Neil deGrasse Tyson > Quotes > Quote > Petra X liked it
“The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.”
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Science is always evolving and is the continuing study of learning more about the world around us, which makes it in a constant state of change. At one time 'scientists' of the day thought the world was flat, and the planets and sun revolved around the earth. At one time 'scientists' thought the atom was the smallest particle occurring in nature. (now it's the quark). Medical guidelines based on science are always changing as well. I'm a little surprised that such an esteemed astrophysicist would say this. Then again I'm certainly not a scientist! (My college physics teacher would attest to that!)
The Daydreamologist - Science overall is always true, the details do change, but that's because as Terry Cornell says, science is ever-evolving towards more knowledge, more 'truth'. Religion is always faith, never 'true' in that provable sense. And certainly for some religions, or perhaps sections of all would rather remain, or retreat, into the the dark ages of superstition, a spy camera in the sky whom no sin escapes and a denial of science if it doesn't fit what the spy camera once told someone a millenia or two ago.
Petra-X wrote: "The Daydreamologist - Science overall is always true, the details do change, but that's because as Terry Cornell says, science is ever-evolving towards more knowledge, more 'truth'. Religion is alw..."I still don't believe that "Science overall is always true", as you say, because science itself contradicted that by being subject to change, by "revolving". Yes, it does always aim to find the truth, but that doesn't mean it always reaches it.
Also:
And all our models and theories are representations and approximations of reality as we see it. That is not truth.
-Paul M. Sutter
As to religion, I'd rather we didn't discuss it. People can believe what they want and I'll believe what I want. Why they do that is none of my business, and why I do is none of theirs, as long as the rights of each of us aren't violated by the beliefs of the other.
Also it would be such a headache 😅.
Petra-X wrote: "The Daydreamologist - Science overall is always true, the details do change, but that's because as Terry Cornell says, science is ever-evolving towards more knowledge, more 'truth'. Religion is alw..."Love your words! Science is true in the moment. Until we learn something new that changes it.
The Daydreamologist wrote: "As to religion, I'd rather we didn't discuss it....."Something else good about science is that it's always changing, as we learn more, science evolves. The bad thing about religion is it always stays the same. And everyone believes that their version of it, one god, many gods, this book, that book, god likes us to kill people, god wants us not to eat this, and all that is immutable truth, now and forever more. Amen.
Petra-X wrote: "The bad thing about religion is it always stays the same. And everyone believes that their version of it, one god, many gods, this book, that book, god likes us to kill people, god wants us not to eat this, and all that is immutable truth, now and forever more. Amen."Well, that shows how little you really know about religions. What you say applies to some, sure, but not all. You have seen the negative effects of some religions, such as terrorism, but have you ever sought to find the positives? Have you ever tried to understand them beyond what you hear? Tried to understand the people who follow them? Why they do follow them? Many people follow religions, you know. Intelligent, thoughtful people. They think deeply before they believe in anything. It's not blind faith; you'd be surprised by how much it isn't. Saying that it is is an unjust generalization.
Also you seem to have that same blind faith. But in science.
You see though, science isn't complete. It is only a part of a whole. Yes, it is crucial, but it isn't everything.
Human life isn't just about science.
I'm not saying that all religions are complete either, but I believe that religion must go hand in hand with science for it to be comprehensive.
ehh I really really don't like getting into this. Interesting discussion all the same, but I don't think it's going anywhere.
Wait what on earth apparently I blocked you? Wow. How can you know something even I don't? Perhaps you have forgotten, but you are the one who made it impossible for me to even reply to anything you say here. And you're having a field day with it too. Way to go.
At least I can still edit my comments.
As to being disrespectful, let me remind you that you disrespected my wish to not discuss religion first. See where that has gotten us?
This was supposed to be a friendly discussion, but you walked all over that intention by disregarding what I asked. It was originally about whether science was the truth or not, and now you're just using it to attack religion.
You said you have nothing against religious people. Yeah, right. All you've done so far is belittle religion. And judge, judge judge.
I've seen how many books on religion you've read. What do you even read them for if you won't open your mind enough to consider them?
You've also said that :
They can't all be true. None of them are.
Of course they can't all be true, but how that translates to none of them being so is beyond my comprehension. How did you reach that most enlightened conclusion, pray?
Also when did I say I didn't believe in science or trust it?
I do believe in it. Right alongside my religious beliefs. They're intertwined.
And no, I'm not one for faith-based answers or conspiracy theories (those are for people with too much time on their hands. Speculation upon speculation.)
Yes, the answers that are solely based on faith annoy me as much as they annoy you. BUT I don't disregard anything just because it's related to faith. It can be faith-based AND proven and backed by science.
That is all. I'm tired of this and I knew it wasn't going anywhere right from the start, bless your heart.
The Daydreamologist wrote: "Well, that shows how little you really know about religions. ..."(view spoiler)That was judgemental, extremely rude and a comment like that should only be made if you actually know the person very well. You don't know me at all (obviously). And it was only the first of your assumptions about me. You just don't like having your world view (religion is truth) challenged.
"Human life isn't just about science."
Religion is a thing of the mind, it is a willing belief in 10,000 gods who need sacrifices and incense and food cast on the ground, or maybe blood spilled, or just one god who watches each and every human being and is so full of ego that he requires constant praise, morning, noon and night.
Religion is saying life is just a testing ground, a prelude, part of a cycle, whatever and we will all be reunited in heaven, or hell, or in rebirth, or we won't be at all if we achieve nirvana. They can't all be true. None of them are. It's just the comfort of not taking full responsibility for your actions and thinking that you should get rewarded for doing good things and punished for doing bad ones and the terrible, existential fear of annihilation, that death will be final.
If that offends you, fine. I'm fed up with religious people thinking they have the right to disrespect me for not sharing their beliefs but I must respect them for theirs. I respect people for what they say and what they do, not what they believe. And you and I do not share that. You respect people only if they share your beliefs.
(view spoiler)
I find it frustrating and also amusing how people like to argue that science isn't true (and they usually quote a random piece of opinion by some "astrophysicist" and as many logical fallacies as they can to back up their opinion). To say "science isn't the whole truth" is ridiculously beside the point. Scientists never claimed to know "the whole truth" of anything. Science is reliable because it's refutable and ever evolving and we're aware there's so much we still don't know. If we knew the whole truth then it'd be pointless to become a researcher. Is it really that hard a concept? :)))))Also, I envy your patience to deal with so many weird comments on such subjects, Petra.
I am so tired of this. Of people not understanding that scientific results are only accepted through peer-reviewed consensus and evidence backed research. Nothing in science is ever taken for granted, and even the axiomatic principles are thoroughly examined and debated before they are accepted as 'true'.I admit that science today does not know the 'whole truth', but neither does it claim to do so. Science is certainly not 'colored truth', as it is one branch of study that is completely objective and normally not influenced by human emotions. Science does not ask for faith, it asks for examination, observation, objectivity and consensus.
And Petra, I echo Settare's sentiments. I'm envious of your patience in dealing with weird comments and Goodreads gatekeepers in general.
Also, it's amazing how people say "you know, people can believe what they want, I don't wanna judge" when we even try to bring up religion, but will also refuse to accept scientific results and ask us "are you sure you wanna believe this?"What a load of baloney.
Settare wrote: "Scientists never claimed to know "the whole truth" of anything..."But religions do. Each of them has the truth revealed through holy men, prophets, seers, sages and all those claptrap conmen through the ages. And no one believes that any religion but their own is "the truth". As someone said, we are all atheists to all the gods that ever were, except our own. I have no problem with the religious, not even ones like the-daydreamologist who wrote her comment and instantly blocked me, because she can't cope with rational argument only unprovable beliefs.
Prerna wrote: "I'm envious of your patience in dealing with weird comments and Goodreads gatekeepers in generalt..."Settare wrote: "Also, I envy your patience to deal with so many weird comments on such subjects, Petra..."
I quite enjoy them actually. They don't upset me. Trolls I just kittenise or sometimes delete. People like the daydreamologist, well I should have been warned, her profile says she only likes clean books, though you can hint at it if they are married. She probably believes that having sex before marriage makes you impure and that schools should teach intelligent design alongside evolution.
Prerna wrote: " "you know, people can believe what they want, I don't wanna judge" when we even try to bring up religion, but will also refuse to accept scientific results and ask..."Ockhams Razor is an unknown concept to some people. They always prefer a faith-based answer which is what conspiracy theories always are. Covid-19: 5G, Bill Gates, polio vaccines, toilet paper, petrol pumps, the CIA, population control and almost the entire Arab world blames... the Jews.... (always good to have a universal scapegoat to cover ignorance, since there'll be lots of backing). I got some of that from the occasionally reliable Wikipedia.
Here's the link to that Forbes article if you'd like to check it out (interstingly, it is also written by an astrophysicists):
https://www.forbes.com/sites/paulmsut...