Women and Men discussion
Trying to find a Copy?
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Ian
(last edited Jul 10, 2017 10:37AM)
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Jul 10, 2017 10:32AM
Elusive as ever. News of other things, such as an essay on censorship based on the talk he gave in Kiev at the publication of Cannonball's translation, also news of a Russian translation of PLUS--the essay interrupts work on water--but nothing about W&M release dates... He shared the cover art for the Ukrainian Cannonball, which is black with a black circle featuring a gray halo--evoking both cannonballs and solar eclipses.
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So Barnes & Noble haven't followed up on my order, but I just realized that the Dzanc version is no longer up for sale or preorder, only used copieshttps://m.barnesandnoble.com/w/women-...
Just read this on Reddit. Like honestly, what a bullshit publisher.Just went to the b&n by me. Said not even the warehouse has any copies. The guy looking it up said it's likely Dzanc pushed the date back and didn't bother telling anyone. Oh well. Picked up Women Without Men by Murakami so I feel like I got halfway there
David wrote: "...Picked up Women Without Men by Murakami so I feel like I got halfway there ..."Thanks for the good laugh. :D
Can't find the link anymore, but there is also a group on 4 Chan with a few more details. Basically, some are saying that it was probably a scam to begin with. Theyre probably right
David wrote: "Can't find the link anymore, but there is also a group on 4 Chan with a few more details. Basically, some are saying that it was probably a scam to begin with. Theyre probably right"He actually posted an entire box filled with the paperbacks. I tried looking around for it, but it appears it was deleted or is no longer up. I'm sure others here can remember.
Either way, I wouldn't be holding my breath for this to come out anytime soon (or ever). Best bet is to just buy the OG version if you really want to read it.
Well, looks like it's a library loan for me. Was really hoping for a copy I could write in without feeling bad.
I'm confident it will be released. Dzanc is a very small operation and Joe is doing all the editing himself ; distracted, for better or worse, by the Water book and other projects. I've not heard anything firm about a release date for quite some time (Joe's site still says "Fall 2017"), but I have no reason to doubt it's in the pipeline.@Nick :: I don't recall ever seeing any physical manifestations of this third edition yet. My assumption has been that it is still on Joe's desk. Are you thinking of the manuscript/notes for the Water book? That was on his twitter.
Nathan "N.R." wrote: "@Nick :: I don't recall ever seeing any physical manifestations of this third edition yet. My assumption has been that it is still on Joe's desk. Are you thinking of the manuscript/notes for the Water book? That was on his twitter. "It's been so long, it's entirely possible my memory is failing. Maybe it was for Cannonball... I just recall seeing a large box, with a flap open, and a ton of newly printed books inside.
Was definitely not the water book.
Nick wrote: "Maybe it was for Cannonball..."That sounds familiar.
Nick wrote: "Nathan "N.R." wrote: "@Nick :: I don't recall ever seeing any physical manifestations of this third edition yet. My assumption has been that it is still on Joe's desk. Are you thinking of the manus..."Yeah I believe that was Cannonball, I've seen that somewhere. The only picture I've seen of the new cover is below, and I am pretty sure it's fake, right?
https://i.warosu.org/data/lit/img/008...
Kyle wrote: "The only picture I've seen of the new cover is below, and I am pretty sure it's fake, right?"That's the cover Joe has posted on his own site ::
http://www.josephmcelroy.com/
But it may change before publication.
David wrote: "Can't find the link anymore, but there is also a group on 4 Chan with a few more details. Basically, some are saying that it was probably a scam to begin with. Theyre probably right"I don't know what they're saying. Do you have a link?
Nathan "N.R." wrote: "David wrote: "Can't find the link anymore, but there is also a group on 4 Chan with a few more details. Basically, some are saying that it was probably a scam to begin with. Theyre probably right"..."
I was following the thread, pretty sure it was just someone trolling. Found the thread.
Yeah,I cancelled my order anyway. I'll reorder it, when the new edition is released. I was just really looking forward to it.
Nathan "N.R." wrote: "That's the cover Joe has posted on his own site ::http://www.josephmcelroy.com/
But it may change before publication. "
And let's hope it changes. First the 'paperback only' choice, and then hideous cover art...
Dude can't catch a break.
I will offer to pool money for a privately printed (hardcover) edition of his water book if/when it's FINALLY released, should we have this same paperback abomination on our hands again.
I received an update from Dzanc today. Be assured, the book is still in the works. Joe has been editing this thing with the aim to make it "a version of this book that he can pick up and not find a single mistake in". There is at least one more process of working in his corrections and returning it to him for further possible corrections. Basically, Dzanc is doing the edition that Joe himself will be as pleased with as possible. As to the cover art, it is a painting by his wife and he "feels it captures the book perfectly".
Dzanc does understand the frustrations expressed in this group with the constant delay. It's their frustration too. But again, they are committed to producing an edition that Joe is happy with. I think that's some pretty cool stuff from a publisher.
We don't have a firm release date yet, but I think it's reasonable to expect it by the year's end. If anyone's got any other question, please do let me know. I'll pass them on to Dzanc. Perhaps I should've inquired sooner with them, but basically what they've told me has been my understanding--it's taking some time and it's going to be done to Joe's own standards. [but not to Nick's standard of calf-bound hd ; but at least there'll be a print edition.]
Nathan "N.R." wrote: "it's taking some time and it's going to be done to Joe's own standards. [but not to Nick's standard of calf-bound hd ; but at least there'll be a print edition.] ":( DAMMIT!
**gently strokes W&M Ultramarine spine**
Nick wrote: "**gently strokes W&M Ultramarine spine** "In this day and age, no one is going to produce something that beautiful. Those days are gone....
Nathan "N.R." wrote: "Nick wrote: "**gently strokes W&M Ultramarine spine** "In this day and age, no one is going to produce something that beautiful. Those days are gone...."
Yup.. no way. We're lucky to even get hardcovers nowadays.
Nick wrote: "Yup.. no way. We're lucky to even get hardcovers nowadays. "And though but even those ain't what they used be back in the day. Open an hd and inside, cheap crumbling paper.
off topic, but here's what Joe tweet'd recently ::'from McElroy Kiev talk 5/17 about censorship: readers' "need to steer away from the text a fear of difficulty like thinking for oneself."'
[Being in Kiev where they're working on translating his books is one of the causes of the delay of W&M]
Nathan "N.R." wrote: "off topic, but here's what Joe tweet'd recently ::'from McElroy Kiev talk 5/17 about censorship: readers' "need to steer away from the text a fear of difficulty like thinking for oneself."'
[Bei..."
Also, he's turning the talk in Kiev into an essay which will be also trans. into Russian.
PLUS also seeing a Russian trans.
Speaking of PLUS; anyone got an extra handy they wanna sell for less than the $175 (hb) or $120 (pb, I mean, seriously?) being floated around on the internet? It's the one missing from my collexion.
Ian wrote: "Speaking of PLUS; anyone got an extra handy they wanna sell for less than the $175 (hb) or $120 (pb, I mean, seriously?) being floated around on the internet? It's the one missing from my collexion."Nope. But W&M Dalkey is down to fifty bucks.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listi...
I had to settle for an ex-libris of Plus myself. One of those things.
Nathan "N.R." wrote: "Ian wrote: "Speaking of PLUS; anyone got an extra handy they wanna sell for less than the $175 (hb) or $120 (pb, I mean, seriously?) being floated around on the internet? It's the one missing from ..."I wouldn't mind so much spending the cashola on PLUS to complete the look, but I don't feel right dishing it out when JPM sees not a hay-penny. I'll brood and probably cave once I'm caught up reading the rest of the oeuvre. By then it'll be double today's take.
I found one at a FoL library book store recently, along with some other good titles. Always worth checking your local friends of the library.
I've got some sellers that I've been chatting with for the Dalkey, the one dropped theirs to $50, but I already have the Knopf edition so if anyone wants that one feel free to take it, and if others want some others offers I've been in contact with a few sellers willing to negotiate.
Ian wrote: "I wouldn't mind so much spending the cashola on PLUS to complete the look, but I don't feel right dishing it out when JPM sees not a hay-penny."I think what would benefit Joe most would be anyone at all reading his books. The hay-pennies not so much. But his publisher would probably benefit a bit from your freely given two=bits. The Kindle from Dzanc is only 10 bucks and some money would be routed to where it's been earned.
But basically, wait and watch ; something more reasonably priced is likely to show up. I'll have to put it back on my watch list.
Nathan "N.R." wrote: "We don't have a firm release date yet, but I think it's reasonable to expect it by the year's end."Joe just further confirmed the fall reprint via my latest Instagram post. Still no date, but that's word from publisher and the man himself within a few days, so at least that's something.
Justin wrote: Joe just further confirmed the fall reprint via my latest Instagram post. ..."Good news. Almost was about to try to snap up one of the $50 copies, even though I doubt I would even get around to reading W&M before the fall.
Griffin wrote: "Justin wrote: Joe just further confirmed the fall reprint via my latest Instagram post. ..."Good news. Almost was about to try to snap up one of the $50 copies, even though I doubt I would even g..."
You can still gaze at it lovingly, let it know it's got a good home until you read it. I read it a number of years back, but I give mine a little wink and a nod every morning when I pass my bookshelf before heading into work.
I noticed that the Dzanc Twitter account responded to somebody looking for an update on august 4th."As soon as it's ready, we'll be rushing it to print. Thanks for checking in."
Anyone else hear anything lately?
David wrote: "Anyone else hear anything lately? ."Not yet. But this will be one of the first places to hear when it hits.
So according to Chapters/Indigo, release date is now March 30th 2018https://www.chapters.indigo.ca/en-ca/...
I will eat my first edition of women and men if dzanc ever releases this thing.
David wrote: "So according to Chapters/Indigo, release date is now March 30th 2018https://www.chapters.indigo.ca/en-ca/..."
This has me excited from the author bio: "A volume of his essays, Exponential, has been published in Italy and in expanded form will be forthcoming from Dzanc."
Jason wrote: "I will eat my first edition of women and men if dzanc ever releases this thing."Jason,
I think the hang ups are out of Dzanc's hands, unfortunately. In digitizing the book, I believe artifacts and errors needed to be addressed. In so doing, McElroy has taken the opportunity to do a top-down scrupulous edit/clean-up of the text, which has taken some time, and also gets sidetracked when he has so many other works in the works--there's the nonfiction water book, there are two unfinished novels-in-progress, three plays, he recently had a short story about Citizens United in the lit journal Fiction, the long story Taken from Him published as Kindle Single, and more on the way. I think the guy's just got a lot on his plate--an exciting time to be a McElroy fan, honestly.
Hopefully, if this Spring 2018 date is real, that means Dzanc's going to print with it soon, and putting a little PR behind it to get some attention to it. Jonathan Lethem did a really wonderful introduction for Ancient History: A Paraphase's reprint a few years back. Would be really cool to see someone else weighing in on an even more seminal work with W&M.
Whatever the reasons, we keep getting these release dates and they keep getting pushed back. I stand by my comment.
Yeah, the "About the author" section is much more complete now. The 2018 date seems a bit more legit. With William T Vollmann's non fiction book about climate change coming out around the same time, there will be a lot of reading to be done in a few months from now.
Got another update from Dzanc.-- They are currently working through the final or penultimate version of the files. Close to being finished with the actual editing.
-- March 2018 is the date Dzanc is currently working with. This will give them time to put together some run-up publicity. They want to use this publication event to renew some interest in McElroy in the wider literary community and not just the handful of us hanging out in this group. In other words, they don't want to just release and dump.
-- Fixing the files following the conversion from print to e- has been difficult. Fixing one thing often changed another thing. This wasn't a simple cut-n-paste job. And Joe is being very diligent on getting things exactly the way he wants them, eg, whether to render it 'blond' or 'blonde' (apparently it was both in the earlier editions.) Very detail oriented.
--I've read the book twice and each time I spent six weeks in it despite long reading days. I can only imagine how much time it would take to work through the whole thing a dozen or so times paying such close attention as to detect the blonds and the blondes.
--Patience folks. It's going to be a sweet thing to see Joe back in the literary lights where he belongs. And it feels like the March '18 date is the most solid one we've had yet.
--Bon appétit, Jason! ; )
I'm new to McElroy, having only recently read Cannonball. That mind bending story made me super excited to have Women & Men on pre-order, which is now cancelled due to the repeated delays. However, this most recent delay to March 2018 may actually facilitate putting in some good effort towards coming to know his overall work, which I'm presuming would improve the returns of Women & Men when it is finally encountered next year. And, seriously, one simply must respect your elders, especially The hOLDy trinity Gass/Pynchon/McElroy!!! How do they do it!?So, post finishing my current read, Joseph Cohen's Witz, which sorta ties in well with McElroy given the talk they did together, I'm gearing up to climb McElroy's towering mind and diving/cannonballing/belly flopping! right into the beginning.
October - A Smuggler's Bible
November - Hind's Kidnap: A Pastoral on Faniliar Airs
December - Ancient History: A Paraphase
January - Lookout Cartridge
February - Plus
March - Women & Men!
Should no gaping craters engulf me, I do hope to make it back up to the surface to discuss with all you good folk here at GR.
If they come out with the updated W & M, I’ll reread. I wonder whether it will be just as difficult as with the first reading.
Relatively new to McElroy here, but I found that my university has a beautiful Dalkey edition of Women and Men in its library. Sadly, it appears never to have been taken out (the silver lining being I can have at it whenever I want to!)
Very nice! And welcome to McElroy country.
amazon round up ::Four copies listed as "Acceptable" (ex-libris, heavy wear) from US$60-70).
And, one "Signed By Author! No DJ & has some wear" for US$90.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listi...
And two in that range listed on abe :
https://www.abebooks.com/servlet/Sear...
Aloha wrote: "If they come out with the updated W & M, I’ll reread. I wonder whether it will be just as difficult as with the first reading."Just to clarify. This new third edition will not be substantially different from the first two. The average reader won't notice the slightest difference. What Joe is doing is what is typically done long after an author is dead--establish exactly how each and every letter should be shaped. This is mostly a matter of the difference between "blond" and "blonde". Nothing of substance will be different.
Nathan "N.R." wrote: "amazon round up ::Four copies listed as "Acceptable" (ex-libris, heavy wear) from US$60-70).
And, one "Signed By Author! No DJ & has some wear" for US$90.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing..."
There's a clean copy that's been up on ebay for over a month for $70. I'm sure they'd take less at this point.
Hello all - I have been going through the papers and library of a deceased relative here in NYC and among the library are a number of quite rare books in mint condition.One of them is Women and Men. 1987 Knopf, not a single mark inside the tome, neither pencil nor pen, not a smudge. Not a single marking to the dust jacket nor a single tear.
It is hardcover, mint condition. I seldom use this site but if you are interested message me here, direct message me, and I will provide e-mail w/ multiple pictures of the text as well.
I wanted to try my luck here with some passionate McElroy fans before posting it at a set price on misc. other vendor sites. I am looking to sell this mint condition Women and Men asap, preferably within some days, and I am totally negotiable pricewise.
Sincerely,
Dr. J. Cohen
Women and Men
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