The Readers Review: Literature from 1714 to 1910 discussion
Arthur Conan Doyle Collection
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Reading Schedule
Frances wrote: "Jessie wrote: "Hey, I *collect* Jane Eyres! How funny you should hit on one of my hobbies. I lament the ones that are lost and that I shall never see...Is there any version better than the Timo..."
Did that version omit the 2nd half, like many of the others?
Denise wrote:I have seen most of them, but I own... Did you catch the Northanger Abbey PBS showed about 25 years ago?
Denise wrote: "Lynnm wrote: "Denise wrote: "But I have even more Jane Austen adaptations - 2 Sense and Sensibility, 3 Pride and Prejudice, 1 Mansfield Park, 2 Emma, 1 Northanger Abbey, and 3 Persuasion. Plus Clue..."I have to tell you something unpleasant, so sit down. Darcy married what's-her-name 200 years ago.
Rochelle wrote: "Did the version omit the 2nd half, like many of the others? "I've always disliked that they omit the 2nd half of the book. But I understand why they do it - a simple reading of WH is Healthcliff's and Catherine's love story, and once Catherine is no longer there, well, there goes the love story.
Rochelle wrote: "I have to tell you something unpleasant, so sit down. Darcy married what's-her-name 200 years ago.":-)
Indeed. They did marry 200 years ago.
Shame, really - why is it that all the good men are always already taken? ;)
Lynnm wrote: "Rochelle wrote: "Did the version omit the 2nd half, like many of the others? "I've always disliked that they omit the 2nd half of the book. But I understand why they do it - a simple reading of W..."
But the next generation heals the wound between the 2 families. And there is a touching love story between Catherine and Hareton, which would have repeated the original story if Catherine had remained as arrogant as her mother. When H dies, all the hatred and evil dies with him. H and C are supposedly reunited in heaven, the 2 families and estates are joined. The arc of the story is complete. The book is not just a simple love story.
However, most of the screenplay writers just went for the big bang.
Lynnm wrote: "Rochelle wrote: "I have to tell you something unpleasant, so sit down. Darcy married what's-her-name 200 years ago.":-)
Indeed. They did marry 200 years ago.
Shame, really - why is it that all ..."
He's too stuffy for Denise anyway.
I see Victorians are going to read Study in Scarlet.
Rochelle wrote: "But the next generation heals the wound between the 2 families. And there is a touching love story between Catherine and Hareton, which would have repeated the original story if Catherine had remained as arrogant as her mother. When H dies, all the hatred and evil dies with him. H and C are supposedly reunited in heaven, the 2 families and estates are joined. The arc of the story is complete. The book is not just a simple love story.However, most of the screenplay writers just went for the big bang. "
I completely agree. I love the entire story. Although I admit, the first time that I read it, I was a bit confused why the story was continuing on after Catherine's death. Then, as I got into it, I realized why it continued on.
There are always two ways to read a text: the simple and the complex. Filmmakers usually choose the simplest reading. And there isn't anything wrong with a simple reading, but I like the complexities of a book.
MadgeUK wrote: "I see Victorians are going to read Study in Scarlet."They stole our idea. How dare they? :-) lol!
But ours will be better. ;)
Wuthering Heights is one of the most complex novels of its time, it is always annoying when people reduce it to a love story, just as when people try to reduce Heathcliff to an anti-hero. They forget that the very point of Heathcliff is that you can't reduce people to types. But most adaptations tend to simply read Heathcliff as the reverse of what Isabella reads him to be. Wuthering Heights also deals with the question of Otherness, of the Sublime and the Beautiful, of blurring the physical divide between the Self and the Other. But heavens forbid any adaptation would want to dwell on THAT.On Study in Scarlet: since I'm a member of both groups I'm actually looking forward to this convergence. The more the perspectives, the better the reading! :)
Rochelle wrote: "Denise wrote:I have seen most of them, but I own... Did you catch the Northanger Abbey PBS showed about 25 years ago?"
Yes, that's the one that I have, from 1987, with Peter Firth and Googie Withers. There was a newer one a few years ago, when PBS showed adaptations of all six of the major novels. Some of the adaptations were new, and others were not. I have a box set of the new Sense and Sensibility and Persuasion; I'm not sure why they didn't include the new Northanger Abbey with them.
Lynnm wrote: "Rochelle wrote: "Did the version omit the 2nd half, like many of the others? "I've always disliked that they omit the 2nd half of the book. But I understand why they do it - a simple reading of W..."
In a way, I was glad that they did omit the second half in the old Olivier/Oberon movie. I saw that movie when I was in seventh grade, and ran out and bought the novel the next day. It was such a wonderful surprise to find that there was the additional story of the next generation!!! That omission in the movie ended up greatly enhancing my enjoyment of the novel.
Lynnm wrote: "MadgeUK wrote: "I see Victorians are going to read Study in Scarlet."They stole our idea. How dare they? :-) lol!
But ours will be better. ;)"
Actually, we are going to start with the Dupin short stories by Edgar Allan Poe, and then continue on with Holmes, to see the influence of Poe's detective stories on Conan Doyle. The idea was to focus on mystery in the Victorian period.
Rochelle wrote: "I have to tell you something unpleasant, so sit down. Darcy married what's-her-name 200 years ago."I think that choose-your-adventure books imply a parallel universe/alternate reality kind of situation, so there would be a world in which he did not marry her!
Wuthering Heights is one of the most complex novels of its time...I agree - it is not just a romance and it is a superb piece of gothic writing too.
Denise wrote: "Actually, we are going to start with the Dupin short stories by Edgar Allan Poe, and then continue on with Holmes, to see the influence of Poe's detective stories on Conan Doyle. The idea was to focus on mystery in the Victorian period. "That sounds interesting. I like compare and contrasts. I noticed the reference to Dupin in A Study in Scarlet.
We're sticking with Sherlock...in his many incarnations. I thought that would be an interesting angle, given with the renewed interest in the Sherlock Holmes stories right at this moment.
Just as with the various Sherlock versions right now, the more different reads on Sherlock, the better!
Denise wrote: "Rochelle wrote: "I have to tell you something unpleasant, so sit down. Darcy married what's-her-name 200 years ago."I think that choose-your-adventure books imply a parallel universe/alternate re..."
So the writer thinks he can improve on Austen?
It's just supposed to be a fun game. And I don't know why I didn't think of it before (it's been a while since I played it), but the reader is taking the part of Elizabeth Bennett, so if successful, it would end up with Darcy marrying Elizabeth.
Can I just say, I am so excited for Sunday to roll around and start our discussion. I feel like Sherlock at the start of a new case. ;)
Denise wrote: "It's just supposed to be a fun game. "It won't replace Scrabble in my heart.
Hi, Kate. Yes, that will be the schedule. I'll re-post again again on Sunday, the first day of our discussions.
Okay, I couldn't wait. I've read the first three chapters. Is anyone else getting started
Christopher wrote: "Okay, I couldn't wait. I've read the first three chapters. Is anyone else getting started"Yes, definitely have started! (Well, I'm moderating so I had to start...)
Really enjoying the stories. :-)
Mod
YES. I couldn't wait either and have read the first 2.
I took out a 2000-page SH volume from the library yesterday. Surely it covered everything. No; it says "Volume II," and guess what's missing?
Rochelle wrote: "I took out a 2000-page SH volume from the library yesterday. Surely it covered everything. No; it says "Volume II," and guess what's missing?"That's funny!
Oh, how frustrating!You can get A Study in Scarlet online. Here's the gutenberg link: http://www.gutenberg.org/files/244/24...
Also, Virginia.edu has the text for A Study in Scarlet as well.
Elementary my dear Rochelle that some detection is required! :D
Emily wrote: "Rochelle wrote: "I took out a 2000-page SH volume from the library yesterday. Surely it covered everything. No; it says "Volume II," and guess what's missing?"That's funny!"
It's The Annotated SH, thus the 2000 pages.
Copied the online one so I can do my own annotations, and I also have an audio file.
Very excited that we are starting tomorrow. Here is the final reading schedule and film/television adaptation schedule.Looking forward to our discussions!
FINAL SCHEDULE:
Novels/short stories:
July 1-July 7: A Study in Scarlet (Part 1)
July 8-July 14: A Study in Scarlet (Part 2)
July 15-July 21: The Valley of Fear (Part 1)
July 22-July 28: The Valley of Fear (Part 2)/The Adventure of the Dancing Men
July 29-August 4: The Adventure of the Bruce-Partington Plans; The Naval Treaty
August 5-August 11: The Five Orange Pips; A Scandal in Bohemia
August 12-August 18: The Hound of the Baskervilles (Part 1)
August 19-August 25: The Hound of the Baskervilles (Part 2)
August 26-September 1: The Final Problem
Film/TV adaptations (correspond - for the most part - with the readings):
July 1-July 7: A Study in Pink (BBC Sherlock)
July 8-July 14: A Study in Scarlet (Reginald Owen)
July 15-July 21: The Blind Banker (BBC Sherlock)
July 22-July 28: The Dancing Men (Brett)
July 29-August 4: The Great Game (BBC Sherlock); The Naval Treaty (Brett); The Bruce Partington Plans (Brett)
August 5-August 11: A Scandal in Belgravia (BBC Sherlock); A Scandal in Bohemia (Brett)
August 12-August 18: The Hound of the Baskervilles (BBC Sherlock)
August 19-August 25: The Hound of the Baskervilles (Rathbone)
August 26-September 1: The Reichenbach Fall (BBC Sherlock); The Final Problem (Brett); Adventures of Sherlock Holmes (Rathbone)
NOTES:
(1) I am going to set up two threads for the Film/TV adaptations: one for the recent BBC Sherlock series and one for Brett/Rathbone/Other. People can watch how much or how little they want. But the information is there whatever someone wants to do.)
(2) I am also going to set up a Sherlock Holmes fan fiction/fanlore thread.
Hi Everyone, I am new to the Goodreads, and am looking forward to the discussions on Sherlock Holmes. He was one of my favorite fictional detectives.
Dillipyckles wrote: "Hi Everyone, I am new to the Goodreads, and am looking forward to the discussions on Sherlock Holmes. He was one of my favorite fictional detectives."
Hi, Dillypyckles, and welcome. May I call you Dilly?
Hi Rochelle, Of course you may call me "Dilli" or if you prefer, my given name is "Carol". And by the way, thank you for introducing me to Goodreads, I am finding the group to be enjoyable thus far.
Watch out for my friend MadgeUK. She's read everything that's ever been printed in English.
Not everything but a great many classics:). That's what comes of having been reading for 75 years! (And I have read only a few of SH.)May I call you Pyckles?
Welcome Dillypyckles! Great name! I think I'll go with Carol. Although having everyone call you Pyckles will remind me of the old Dick Van Dyck show - Buddy's wife's name was Pickles.
And also welcome to the other newcomers! Good to have some new folks onboard for the Sherlock Holmes discussion.
Lynnm wrote: "Welcome Dillypyckles! Great name! I think I'll go with Carol. Although having everyone call you Pyckles will remind me of the old Dick Van Dyck show - Buddy's wife's name was Pickles."You have an incredible memory.
This is the lightest lit we've read since the group's inception. It practically floats like a cloud.
Rochelle wrote: "You have an incredible memory.This is the lightest lit we've read since the group's inception. It practically floats like a cloud. "
The Dick Van Dyck show was one of my favorites when I was a kid. I used to love it when I was home sick from school and could watch all the repeats of the show during the day (along with Bewitched reruns).
I disagree - have you read my suggestions? :-) We have an opportunity to talk about things that we haven't been able to since we generally read the same types of genres over and over again.
And with the introduction of film/tv, we can discuss some other elements that we can't talk about with just a novel: the importance of the musical score, interior designs, etc.
Plus, I don't think that certain literary types are "better" than another. It's not fair to people who like variety in their books.
I think that you will be pleasantly surprised.
You can get 'depth' from any literary genre. I could probably write a thesis on Harlequin romance novels citing Mary Wollstonecraft et al:D.
MadgeUK wrote: "You can get 'depth' from any literary genre. I could probably write a thesis on Harlequin romance novels citing Mary Wollstonecraft et al:D."But it's unlikely you will.
MadgeUK wrote: "You can get 'depth' from any literary genre. I could probably write a thesis on Harlequin romance novels citing Mary Wollstonecraft et al:D."Completely agree. And I'm sure people have.
In fact, I came across a scholarly essay when I was doing research about how the Sherlock Holmes stories teach students critical thinking skills. That ability to pay close attention to details, make connections and inferences, etc.
Yes, I am sure I could have done with such teaching because my powers of deduction are very poor!
Lynnm wrote: "Welcome Dillypyckles! Great name! I think I'll go with Carol. Although having everyone call you Pyckles will remind me of the old Dick Van Dyck show - Buddy's wife's name was Pickles."Thank you Lynn,
My nickname was Pickles as a kid ...I love dill pickles and thus my name...I also grew up with the
Dick Van Dyke show and found it was funnier when I was young. Guess I have lost my sense of humor as I have aged. So either way I will answer to both.
Dillipyckles wrote: "Lynnm wrote: "Welcome Dillypyckles! Great name! I think I'll go with Carol. Although having everyone call you Pyckles will remind me of the old Dick Van Dyck show - Buddy's wife's name was Pickles...."I think what we laughed at in the '70's has been copied too many times and is no longer fresh. And also what we find funny now may not be what we found funny in our youth. I've gotten into trouble a few times at another website because the mod in her 20's didn't understand my jokes, and thought I was insulting someone. There was a big age gap, and therefore cultural gap, between us.
BTW, Dilly and I are good friends of many years, and I dragged her here by her hair. If you catch me insulting her, just ignore it. :-D
Carol - I love dill pickles too! Pickles and olives. When I was a kid, my mom used to limit how many I could have of each. But now that I'm older, I can do what I want! :-)All the shows from when we were kids don't seem as good today as when we watched them long ago.
Television today is far more sophisticated. People expect more.
With that said, though, I still like watching the older shows now and again. Especially since I have Netflix and I can watch them via streaming.
I still love all the old shows! We have a couple of stations that run them. I was recently glad that one started showing The Mothers-in-Law, starring Eve Arden and Kaye Ballard. I don't think I had seen that one since it ran in the 70s; it's produced by Desi Arnaz and written by the same team that wrote I Love Lucy. It is very dated and silly, but I like silly - it makes me laugh! They're also showing Love American Style, Batman, Get Smart, Dick van Dyke (which I think was from the 60s, not the 70s), Mary Tyler Moore, Bob Newhart, the hour-long I Love Lucy series (I think the actual name was something like the Lucy-Desi Comedy Hours, but it's all the same characters with lots of guest stars), and lots more. The other day they had a My Three Sons marathon, in tribute to Don Grady (Robbie), who passed away last week. Another station has Perry Mason, which I used to love, and I've watched that a few times, too.Dilly, have you tried Lay's Dill Pickle potato chips? I love them! They're not always available - I thought they stopped making them a while back, but they recently showed up again.
I particularly liked Toby Stephens as Rochester. He wasn't as ugly ..."
And Jane has never been played by a "plain" women, as is stated in the book. The whole point is that she's not outwardly beautiful, but survives through her intelligence, resilience and maturity.