POST COMPLAINTS HERE Showing 6,801-6,850 of 7,256

[Preston, Moderator]

While North Carolina brought us bad news for sexual minorities it appears not the entire Southern US is as bigoted at NC. Georgia's governor vetoed legislation that would have allowed clergy and churches to refuse to marry a couples of the same gender (commonly referred to as gay marriage.) The bill would have not only allowed clergy and churches from performning gay marriages but also it would have allowed churches and affiliated religious to have used their faith as an argument for refusing to serve or hire someone. The governors veto prevented this legislation from passing. See Associated Press report below:

ATLANTA (AP) — Georgia Gov. Nathan Deal on Monday said he will veto legislation shielding opponents of same-sex marriage, after a groundswell of opposition from companies threatening to boycott the state if it became law.

The Republican announced his decision during a news conference in his office at the Georgia Capitol, saying, "I have examined the protections that this bill proposes to provide to the faith based community and I can find no examples of any of those circumstances occurring in our state."

Deal added, "I do not think that we have to discriminate against anyone to protect the faith-based community in Georgia."

Republican majorities passed the bill to broadly protect people whose actions were rooted in their religion. It also would have protected clergy who won't perform gay marriages and people who won't attend a wedding for religious reasons.

Churches and affiliated religious groups could have used their faith as an argument for refusing to serve or hire someone.

[Eric]

I will perhaps step on some toes here, but frankly I believe any priest, rabbi, pastor, preacher, minister, whatever has an absolute right to refuse to perform same-sex marriages because of his/her religious beliefs. That definitely is an area where we as gay folks have no right to force our religious beliefs on someone else, which is essentially what anyone would be doing if John and Jack wanted a Catholic priest to marry them (for example), and then sued when refused.

Similarly, I have absolutely no trouble with a private religious school...which receives no funding from any government source...having the right to hire and fire based on religious standards. Once that institution crosses over the line by accepting funding of any sort, then it is no longer a strictly religious operation and should have to adhere to all laws. And if there is a law that prohibits hiring/firing discrimination based on sexual orientation, that law would have to be followed.

Now when it comes to operating a business, which requires compliance with various laws (health codes, tax returns, business licenses, etc., etc.), and which asks the public to come spend money in the establishment, then with equal absolutivity, that business has no right to discriminate based on religion. In that instance, that would force the owners' religious beliefs on certain of their customers.

Just my USD .02.

Eric

[Lori S.]

👍 👍 👍 👍 👍 👍 👍 👍

[Eric]

Lori S. wrote: "

[Preston, Moderator]

Preston wrote: "ATLANTA (AP) — Georgia Gov. Nathan Deal on Monday said he will veto legislation shielding opponents of same-sex marriage, after a groundswell of opposition from companies threatening to boycott the state if it became law...."

My personal opinion as a gay man on this is most likely opposed to most other people who are sexual minorities.

I don't believe clergy or churches should have to marry a same gender couple if it is against their faith. Our right to freedom of religion allows for us to choose our religious beliefs without government interference regardless of whether we are traditional Christian churches, Islamic sects, Buddhists, Wiccans, devil worshippers or people who worship women who write M/M romances. No one should be forced by the government to do some religious ceremony that is against their religion.

We have never forced Catholic priests to marry a divorced couple or a Rabbi to marry non-Jews or Wiccan clergy to marry people who sought to disparage witches.

Congregations who create and support a church with their voluntary charitable donations should not be forced to use that money to support a religious ceremony that violates the principles of their faith they counted on when they donated their money because of their beliefs.

If a same gender couple cannot find a faith they believe in, they can always get married without a religious ceremony. I don't see why any same sex couple or even a man and a woman would want to be married in a faith they don't believe in. It just doesn't make sense to the couple or to the church, mosque, temple or other religious institution.

We have a Constitution with a Bill of Rights that guarantees freedom of religion. That is the law of this US and the federal law should be followed.

I do not consider the Governor's veto of the legislation in Georgia to be a victory for sexual minorities. As LGBT+ persons we should want to make sure the government insures all rights guaranteed Americans, whether or not they are sexual minorities. are enforced.

PS: I don't under stand this at all: "It also would have protected clergy who won't perform gay marriages and people who won't attend a wedding for religious reasons.

That is outrageous if it means congregation members are going to be forced to attend a gay marriage no matter whether they want to or not or even know the couple or not. That's crazy.

[Lori S.]

I do agree that whatever the religious institution, forcing them to cater to or host SSM is wrong if they do not wish to do so. However, that's not what this bill was about. This bill was an attempt to legalize a Civil Rights violation by allowing business owners to practice discrimination based purely on someone's orientation.

[Preston, Moderator]

Lori S. wrote: "This bill was an attempt to legalize a Civil Rights violation by allowing business owners to practice discrimination based purely on someone's orientation."

Obviously Lori is more reliable source than the Associated Press. I agree that the bill should be vetoed since it allowed business owners to practice discrimination based purely on someone's orientation.

The Governor Nathan Deal should have stated that he vetoed the bill for the reasons Lori stated.

[Lori S.]

Preston wrote: "Lori S. wrote: "This bill was an attempt to legalize a Civil Rights violation by allowing business owners to practice discrimination based purely on someone's orientation."

Obviously Lori is more reliable source than the Associated Press. I agree that the bill should be vetoed since it allowed business owners to practice discrimination based purely on someone's orientation...."

Nah, it's an opinion only. I kinda expected some argument really. :)

[Wren]

Yeah I don't think any church should be forced to marry same sex/gender couples. However they should also have zero say in any government or rights issues (idk how to word that), such as marriage equality and trans equality, abortion, etc. Anything secular such as businesses, public schools (tho to be fair i dont think religious schools are healthy environments, so in a perfect world, just schools), etc shouldn't be able to discriminate.

Also what LGBT person would want to get married at a church that previously denied them, or is only marrying them because they're forced to by the government?

[Wren]

I want to complain that still NO JOB! not to mention that I had to delete my account on another site after posting about my job issues and hopes, and somebody commented that "maybe if you weren't so bitter and ungrateful god would help you find a job". and then the bullying ensued.

Like please....you know nothing about me. and then they went on to suggest that im a brat because I'm not super positive and have a working computer and electricity. How about this: the only reason i have those things is a bursary that is quickly running out. ugh. im still upset over it

[Preston, Moderator]

Wren (He or They) wrote: ""maybe if you weren't so bitter and ungrateful god would help you find a job"…."

Anyone who would use god to put you down and insult you has no concept of why we were put on this planet. We are here to help one another.

Wren when those people start attacking you, then you know they are stupid, mean fools who should be immediately ignored or avoided as you did. You were right when you deleted your account.

You are always welcome here. It is against the rules for anyone to put you down here in the Complaint Department . You are certainly not ungrateful nor are you bitter. You are having hard times. No one can expect you to be happy about that.

I'm sorry the bursary is quickly running out. We care about you here and value your contributions as a member and hope you never have to leave the group. I know I speak for all our active members in hoping you find a job soon.

[Wren]

Preston wrote: "Wren (He or They) wrote: ""maybe if you weren't so bitter and ungrateful god would help you find a job"…."

Anyone who would use god to put you down and insult you has no concept of why we were put..."

thank you! it really upset me and to be honest I am still disturbed by it

[WIL]

this is not a complaint but do not see a place to ask questions - if I see a book that interests me how do I access it to read it - can it be downloaded to Kindle, read only online? any help would be appreciated as I am a new member - thank you

[Preston, Moderator]

WIL wrote: "this is not a complaint but do not see a place to ask questions - if I see a book that interests me how do I access it to read it - can it be downloaded to Kindle, read only online? any help would ..."

Books have to purchased in stores. Beneath the description there is a section that says, Get a copy. It lists Amazon and other stores where the it might be possible to buy the book. I never bother with this since it's hard to use and sometimes inaccurate.

I suggest just using Google with the books title and author to search for where it is sold if indeed it is sold anywhere.

Goodreads really only a place for people to discover books, write reviews, make friends with other readers and join groups with people who have common interests.

[Monika]

Hi there. You can't usually download books here, there are reviews and recs, yeah, but no book files. There are some stories, which are sometimes available for free and it's usually said somewhere in the description or in comments but still you'll have to go somewhere else to download.

[Wren]

I want to complain that this really religious girl I know overstepped her bounds today.

First she asked me if I believed in god, which is fine. I told her I'm agnostic theist, yada yada. Then she asked what I thought about gay and transgender people. I said well its not hurting anyone so I'm fine with it (plus im pan and trans so....) she asked what I thought god thought of it. I say well it doesn't hurt anyone so obviously he'd be fine with it. Then she goes on to say well do you think god hates these people? I'm like...no?

She's like thats right. ...he loves you but hates the sin . Loves the sinner hates the sin.

Inside I was boiling over with rage. But being the dirty immoral non-christian I am, I kept it inside somehow.

So I left then with a polite goodbye, close to tears. She knows my identity. I was abused by christians who said really similar things. Lght people are treated like crap worldwide and she goes on like this? People need to learn to keep their prejudices to themselves especially when its toward a group who is actually suffering over something they can't control.

I am so angry and I keep seeing this religious and phobic stuff all the time and I wanna complain its really pushing me to the edge

[WIL]

Preston wrote: "WIL wrote: "this is not a complaint but do not see a place to ask questions - if I see a book that interests me how do I access it to read it - can it be downloaded to Kindle, read only online? any..."

thank you

[WIL]

Monika wrote: "Hi there. You can't usually download books here, there are reviews and recs, yeah, but no book files. There are some stories, which are sometimes available for free and it's usually said somewhere ..."

thank you

[Preston, Moderator]

WIL wrote: "thank you."

Anytime Wil. We enjoy being of help so if we can assist in anyway just ask no matter how trivial. We are not Goodreads staff though so we can't fix all the stupid and broken stuff here on Goodreads. We are just a group for having fun and making friends. We play word and book-related games a lot so that's a good way to get to know people here.

[Lori S.]

Wren (He or They) wrote: "... She's like thats right. ...he loves you but hates the sin . Loves the sinner hates the sin. ..."

This line of "logic" really makes me mad and all I want to do is punch something. It's so condescending and holier than thou that even the people who are being sincere come across as complete [expletive deleted].

She probably felt superior for pulling this on you Wren, so just know that she's the blind one here.

[Wren]

Lori S. wrote: "Wren (He or They) wrote: "... She's like thats right. ...he loves you but hates the sin . Loves the sinner hates the sin. ..."

This line of "logic" really makes me mad and all I want to do is punc..."

yes !!!! ugh

I try to remember that. but it really affects me.

[[deleted user]]

Wren (He or They) wrote: "I want to complain that this really religious girl I know overstepped her bounds today.

First she asked me if I believed in god, which is fine. I told her I'm agnostic theist, yada yada. Then she ..."


That totally sucks. I'm furious too just reading it. Sometimes there are no answers for people that , I guess, would you call it "evangelicals" . The easiest way for me to deal with that is to say. I'm too busy. Please ask someone else. Or maybe: I been accused of being too nice and I'm working to mend my ways. Or I doubt Jesus would ask me such annoying questions. If you have a problem with me take it up with him.

I have had a little, very little experience with prostelystizers. I am born and raised and live in Vermont. Which is the most atheist state in the nation. So my experience has been people believe they can fix me with God. Because I have a disability. I have been told that it's past life karma too... that I was injured.

But screw it. The best way for me to deal with that stuff..
I either say, I don't want to talk about it. Which works well. Or answer a question with a question which works even better. The more rhetorical the question the better.

So my favorite one recently has been, "Don't you think that's a little superstitious?"

.... I know we all often think of these things in afterthought... but if they can't be avoided.. you can have vindication. "I was thinking about our conversation. At first it really hurt my feelings. But then I realized it's not about me is it? It's about you. And I don't know maybe you are having a crisis of faith right now. And I'm sorry it will pass. But the answers you are looking for are between you and God. And in the words of Forrest Gump that's all I have to say about that

[[deleted user]]

Well, I got a complaint. I got lots of them. It's this election cycle that is really tough. Because I wish people could have the experience that I had growing up with Bernie Sanders as my mayor, my governor, my US Rep, my Senator. So I draw the line around me and tell you I've had enough of people saying to me "but he's a socialist". The atmosphere here in my area is palpable and thick... everyone waiting to exhale. I think I'm beginning to judge people as either drunk or stupid. No one in my home state has gotten in my face about Bernie. Everyone knows he's the best. There's a John Steinbeck quote: " Socialism never really took hold in America because we all liken ourselves to temporarily embarrassed billionaires."

[Wren]

Sonja wrote: "Wren (He or They) wrote: "I want to complain that this really religious girl I know overstepped her bounds today.

First she asked me if I believed in god, which is fine. I told her I'm agnostic th..."

thank you!

and wow I can't believe people would say that to you

[Lori S.]

I've given some serious thoughts to voting for Mr. Sanders and I am truly impressed by his campaign this year, Hillary's too, if I'm honest. Neither one of them have given in to the nonsense and really poor behavior exhibited by the Republican candidates.

@Sonja: that's a really good idea! Responding with a question like that. I will have to remember it in the future. :)

[Tj]

Sonja wrote: "Wren (He or They) wrote: "I want to complain that this really religious girl I know overstepped her bounds today.

First she asked me if I believed in god, which is fine. I told her I'm agnostic th..."

Sounds like those "Christians" that are all about the "healthy & wealthy". IF you are a true believer and "right" with God you WILL be healthy & ... well, well off anyway (not necessarily rich). It is such BULL. I get it a lot because of my medical stuff. I don't attend church anymore because of this sort of hypocrisy. (Never really believed everything spouted anyway.)

[[deleted user]]

sounds like we've all had similar experiences with the "evangelicals"

Thanks for the new friendships and replies. I like this place to vent. I saw an article about the Internet getting more angry venting. Rage on or Rant on . I think there is a website. It mentioned how the anonymous nature encouraged the vent.. but you know all those celebrities tweets and all. Really nasty stuff. It said in the article our rage-on tweet culture can be damaging when people don't take responsibility for their anger. I don't like getting angry. But I do get a power rush sometimes. I am more about forgiveness and embracing differences. It takes a while. I was raised that only I am responsible for my feelings and no one "makes" me feel anything unless I give them permission.

But there is another part of the world that is dumbing stuff down... being very anti-intellectual.

TBH, I can't deal with any of it anymore. I need to hide away into a fantasy. At least this group appears to be a good way to relieve some stress.

Sorry to ramble. Thanks.

[[deleted user]]

Stephen Colbert just called Twitter America's place for uninformed verbal abuse. Heh heh.

[[deleted user]]

About marriage... I look forward to when any commitment ceremony doesn't have the qualifer of "gay" marriage. It should just be marriage. Or for that matter why not call some unions "straight marriage". I not even allowed to get married... and millions like me who are disabled. It's called a marriage penalty. And I would lose my health insurance and only source of income. If I married someone who is also disabled they too would lose their health insurance and SSI. My guess about some recent legislation mentioned above... would protect priests and such from lawsuit if they don't want to perform a marriage. It's wrong on so many levels.

[[deleted user]]

I want to be able to go one day without hearing about the presidential election. Very positive to make goals.

[Lori S.]

Turn off the TV and radio, etc. That's the only way to avoid all the news and adds...

As for marriage, I agree with you on qualifiers, it should just be marriage (not civil unions either!).

Inhales to the extreme about your benefits and getting married. We, as a nation, have a long way to go before we're actually a great nation. Sigh.

[[deleted user]]

Thank you! Oh yes, I don't watch much commercial tv. Neither listen to commercial radio. But certainly I must avoid FB. I live in the HQ city for Bernie Sanders campaign. Not many foolish enough to waste ad money up here. Because we are all very excited for him.
Or as he puts it not him/us.
I'm grateful to live in the great state of Vermont. Yes, breathe go day by day. Soon we will have little buds on the trees. The Vermont state slogan :
It could always be worse!

[[deleted user]]

I deleted a post I just left here. Because I'm sensitive to other people if they don't like expletives. I'm sorry if I offended anyone. I just solved the irritation by quitting the other group. Yes, the offence was tiny and meaningless but I get keyed up by hypocrisy. I guess even if I avoid TV, radio, FB and certain GR groups I won't have to have more election cycle rhetoric in my face. And yes if I vent I'm gonna use the moniker for female dog. Regardless of gender identification. The B-word works well. And people say it on TV now. But I'm new here. And there's lots of people who love ... love... people who love love. Sorry, I ramble. The curious nature of right wing politics is that they have no sense of humor. Personally I'm an independent and sort of a snob, unfortunately.

[Lori S.]

LOL

[Monika]

@ Wren, darling, you should be more assertive when dealing with others. Not just answering someone’s questions but ask your own, just as Sonja recommends.

When dealing with overly religious people, who try to offend you in any way and quote the Bible to prove they are right and God really hates gay and transgender people or whoever else, remind them that the Bible says only God has the power to create life and all his creations are good (otherwise He wouldn’t create them) so He cannot hate them. People may not know or see this goodness in others at first or even at all, but if God created someone then He must have a plan for this person and no one should doubt it. Ask them if they think the God was wrong when creating diverse people. Ask if it isn’t, coincidentally, a blasphemy for them to doubt His ideas and try to guess or ask others what He thinks.

[[deleted user]]

No rest for the wicked. Must go. Regrettably. I so enjoy the word games and repartee. I believe I'll stay in my cups until November. That's classic American exaggeration. It's difficult being from the USA. Boo hoo.

[Preston, Moderator]

Sonja wrote: "Sorry to ramble.."

Hi Sonja,

The Complaint Department is the place to ramble and vent. As you said "At least this group appears to be a good way to relieve some stress."

So ramble on!

Also take Lori's advice about not getting news from TV and radio. I don't watch TV and only listen to interviews or reports on nature, art or other nonpolitical; subjects that interest me on NPR (National Public Radio).

I admire Lori so much and respect her suggestions. She is smart, compassionate and fair.

Happy complaining !

[[deleted user]]

Thanks :) I agree with all of it, I especially like the encouragement and venting because I get workaholic ism. Especially spend too much time on computer. But its worth it, most of what I'm doing right now is helpimg to review advance copies. all of you should try edelweiss.abovethetreeline I learned of it from Publisher's Weekly.
Its a bonus if you have a blog and review to a niche market. I don't have a blog... but I have a background in publishing and book design. i get really overwhelmed from it. Perfectionism is the illness. I believe.

[Wren]

Monika wrote: "@ Wren, darling, you should be more assertive when dealing with others. Not just answering someone’s questions but ask your own, just as Sonja recommends.

When dealing with overly religious peopl..."

I try being assertive but I'm so sensitive. I'm always on the edge of breaking down and crying. Walking away from her was the best I could do, i mean afterwards I almost broke down. Asking questions in that situation wouldn't have worked. But I try being assertive. when it's necessary, I try

[Wren]

Thanks for the advice everyone!

[[deleted user]]

Hey Wren, hugs. Is all easier said than done. You seem pretty "with it" and I hope you say nice things to yourself.

[Wren]

Sonja wrote: "Hey Wren, hugs. Is all easier said than done. You seem pretty "with it" and I hope you say nice things to yourself."

thanks. hugs to you too

[Bethany]

I'm writing to complain because I have a headache and no matter what healthy foods I try to eat, it never goes away. ;_;

[[deleted user]]

Bethany wrote: "I'm writing to complain because I have a headache and no matter what healthy foods I try to eat, it never goes away. ;_;"

maybe water, caffeine, eye strain? I have minor complaints too. The moment I saw your post about 30 min. Ago. I thought oh no! Because I jump to the worse conclusions at times

I have had insomnia and exhausted insomnia at that. It's probably because of computer use.. err.. kindle use. I have my period. Cramps. And I feel gross and need a shower but I have to turn the heat on first. Because it's not spring YET.

On a brighter note I heard from my dearest friend who I grew up withh. I think she is more gloomy than me, at times, but she is bright and funny and lives in the unbright and normally unfunny Maritimes of Canada.

We have a correspondence blog... she is one character and I am another. This is the first time I shared this writing with people I don't know.

My mind is a full time osmosis system at times. It comes out in journals, letters, a blog of dreams, largely abandoned. But I'm more in the mood to share a poem, maybe. I don't know.

I rather just share music. She sent me a passage from The Citadel by Antoine Exuperey. And I want to share it. But then it becomes electronic crud. I don't know.

I wish I could do more with computers ... besides whine, play games and read the synopsis of movies and tv shows. It's the visual input that causes a strong narcotic TMI. I used to take medicine for narcolepsy. I had a dream that I should start takinhmg it again.

Yea, personal hygiene is important and the next goal to accomplish is bracing the icy Nathaniel Hawthorne house ( I exaggerate) .... I'm really overdoing it on the word count.

Truman Capote remarked about Jack Kerouac...
" it's not writing, it's typing. "
But I really enjoy the era of NY in the 5Os. And wonder when my own zeitgeist , gave up the ghost, as it were. So sick and tired of saying sorry. My PMA got PMS and a family member is going on vacation tomorrow and I'm jealous. Boo hoo.

[Preston, Moderator]

Bethany wrote: "I'm writing to complain because I have a headache and no matter what healthy foods I try to eat, it never goes away. ;_;"

Oh Bethany! I'm so sorry. I hate headaches worst of all because something that is in your head is impossible to ignore. I used doctor prescribed migraine medication in the past but lately they haven't been a problem.

It's so hard to avoid stress, light, sound and all those rotten things that make your headache worse. I hope you have a peaceful place you can rest when a headache is especially bad.

I like your new profile picture! Nice big smile :)

[Tj]

Bethany wrote: "I'm writing to complain because I have a headache and no matter what healthy foods I try to eat, it never goes away. ;_;"

Headaches do suck! I hope there is some peace for you soon with that. I myself suffer from Fibromyalgia so I understand pain not going away:(

[Preston, Moderator]

Tj wrote: "I myself suffer from Fibromyalgia so I understand pain not going away:( ..."

TJ I miss "seeing" you here but I think of you often and I look at your photos in your profile pics. Goodness your grandson is so big. Keep taking photos or get your extraordinarily handsome son and sweet wife to send you photos we can see of of your grandbaby… um, er and your son :) not that I drool over him much. Just when my boyfriend isn't looking :)

I've prayed for relief of your pain and you know how much I care for you and hate that you are hurting.

Big loving hugs, ♡ Preston

[Tj]

Preston wrote: "Tj wrote: "I myself suffer from Fibromyalgia so I understand pain not going away:( ..."

TJ I miss "seeing" you here but I think of you often and I look at your photos in your profile pics. Goodnes..."

Aww, thanks. Also, he has told me I will be a grandmother AGAIN the end of September! Yup, he is making me feel old;)

[Averin]

Tj wrote: "Preston wrote: "Tj wrote: "I myself suffer from Fibromyalgia so I understand pain not going away:( ..."

TJ I miss "seeing" you here but I think of you often and I look at your photos in your profi..."

Congratulations TJ!

[Preston, Moderator]

Tj wrote: "I will be a grandmother AGAIN the end of September!..."

Maybe a granddaughter this time? It would be nice but of course all I wish for you is a healthy grandbaby No you are not old. You just started early.