Should have read classics discussion
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Atlas Shrugged
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Atlas Shrugged, Discussion thread.
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Lisa, the usurper
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May 04, 2012 09:13AM
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I should get started by Monday. My book is split into three sections of 10 chapters, so that sounds like a great idea!
I am new to this group but I have always wanted to read this book with someone. How exciting.
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Hi, I just started reading this book 2 days ago. on chapter 3 of the 1st section. I would love to be included in the group discussion.
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I know the group's already read the book, but I'm a part of a different group, and we'll be taking on this massive tome of a book known as Atlas Shrugged. I don't have a copy yet, but I am VERY interested in it, and cannot wait to start soon!
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Lisa wrote: "Actually, you are fine, I'm bringing "snail pace" to a new place with this one. I'm only on page 600, so feel free to join in with us also! It is really interesting and a great story. Enjoy!"Thank you so much, Lisa! That's very kind of you.:)
It's encouraging that you said it's an interesting and great story. Thank you.
Great, that's about where I'm at too Lisa. Trying to get through section 2 before commenting on that part.
So is it true that things get a bit better after Part I? Is it incredibly slow in the beginning? Please tell me that Rand keeps it interesting, at least.:)
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Tortured analogy time, think of Part I as a one dish buffet that you keep eating from for about 3 weeks, then when you can't take it any more the curtain parts and before you is a Las Vegas style buffet and you keep jumping from dish to dish, not quite sure which one to sample first. That seems to be my take on this book so far, after every three pages right now I want to jump on the computer and pose a question. Hope that helps, and considering that everyone tastes in books are different I hope that my food analogy doesn't make you throw up in the end! :)
No, that's a great analogy, IMO! Thank you!
YAY, I picked up my copy last night!!:) I cannot wait to get started!!
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Lisa wrote: "Good luck!"Thank you. You, too!
I found the 1st part pretty good and it went by very quickly. It's part two that has dragged me down and taken months. I'm almost at 3 and really hoping it picks up some steam once it gets into the last portion.
Laurie wrote: "I found the 1st part pretty good and it went by very quickly. It's part two that has dragged me down and taken months. I'm almost at 3 and really hoping it picks up some steam once it gets into t..."That's interesting. Thank you, Laurie, I appreciate your input!
So I should be starting the book on Monday, if not sooner.:) I cannot wait!!
I am really impressed with Rand's writing, it's incredibly vivid. That opening sentence, "Who is John Galt?," draws the reader in immediately (it did me, anyway.) I cannot wait to delve deeper!!
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Lisa wrote: "Just wait. It will draw you in even more!"Oh, really?? Awesome, I am soo looking forward to that, Lisa!! Thank you.
You are exactly right, Lisa.:) I'm currently about 1/4 into The Immovable Movers, and the more I read, Rand's expert storytelling reels me in a bit deeper, and deeper yet. I'm loving it!!So far, I think Dagny is my favorite character. I really admire her for her determination and passion!
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Lisa wrote: "Still cruising Dustin?"I haven't made much progress, actually. I'm near the beginning of the 5th chapter, p. 91. Thank you for asking!:)
I finally made some more progress yesterday, woo-hooo! I'm now on p. 124, Chapter VI: The Non-Commercial. I'm looking forward to getting to know Reardon's character more intimately, and to find out how he'll proceed!
I have made significant progress, as of late. P. 203, Chapter VIII: The John Galt Line. I am loving the overall progression of the story, which is starting to heat up now. And Ayn Rand's writing, of course, continues to amaze me.:) I cannot wait to see how everything unravels!!BTW, who the heck is John Galt?? The suspense thickens!
Unfortunately, I have barely made any progress at all since my last post. I'm now 216 pages in.. There are a couple mysterious elements which intrigue me very much, I cannot wait to get back to it!!
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Thank you, Lisa! I really appreciate the enthusiasm and the heads-up.:) BTW, I'm to Chapter IX now. Where are you, or have you finished it?
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Well all right, that's awesome, Lisa! Congratulations!!! I'm glad you enjoyed it.:) I have thought about checking out the other threads, but I don't want to see any possible spoilers.. Thank you, though!
I haven't felt well at all this week, but I managed to read most of Chapter IX. Some interesting developments therein! I can't wait to dive back in, and finally start Part II!!
I'm very much hoping to finish Chapter X later today!
Woo-hooo! I am now at the start of Part II!!
Hi Dustin,I'm also reading this and just started Part II. It's turning out to be what I expected and that's not a good thing. After reading about Rand and not agreeing with her ideas, I was still very curious to read Atlas Shrugged because it's the second most influential book in America after the bible.
Aw, I'm sorry to hear that, Gilles.. What were you expecting that isn't good?
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I'm also reading this and just started Part II. It's turning out to be what I expected and that's not a good thing. After reading about Rand and not agreeing with her ideas, I was still..."
I was wondering the same thing as Dustin. What do you not like about the book? I had no idea that it was ranked behind the Bible in being that influential. I would love to know how that was judged.
Dustin wrote: "Aw, I'm sorry to hear that, Gilles.. What were you expecting that isn't good?"Well, to start, I don't agree with Rand that the world would be a better place, as she implies, if business people would be totally free to pursue their goals unchecked by any public oversight.
Wall Street was allowed to go unchecked for a while and we know where it led us. Let me explain: Wall Street came up with the idea of Credit Default Swaps(CDS)which were not regulated. By 2007, the global credit default swaps market was valued at $62 trillion but in fact we don`t really know because most CDS are secret agreements between two parties and no one was recording them, not the financial industry, not the government (it was not regulated). In the end, too many players were so overexposed that when trouble started it just snowballed. This is what happened on this occasion where business was allowed to run free without public oversight. This case DID NOT prove that runaway business CAN wreck the system, it proved that it DID.
I`m not saying the system is perfect. It need fixing but we must not throw the baby with the bath water as Rand advocates as she is opposed to almost every kind of public constraint over business.
People have some levers to support or oppose what`s happening in society. They can vote with their feet (move to a different jurisdiction), they can vote with their wallet (buy fair trade goods) and they can vote at the ballot. In elections, every person has an equal vote. In the world of economics and business, when Bill Gates votes with his wallet, it`s not the same as you and I voting with our wallet. Yet, at the ballot, Bill Gates`vote has no more value than yours.
This is a long and vented argument leading to the following question : Do we want a society ran by unbridled big wallets over which citizens have no legal control or by responsible and democratically elected government accountable to voters? I believe evil and good is equally distributed in business and government. If you have some faith left in our democracy you know that, as people, we have some control over government than over business. I will never believe in corporations or in the un-elected ultra weathy as champions of human rights. They can only be champions of their own rights.
Apologies for a reply that may be too long.
Lisa wrote: "Gilles wrote: "Hi Dustin,I'm also reading this and just started Part II. It's turning out to be what I expected and that's not a good thing. After reading about Rand and not agreeing with her ide..."
Lisa wrote: "Gilles wrote: "Hi Dustin,
I'm also reading this and just started Part II. It's turning out to be what I expected and that's not a good thing. After reading about Rand and not agreeing with her ide..."
Quote from Wikipedia:
According to a 1991 survey done for the Library of Congress and the Book of the Month Club, Atlas Shrugged was situated between the Bible and M. Scott Peck's The Road Less Traveled as the book that made the most difference in the lives of 5,000 Book-of-the-Month club members surveyed, with a "large gap existing between the #1 book and the rest of the list
Of course, another thing that bugs me in this book is the subtext: It`s alright not to care about the suffering of others. Live long and prosper (i.e. pursue your dream and f... the rest). AmenWhat a relief: we don`t have to feel any guilt anymore. For the wealthy, this is better than any revelation or atonement any religion may have provided.
Lisa wrote: "Gilles wrote: "Hi Dustin,I'm also reading this and just started Part II. It's turning out to be what I expected and that's not a good thing. After reading about Rand and not agreeing with her ide..."
Aw, thank you, Lisa! It's good to know that I'm not the only one to wonder about that.. I did, however, know that it's considered the 2nd most influential book..
Thank you for your insight and feedback, Gilles. It is appreciated. I'm not sure if I understood everything you said, but one that's crystal clear is the age-old debate: do we, as a society, want big or small government regulating our lives? The same goes for multi-million dollar businesses opposed to the struggling small ones. I certainly don't advocate big government (I think they have too much control as it is,) but at the same time, I don't think it's a black-and-white issue, either. No matter the topic, there's bound to be shades of grey, right?
As someone who is quite sympathetic to socialism, I find this book quite maddening to say the least. However, I can certainly appreciate the skill with which she writes. I can't help but think her zeal for capitalism is probably due to the fact that she was born in Russia just before the Russian Revolution. With that in mind, I don't take her philosophy (objectivism) serious and I take ATLAS SHRUGGED for just another novel and nothing more.
Hey, Chuck! It's great to see you in this thread, man.:)I love the skill with which she wrote it, as well. Much of what I've read (so far) truly amazes me. It's awe inspiring, really.
Would you care to elaborate on what, exactly, is maddening to you? I'd love to hear your thoughts on it. And why is Atlas Shrugged "just another novel" to you?
Dustin wrote: "Would you care to elaborate on what, exactly, is maddening to you? "
I mean, she totally mischaracterizes those of us on the left.
Dustin wrote: "And why is Atlas Shrugged "just another novel" to you?"
What I mean by that is I don't take objectivism seriously. Because of that I look at ATLAS SHRUGGED as just another story, nothing more nothing less.
Oh, okay. Admittedly, I know next to nothing about her philosophy, Objectivism, or where she stood politically, but I'm not taking the novel too serious. On the other hand, I firmly believe that what she achieved with her work was way beyond her years. And much of it is still relevant today. That's what really gets me!
Dustin wrote: "Thank you for your insight and feedback, Gilles. It is appreciated. I'm not sure if I understood everything you said, but one that's crystal clear is the age-old debate: do we, as a society, want ..."Absolutely right. Extremism is never a good thing either way. But I really digressed from talking about the book itself; I find Rand`s characters shallow and unidimentional, and either too good or evil, they just don`t seem real.
