Geoff > Status Update

Geoff wrote: "I say the same thing all the time, friend. "

I was truly terrified of him. No way he loses. No way. Hillary was the greatest gift.

Wow, this has come to a pretty pass. So we can all agree Bernie would have won, and Clinton was a terrible choice for the Democrats?

(calling down the wrath of Wastrel?)

David wrote: "Wow, this has come to a pretty pass. So we can all agree Bernie would have won, and Clinton was a terrible choice for the Democrats?

(calling down the wrath of Wastrel?)"

This was my contention all along. Because Bernie actually addressed the issues Trump voters were concerned with, but you know, in ways that would help solve them, rather than exacerbate them.

Should go without saying that I wish he'd run, yet surprised so many (including Nick) are confident he'd have won.

But then it wouldn't have needed a very large percentage of the vote.

As another GR friend said elsewhere... Did anyone make a restore point around the start of January 2016?

David wrote: "Wow, this has come to a pretty pass. So we can all agree Bernie would have won, and Clinton was a terrible choice for the Democrats?

(calling down the wrath of Wastrel?)"

Only the delusional think Bernie loses to Trump. Hillary lost because enthusiasm sucked and people stayed home.

Bernie had enthusiasm in spades. At least on par with Trump... but without the incredible hatred. Hard to see how that doesn't win out.

Nick wrote: "David wrote: "Wow, this has come to a pretty pass. So we can all agree Bernie would have won, and Clinton was a terrible choice for the Democrats?

(calling down the wrath of Wastrel?)"

Only the ..."

I think there's a bit of underestimation here of the negatives that Sanders would have faced in this country because of his avowed socialism. (This coming from one who gave money more than once to Sanders campaign, and surely would have voted for him.) Uh ... "socialism" and "communism" basically mean the same thing to probably a majority in this country.

The opposition wouldn't have needed "fake news" to blast Sanders, and I have serious doubts he could have handled it in debates well enough to have defused it, laid it aside.

Ted wrote: "I think there's a bit of underestimation here of the negatives that Sanders would have faced in this country because of his avowed socialism. (This coming from one who gave money more than once to Sanders campaign, and surely would have voted for him.) Uh ... "socialism" and "communism" basically mean the same thing to probably a majority in this country."

As someone who holds the exact opposite of his economic views, I agree with you to an extent. But I think hatred of Trump would've overcome his economic shortcomings.

I don't think he came across particularly well against Cruz in the recent health care debate... then again, I don't think anyone can beat Cruz head to head in a debate. As much as I want to punch the guy in the face, I love watching his debating skills in action.

I don't think Trump would've been able to take advantage of Bernie in the debates like a Cruz could have. No matter what he or anyone else says, Trump is an absolutely shit debater. And his biggest weakness is properly pouncing on GAPING holes in opponents arguments. Hillary set herself up time after time and he missed them 9/10 times.

Niklas wrote: "Of course you can't compare them, and I don't know if Trump did but I am only stating that the levels of immigration into Sweden has led to a high increase in crime and massive social problems..."

I can see that it's a difficult situation and people are worried. But there is still something completely unreasonable about Trump holding up Sweden as an example of what can happen when you let Middle Eastern refugees into a country, given that the US is far more dangerous.

The critical question of course is whether Sweden can get these problems under control. The country has a good track record of assimilating immigrants and turning them into normal Swedish citizens, and in general is good at social engineering. What are people at government level saying? What programs are in place to address the issues? I'd be surprised if nothing was being done.

And, getting back to the racism of all republicans...

Well, okay, it's only reasonable to assume that not all people who voted for Trump are racist in terms of what they believe, but as Geoff suggests (maybe in better words than I will choose), electing a racist is in itself a sort of racist act. Similarly, not all Trump voters are idiots, but electing an idiot is in itself a sort of idiotic act.

As for the field of republican candidates for president who shared the stage with Trump during their early debates, the majority of them were advocating harsh-to-extreme anti-immigration policies, they were hyping up fear of the other, and Trump just took the mainstream Republican talking points and made them louder and more outrageous. They were mostly deplorable, and some (Ben Carson and Chris Christie for instance) were nearly as horrific as Trump himself (actually... can you imagine if either of them were president... ech...). I'd probably have voted for Lincoln Chafee over anyone on that stage, even though he came across as a weak, naive simpleton, and even though he's recently made the fool move of speaking up in defense of Trump against the media (wow!) Basically, I'm saying give me the worst of the Democrats against the best of the Republicans, and I'd have likely voted for the Democrat even though I'm not a Democrat myself.

As for the members of my own family (anecdotal time) who voted for, or may have voted for Trump (not everyone is outspoken about these things), I'd say no one flings around the word "nigger", nor do they express hostility towards minorities. But they're skittish and worried a lot, and easily swayed to believe that it's time to Make American Great Again, which means safe in a Leave-It-To-Beaver way, and never mind that was only a TV show. I don't think they have a very high comfort level when it comes to living next to dark-skinned folks, and they are likely to view Muslims and immigrants as threats and problems. So is that "racist"? Or is that just willing-to-get-behind-a-racist-who-promises-to-make-the-threat-go-away?

But yeah, again, to be fair, the majority of "mainstream Republicans" (though, are they the mainstream anymore when they're the minority in their own party) who voted for Trump did so for the very basic reason that he was the Republican candidate and they vote Republican. I mean, that simplifies things, right?

Which is kind of why I was sickened when Trump won the Republican primary. I was already depressed and angry about that without having to wait or imagine that he would actually become president!

Zadignose wrote: "electing a racist is in itself a sort of racist act.."

The jump you make here is quite astounding...

"But yeah, again, to be fair, the majority of "mainstream Republicans" (though, are they the mainstream anymore when they're the minority in their own party) who voted for Trump did so for the very basic reason that he was the Republican candidate and they vote Republican. I mean, that simplifies things, right?"

It's much more than the fact that he has an "R" next to his name.

Niklas wrote: "...but I am only stating that the levels of immigration into Sweden has led to a high increase in crime and massive social problems...."

But is this true? It could be, but the stats that have been brought to my attention so far state that there has been no increase in violent crime in Sweden as a result of recent immigration, and that the violent crime rate was somewhat higher in 2012 than it is today.

The stats also suggest that the only form of violent crime to have shown a significant recent increase is rape, but this has been explained by a recent legal change in the definition of rape and how it is measured in statistics, and there's no indication of a connection between sex crimes and immigrants as perpetrators. Did Syrian refugees somehow convince native Swedes to start raping more?

Actually... how often are the refugees the victims of the crimes and natives the perpetrators?

Even thought it's not actually true that Trump was a principled critic of the Iraq war, I think a Trump voter could still claim that at least he wasn't as pro-war as Clinton.

Just as a vote for Clinton was not necessarily a vote for more war in the Middel East, a vote for Trump was not necessarily a vote for more racist violence in our own country.

Just trying to be generous towards my fellow citizens...

Nick wrote: "...It's much more than the fact that he has an "R" next to his name...."

Really? Well, what is it then? It seems that a Republican would vote for him either because of what he represents individually--taking in the whole package of insanity, xenophobia, etc.--or despite what he represents--either because he will lend power to their party, or will represent some of their values, such as reduced taxation, or because he will deny power to the Democrats, i.e., voting along party lines.

If it's not one of these, what is it?

http://www.dsausa.org/

Become a member. Organize.

Dronestar wrote: "http://www.dsausa.org/"

Right on! I joined shortly after the election.

(ISO is also cool http://www.internationalsocialist.org/)

Niklas wrote: "and I don't know if Trump did but I am only stating that the levels of immigration into Sweden has led to a high increase in crime and massive social problems. "

Setting aside stats and their interpretation (and that's simply because I know nothing about Sweden or its immigrant/refugee community), my theory is that when a large number of people move from one place to another in a short span of time there are bound to be problems, especially when migrating community is largely comprised of refugees and survivors of violence. It doesn't matter where they come from. Those people have precarious existence and it is inevitable that some would carry their harsh ways into the countries they migrate to. Not many people know that Pakistan hosts the largest population of refugees anywhere in the world and has done so for the last 30 odd years. There has been a similar rise in violent crime (kidnappings, robbery etc) with the great influx of Afghans refugees uprooted from their lands and scattered to the four winds.

This is a problem and it needs comprehensive and long-term solution (one of which is to stop playing war games in a region that doesn't want you there). But in the hands of people like Trump, Le Pen, Farage et al this becomes a springboard to launch their own racism and bigotry in the name of public good. So when Trump cites these "look at what's happening blah blah..." I don't think decent people should listen to him. He doesn't have a solution nor any of his far right-wing buddies across the Atlantic have it.

Jibran wrote: "This is a problem and it needs comprehensive and long-term solution (one of which is to stop playing war games in a region that doesn't want you there) ."

Word.

It might be possible to have more sympathy for western civilization if we hadn't done so much to bomb, invade, and generally destabilize these countries in the first place.

Jibran wrote: "Niklas wrote: "and I don't know if Trump did but I am only stating that the levels of immigration into Sweden has led to a high increase in crime and massive social problems. "

Setting aside stats..."

Exactly, Jibran. Very good comment. Also possible that some refugees are bringing personal feuds from the old place with them, and these are causing part of the violence in new refugee areas.

y'all might enjoy this: http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2017...

For those who care, I'm currently predicting a Le Pen victory...

Nick wrote: "For those who care, I'm currently predicting a Le Pen victory..."

I was in Paris the day Hollande won and was down with the crowds in Place de la Bastille with the socialists drinking champagne in the street and setting off fireworks. Look how far we've come..

Geoff wrote: "Nick wrote: "For those who care, I'm currently predicting a Le Pen victory..."

I was in Paris the day Hollande won and was down with the crowds in Place de la Bastille with the socialists drinking..."

Well, no polls currently show her winning. I'm just taking the brexit/trump surprise vote into consideration here... and how the market has been selling off french bonds vs. german bunds.

Manny wrote: "The critical question of course is whether Sweden can get these problems under control. The country has a good track record of assimilating immigrants and turning them into normal Swedish citizens, and in general is good at social engineering. What are people at government level saying? What programs are in place to address the issues? I'd be surprised if nothing was being done."

Both the current (Social Democrat) and the previous (Centre-Right) government have spent countless millions on various projects for integration, most of which have failed utterly. Latest estimates show that it takes approximately nine years for only half of all refugees to find employment. So half of all asylum seekers who came way back in 2008 are still unemployed. In 2009 it was estimated to take seven years, so integration into the job market is definitely getting worse and worse.

Swedish source: https://www.svensktnaringsliv.se/frag...

Zadignose wrote: "But is this true? It could be, but the stats that have been brought to my attention so far state that there has been no increase in violent crime in Sweden as a result of recent immigration"

I'm not sure where you are getting your stats from, but according to the Swedish National Council for Crime Prevention (BRÅ) from 2014 - 2015 there have been a 25% increase in "deadly violence".

There seems to be a lot of confusion over our laws regarding sexual crimes abroad, but it has most definitely increased dramatically in the last few years. Where women have been the victims, the amount of sexual crimes were relatively stable from 2005 - 2012, but suddenly shot up in the last few years.

In the summer of 2016, some months after the initial 2015 refugee crisis, the number of sexual crime reports went through the roof. For example, during all of Sweden's summer festivals in 2015 the number of reported sex crimes numbered only ten (10) in all. In 2016 they increased to one-hundred and eleven (111).

Swedish sources: https://www.bra.se/bra/brott-och-stat...
http://www.bra.se/bra/nytt-fran-bra/a...
http://sverigesradio.se/sida/artikel....

Jibran wrote: "Setting aside stats and their interpretation (and that's simply because I know nothing about Sweden or its immigrant/refugee community)..."

Jibran, I completely agree with you and I am not putting any blame on anyone. I am merely lamenting the fact that Sweden has taken on a greater responsibility than it could ever hope to handle. Our welfare state was not designed for this kind of immense pressure it is currently experiencing and I am afraid that it will collapse within the next few years.

The problem is that people are desperate for a solution, any kind of solution. And right now the right-wing populists are the only ones offering one at all.

David wrote: "It might be possible to have more sympathy for western civilization if we hadn't done so much to bomb, invade, and generally destabilize these countries in the first place."

Boy, I sure love bearing that collective guilt of Western civilization even though Sweden has done nothing wrong.

Nick wrote: "Geoff wrote: "Nick wrote: "For those who care, I'm currently predicting a Le Pen victory..."

I was in Paris the day Hollande won and was down with the crowds in Place de la Bastille with the socia..."

Oh I agree with you, I was just taking the ironic tone - "look how far we've come, from Hollande to Le Pen"

Niklas... what's amazing you are literally the only one going public with this info. If you look anywhere else online (ex right-wing websites) it's denial denial denial. Even most people from your country pretend everything is all roses. Don't believe me? See the reddit post that blew up in response to Trump's Sweden comments.

Nick wrote: "Niklas... what's amazing you are literally the only one going public with this info. If you look anywhere else online (ex right-wing websites) it's denial denial denial. Even most people from your ..."

I don't think that is quite true Nick. I have actually seen some interesting discussions of the complex issues Sweden is facing. I think the real critique of Trump, and why it has become such a meme, is that he saw some segment on Fox and then made some (untrue) reference to something "happening" in Sweden last night (the clear, intended, inference being some sort of terror attack). It was an idiotic and irresponsible thing to do.

Jonathan wrote: "I don't think that is quite true Nick. I have actually seen some interesting discussions of the complex issues Sweden is facing."

You could very well be right. I'm just going off of what I hear... snippets here and there. I won't pretend to have a solid grasp of what's going on there.

I think my favorite Trump/Fox News bit is when he's talk to the press on his first air force one flight and the 588-2300 Empire commercial is full blast in the background.

The hellish barren burning Mad Max-style dystopia of Sweden must be wrested from the hands of raping pillaging water and grain hoarding gangs that control the frightened, decimated population forced to turn whores and mercenaries in the blood-drenched streets of foul, reeking Stockholm, where corpses rise to the smoldering sky and rats feed on human flesh and rule the night!

Ted wrote: "Exactly, Jibran. Very good comment. Also possible that some refugees are bringing personal feuds from the old place with them, and these are causing part of the violence in new refugee areas. "

Yes, it's happening. There have been incidents of Salafis attacking Shias in London. Shia businesses in Australia have been set upon by bands of angry Salafis over the Syrian war. Two Libyan refugees from different tribes taking opposite political positions in the mess back home ended up knifing each other somewhere in Europe. Can't remember where. If you do a quick google search you'll find these incidents. For instance:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-06-04...

Perhaps immigrant-on-immigrant crime is bigger than the immigrant-on-indigenous crime.

Nick wrote: "You could very well be right. I'm just going off of what I hear... snippets here and there. I won't pretend to have a solid grasp of what's going on there."

Trump could say that word for word but he's not humble like you. What can we expect from a "precedent" who gets his foreign policy briefings from Fox News lol.

Sweden is not utopia, guys! There's capitalists there too!

Jibran wrote: "Trump could say that word for word but he's not humble like you. What can we expect from a "precedent" who gets his foreign policy briefings from Fox News lol. ."

Well when I watch news tv, especially election coverage, it's only Fox News. I can't stand the other networks... they're absolute shit. And it only has a little to do with the bias but almost entirely on the contributors being utter morons with no personality.

EDIT: the one person I care most about is Krauthammer... the undisputed best contributor on any network. And he's on Fox. So there I go.

The notion of Krauthammer fanboyism just made me lol. You do you, Nick.

Man, Steve Bannon really looks sick, like whatever evil got into his gut or like scrotum and worked its way into his brain is slowly devouring his body face-first. But again Trump kinda looks like a cheeseburger that got left out in the rain overnight, so you know. La di da I love ad hominem attacks on ideological opponents. Oh but hey at CPAC today Bannon finally admitted he's totally into Deconstruction - whomever on this thread or the other one about Derrida and Hegel being the cause of the rise of Trumpism turned out to be 100% TOTALLY RIGHT:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/p...

By the way, one of my favorite AU COURANT phrases is "crazier than a shithouse rat" - it comes in handy so often these days! Or, comes in often so handy these days. Also, science is gonna save us all. La di da this thread, and life, goes on and on..

I've heard the variation 'meaner than a shithouse rat.' I really like.

David wrote: "I've heard the variation 'meaner than a shithouse rat.' I really like."

Both are well-suited to our epoch.

But I'm not sure that one's "au courant"

"Trump administration is in unending battle for ‘deconstruction of the administrative state’"

All I could find at short notice on the front of 'Derrida' and 'administration' is :: Derridean deconstruction is a significant resource for public administration thinking and practice. It facilitates antiadministration, for example. This article recognizes the severe difficulties that deconstruction presents. Yet, it supports the claim that deconstruction can help public administration. It does so by exploring the nature of deconstruction, by illustrating how bureaucratic deconstruction can be used in public administration and how it is useful, and by analyzing the most significant of deconstruction's difficulties.
http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/1...

'Deconstruction' and 'administration' return the Bannon thing at the top.

And then there's The Administrative State for which there is a helpful wikipedia article ::
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Adm...

But I think what he's getting at is that he wants to replace any form of democratic government with The State. These people are evil.

Geoff wrote: "But I'm not sure that one's "au courant""

It may not be au courant, but it does have a certain je ne sais quoi.

Nathan "N.R." wrote: ""Trump administration is in unending battle for ‘deconstruction of the administrative state’"

All I could find at short notice on the front of 'Derrida' and 'administration' is :: Derridean decons..."

Damn that's au courant. I would love it if it turned out they were trying to use deconstruction to critique the Administrative State. That would be a twist! And would be crazier than a shithouse rat.

Geoff wrote: "Deconstruction..."

I knew it was all Derrida's fault.

howl of minerva wrote: "Geoff wrote: "Deconstruction..."

I knew it was all Derrida's fault."

All this au courant deconstruction of the administrative state can be directly linked back to Kant's second antinomy. For those of you fuckin' plebs unfamiliar with it, here I'll recite it out of memory, not from wikipedia!

Thesis : Every composite substance in the world is made up of simple parts, and nothing anywhere exists save the simple or what is composed of the simple.

Antithesis : No composite thing in the world is made up of simple parts, and there nowhere exists in the world anything simple.

Suck on it, transgender bathroom rights!

By the way, it's 75 degrees today, Feb. 23 2017 in Washington DC. That's not normal. Good thing we're about to deconstruct the EPA into fucking nonexistence. La di da all this has such a je ne sais quoi about it. A shithouse rat might be both mean and crazy.

The two leading Swedish dailies are pretty annoyed about the article by the far-right Sverigedemokraterna in the WSJ. The government is accusing them of intentionally destroying Sweden's good reputation for political ends, and says that many of their claimed facts are incorrect. In particular, they say that there are no "no go zones".

We should be in Stockholm this summer for a conference, maybe we'll just have to go check it out for ourselves. I see there is a chess club in Rinkeby, where the riots occurred the other day.

Manny wrote: "The two leading Swedish dailies are pretty annoyed about the article by the far-right Sverigedemokraterna in the WSJ. The government is accusing them of intentionally destroying Sweden's good reput..."

Manny, next time you post, could you please incorporate the phrases "au courant", "je ne sais quoi", and "crazier than a shithouse rat" or "meaner than a shithouse rat"? Thanks if not I might have to flag that comment.

Manny wrote: "In particular, they say that there are no "no go zones"."

There has been some minor debate in Sweden recently about what exactly a "no go zone" is. It's supposedly originally a military term about rebel controlled areas. Recently it's been appropriated into civilian use to mean areas where police are unable to uphold the law or where the very presence of police units sparks violent actions, which there are several of in Sweden.

I too read the article in DN about the Minister of Justice accusing the Sweden Democrats of slandering Sweden's good name. However, and I quote, "He could, however, not point out any factual errors in the published article".

I highly recommend visiting Rinkeby for the genuine Swedish experience.

Niklas wrote: "Manny wrote: "In particular, they say that there are no "no go zones"."

There has been some minor debate in Sweden recently about what exactly a "no go zone" is. It's supposedly originally a milit..."

This article in today's Svenska Dagbladet says that there are obvious factual errors in the WSJ article.

I've just been checking out the Facebook page for Rinkeby's public library. There are some terrifying videos of immigrants explaining the rules of chess in heavily accented Swedish and little girls in hijabs reading poetry. Despite this, I may find the courage to pay them a visit.

(Sorry Geoff, those little girls look meaner than shithouse rats. But I still think they have a certain je ne sais quoi, or do I mean jag vet inte vad?)

Geoff wrote: "La di da this thread, and life, goes on and on.. "

Donald stays at home and does his pretty face
And in the evening he's a tweeter with his hand