Katelyn’s Comments (group member since Jan 07, 2016)

Katelyn’s comments from the Our Shared Shelf group.

Kori wrote: "Daniela wrote: "@Kori

Well first of I study cultur and social anthropology and we did learn some things about colonialism and racism. It's just something that I recognised in the book.
Missionar..."

I'm with you. I enjoyed the stories that Nettie shared in her letters, but because I have reservations about missions in general, I had a much harder time sympathizing with Nettie, Corrine, and Samuel, compared with the people in Celie's letters. For example, all of the discussion of the ritual face scarring just... mostly made me feel conflicted. Ultimately I felt sorry for everyone because it seemed like Tashi had regrets about it, but the whole thing was so fraught with colonial imposition of values. Would Tashi's regrets have been as profound if not for the presence of missionaries (with whom she had formed solid friendships)? That being said, it was nice to find out that girls were being educated toward the end of the book. I can't help but remain ethnocentric (if that's the word that best applies here. I'm tired and my brain has been slow today as it is!) when it comes to gender equality in education and the like.

I'm not saying that the increase is only because of increased diagnoses, although diagnosis alone increase about 20% each year (although 80% of people in the U.S. with symptoms of depression go untreated and undiagnosed). The numbers are, however, skewed by the fact that we don't have an accurate record of depression throughout history. So it is simply inaccurate to say that throughout history there have never been as many depressed people. We have no way of knowing that. And we certainly cannot compare how it manifested in individuals or how they coped with it to how it manifested and is coped with today.

Elena wrote: "But societies throughout History have never had so many depressed people. This is an endemic problem of our society. People in the past had lots of problems, fundamentally bigger than ours, and thi..."

This is a fallacy, actually. The reason that instances of depression, anxiety, and other mental health diagnoses have increased significantly in the past couple of decades is because of a decreasing stigma. More people are seeking help. Furthermore, there are always new ways of treating and diagnosing mental health issues, so doctors are identifying this more and more. I've noticed on college campuses in recent years, health centers and administration have become more proactive in identifying and treating depression.

It's like the vaccines and autism debate. Some claim that an increase in autism diagnoses relates to an increase in vaccines, but it is actually the result of an expansion of what constitutes an autism spectrum disorder, and it is becoming more recognizable, diagnosable, and treatable!

Erin wrote: "Katelyn wrote: "Erin wrote: "Controversy over Steinem and Albright - Everyone needs to get off their high horse - if you see the Albright video, it's hilarious - it's a damn joke. Tosh.O makes a ga..."

Most were formed as questions for her in regards to her comments. The subject of this thread is the event with Gloria Steinem, and questions that members would like Emma to ask in her interview.

As I pointed out in my last post, there is a thread devoted to discussing this topic elsewhere on the board (I linked to it in my last post). This isn't the proper place for a debate, as we are looking to gather questions for the interview. You are welcome to discuss Steinem's comments on Maher's show in the appropriate thread.

Aglaea wrote: "Katelyn wrote: "Aglaea wrote: "I don't care if people like a particular book, but let's at least be honest about what is going on, rather than paint a picture of unicorns and rainbows."

Precisely!..."

I bet there are many authors that write BDSM better than it is written in a book that started off as Twilight fan fiction. No doubt! hah.

I guess 50 Shades is a bit more mainstream, which is probably why it is picked up by so many women who probably wouldn't have been interested in BDSM otherwise... and from what i understand, this is a real problem because it is depicted rather problematically.

I think there's something interesting, culturally, that happened during those few months where every woman was carrying around this book and proudly reading it in public despite its known sexual content. Most of the women I know who read and enjoyed it would not normally be the type to openly read or discuss something like that, but they did in this case. Why? How did that affect public perception of female sexuality? I remember there being some reaction like "Oh, women like porn type stuff, too? Who knew?!"

Thanks you for your brave post (and everyone else, as well)! I am glad that this community has been helpful so far.

I've had lots of anxiety-related health problems, and it took many years of failing to manage symptoms to realize that the cause was much deeper. I've had periods of depression, although never officially diagnosed, and the anxiety is a pretty much a constant. But I found that for me, the first step was realizing that it is not something I can control, and that acceptance allowed me to relax a little. I did not have to feel responsible for the way my body treats me and reacts to things.

I've also learned to be open about my struggles, and to speak about it very casually. I've come to find that so many, perhaps even a majority, of my friends have similar issues. This of course depends on your social circle (some hold on to the stigma more steadfastly than others), but if nothing else, this is a good place to practice!

Not to mention, books have always been a positive escape for me. My worst period of anxiety was at a time when I did not have the time to read... instead, I threw myself into work that needed to get done (also helpful and relaxing for me actually, but not as much).

Aglaea wrote: "I don't care if people like a particular book, but let's at least be honest about what is going on, rather than paint a picture of unicorns and rainbows."

Precisely! It's totally okay to enjoy problematic things as long as you acknowledge said problems (this applies in the other thread about old movies as well). I have many guilty pleasures, and I am happy to defend something for its entertainment value, if not for its content. Which is why I acknowledge that Twilight (despite being atrociously written) is entertaining, and the main problem I have with it is its target audience. At least 50 Shades is for adults who (should theoretically) have a better grasp on what is healthy and what is not (although I realize this is totally not true and the story is still quite damaging). I've not read 50 shades, so I can't comment on its entertainment value beyond the fact that most adult women I know enjoyed it and felt that reading it in public was a bit of a rebellion (due to the graphic sexual content), so that's something interesting, I think.

RachelvlehcaR wrote: "Katelyn, I understand your point of view but it really boils down to the publisher and not Steinem, which makes the Taylor Swift comparison not accurate. I'm a huge fan about getting the informatio..."

Thanks for the links! I didn't mean that it was Steinem's decision, and I realize that it is mostly Amazon protecting Amazon's interests, I just meant that it does have the benefit of helping the author, who already loses money when people purchase ebooks (because of the unfair percentages compared to print), and even more when it is part of the Unlimited offerings (which is what I meant with my Spotify comparison).

I am 24. I have been in a years-long relationship, yes. Why does this make it appropriate for people to ask if I want to have kids or get married? They are very personal questions, and I find myself getting defensive and putting my guard up when people ask me about those things. I'm like "I'm 24! Even if I knew for sure I wanted those things, why would I be thinking about that now?!" I'll probably get married eventually, because of the many legal benefits to couples who do, but I genuinely do not know if I want kids. Actually, I leave towards not wanting them, but again, I am 24 years old! Of course I don't want them now, but I can't know what I'll feel in 10 years.

I like how later in the book, (view spoiler)[we see that the girls in the tribe start to attend school. When Nettie leaves Africa, there are a lot of terrible things going on in the way of colonialism, but this evolution in attitudes toward gender and education is very hopeful. (hide spoiler)]

btw, I love that you've started a bilingual thread, Maika! Hopefully more French-speakers will join in. Wish I could translate my thoughts like you did.

Julie wrote: "Waw, it's interesting the debate around Mr.____

Am I the only one who thinks that Mr. is finally a great hope in this story ? I thought at first he was some kind of desperate feminist who will nev..."

You might want to use spoiler tags in case people haven't read to the end yet.

But I totally agree with you! (view spoiler)[ He certainly shouldn't be forgiven completely for all that he did to Celie, but his redemption in that end was very uplifting and hopefully. Like you said, it makes me believe that we can make even the worst offenders realize that what they did was wrong! (hide spoiler)]

P.S. When you say feminist in your post, do you mean sexist? ;)

Henriette wrote: "I'm danish :)
I read the book in english as a young teenager, and it was a hard read. It was hard to grasp the sentences, but it was also a great experience. And I think I would be able to read it ..."

Wow, that note from the translator is fascinating! I really appreciate that they made such an effort to recognize that incorporating dialect into the translation could be disrespectful (not that is necessarily would be, but there is certainly a distinct possibility, and it's nice that the translator acknowledged this).

What strikes me specifically (as a musicologist, and I'm going off topic here so sorry about that) is that the example the translator uses to indicate the dialect that was used by the author is "negro spirituals." Is that something that would give Danish readers a reference for what the dialect should be like? Spirituals are well-known enough for that to be useful?

Jasmine, you mention purple's connection with magic, and I think this applies here as well. At least in the sense that magic can be seen as a type of spirituality, or another way of explaining miracles. I think for Celie and Shug, purple is a miracle. Some kind of sign from God, or a way that it shows its love. Shug says, "I think God gets pissed off when you walk by the colour purple in a field and don't notice."

I like the connotations that everyone else made, as well. Associations between color and concept are indeed cultural, though there are natural connotations as well, of course (as mentioned: leaves, flowers, etc.).

Never said anything about anger being a bad thing. It can definitely be useful. But as I said in my comment (which I thought was rather clear), the problem is with the stereotype, which often assumes that feminism draws from a place of irrational anger. Our Shared Shelf demonstrates that an international cohort of feminist readers can discuss charged issues thoughtfully and respectfully, while also expressing anger, sadness, frustration, and all kinds of negative emotions. We can maintain a sense of urgency and high stakes while still being decorous and polite. Sometimes a more aggressive approach is useful and necessary, but not all feminists approach every issue this way, and I think a book club is a perfect place to expand our thought, collaborate, and develop ideas in a comfortable and supportive space.

Emily, you can also add those quotes to the thread that was started to collect everyone's favorite quotes in the book! If you haven't already, that is :)

I think it's an effort to make sure that the author is compensated for her work. Already when it comes to books, authors receive a much smaller percent of the price than they do from print sales. It's a huge problem that needs to be addressed. For now, by removing them from Kindle Unlimited, both Steinem and Amazon are benefitted. Steinem, more importantly. It's kind of like Taylor Swift removing her music from Spotify. At a certain point, artists were not being compensated fairly given the amount of music that was being streamed. Similar in this case, I think, aside from the fact that Amazon also stands to benefit, in addition to the writer.

Yay! Excellent!

No one is saying that a woman shouldn't vote for a woman, or saying that it is bad for that to be a factor in your decision about who to vote for. Certainly, I appreciate Clinton's perspective on issues as a woman and that is an important part of what has made her such an admirable public figure.

The problem is when we expect a woman will vote for another woman because she is a woman.

You make a lot of good points, but I disagree that we should forgive and forget with Steinem and Albright. I feel strongly that we need to hold such influential women accountable for what they say publicly. Their words are important and hold a lot of weight for feminists everywhere.

I don't know anything about Tosh.0 other than that he is a comedian. I'm not saying he sjhouldn't be taken to task for saying misogynistic things, but he as a comedian, he gets a bit more slack when making jokes. Neither Steinem nor Albright is a comedian, and that is why their "jokes" are taken far more seriously. I agree that we should support other women, but that doesn't include turning a blind eye when they do or say something damaging.

I'll also just mention that the way the media has hyped all of these things is obviously ridiculous, and it's unfortunate that it's taking focus from the real issues that politicians should be judged on. It's a shame that it is making people reconsider their votes. I think both candidates would agree.

I loved reading everyone's responses here! I had many of the same feelings and thoughts as I was reading.

I gave the book 5 stars. Here's my review: https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...

When the Celie signed her letter with the name of her pants business, I felt so triumphant for her! I cheered out loud!

Lots of good points! I think, generally speaking, social media is a good thing for feminism and other social causes. The issues reach a wider demographic of people, many of whom would not have had the opportunity to engage with new ideas.

I am positively addicted to comment sections. It's definitely unhealthy. But I also like to take is as a dose of reality. My personal news feeds and RL social circles are generally composed of like-minded people. Comment sections are a great way to remind myself that we still have a ton of work to do, and it gives me an idea of what people have to say who think differently than I do.

As far as social media as superficial and related to social pressure, that is definitely one aspect. But I'm inclined to believe that it's no worse than it is IRL. Whether online or in school (or work or wherever else), you have the opportunity to cultivate the kinda of people you spend time with and listen to. Obviously there's a necessity in interacting with others as well, but I don't think it's much higher on the internet than it is in everyday life.

I also like participating in online debates. I don't have to raise my voice, I can spend some time thinking about what I want to say, and I can formulate a full thought without being cut off. Sure, people may not read it or listen, but that's, again, not much different than what I've experienced in real life. It's nice to be challenged by people who I don't know, because I don't have to be polite because I'm worried about awkwardness, haha.

Anyway, I love social media and the internet. I think ultimately, the effects are overwhelmingly positive. Not to mention, it's absolutely essential at this point in time for social movements to utilize social media, so regardless, it's so important. AND... it brought us all together on Goodreads and Our Shared Shelf!!! :)

I'm not yet clear on my plans immediately prior to and after the event, but if members of OSS who attend the event are planning to meet up after, that would be the easiest way for me to meet everyone, even if I'm a bit late. Not that anyone should change their plans for my benefit ;)