Discussing "the secret"

[Amit]

I am in the process of reading "the secret", while reading it there are a lot of thoughts, doubts and counter arguments in my mind. I would really love to discuss about this book and in the process get a better understanding of this whole concept of this secret. For example "thoughts become things", what would explain the things that happen in our life which we never really thought of!! Any comments ?

[Will]

This book is stupid. There, I said it. It comes down to: think positive thoughts. There's a reason this works and there's nothing secret about it; if you are positive, you will seize more opportunities and thus be more likely to profit. It's basically Carpe Diem with a bunch of balderdash thrown in.

[Amit]

Will wrote: "This book is stupid. There, I said it. It comes down to: think positive thoughts. There's a reason this works and there's nothing secret about it; if you are positive, you will seize more opportuni..."

I agree With you Will on account of the gist of this book being "think positive" and I agree it's no BIG secret but I really don't find this book stupid. There are a lot of "the right thing to do" we know but rarely follow/ implement most of them. But it just happens that someone or some book helps us understand that right thing in a better way and gets us to see the whole logic to it. Secret is that book to me, though there are times when I get some counter arguments in my mind while reading the book.

[Chanouel]

Will wrote: "This book is stupid. There, I said it. It comes down to: think positive thoughts. There's a reason this works and there's nothing secret about it; if you are positive, you will seize more opportuni..."

Stupid is a bit strong. I agree, it's a simple thought but do you realize how many people have no idea how to go about thinking positive thoughts? I'm surrounded by a few specimens every day at work.
People who walk around with their own little black cloud floating above their heads. Blaming everything and everyone for their misfortunes. They drive me nuts sometimes.
I browsed the book quickly and it didn't reveal anything that I didn't already know. But it was a reminder for me to keep thinking positive. In the midst of real life sometimes we forget...

[Will]

It's stupid for several reasons. 1) Thinking positive is only going to help people who are in a position to benefit from it in the first place. In other words, a starving child in Africa is not going attract food into his/her mouth from positive thinking. An extreme example, granted. 2) The book is infested with pseudoscience mumbo-jumbo about laws of attraction and frequency signals sent to the universe blah blah blah; a bunch of uncritical, lazy, made-up garbage that's meant to fool the gullible and sell lots of books and make lots of money.

[Chanouel]

Will wrote: "It's stupid for several reasons. 1) Thinking positive is only going to help people who are in a position to benefit from it in the first place. In other words, a starving child in Africa is not goi..."

1) Agreed, the idea of the book does not apply to every situation.
2) Agreed, the book is full of pseudoscience mumbo-jumbo

Although I find it hard to believe that one would be so gullible as to believe all that. But I'm sure they're out there...

[♒ ✯ɐɯıʇɐɟ✯ ╰☆╮]

What everyone is saying right now is practically negative.
Yes, you can't attract everything to yourself but as long as you believe in it, it will drive you to work harder. Doesn't believing in yourself come from you thinking positive thoughts?

I think the book is simply trying to tell people who don't know that thinking positive is one step to brightening up your day. What's so wrong with believing in that?

[Nouran]

totally agree with Will, that book was a waste of money and time

[Amit]

Its nice to see an interesting discussion going on here. unless the counter points to a concept are also taken into account it may not be possible to acquire a complete understanding of it. While i agree with Will that a hungry person cannot attract food into his mouth just by thoughts. Will is being completely practical about this whole thing. But there is another aspect to this "Secret" thing, firstly, a very few people know about it/ realize it, secondly not really knowing how to use it to their advantage. In addition there are a lot of people who are using the power of positive thinking without even realizing that they are already using this power. Since i am still reading this book, therefore at lot of occasions i have questions in my mind which are in line with Wills point of view and of course contrary to what Rhonda Byrne has to say. But then again i think about people who have reached from rags to riches, people who were really struggling for mere survival but reached the top in various fields. They would have been no different from that child in africa but still something happened that changed their lives forever. I feel it must have been just firstly THINKING about something really big and impossible followed by having faith in that thought, thirdly thinking positive and believing in urself and finally reaching there! All about thinking BIG, thinking positive and making it happen! I think thats all what 'SECRET' is trying to say! and it makes a lot of sense.

[Marc]

Some of you might enjoy this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5um8Q...

I'm also a SHAM (self help and actualization movement) author myself. Although I would like to think I offer more than "The Secret", it's a very fine line and by all means subjective.

[Global]

♒ ✯ɐɯıʇɐɟ✯ ╰☆╮ wrote: "What everyone is saying right now is practically negative.
Yes, you can't attract everything to yourself but as long as you believe in it, it will drive you to work harder. Doesn't believing in yo..."



No kidding... thus... why the book was written to discuss the consequences of thinking negatively...

[Global]

Amit wrote: "Its nice to see an interesting discussion going on here. unless the counter points to a concept are also taken into account it may not be possible to acquire a complete understanding of it. While i..."

The book is practical. In many times people miss the simple concepts in life that are the most essential...positive thougths...positive conversations... as with anything.... take what you can and leave the rest...For me the book was an inspring one. It elaborated on the same thing but it maybe because i understand the concept...I'm pretty positive... it does come but also there's more to this. One also needs to have a lifestyle and environment that assists in the process.

[Global]

If one doesn't work in that type of environment create it... if there challenges to that...it's a character building experience.

[Marc]

I don't think the objective here (at least mine) was to dismiss positive thinking, but rather argue against over reaching. I will offer two examples of "The Secret" gone wrong.

1. The Youtube video above that I left a link to has some damning evidence. Is there anyone here who thinks the people who perished in the 2004 Christmas day tsunami in Indonesia were asking for a tsunami to come?

2. I had a very good friend who had a young child with a brain tumor. After reading "The Secret" he spent considerable time blaming himself for bringing this upon his child.

I'm not against postive thinking but rather taking it to far and applying it to cases where it has no relevance.

Shawn Achor wrote a beautiful little book about the power of positive thinking. I will included a link (it does go to my blog) that has links to a number of his videos.

http://www.keepingscorebook.com/blog/...

[[deleted user]]

Anyone who drew or draws inspiration from this book or any book of its ilk is a rube. If you only focus on the positives you are not basing your existence in reality. Fact: terrible things happen, and they happen for no reason.

The idea that we manifest our own destiny through positive thinking is borderline insanity. If this was true no one would be poor, and no one would be dying of cancer. Every asshole that scratches a lottery ticket would be rich, and anyone who wished they had a BMW would be driving around in luxury.

[Marc]

Paul wrote: "Anyone who drew or draws inspiration from this book or any book of its ilk is a rube."

That's perhaps a bit to harsh. I can agree with the lottery ticket example but a BMW is well with the ability of people. The lottery ticket requires no skill or effort other than buying the ticket. The BMW is something that if a person works hard and saves for can be achieved.

Regardless of how you think (positive or negative) it will not improve your odds of winning the lottery- assuming you continue to buy a ticket. However the same cannot be said about acquiring a BMW- assuming you are willing to do more than think about it.

[Will]

Marc wrote: "Some of you might enjoy this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5um8Q..."

Great video that highlights the major problems of this book and books like it.

[[deleted user]]

Marc wrote: "Paul wrote: "Anyone who drew or draws inspiration from this book or any book of its ilk is a rube."

That's perhaps a bit to harsh. I can agree with the lottery ticket example but a BMW is well wit..."

Actually, I don't think it's harsh enough. Not enough negative things can be said about those who accept untruths from people who claim to have all the answers. It's no different than religion in regards to the snake oil salesmen who are selling false remedies.

Regardless, you missed my point. My point wasn't that the BMW could not be obtained. It's an object, and any object can be obtained. My point is that it would take more than someone just "thinking positive" to attain it.

The secret promotes goals being made through positive thinking, not physically working towards them. The theory at play here is that nothing comes to us that we don't will in the first place, and that is not only immoral, but it is false and it is lunacy.

If you believe that you get what you will; you might as well believe in the tooth fairy or a wish granting deity, because it's just as nutty.

[kisha]

♒ ✯ɐɯıʇɐɟ✯ ╰☆╮ wrote: "What everyone is saying right now is practically negative.
Yes, you can't attract everything to yourself but as long as you believe in it, it will drive you to work harder. Doesn't believing in yo..."

I would almost agree with you, however, the author herself went on to say that working for it is unnecessary and too hard. That the universe doesn't expect you to work for it just think it. That's where she lost me. And she must have said that at least three times. That was extremely irresponsible for her to imply that hard work is not necessary to succeed, only positive thoughts. And I'm not one to take a self-help/motivational book super literal but she forced that point so hard that she must have meant it literally. She just made life sound too happy and unrealistic. Yes negative thoughts will impede your progress but my goodness somewhere in this book she went left field into lala land.

[Will]

Layla, that is fantastic that your situation is better now, but do you really think that thinking positive had anything to do with the economic improvements in your country?

The people that were actually placing policies for improvement likely never read the book and weren't just sitting around thinking positive thoughts. They were doing work. "Thought frequency" is just babble. It has no meaning. The implications that a bunch of people thinking happy thoughts can make the universe give you something you want means that the opposite is true. The author has stated that tsunami victims must have been projecting "tsunami-like vibes" to bring on such destruction. This is nonsense.

Positive thinking can be a good thing, but it's action that gets stuff done, not thoughts.

[[deleted user]]

It doesn't shock me that she believes this. They still persecute people for practicing witchcraft in Zimbabwe.

[Amit]

Everything starts with a thought!

[Will]

There is a HUGE difference between thinking positive and trying, through action, to improve your situation, and believing that thoughts influence (through some sort of "frequency") the universe to give you things. One is realistic, the other is what this books promotes, and it's nonsense.

[[deleted user]]

Layla wrote: "People do believe in witchcraft in my country (a small percentage at that) and what you say about persecuting people for practicing it is not true. Its just like your country, were I saw people burning Harry Potter books because they promote witches. And don't get me started on the hundreds of videos that are posted everyday on you tube from people of your country who believe in Satanists controlling the world."

Yeah, not quite...

http://www.voazimbabwe.com/content/zi...

Those youtube videos are from lone morons and nutcases. Our federal courts do not prosecute people for practicing witchcraft or satanism.

[Chanouel]

I don't agree with everything that was written in the book and I do agree with Kisha that sometimes, the author took a turn for Lalaland.
But what I got from the book, and what I try to apply to my every day life is that, yes, indeed, everything starts with a thought. And if that thought is positive, you will be more aware of the opportunities that surround you to make that thought become reality.
I feel that when a person is being negative, they are blind to the possibilities around them.
Yes, getting what you wish for takes work, sometimes hard work. But keeping a positive attitude will open some doors that you would completely pass by if you walk around with that little black cloud over your head all the time.

[[deleted user]]

The point I was trying to make Layla, which you have obviously missed, is that your country is very superstitious and it would explain why you think the change that occurred was due to a "phenomenon."

[Marc]

I'm quite skeptical of things improving in Zimbabwe just because people read The Secret and started thinking positive. By the same logic how many people did it take thinking negative to cause the crisis in Zimbabwe? Should the people who were thinking negative and caused the crisis be held accountable for the damage they caused, how can they be identified?

I don't think it's fair though to single Zimbabwe out as being very superstitious. Any country or culture that experiences conditions that deviate from their traditional norm sees an uptick in less than logical behavior as a means of trying to grasp what has happened. Whether it's AIDS or Hurricane Katrina that swamped New Orleans there are always some who are very quick to offer explanations that border on the absurd. In addition the US is not that far off from experiencing it's own Zimbabwe moment, our response so far does indeed suggest a less than solid grasp of reality. We will know the end has arrived when the politicians campaign for mandatory public readings of The Secret as part of the recovery plan.

[[deleted user]]

Marc wrote: "I don't think it's fair though to single Zimbabwe out as being very superstitious."

Any country whose court system tries people for practicing witchcraft is superstitious and is in the dark ages...

Layla is in denial and deflecting.

[Chanouel]

Paul, I believe Marc did not say that Zimbabwe was not supertitious. He said that it should not be singled out.
And what is it to you personnally that Layla believes in what she believes in?
I don't agree with everything she said but I wouldn't go as far as to say she's in denial.
This book changed her life for the better, she believes it and it makes her happy. What's wrong with that?

[[deleted user]]

Marc said "I don't think it's fair though to single Zimbabwe out as being very superstitious." Which I translate as they shouldn't be called very superstitious.

And I'm not saying she's in denial about her beliefs. I am saying that she's in denial about her country's persecution of so-called "witches."

[Will]

"But I am saying that those who wanted their lives to get better, their lives got better. And it just so happens that most people wanted to live a better life hence the standards of living for most people improved."

Post hoc ergo propter hoc.

This is a fallacy of correlation and causation. Because your country's economic situation improved, it must be because you were thinking positive thoughts? This is beyond ridiculous.

If I started to chant "pizza bottom" every day in hopes that it sent a frequency that increased the economic climate of my country, and my country's economy improved, did I cause that?

If there are people in your country that believe in "The Secret" and those that do not, but your country still improved, isn't it FAR more likely that it improved because, well, your leaders made changes that improved the economy. It's as simple as that. The odds are that eventually, your country was going to improve given a long enough timeline.

[Will]

This book is just more proof that people will believe anything.

[Marc]

For a moment let's pretend that we are talking about whether or not unicorns exist. While there is little to no scientific evidence to suggest that unicorns are out there hidden in some secret valley waiting to be discovered, it's also rash to say it is impossible that unicorns cannot exist, don't exist, or have never existed. It is however very prudent to strongly suggest that in light of the current evidence that unicorns are likely a creation of the human imgination, don't exist today and likely never did in the past either.

While I have no desire to be governed by those who persist in believing in unicorns, it's also less than appealing to be governed by those who specialize in the persecution of those who believe in unicorns.

My limited experience in life has taught me that nearly 1/2 of what I think I know to be true today will in the future be proven false. It has also been my observation that most of these judgement failures on my part come from lack of experience.

I think it is fair to say that certain environments/conditions might make one more willing to believe in unicorns. Until one has lived in an environment or conditions where one would be more willing to consider the existence of unicorns, is it really wise to completely dismiss the possibility?

History is full of such examples of concrete thinking, the world is flat, white males are the smartest, Rome will never fall, everything useful has been invented, people cannot travel faster than a galloping horse, the end is near.....

[[deleted user]]

"Layla wrote: "I do not think you understood what I was trying to explain. I was simply saying that I wanted things to change in my country and things to change in my life and they did."

I'm sorry, you're insane.

If you actually believe your individual thoughts changed a country just by thinking them, you've lost your mind.

[Amit]

Layla wrote: "FYI: This is meant for like minded individuals and not for some eh...angry atheists whom I might have accidentally made even angrier with my earlier comments. Oops... But if you feel you want a lit..."

Well said Layla !

[nisrine]

I couldn't read all the comments, but I would like to present my opinion.
The book, "the secret" yes it is so simple, but, that doesn't mean it is isn't interesting, for me It changed things on me, I become more aware o what I think, what I expect, in a realistic optimistic way, I try to experience some of the recommendations in the book, but what it is all about, isn't the matter of changing things, but how we could change our visions to things, to the whole world, to ourselves...
well this is what I think, an honestly, I even don't want to re-read it

[Chanouel]

I wonder what this one will bring that we don't already know...

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B005JJWBNG/?...

[Will]

This has been happening more and more frequently. These con artists are jumping on every opportunity to try and spin quantum mechanics into really bad science, and they are succeeding in duping people because the average person knows jack-shit about quantum mechanics.

Look, positive thinking is great. And, like I said above, the reason positive thinking works is because a person with that mindset is going to seize more opportunities, thus providing themselves greater chances of success. People also gravitate towards other people who are positive thinkers (in a natural way like how people prefer to be around nice people than jerks), and thus a positive thinker will be more likely to surround him/herself with successful people furthering your chances of having more opportunities. It's as simple as that.

Your thoughts, however, do not in any way physically affect nature. Nor is there any such thing as a "thought frequency" or any such nonsense. This is dangerous pseud-science. It is meant to fool the gullible and to con them from their money. Why would you give your money to a con artist? I can guarantee there are plenty of books out there dedicated to positive thinking that do not delve into pseudo-science and aren't made in order to take your money and convince you of something that is flat out not true.

[C.C.]

We are made of energy, and how we use it is up to us.
You will believe or disbelieve... That is what is called free choice and free will.

[Shireen]

The Secret isn't really just about "positive thinking" it's about The Law of Attraction. I suggest reading more about The Law of Attraction in other great books. The Secret is a great Introduction, but there is so more to learn and know.

[Frankiejohnny]

There are 2 types of people in the world: Those who create positive energy and those who deplete it. Which are you?

This was a quote I heard (can’t remember where) and it made me stop and think... Am I sucking the positive energy out of a room or adding to it? Am I killing the fun and laughter from a situation? Or creating happiness, comfort, and joy? Am I surrounding myself with people who add energy to my life, or suck it all away with negative comments and attitudes?

The secret was the first book I read that started me thinking about my attitude and internal dialogue, and it led me on a path of learning and discovery. I still have work to do, but my life has improved so much, it's unrecognizable from 5 years ago.

Wishing you the best in life
-Frankie

[Shelby]

Marc wrote: "For a moment let's pretend that we are talking about whether or not unicorns exist. While there is little to no scientific evidence to suggest that unicorns are out there hidden in some secret vall..."

I like your observation. Its also fair to say that the same argument can be made for atheism

[Shelby]

Xox wrote: "Shelby wrote: "I like your observation. Its also fair to say that the same argument can be made for atheism "

No you cannot."

Another ignorant atheist.

[Shelby]

♒ ✯ɐɯıʇɐɟ✯ ╰☆╮ wrote: "What everyone is saying right now is practically negative.
Yes, you can't attract everything to yourself but as long as you believe in it, it will drive you to work harder. Doesn't believing in yo..."

Nothing at all.

[[deleted user]]

Shelby wrote: "Another ignorant atheist."

As opposed to being a fool that's been duped by an obvious con?

lol

[Shelby]

Paul wrote: "Shelby wrote: "Another ignorant atheist."

As opposed to being a fool that's been duped by an obvious con?

lol"

WTF!?

This discussion is filled with struggling authors who think criticising another author's work will give them more publicity. (Obviously barking the wrong tree.)

If you want people to buy your books you should start discussions that attract fellow minded people. Here your narrow mindedness just reeks.

Just my advice to you

[Shelby]

LMFAO! You know how to put it Layla!

[Will]

I'm not an author, and regardless, we are allowed to criticize an author's work. Especially when they are conning the money from your pocket by making people believe in gibberish like "Law of Attraction." If this was a book on homeopathy, I would be just as critical, because it's just as absurd. The author knows this and is laughing all the way to the bank.

[[deleted user]]

Shelby wrote: "WTF!?

This discussion is filled with struggling authors who think criticising another author's work will give them more publicity. (Obviously barking the wrong tree.)

If you want people to buy your books you should start discussions that attract fellow minded people. Here your narrow mindedness just reeks.

Just my advice to you "

Nowhere here has anyone promoted any of their work or used their work as a means of comparison to the book being discussed. You are simply making blind accusations because you don't have a leg to stand on when it comes to a thoughtful debate on the issue at hand.

Layla proves the true meaning of this book; nothing matters in the world but success and self-centered happiness, and those who cannot achieve just simply didn't want it enough. And this is viewed as spirituality. Sad, really.

[Frankiejohnny]

Will wrote: "The author knows this and is laughing all the way to the bank."

Since reading this book, and practicing its principles, I was offered a position with a fortune 100 company, they put their employees first, offer 6-8% raises each year (rather than the crap 2% at my old company), and stock options. So if she is laughing all the way to the bank... so am I.