Terminalcoffee for group members who haven't been on Terminalcoffee lately (NYC is not filthy, says fans)

[Dave]

I spent a week in NYC in 2000. I met a friendly couple in Coney Island. They were tourists from Minnesota. They were the only friendly people I met.

Also, the public bathroom at Washington Square Park was much like the second ditch of Dante's Eighth circle of Hell. I still have PTSD from that experience.

The Met had some great art though.

[[deleted user]]

I love The Met. I can't wait to see it, again, in March.

[Dave]

The Met has pretty good public bathrooms as well.

[[deleted user]]

Of course.

[Lori]

AHAHAHAHA I just looked up Danielle's age to check on her statement about NYC not being as dirty or unsafe as she's heard it to be, and then realized she wasn't even ALIVE during it's most recent descent into hell!

OK that's an exaggeration, but Danielle, NY was disgustingly dirty, smelly and extremely unsafe during Dinkins. I have no idea how Guiliano did it, but he really acted a miracle there, never thought NYC could recover so quickly and once again become the city of my childhood.

Still glad I no longer live there tho. Been there, done that.

But the very first place I would go is The Met. I've had mystical experiences there, starting when I was a young teen. *sigh*

Then I would go straight to Carvel. Why is there no Carvel on the West Coast? A Whale of a Good Time!

[RandomAnthony]

I have a hard time generalizing an entire city as clean or dirty. I think parts of Chicago are clean, esp. in the touristy areas, but whoo, go about twenty blocks in any direction and I can show you some messy parts. Same with Milwaukee.

[[deleted user]]

I grew up in NYC during the 70's and '80s. Yes, NYC was a dangerous and unsafe place to be, but it was our home and we loved it there. Even with all the crime and drugs and rampant bullshit, NYC was the place to be. You couldn't walk anywhere without having anything to do.

Sure, Sheriff Rudy cleaned up the joint, and for that he's to be commended - take it from me, he wasn't the Mayor he claims to be, considering his strong-armed tactics made him quite unpopular at times. However, in cleaning up NYC, especially Times Square, Giuliani traded one sin (lust) for another (greed). He took all the peep shows and hookers and crack dens on 42nd Street, and replaced all of Times Square with chain restaurants and tourist attractions. Turning Times Square into a theme park may be fine for the out-of-towners, and fantastic for the city's wallet, but there's something missing. Still, the tourists can keep Times Square.

Carvel?

That shit is nasty.

[Danielle]

I'm fully aware of how much GiulianI cleaned up NYC. I was 12 or 13 when he took office, so yes, not having been born is a BIT of an exaggeration. Like most people, I was fully cognizant of my surroundings at that age. The reason I expressed feeling less sure of the crime issue than the actual grime issue is because I WASN'T yet going into the city on my own before Giuliani and so didn't have much opportunity to run into whatever trouble was available. I did however, spend plenty of time there, being 20 minutes away, and was fully exposed to how physically dirty it was and the general atmosphere. But when I say not as dangerous as it was made out to be, I'm referring to the people who've only heard the hype and assume that as soon as you set foot on a Manhattan sidewalk, you WILL be mugged or worse... like the people at a beer tent at the Fringe Festival in Edmonton who literally huddled around me en masse to get a look at my NY State license while one of them said, "You're not going to stab us, are you?"

Incidentally, yes Gus, I also think the city lost something during the reign of Giuliani, but it only says more for the place that it's noticeably less than it once was and is still the greatest city in the world.

[Jessica]

I love NYC. I'm lucky to live near a commuter train, MetroNorth, yay! an inexpensive & efficient way to get into the city in 2 hours. I go there once a month or so.

[Danielle]

Hahaha. Gus, I didn't even notice the Carvel comment. I've always felt that way too. Although I DID enjoy the baseball-cap-cups they gave out when I was forced to go there. What's your take on Haagen Dazs?

Also... I started a group I think some of you will appreciate. It's under music (under arts & entertainment). I'm TERRIBLE at giving things titles. It's called "What WAS Deaner Talking About?"
You should all check it out :)

[Chloe]

Danielle, anything named after a Ween song can never be lame. In fact, I think that guarantees it a place in the "GR Groups Hall of Fame." Because Ween is just that awesome.

[RandomAnthony]

We have a great commuter train from Milwaukee to Chicago, about twenty bucks one way, a little over an hour...I love it. I wish I could take the train to work, but there's no commuter train near here.

I'll check out the group, Danielle!

[Félix]

What about the old guy with the gravelly voice who did the commercials for Carvel? Wow how lame was that?

[[deleted user]]

Danielle, Haagen-Dazs is fine with me, but I'm more of a Ben & Jerry's man. However, I've sworn off ice cream for now, since I'm waging a war against the foods that keep me overweight. I can't remember the last time I've eaten ice cream. Sigh...

That gravely-voiced man was Tom Carvel himself, pimping that god-damned Fudgy the Whale. Lame old fucker.

[Lori]

Haha yeah but I have to admit I miss Carvel.

Danielle, that's a funny story you tell of everyone thinking you were a mugger! Yes I see what you mean about people thinking it's a horribly dangerous city, during the Dinkins era at its worst I felt pretty secure, as much as you can be anywhere.

Also I think New Yorkers develop a street smart that others don't have, and therefore the city doesn't feel dangerous to us because we know what's around all the time and know how to keep to our own space.
As for people who say New Yorkers are rude, I think that's utter nonsense. We just don't have time to waste, and so get to the point right away! That drove me crazy when I moved to Seattle. Especially at first when I was job interviewing, everyone wanted to meet me, and then after a coupla hours told me they knew someone else who'd want to meet me, etc etc, everyone is so polite, GET TO THE POINT ALREADY!!! haha.

And last time I was in NY I was quite disgusted with Times Sq. Sheesh, there's no life there anymore, Gus you hit it on the nail, it's become a shrine to greed and sterile commercialism. And when I left in 91, the homeless who were dangerously crazy were all over, and Rudy did get rid of them, but what did he do - ship them to NJ? Yes, on the outside Rudy did a fantastic job, but I've heard from friends still there, and I know I'm rather ignorant of the inside scoop there.

Before Dinkins, all my friends would feel safe walking around or taking the subway pretty much any time, but when I left, we all stopped taking the subway by 9PM. So sad.

[Heidi]

I'm glad Nekkid Cowboy still makes appearances in Times Square, though. :)