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Does Outdated Technology Spoil a Story?
Jim wrote: "Let's just say that people of a "certain" age do not / cannot text. Just doing the little Kindle keyboard is taxing enough. And you know what Robert Cray says about taxes."Texting - not going to happen. I've seen the size of the "keys," and typing on those is not going to work for yours truly, what with the stroke.
Hang in there, Susanna. Don't give up the ship.
Susanna wrote: "Texting - not going to happen. I've seen the size of the "keys," and typing on those is not going to work for yours truly, what with the stroke. "I make a game of it, and have the recipient guess at whether I've imbibed, and if so, how much.
Oh, I'm fine, Jim. Compared to how I was in 2004 (when I had a stroke at 37), I'm in fabulous shape.Just not going to be texting any time soon, unless they make the keyboards bigger! (The one on the kindle is about the smallest I can manage.)
I'm a great fan of John D MacDonald and his Travis McGee novels. Most of them were written in the 60s-70s, and as such they have become dated in regards to the technology/lack thereof, but that fact does not detract from the stories. Recently (in the last 5 years) these books were reissued in paperback. And this subject was addressed in a forward, which noted things such as dollar amounts, which seem puny in in these times of trillion $ deficits. I am glad that they chose to leave these things alone in the books--I think Travis would agree.
If handled right in the books, it can be charming, even.
As Kaye writes, if the story is set in the right time for the technology, it doesn't bother me. I quite like reading books set in previous eras.
No it doesn't ruin it for me. I read older books alot. Sometimes it's even quaint. Sometimes it does frustrate because I'm thinking why don't you just pick up your cell phone? lol. But, most of the time if something dated shows up in a book, I just chuckle. If it's a good story it shouldn't take anything away from it.
I just have a question. What do you look for in a book review? I just left a review on Amazon,which I haven't done before, and someone told me I didn't review the book itself. I'm not sure what that means. I just like to read and tell people if I liked the book or not, and I try not to give away the plot. What do you add or leave out when leaving a review?
Julie; when I write reviews, mostly I write about what I enjoyed in the book such as good character development, believable plot, tight story telling, fast paced etc. I don't focus on the odd typo or grammar error (unless the work is littered with them, and then I'd contact the author directly). You're right not to give the plot away.
I honestly don't think that 'outdated technology' could ever spoil a story. Treasure Island for example wouldn't be the same book if they updated it to include motor boats, cars and modern weapons. Part of the charm of all old books is just that, they are old and reflect the time they are set in. Anyway, that's my take on it.
I concentrate on what my reaction to the book was.If I comment on something essential to the plot, I spoiler-mark it. (I don't review at Amazon.)
I think that books that rely too heavily on the technology du jour become outdated. Like if a book from 2012 mentioned all the hot technology, and used it a lot, it would become outdated relatively quickly. Many books cause me to flip to the front to find the copyright date. A book can use technology without causing me to search for the date. With books like Treasure Island, you most likely know the setting and time of the book, so that wouldn't be a shock to not have cell phones. With books that don't necessarily have a defined time period, technology can be a problem.
Denise wrote: "It doesn't bother me. If anything, it adds to the setting and time of the story as long as the author remains in that period of time and doesn't introduce something that hasn't been invented yet."Exactly. Could you imagine reading a Charles DIckens book and suddenly someone mentions that she met Mr Darcy through an online dating site? Although I fear it may be just a matter of time before companies start paying to have their products mentioned in classic novels. 'Little Women Use L'Oreal Products' by Louisa May Alcott perhaps?
Julie wrote: "I just have a question. What do you look for in a book review? I just left a review on Amazon,which I haven't done before, and someone told me I didn't review the book itself. I'm not sure what tha..."Look, someone will always complain about anything you do publicly. Fugedaboudit. Tell it like you see it. I make my reading decisions (to read or not to read a book) very quickly.
Twenty years from now, people will look at "our" books as being historical, they'll read them to find out what it was like with the first iPads and stuff.
Speak for yourself, Jim. I am "a certain age" and texting is what I mainly use my phone for. (Some people say that's because I'm too deaf and can't carry on a speaking conversation, but we won't listen to them, will we?)
Okay. Like with all those voices, don't listen to them either. Just checked your bio and noticed an ad for a book called The Expats. Weird coincidence, eh? Bet the Italian food is better where you are than it is here in the wilds of Montana.
I used to complain about reviews also until I spoke with someone who was a professional (read: paid) reviewer. He said most of the big names (Kirkus, PW, etc.) required their reviewers to file a very particular format, which left almost no room for a personal opinion. The most they could do was put a line in at the end to summarize how they felt, such as "this was a great read" or "this should never have been published." After that I started noticing how reviews were structured and I could easily see his point.
Kari wrote: "Often in the older books there would be no mystery. A CSI test could clear the mystery up in a few pages. I am amazed that Sue Grafton has been able to keep Kinsey in the 80s.
I do not like revi..."
I totally agree with you about Kinsey - sometimes I find myself thinking - "just call them on your cell" and then I remember - oh yeah - you don't have one of those!!!!
I find it falls into two categories for me, which seems to line up pretty well with what others are saying here. Technology which is part of the setting isn't a problem at all, and often works to help with verisimilitude -- pay phones and floppy disks or muzzle loaders and quill pens.
Technology which is the point of the story detracts terribly once enough time has passed, the same way that any overly clever specialized knowledge does (I think there's a Father Brown story that requires knowledge of 1890's British postal delivery patterns, for example). Larsson's a good example, as is some of Conan Doyle's trainspotting for me.
As a writer, I have honestly had a blast with my latest manuscript which takes place 8 years ago. There are distinct changes in technology, but my favorite was writing into the plot line the first cell phone with a camera. It's like creating a really fun time capsule. I got a kick out of writing that chapter and made it stick out a bit that the character was excited to have purchased a camera phone.
In the books I read, I just prefer to see that the technology is current for the time period/setting of the novel.
As some other readers have indicated, it does get a bit too tedious if details are just tossed your way at the speed of light. If you go overboard with the technological details, as it becomes passe, it will detract from the plot, but that's just my opinion.
Happy reading!
Joey
Honestly outdate tech does take me out of a story. If it is a period piece I don't mind but when something is presented as current and the tech is outdated it drives me nuts.
I agree! That's why it's important to know the time frame and for the author to properly lay this out for the reader. Time is part of the story world and some of them just leave out the time frame.I'm with you 100%.
I have absolutely no problem with the older tech in certain books...I'm sort of mini obsessed with technology and pop culture from other decades so when I see certain things in novels it brings me into that time period...Also it can up the thrill factor because you know that character doesn't have a cell phone, internet access, and DNA Tech to help their investigation. They end up having to use "old-fashioned" ingenuity.
Technology is an ongoing challenge for writers. Cara Black sets her series in Paris in the 1990s, which allows her to ignore all the changes since then but she has to be careful not to let her characters "creep" into the future.I set one of my crime series in India, and every year when I visit I take note of changes. The one I still think of is taking a ride in an autorickshaw out into the countryside and stopping for a drink of coconut milk. The man was sitting on the side of the road, cracked open a coconut with his antique machete, and gave me a 'used' straw (which I threw away). While I drank from the coconut (and these things are heavy), he pulled a cell phone (called a mobile) out of his short pocket and called someone. That was the only sign of modernity for miles around. I've never forgotten the image of him leaning against a tree talking on his cell.
I love Sue Grafton's Kinsey Millhone series, which is set in the 80s. I'm fine with outdated technology as long as the author is consistent with what was and wasn't available in the timeframe she's writing in. Grafton does this seamlessly in my opinion.
Just finished reading Black Swan Green by David Mitchell, which was set in the eaely 1980s. The author had everything right for the era and I was filled with nostalgia for the good old days. It made the book for me. So I think I've covered the comment on technology and reviews.
No,in fact I just started reading a bit of Agatha Christie and it doesn't make a difference. You just have to put the setting in context.
Maria wrote: "Just finished reading Black Swan Green by David Mitchell, which was set in the eaely 1980s. The author had everything right for the era and I was filled with nostalgia for the good old days. It mad..."Did you enjoy this? I thought it was wonderful. The depiction of the main character is exquisitely awkward to witness as he negotiates his way through adolescence. I read it a few years back now. Have you read any others? I loved Cloud Atlas but it took me 3 attempts to read it!!! Havent read the latest one yet.
Not at all. References to a manual typewriter give an indication of period. If a character is using a manual typewritter in a modern novel because they hate new inventions that adds a facet to their personality.
Reading through the Kenzie/Generro series by Dennis Lehane. These are set in the early nineties and the computer language with floppy discs and the use of pay phones dates it. A bit distracting but I'll cut some slack. Who could possibly keep up. I might mention a thumb drive in one of mine and look like a horse and buggy writer in a decade.
Kari wrote: "I recently read a mystery that was recently published but took place during the eighties. The main business was a software company with stolen diskettes. This was a big plot point. The problem was ..."didn't you just say it was set in the eighties?
I agree with a lot of others. The right technologies for the right time frame.if a book became outdated as soon as the technology improved a lot of books would became obsolete.
kinsey hates tecnology and so it fits her personalit and it it not so modern.
i don't think about technology when reading the book as a how it is written by the writer is usually the way it should be.
I read Agatha Christie mysteries, which were written between 1920 and 1974, so there are all manner of out-dated technologies, transportation, clothing, housing, and social events referred to in her books. However, it merely makes her books more charming.I read Charles Dickens,for example, but we certainly do not live the same way Dickens did. It never crossed my mind that the change in our world took away from Dickens's story. Quite the contrary...I enjoy getting lost in a different time period. Give the reader a little credit. I believe most readers will be able to ascertain what technology is appropriate for what story, and it will only add to the beauty of the narrative.
Maria wrote: "Just finished reading Black Swan Green by David Mitchell, which was set in the eaely 1980s. The author had everything right for the era and I was filled with nostalgia for the good old days. It mad..."Yes, Maria, my point exactly! I love this book and the way the author captures this time period perfectly while drawing that teenage agnst out in his character at the same time. Beautiful.
In some ways, I think recent but not current technology can be a little distracting, even if it fits the time frame. So, as Kari mentioned, diskettes may be distracting - even more than a typewriter, which as others have noted could be attributed to the personality or preferences of the character. As the age of the book's publication date increases or the date of the story is more distant, it's easier for me to make the adjustment - my expectation is that the technology will be outdated. And beyond a certain point, it starts to become educational!
C.nick wrote: "I've never opperated a trebuchet, nor have I rode in a horse-drawn buggy but I still like reading about these things, and for me technology is no different. The only thing that's distracting is if ..."I so agree. The use of technology references actually validates the setting of the story.
This discussion is so interesting! I find the viewpoints thoughtful and a help to me as I struggle with 'cell phone' in a story that goes back to 2010. My feeling is I should skip 'cell' and just refer to phone.
My first novel takes place back in the 60's and 70's. It was comical, because I had to go back and look at the models of typewriters and copies from then. I had forgotten. My editor also made a rather humorous mistake, she said people send email, not inter-office memos. I had to remind her that there were no office computers back then....
(Just joined the group so lots of threads to catch up on...)Ernest Clines, Ready Player One is a submersion in a technology flashback and was a complete blast to experience.
I'm reading "The Fifth Horseman" by Collins & Lapierre, written in 1980 about a nuclear bomb planted in NYC by Qaddafi's terrorists. If the story is engrossing, you're in the moment and the technology or lack thereof doesn't register, with me, anyways.
I've read these posts with interest....some very good comments but I couldn't care less about technology in a story. If the story is set in the 1930s or the 1890s, then that's when the action is taking place. If they use telegrams, send a note with a butler, write a letter, or drive like mad in a open roadster to deliver a message, that is true to the time in which the action occurs. If it is a good tale, technology has little or no effect on how much one enjoys it.
For me, it depends how "dated"the references are; I don't mind older technology that clearly places events in a time and setting. It's more recent technology that has gone on and evolved that I find jarring sometimes.
I suspect Darvin's right, that readers are more likely to get huffy -- or at least distracted -- by references to something used only 10 or 20 years in the past.
Hi. First, I'd like to say hello. I just joined Goodreads and I'm really enjoying it. I thought I'd share my daughter's comments about outdated technology in books. She recently received a package in the mail and was ecstatic--she had purchased a complete set of the Travis McGee novels that she found on eBay. She's 30 years old and has been a Travis McGee fan for years. I mentioned to her that on a mystery digest I subscribe to there had been a recent discussion about whether writers should update books if they were reprinting them. The idea horrified her! She said one of the things she loves about the Travis McGee novels is that they're a little time capsule of what the world was like before she was born. After reading the discussion on the mystery digest, I gave some thought to how updating my out-of-print mysteries would change them and I realized that they simply wouldn't be the same books anymore. Historical novels are well-liked and novels that are contemporary when they're written eventually become historical and I think that's a good thing.
L.L. wrote: "...updating my out-of-print mysteries would change them and I realized that they simply wouldn't be the same books anymore."I'm a big fan of Raymond Chandler and having Philip Marlowe with a cell phone just doesn't cut it.
I'd commented on this thread earlier and my objection is the books where the author starts detailing the technology. You see this a lot in cyber-thrillers. I have no objections to a character hacking an account or doing computer searches.
What I don't like is when the protagonist hacks an account using his Dazzleberry 600-S decrypter and disguises his IP address with the latest version of Deekriptor that uses false WAN protocols, then downloads the info on his 32 gig UBEX flash drive.
I see Benjamin Black is going to resurrect Marlowe. I hope he keeps him in 1940 Ocean City instead of having him drive around in his Beemer.
Marlowe would have to stay the same. Taking place in the 40's was what made the stories so great.
I have a book where everyone wrote a Marlowe story - Raymond Chandler's Philip Marlowe: A Centennial Celebration including Max Allan Collins, Sara Paretsky and Robert Crais, to name just a few. They were told in homage. And, so far, of the ones I've read, they all take place back then. I think it was part of the "rules".
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