Infinite Jest - Chunky- Discussion thread

[Amy]

I've read Hamlet a few times, but not recently... and I don't know how good my memory is.

Yorick was the skull Hamlet held up when he said "Alas,Poor Yorick, I knew him well." He was the jester Hamlet knew as a child.

[LauraT]

Yes Amy, I think you're right!
I'm having problems with reading the notes with my ebook and I feel it is a bit of a problem!

[Meg]

Hamlet Plot Overview

On a dark winter night, a ghost walks the ramparts of Elsinore Castle in Denmark. Discovered first by a pair of watchmen, then by the scholar Horatio, the ghost resembles the recently deceased King Hamlet, whose brother Claudius has inherited the throne and married the king’s widow, Queen Gertrude. When Horatio and the watchmen bring Prince Hamlet, the son of Gertrude and the dead king, to see the ghost, it speaks to him, declaring ominously that it is indeed his father’s spirit, and that he was murdered by none other than Claudius. Ordering Hamlet to seek revenge on the man who usurped his throne and married his wife, the ghost disappears with the dawn.

Do we need more?

[Petra]

Laura, I tried reading this in ebook format the last time and am reading the real book this time. It's much easier with a real book. It's also the first time in many years that I've marked up a book. I have a lot of underlines and notes in the margins already.

I looked up Yorick and a bit of the plot of Hamlet around the time of Yorick's skull being dug up:

The Speech:
"Alas, poor Yorick! I knew him, Horatio; a fellow of infinite jest, of most excellent fancy; he hath borne me on his back a thousand times; and now, how abhorred in my imagination it is! My gorge rises at it. Here hung those lips that I have kissed I know not how oft. Where be your gibes now? Your gambols? Your songs? Your flashes of merriment, that were wont to set the table on a roar?" (Hamlet, V.i)

The sybolism of the skull:
"The contrast between Yorick as "a fellow of infinite jest, of most excellent fancy" and his grim remains is a variation on the theme of earthly vanity (cf Vanitas**): death being unavoidable, the things of this life are inconsequential.

** In the arts, vanitas is a type of symbolic work of art. The Latin word means "vanity" and loosely translated corresponds to the meaninglessness of earthly life and the transient nature of all earthly goods and pursuits.

A summary of Hamlet at the scene where the skull is dug up:
In the Elsinore churchyard, two "clowns", typically represented as "gravediggers," enter to prepare Ophelia's grave, and although the coroner has ruled her death accidental so that she may receive Christian burial, they argue that it was a case of suicide.
Hamlet arrives with Horatio and banters with one of them, who unearths the skull of a jester whom Hamlet once knew, Yorick ("Alas, Poor Yorick; I knew him, Horatio.").
Ophelia's funeral procession approaches, led by her mournful brother Laertes. Distraught at the lack of ceremony (due to the actually-deemed suicide) and overcome by emotion, Laertes leaps into the grave, cursing Hamlet as the cause of her death.
Hamlet interrupts, professing his own love and grief for Ophelia. He and Laertes grapple, but the fight is broken up by Claudius and Gertrude.

[Rae]

I appreciate my iPad book version to facilitate dictionary look-up and hop from footnotes to text. I am also highlighting new vocab words as I go.
I get the distinct impression that this book is on a whole different plane. I may have to read other analyses of the book to better understand what is passing well over my head.

[Sheila , Supporting Chick]

Ok, I got through footnote 24 last night. I don't know, for some reason an 8 1/2 page footnote just seems a tad bit excessive to me! LOL

As to Hamlet, I have not read Hamlet in 20 years, but I do remember Yorick being the skull, the jester, which I guess plays into the title of "Infinite Jest"

I did see in footnote 24 that 5 versions of the movie "Infinite Jest" were made (I think 5 was the final count). And I'm guessing that the guy who was left in his chair with the food tray strapped around his chin, while his wife went out, who was watching the unmarked entertainment cartridge, is watching one of the lost versions of "Infinite Jest"?

Quirky story, that is for sure. I feel like I am not so much reading a story, but instead I feel like I am crawling into the mind of David Foster Wallace, which is actually a bit scary.

[Petra]

I have finished the summary of pages 3-95 in Post 69.
With this sort of book, I'm not sure if a summary is helpful. Please let me know your thoughts.

[Petra]

Crazy, crazy story!!

Sheila, I also think that Infinite Jest V is the cassette watched by the Medical Attache.

That footnote was amazingly long. It took me a good part of an evening to get through it, with some back referencing to earlier parts of the book. I found it chockfull of info.

There's a lot of story hidden in these pages. I'm not sure how much I reaped, what's true, what I've mistakenly read between the lines, etc. It seems to be very well planned and is written very tightly to keep the reader guessing.

So far, I think the Moms is sexually promiscuous; has always been so, even before she met James Incandenza. She's had an affair with the Medical Attache in her younger days.
She is Canadian; James is American. They marry. In order for her to get a green card more quickly, they quickly conceive Orin.
She continues to have affairs throughout their marriage.
James starts the tennis academy but then shifts into making movies, giving responsibility of the academy to Avril and her half-brother.
His mindset is shown in his movies: lots of depression and lack of communication and a betrayal of some sort.
James is isolated from his family even while living with them. So much so, that he thinks Hal is a mute.
Orin is also isolated from the family. He has one very large leg & very large arm. He is afraid of heights.
James dies. He's buried in Canada.
Lots of drugs (very detailed information on drugs. DFW sure knew a lot about drugs); lots of people involved with drugs.
Not sure what to make of the wheelchair assassin group. Steeply's portrayal was funny. Seems like his BSS group has no respect for him since they choose his outfits.
Maranthe may or may not have released the cassette.
The guy who died in the house robbery was a big-wig in the wheelchair assassin group.
Maranthe is prepared to kill anyone who guesses too much??, knows too much??....not sure.

There are feral hamsters in north-east USA. Don't run into them, especially if you carry food. :D


Any thoughts on the circles with the darkened crescent moon on the right that are found at the beginning of some of the chapters? It just dawned on my last night that they sometimes appear and sometimes don't. I wonder if they have a significance.

[Rebecca]

Petra. You are doing an awsome job. Thank you so much. I think the summarys are more work for you. I like the recaps you are doing. I am very glad to be tackling this with the group otherwise I don't think I would have a hope and a prayer.

I have wondered if the myth riddle on page 80 is part of the S Gasket? Also does anyone understand Mario and Gerhardts relationship? Mario sure has a thing for him.

I completed the first readings. I cant tell if I am getting things or not. Hang in there for the ride everyone.

[Irene]

My book arrived and I read the first 85 pages.

Huh? Hal and Orin are brothers?
Is Mario Hal's brother or just a dorm-mate?
What is Mario's physical problem?
The chapter with the "conversationalist" was odd? Was that his father or was Hal just projecting that?
I am not sure what is in Hal's head and what is real? After that first chapter when Hal saw things one way and everyone else saw it differently and he ends up in restraints, I don't trust anything as being "real".
Is Hal a brilliant autistic? Schzophrenic? Fried his brains on drugs? or some combination?
What was going on in that scene with Orin in a bird costume talking about being afraid of heights and punting while the kids watched?

I have to scan the text into my computer and then have the computer read it to me, so I can't flip around with foot notes, so I'm skipping them.

[Petra]

Irene, if there's any way to do it, I highly recommend the footnotes. They add some of needed details to the story.

To answer some of your questions:
Yes, Orin, Hal & Mario are brothers. Orin is the oldest. I'm still not sure about my spoiler-tagged question above about Hal & Mario.

We don't know yet what Mario's physical issues are.

According to the footnotes, the incident with the Conversationalist happened (and was filmed). The conversationalist was James Incandenza, Hal's father.

Good observation about the first chapter! I hadn't thought that some things mentioned in the book may not be real. I saw the first chapter as the final event where something happened and Hal was somehow damaged. I will keep your thought in mind. It could be the way DFW rolls and is intending the story.

No idea about Hal. But I'm guessing he's brilliant in some way. There was a short mention in the conversationalist chapter (or in a footnote....) that Hal's mom is putting something into his cereal to enhance his brain. I just remembered that and will look it up and get back.

That scene with Orin was bizarre. It seemed like a pre-show of some kind. A very bizarre pre-show. Hope we find out more later.


Rebecca, thanks! I will try to keep the summaries going then.
I have to go back and reread the myth riddle now.

[Meg]

It is helping me a lot Petra, it is keeping me focused. thank you!

[Petra]

I found that info about Avril spiking Hal's breakfast on page30 (I added the bold):
"....that her introduction of esoteric mnemonic steroids, stereochemically not dissimilar to your father's own daily hypodermic "megavitamin" supplement derived from a certain organic testosterone-regeneration compound distilled by the Jivaro shamen of the South-Central L/A. basin, into your innocent-looking bowl of morning Ralston..."

Also, in this chapter, Hal states his birthday. From this, I'm going out on a limb to say that (view spoiler)[Mario and Hal are twins. Mario is born in May (pg 54); Hal is born in June (pg 27). My guess is that Mario was born just before midnight on May 30th & Hal was born just after midnight on June 1st. (hide spoiler)]


Here are a list of the chapters that have a circle with a solid crescent moon shape on the right-hand side at the beginning. One of the chapters doesn't start with the circle but has the circle at one of the segments (noted below):

Year of Glad

Year of the Depend Adult Undergarment (PDAU) - Erledy

Year of the Tuck's Medicated Pad, 1st April - Professional Conversationalist

9 May YDAU - Phone call from Orin to Hal

YDAU - Medical Attache gets the cassette

YDAU - Mario & Hal talk about God, Himself's death & the Moms reaction to the death

YDAU - Hal smokes pot

As of YDAU - short bio of James Incandenza, his marriage, the ETA

Denver Co, 1 Nov YDAU - only the section where Pemulis is being the big-brother to the smaller kids

YDAU - Kate Gompert in the Psych ward.

30 Apr YSAU - Maranthe & Steely

What is it about these chapters? Does the circle & crescent moon mean anything?

[LauraT]

Rebecca wrote: "Petra. You are doing an awsome job. Thank you so much. I think the summarys are more work for you. I like the recaps you are doing. I am very glad to be tackling this with the group otherwise I don..."

I agree Rebecca: she is doing a real hell of a job!

[Amy]

LauraT wrote: "Rebecca wrote: "Petra. You are doing an awsome job. Thank you so much. I think the summarys are more work for you. I like the recaps you are doing. I am very glad to be tackling this with the grou..."

I agree, also - this is one of the better discussions I've taken part in. Nice job, Petra!

[Meg]

Yay Petra!!!

[Sheila , Supporting Chick]

Ok, I made it through the first week's reading last night (just in the nick of time). :o)
I really hope the feral hamsters make another appearance in the book. LOL

[Petra]

Thanks, everyone!

Stacey, with all the affairs that the Moms has had, I've wondered that, too. It may be part of James' story, if we hear more about his life. Although the parentage of the boys isn't important to the novel, it may have been important to James on a personal level???

.....actually, just typing that brings up something for next week's discussion; if I forget or no one else mentions it, remind me please, everyone.

I love how someone's casual mention of something brings up a thought that was first bypassed. That's the second time this has happened and, I think, shows that a group discussion on this book is helpful. Mention everything, no matter how small/insignificant it may be. It may twig a thought/idea from any of us.
This is a weird book, for sure. It seems to live under the adage of "it takes a village to read a book". :D

Sheila, the feral hamsters were funny....and odd....and out of place. I hope we see them again, too.

[Helen]

Hi, sorry I havent contributed, I have had to finish a book someone lent me, so now I will try and catch up reading Infinite Jest. SO I can particiapte in discussions. Wish me luck, the book is ..big! From Helen

[Petra]

Helen, we'll be here when you catch up.

I found this image of Hal during the interview in Year Of Glad:

[LauraT]

FUNNY!

[Amy]

I love the drawing!!!

[Meg]

Thanks for sharing this!

[Rebecca]

I made a bookmark with reading schedule. I agree Funny. :)

[Petra]

I've removed the spoiler tags in Week 1's summary and added a bolded "O" to the chapters or segments with that circular symbol. At this point, I've not idea if these symbols mean anything but who wants to go back and double check the chapters later? :D
Week 2's summary will be up on Friday.

Glad you all enjoyed the drawing. I found another one for next week that's really interesting (I think so, anyway).

[Petra]

Summary Week 2; Pages 95-198

The "O" symbol signifies the chapters or sections that have the circular symbol in the book (just in case they prove to be important later).

YDAU
- locker room talk after workout; everyone is tired & spent
- Hal has a photographic memory
- Maranthe & Steely watch the sunset
- Stice wears/uses black towels instead of ETA-issued white ones & wears all black gear & clothes. His nickname is “The Darkness”.
- Big Buddy system is described
- Ingersoll is annoying. He’s traded from Axford’s Big Buddy group to Hal’s.
- Lemon Pledge is an awesome sunscreen.
- Physical descriptions of the Incandenza brothers. Hal is darker than Orin and Mario.
- Schacht suffers from Crohn’s disease.
- Maranthe & Steely talk about loving enough to die for it (twice)

3 Nov YDAU
Big Buddy groups meet:
1. Hal: talk of the loneliness/individuality and the community of playing tennis
2. John Wayne: talks about plateaus reached during training. Chu does the talking for John Wayne.
3. Pemulis: slight-of-hand card tricks
4. Ted Schacht: dental flossing demo
5. Troeltsch: the necessity of the repetitiveness of training
6. James Struck Jr: whether to play fair or not & playing while suffering with an internal gas issue.
7. Stice: Schtitt is great

Mario’s First Remote Romantic Encounter
- very remote indeed
- cinematic tripod found in thicket.

30 Apr YDAU (2 chapters)
1. Steely & Maranthe discuss the probability of the existence of an anti-Entertainment cartridge to nullify the lethality of the Entertainment cassette.

2.
- "O" Guru on top of towel dispenser in weight room who’s name may be Lyle.
- yrstruly, C & Poor tony do petty and some not-so-petty crime to feed their habit, then buy heroin from Dr. Wo, who seeks revenge against Little Tony. Heroin shoot goes bad. yrstruly goes into detox.

3 Nov YDAU
“O” - Hal gets a phone call from Orin, who asks Hal what he knows about Separatism
“O” - Enfield House of Drugs & Alcohol Recover Center was started by an addict. Original furniture was boosted. Eating rocks was an initiation into the program. Founder died @ 68 years of age in the Year of the Yushityu 2007 Mimetic-Resolution-Cartridge-View-Motherboard-Easy-To-Install-Upgrade For Infernatron/InterLace TP Systems For Home, Office, Or Mobile.

-A series of writings:
1. (email) copy of a WCB claims letter written by Dwayne R. Glynn
2. (essay) Hal’s 7th Grade essay contrasting Steve McGarrettt (Hawaii 5-0) and Frank Furillo (Hill Street Blues) (written 1 yr after James’ death: Year of the Perdue Wonderchicken)
3. (magazine article) Helen Steeply’s article on North America’s 2nd Recipient of the Jarvik IX Exterior Artifical Heart (written 4 years after James’ death: Year of the Yushityu 2007 Mimetic-Resolution-Cartridge-View-Motherboard-Easy-To-Install-Upgrade For Infernatron/InterLace TP Systems For Home, Office, Or Mobile)
4. (list) Alphabetized list of Anti-ONAN Terrorist Groups
5. (article) Why videophony failed

“O” - quarterly urine tests....."Urine you’d be proud to take home and introduce to the folks!”
“O” - ONAN ensign: a combo of USA, Canadian and Mexican imagery
“O” - Bits of info on all the Incandenza brothers

“O” Winter B.S. 1960 – Tucson, Arizona
- 10-year old James Incandenza and his drunken father
- Father calls his dad (Hal’s great-grandfather) “Himself”, too.

4 Nov YDAU
Introduced to Madame Psychosis, the incredibly potent amphetamine.

Tennis & The Feral Prodigy; Year of the Yushityu 2007 Mimetic-Resolution-Cartridge-View-Motherboard-Easy-To-Install-Upgrade For Infernatron/InterLace TP Systems For Home, Office, Or Mobile
Stress, pain & fear of being a tennis prodigy; a film made by Mario.

4 Nov YDAU
A day in the life of a Resident-Interfacer in Ennet House.

"O"Late Oct YDAU
- introduced to Madame Psychosis, the person, & her radio program.
- description of The Union building that the radio program is aired from, complete with an escape route off the roof.
- an evening at HmH; Mario listens to Madame Psychosis on the radio; Hal eats.
- Buildings on the grounds of Enfield Marine Public Health Hospital:
Building #1 = a day-counselling center for very-delayed stress disorders
Building #2 = methadone clinic.
Building #3 = across the road from #2; unoccupied but being reconditioned; not boarded up
Building #4 = equidistant between the parking lot & steep ravine; houses Alzheimer patients with VA pensions
Building #5 = kitty-corner across from Ennet House; houses "catatonic & various vegetablish, fetal-positioned mental patients"; called The Shed
Building #6 = up against the ravine; Ennet House Drug & Alcohol Recovery House
Bulding #7 = west side of the street end, teetering on the edge of the eroding ravine; boarded up, infamous as the place Ennet House residents secretly relapse.
- Don Gately is a resident at Ennet House.
- ETA is built on top of the hill behind #7 & pays monthly rent for Building #7.

[Petra]

What's a police lock look like and how does it hold up Mario?

A police lock is a long metal pole that inserts into brackets above the door and on the floor or across the door.
So Mario has a bracket on his vest and then that brick/weight he hauls around has another bracket. Think of what it looks like to lean your gut into a golf club, baseball bat, etc.

DFW approved drawing of Mario:

[Julia]

Had a crazy week and couldn't really post here, but I'd just like to say how much I appreciate the work you are doing, Petra!

This is more of a Week 1 comment, but I was a little behind and forgot to post here. As a cinephile, I know that you can tell a lot about a director by going through his filmography. I wonder how many clues are hidden at that footnote.

Also, for this week, I'm away from home and keeping up with the book through my ipad version, that does not have corresponding pages. Could anyone go over page 299 and provide me with a sentence so I can bookmark it?

Thank you very much!

[LauraT]

Poor Mario!!!

[Sheila , Supporting Chick]

Julia wrote: "Could anyone go over page 299 and provide me with a sentence so I can bookmark it?

Thank you very much!
"

The start of that section (page 299) is the sentence:
"Poor Tony Krause had a seizure on the T."
This is under a heading of "14 NOVEMBER YEAR OF THE DEPEND ADULT UNDERGARMENT".
So you would read up to that point for the Jan 19th discussion. :o)

[Petra]

Julia wrote: "This is more of a Week 1 comment, but I was a little behind and forgot to post here. As a cinephile, I know that you can tell a lot about a director by going through his filmography. I wonder how many clues are hidden at that footnote.
..."

Julia, I also think that Footnote 24 tells us a lot. It may be the basis of this entire novel.

I thought that this week's section had quite a bit of humour in it. The footnote about how Building 5 got its nickname was funny. Also, that letter to the Claims Adjuster was hilarious.
I got a kick out of the chapter with excerpts from the Interfacer's notes. I managed to identify 2 of the residents. I'm such a nerd. LOL!

To this point, I'm still sticking with my idea (view spoiler)[that Mario & Hal are twins (hide spoiler)]. I'm not completely convinced but more so than not at this point.

ETA: the only thing that has me wondering whether it could be true is "Hal is the only extant Incandenza who looks in any way ethnic". (view spoiler)[...but one can get pregnant by two different men, right??? If one ovulates 2 eggs and each is fertilized by different men, one can have twins with different genes. Rare, but it's happened. (hide spoiler)]

[Petra]

LauraT wrote: "Poor Mario!!!"

I wonder........At first, I thought this too. Every time a description of Mario came up I thought "poor Mario".
But Mario seems to be the only person in this book without an ego, problem or concern. He loves what he does, enjoys the people he's around, is content, doesn't seem to be aware of or concerned with any physical restrictions he has and is happy with everyone's success. Seems like a wonderful life. Mario is becoming my favorite person.
Of course, he leads a very, very sheltered life at ETA. Put him in the real world and he wouldn't be as accepted. He'd be ignored, ridiculed and rejected....which would lead to a very different and unhappy Mario.
In that sense, Mario's life at ETA can be compared with the addicts' lives in Rehab: sheltered and protected.

Some quotes of Mario that struck me:
"if you're poor old Mario Incandenza you take your competitive stokes where you can find them." (happy doing his part; doesn't compare himself to others?)
"...as far as Mario's concerned, ultimately all right, if that's the way things unfolded." (accepting; goes with the flow; takes things as they come)
"Avril never actually asks Mario to keep it down; he does it out of unspoken consideration for her thing about sound." (respectful; considerate, caring)

[Petra]

I was also struck with how Maranthe and Hal (in his Buddy Group discussion) seemed to be saying the same thing:

Maranthe & Steely were talking about loving something enough to die for it twice. Maranthe stated that one had to find a cause to love (live for/fight for??) and ended by saying "something bigger than the self".
Hal was talking about hate and how the staff of ETA gave the boys a common goal to hate; that "nothing brings you together like a common enemy" (something bigger than the self).

[Petra]

Some other things:

Is Luria Maranthe's wife??

Who's the "I" who sometimes narrates a section?

I got a chuckle that Le Bloc Quebecois was on the list of terrorists. The Bloc is a political group in Quebec that carries a lot of power in Ottawa and their main concern is to separate from Canada.

Hal's essay, written one year after James' death, is about going from being a one-task worker to a multi-task, organizational worker. James went from being a one-man show running ETA to giving that control to Avril & CT (multi-tasking operation?) while he (James) went on to concentrate on his cinematography. Is there a comparison between the essay and James? Is Hal trying to understand something about his father?

Did yrstruly kill Little Tony or just think about killing him? The artificial heart incident happened 2 years before this segment. Was Dr. Wo's resentment towards Little Tony about that incident? I probably should read that section again; it was confusing.

Hal's grandfather called Hal's great-grandfather "Himself", just as Hal, Orin & Mario call James "Himself".

James seems to have followed his father’s footsteps: first tennis, then film. Was he not his own person? Was he always trying to please his father? Was this the reason for his depression, distance from his own family, suicide?

[Sheila , Supporting Chick]

Why do I feel that 95% of the hidden meaning in this book is whooshing over my head without me ever picking up on it? LOL

Petra, I am getting way more out of your interpretations than I am out of my own reading! :o)

[Julia]

Sheila, got it! Thank you very much!

Petra, considering your theory: (view spoiler)[It is always possible that they are fraternal twins and, therefore, have the same father but do not look alike. (hide spoiler)]

[Rebecca]

Petra, I am getting way more out of your interpretations than I am out of my own reading! :o)

Me TOO!!

[Julia]

SO TRUE! Petra's interpretations are being quite helpful, but I guess this is the kind of book group reads are made of.

Just out of curiosity, how are you guys tackling it? Are you taking notes and underlining sentences or just going with the flow? Also, how much do you read at each time? I find that I can't stay with it for as long as some other books, so I have to take several pauses.

[Petra]

Wow...thanks but don't count on my interpretation. What if I've got it all wrong? I'm not sure at all if I'm going in the same direction as DFW was. I hope I'm not leading you all down the garden path.
I'd be interested in everyone's thoughts and ideas. Between us, we'd figure this out. I've got a ton of thoughts but need your inputs to sort it through. I don't want to be the only one putting out ideas because that might skew how you all see the novel and that wouldn't be right of me.

For instance, what are your thoughts on this sentence from the Madame Psychosis (radio personality) section:
"And Darkness was all over the Face of the Deep."
I thought of Stice right away because his nickname is The Darkness but what does Stice have to do with Madame Psychosis, the radio station, the Union building or anything at all with anyone in that chapter? There are a lot of red herrings in this book, me thinketh.

Julia, that's what I thought at first until I read "Hal is the only extant Incandenza who looks in any way ethnic". We know that Orin is James' son because they had him quickly after the marriage to get Avril's green card. We also know that Avril slept around....a lot, so parentage of Mario & Hal are suspect. In the descriptions of the Incandenza boys, Orin and Mario are similar in colour. Mario's physical issues makes further comparison difficult (DFW's intent?).
But Hal, on the other hand, is specifically singled out as "ethnic" & in the section where Lemon Pledge was mentioned as a sunscreen it said that Hal didn't use sunscreen because of his darker skin; he simply didn't need it.
So, for now, I'm leaning towards (view spoiler)[they are twins with different fathers (hide spoiler)].....but I could be so far off-base that I'm not even in the ballpark. :D (view spoiler)[They may not be twins at all. I may have pulled that out of nowhere because...well....why keep that a secret fact from your readers? (hide spoiler)]

[Julia]

Peta, you never know. For now, I think that (view spoiler)[his reluctance towards mentioning Mario's age and more details about his parentage points towards a deeper meaning. The reason I mentioned fraternal twins - also known as non-identical twins - is that I actually know two twin brothers who look completely different from one another. On has dark hair and olive skin, looking like his father, and the other has a lighter complexion, like his mother. It is possible, then, for them to look completely different and still be twins from the same father. What doesn't mean, of course, that they couldn't have different fathers. After all, doesn't it look just like the plot twist IJ is made of? (hide spoiler)]

And about your interpretations, even if they are not what DFW initially wanted from his readers, they can't be qualified as wrong. They are, after all, what you got from the text and do have a value by themselves. After all, isn't that the fun of discussing literature?

[Petra]

What were your favorite parts this week?

I liked the humour. It's often politically incorrect and if I were to see situations like those described, I'd be mortified and try to stop it but in print, as part of a book, I found them funny.
There was the letter from Dwayne R. Glynn, the pranks played by the Ennet House residents (the one where Gately put the "closed" sign on the methadone clinic's door was hilarious, especially the description "apeshit has rarely enjoyed so literal a denotation" for the results of the joke) and how The Shed got its nickname.

[Sheila , Supporting Chick]

Julia wrote: "Just out of curiosity, how are you guys tackling it? Are you taking notes and underlining sentences or just going with the flow? Also, how much do you read at each time? I find that I can't stay with it for as long as some other books, so I have to take several pauses."

For me there is no note taking or underlining...I am just going with the flow...and if I get to a part that is too confusing for my muddled brain or too much repeated description of drugs I kind of skim read until it seems to turn back into something I can understand. :o)

As to how much I read at a time, I try to read about 15-20 pages a night (or try to get that many knocked out during the day). I can't really deal with more than that at once, and some days I can only read a few pages before having to put it down and return to it later.

[Petra]

Julie, we must have been posting at the same time. I just saw your posts.

I'm underlining and making notes in the margins. It's been years since I've done that with a book. I think this book may be a reread one day. It'll be fun to see what I've noted the first time through.
I'm also keeping a summary of each chapter on a piece of paper for the updates.

Thanks, Julie. That is the great thing about books...we all get something different out of them. That makes it fun to talk about.

I'm trying to keep up with the reading schedule so as not to be late with the summaries. I just made it under the wire this week. That's averaging about 15 pages a day plus footnote pages. For most books that isn't a lot but for IJ that seems like an awful lot.


Does anyone remember a character by the name of Emil Minty? I'm not sure if I remember the name from our first 2 weeks of IJ or whether the name is familiar because of Minty Fresh from A Dirty Job and has nothing to do with IJ at all.

[Irene]

I am behind. Busy work week last week, the need to read a more enjoyable book for my local book group on Wednesday, and just the effort it is taking has all put me behind. I did try to read a chunk of the footnote section, but did not get anything out of it. Maybe it is because I am not reading the footnotes along with the text, but apart from the text. I am finding the entire thing confusing.

[Sheila , Supporting Chick]

Irene, the way the footnotes are set up, with some footnotes only being a sentence long and other footnotes being many pages long, and with the footnotes being on a huge range of topics, they probably would make no sense reading them separate from the story. Heck, they don't always make sense reading them where they are noted in the story! LOL

For you, probably easiest to just skip the footnotes, and just read the story for all its own confusing worth. (smile)

[Irene]

I think I am going to skip the rest of the footnotes, as you suggest. That was my original intent, but there were enough posts that made them seem significant that I thought I should give them a try. I am having "Ulysses" flashbacks.

[Petra]

IJ is very much like Ulysses in the sense that it's a lot of work to read through the first time.
With Ulysses, I got the sense that when/if I were to read it again, it would not only be easier to read but enjoyable as well. The story was good but making sense of it the first time was hard work.
IJ seems to be the same....but not as much work and more enjoyable to read the first time. There's a lot of words that must be read in order to find that nugget of info that relates. But, the "lot of words" also add to the story even though they aren't exactly a part of the ongoing story. .....that sounds as confusing as IJ, doesn't it??

So far, week 3 is more linear....still wordy but easier to pick up on the storyline.

I know its a pain to flip back & forth between the footnotes and the novel but the footnotes add a lot of detail to the story that helps explain it. If you're not reading the footnotes, please ask about a confusing issue/scene. We may be able to explain a footnote to you that would help.

[Petra]

Maranthe & Steeply over Tucson, AZ:

[Petra]

The ONAN Ensign:

[Petra]

Subsidized Time: