Oliver Twist: Week 10 - Book 3, Chapters V - VIII

[Loretta]

Sorry for the delay in posting. Discuss below!

[MadgeUK]

Thanks Loretta.

In this section we meet up with the sleazy character of Monks, who is meeting the Bumbles for a private conversation. We learn a few more details about the death of Oliver's mother, and we get some hazy information regarding who Oliver is. A mysterious bundle is dropped into a roaring pit, destroying any and all evidence of who Oliver is....

The story moves back towards Fagin and we soon learn that Monks also knows Fagin. Together, they plot to destroy Oliver but.... We also learn more about Nancy and Sikes. Some very nasty things occur which take up the bulk of this ending section. I don't want to go into detail to ruin it for anyone who hasn't read the novel, but I loved the action and power of this part of the novel. There is a lot of drama and as a reader I think Dickens was trying to shock his readers a bit.

Beneath the sarcasm and humour the novel paints a very seedy picture of society at the time and well illustrates what Dickens, the reformer, was trying to bring to the attention of his readers.

I think this last section moves along much quicker than the first 2/3 of the book and we can focus less on Oliver and get more involved in what the nasty characters are doing.

[Robin P, Moderator]

Dickens does a great job describing "a dark and stormy night", in fact in this part of the book there are a number of night scenes. Although Fagin's boys work in the daytime, generally we see Fagin, Bill, Nancy and Monks at night. They belong to the darkness.

As I'm finishing the book I see that a modern reader might be bothered by the "coincidences" linking a number of characters who earlier seemed totally unrelated. But you could also see this as masterful plotting, everything has a reason to be there. In this way it's more like a mystery, all the clues have been presented but you don't see that there are clues till the end.

[Robin P, Moderator]

Good point, Madge, about less focus on Oliver. Where earlier he had been restricted and manipulated by others, in this part of the book we don't see him at all, and yet he is the cause of all the activity. He's at the center of a whirlpool or a windstorm, with various forces circling around him.

[Zulfiya]

Great analysis, ladies. I have managed to read only one chapter of this week's portion so far: I am somewhat overwhelmed and snowed under the final papers and tests I have to grade (and yes, Christmas shopping:-)). Hopefully, Friday and Sunday will be less stressful, and I will be able to catch up.

Monks is truly a shadowy figure. I have a feeling that he deliberately cultivates that aura of mystery and ominous enigma. That episode shows that Dickens is not only gifted as a character writer, but he is also exceptionally good at creating this shadowy,foreboding atmosphere.

[Jenny]

What struck me in this part of the novel was the sad acceptance by Nancy and Charlotte of their abusive treatment. Although Charlotte and Noah’s scene on the road to London is comical, it is also bitter. And when Nancy is offered a way out of her situation, during her meeting with Rose, and refuses it, it is just sad. I know that many people in abusive situations feel that they deserve the abuse in some distorted way. Dickens really pulls for the poor, the young, and women in this novel. It must have opened many eyes during that time.

[MadgeUK]

And yet Dickens treated his wife badly in real life:(

http://www.dickens-and-london.com/Wom...

He was attracted to young women and had a number of flirtations, starting with his wife's sister aged 17 and culminating in a long affair with Ellen Ternan beginning when she was 18 years of age.

Dickens had very idealised and Victorian ideas about women and their place in the home - as the Angel on the Hearth - and was against women's liberation, about which he wrote scathingly.

[Susan Margaret]

MadgeUK wrote: "And yet Dickens treated his wife badly in real life:(

http://www.dickens-and-london.com/Wom...

He was attracted to young women and had a number of flirtations, starting with his wife's sister ..."

Poor Catherine Dickens! To be married for 22 years, raise ten children and then to be kicked out like a dog! I am not liking Charles Dickens very much right now.

[Robin P, Moderator]

I like this quote from his daughter in that article:

We like to think of our geniuses as great characters - but we can't.'

Reminds me of recent articles about Steve Jobs, and others such as Frank Lloyd Wright, whose actions in personal life didn't mesh with their talent in a particular area.

[Jenny]

Poor Catherine, I agree. It really was a man's world. I recently watched The Mystery of Charles Dickens w/ Simon Callow and his treatment of his wife was alluded to there. Catherine's daughter's quote, "We like to think of our geniuses as great characters, but we can't" hits home. Thank you for the link.

[MadgeUK]

If we judged literature by the character and behaviour of writers themselves, I think we would would be hunting around for things to read:).

[Deborah, Moderator]

Agreed Madge. Living in a writer's home and getting to know his partner (who he dumped without any warning), you see a different perspective on the artist. His partner said that he really had no idea of the impact a famous writer would have on the private relationship.

I, too, found the scene where Nancy walks away from her alternatives heart breaking. I think the more dysfunctional a relationship, the harder it is to change.

I've been enjoying the journey with Oliver. I had never read it before, but knew most of the plot. Still, there were some nice surprises along the way for me. I always enjoy Dickens' characters, and knew about his poor treatment of his wife. I got to go to Dickens' home while in London and the tour there was very clear about his infatuation with the wife's younger sister and his dalliances.

Still it's been a great read.

[Jenny]

Can anyone post the 11th week?