know it grows and evolves...Language is like Legos, some people have fun taking apart the pieces..."I think that some people have strong opinions about matters which they reckon they would do better. One of the things I liked about "A Clockwork Orange" was the use of "Nadsat", an invented teenage slang heavily based on Russian. Perhaps an actual Russian speaker would feel the same way about Nadsat words as Clayton feels about "Mondayness".
I personally enjoy reading material which has neologisms and/or elements of other languages because (1) I like the challenge of working out WTF they're talking about, (2) if it gets too silly, I can just stop trying to puzzle it out. By contrast, I once joined a choral group, but had to quit because their repertoire included some truly STOOPID English hymns. "Jesus is an apple tree"? Puhleeze! I couldn't turn off my translation attempts and just enjoy the tune.
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To me that's like saying "Sushi sounds gross and I would never eat it, even though I've never tried it" or "I had cheesecake once and it was bad so I'm never having cheesecake again".
So my question to you all is why not? What is it exactly about YA that you don't like?
I would love to get a discussion going because this is something I truly don't understand.
(oh and PS, I can understand the comments that most YA wouldn't fit within the scope of this particular book club, because yes most YA does tone down the sex. Though I would argue that I personally would rather read a romance that builds tension until you get to that one super awesome kiss than like in Naked in Death for example where the main characters were having sex basically from their first encounter.)