The perception that everybody had at that time was that the Toyota Production System just worked people to death. It was just basically "Speed up!" In fact, I remember the first meeting we had in the union hall with union leadership and there was this gentleman by the name of Gus Billy. He was sitting at the end of the table and we were talking about the Toyota Production System and kaizen, etc. He said, "It sounds like a production speed-up to me. It's the whole concept of making all these suggestions, trying to suggest your way out of a job."