Robert E. Howard Readers discussion
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It might stifle authors to some extent because they can't get found. I've heard that editors are overwhelmed since the age of the Internet - word processing & electronic files are so much easier than paper & typewriters or pens. I know trying to find a decent book without GR on a site like Smashwords is about impossible.
Mohammed wrote: "You dont even need shelfs to read paperbooks. Most people trade,give away and buy new books. Why second hand stores are around. I have read twice as many books as i have kept. "There's a second-hand bookstore around the corner. I've sold a few books there just to get rid of them. About the only ones that weren't bent and cracked and wrinkled were the ones I supplied. A crappy copy of a book that somebody else made crappy doesn't sit well; it's ok if it's my own doing, though.
As for reading words off paper vs. electronic. Doesn't matter to me. My imagination gets the same kick out of both regardless of the medium.
Indeed, if E-readers do usurp the book world, I wonder what will become of all those publishing companies that have been around forever - Del Rey, Ballantine, Simon & Schuster, Penguin, Bantam, Fawcett, Pocket, etc, etc, etc...?
If they keep their heads up their wahzoos, where they've had them firmly planted for the past decade or more, they'll fold like any other business. Considering that they're following the example set by the music companies, who have pretty much abandoned it since they learned it doesn't pay, that's doubly stupid & they deserve to fail.
If I may interject a biological analogy, times of rapid environmental change bring about extinction in those species that can not (or will not) adapt quickly enough to survive. Those that can adapt often flourish in the newly expanded territory they gain. I think the music industry is a perfect example of this, Jim.
We're already seeing the decline of bookstores and the spike in prices of graphic novels as readership dwindles. Printed books won't disappear altogether, but I do believe they'll decline in sheer number.
Will publishing standards lower? I think so, at least for a time. But the human mind will remain the same and I have faith that readers will, eventually, find the good writing that they really want. It'll just take time for things to get sorted out, I'm afraid.
Ó Ruairc wrote: "Indeed, if E-readers do usurp the book world, I wonder what will become of all those publishing companies that have been around forever - Del Rey, Ballantine, Simon & Schuster, Penguin, Bantam, Faw..."They all should have their ebook sections in place and selling by now. If I can format and sell an electronic novel, surely the mega-houses can.
Here's a link to some Randomhouse bestseller ebooks:
http://www.randomhouse.com/catalog/be...
Pricing their ebooks so high may prove a downfall, however.
Ó Ruairc what has happened to those publishers you listed? Are they still around? IMO, not really. Most of them are parts of huge corporations now & no longer have the freedom or identity that once made them great. Worse, they don't have the flexibility to adapt, as Peregrine pointed out. They're all about the bottom line & are pricing themselves out of the market, as John said. Konrath points this out in one of his conversations with Eisler on self-publishing. Both of them left Big 6 publishers because they weren't getting the service they thought the publishers should be giving them. Konrath says he can get a book out a year faster & sell far more copies at $2.99 for a far greater percentage than he was getting through a major publisher. He sells a lot at $.99 & also has free ones out there. Baen is one of the few publishers that emulates him. I think they'll make it, too.
But more than that, publishers aren't leveraging ebooks at all. They look at them simply as books - the way I look at them on my old Sony ereader. That's fine, as far as it goes for what I'm currently reading - old, free stuff from Gutenberg.org, new stuff from budding authors, tech docs I read for work, & such - but that's old school. Ebooks could & should be SO much more - if the customer wants.
A couple of years ago, I read a mystery by Clyde Ford. His website had a very cool link to Google Earth that allowed me to look around the area where the story took place. There was an overlay on it with notes of dates, times, routes, & specific place names in the book, so I could see them.
I read the paper book & had to carry it to the computer, put it down & look up the app. I don't know if he had an ebook or not, but I'll bet if he did, the same thing would hold true & that's stupid. Not on the author's part, but on those who manufacture ereaders & the big publishers. Just think of the possibilities!
How cool would it be to be able to annotate your personal copy of a Conan story with web links that showed maps & pictures? Can you do it? Probably not, especially not if the file is DRM locked or in a proprietary format. I can do it if I convert to a Word, RTF, or PDF format & do it on the PC. Why can't a Kindle, Nook or iPad user do it? Why aren't the publishers pumping out ebooks with extra content to justify their high prices?
Interestingly enough, one of the better tech writers was just wondering the same thing.
http://www.networkworld.com/columnist...
Hey Michael, I bet you didn't see this conversation coming out of the 'REH Reader's Challenge,' huh?So cool.
No, I didn't. That's what's cool about it :-)Edit: I didn't notice you said "cool", too. So, "That's what's so spiffing about it"!
Hey, I managed to get Conan's name in my message. You might have to read a novel to find it, but it's there!;-)
Yes, exceedingly groovy, baby, groovy.
Jim wrote: "I don't think any one of us believes ereaders will do away with paper books, Mohammed. --------------
I think ereaders are going to bring back the penny dreadfuls - or maybe they already have. ..."
I know e-books is here to stay and are helpful for some readers. But i had problem with comparing paper books to letters writing and email taking its place. People never wrote letters everday, it was not as important.
Saying e-books will be the only way people read books in the near future is like 1950s people who thought in 1980s-2000s we would be driving flying cars ;)
Yeah free books+e-reader i have seen have made people read what they think of as cheap,not so good writng because its free. While i cant afford to buy paper books i dont think will be good or great. There are no free paper books.
John wrote: "Mohammed wrote: "You dont even need shelfs to read paperbooks. Most people trade,give away and buy new books. Why second hand stores are around. I have read twice as many books as i have kept. "T..."
Yeah you have to find good second hand stores. Just like you have to find new books bookstores you can trust, restaurants you can count on.
Try bookmoocch where you can trade your old books for other second hands. People like me give away brand new paperbacks that have made alot of readers happy to see in good condition. I have given away 30 books and gotten points to get 60 second hands books in very good condition from readers around the whole world. Only some guy in Philipines tricked me and gave me a damaged copy of Leigh Brackett book.
My problem with BookMooch is that no one seems to be using it any more. I ahve 18 credits on there & probably only got 2 books off it last year. I get most of my books through PaperBackSwap now.
Jim wrote: "My problem with BookMooch is that no one seems to be using it any more. I ahve 18 credits on there & probably only got 2 books off it last year. I get most of my books through PaperBackSwap now."I have had no trouble with bookmooch except that it doesnt have as many SFF books as PaperbackSwap but that one is useless to me since its US only. Many of the rare books im after are american ones.
I dont use bookmooch right now since i send books worldwide and i cant spend money on the shipping right now. Poor Uni student! Im very popular over there because many users are americans who dont send outside US. If i list a book it will be mooched by someone in less than 24 hours ;)
I'll send books outside the US if it is under $10. Unfortunately, that's not the case for a lot of countries or books. A paperback to the Philippines or Australia is crazy & it was going to be $15 to send a hard back to France. That's just too much.
Jim wrote: "I'll send books outside the US if it is under $10. Unfortunately, that's not the case for a lot of countries or books. A paperback to the Philippines or Australia is crazy & it was going to be $1..."It costs me 6-8 dollars to sent internationally. Why i sent worldwide i could afford it. I have got many rare books my fav authors so it was worth it. I would never spend 15 dollars to send books.
Weird for me it cost as much to send books to France as US and Japan.
Jim, in the last 2-3 days, I've mooched two books on BookMooch and had the mooches accepted (one has been mailed); and just a few minutes ago, I accepted a mooch from a lady in Texas. So the impression that no one is using it anymore may not be accurate. But the level of mooching activity on it depends on how many people happen to have wishlist titles come available, or find titles they want by browsing, in a given period of time. For most, I'd guess, it's more of an occasional than a regular thing.Because so many members are, like me, located in the U.S. and not well-to-do enough to send books outside their country, it's a network that's probably less useful for non-U.S. residents than for residents. But glad that your experience with it has been mostly positive, Mohammed!
Though these comments are not salient to this particular thread, I am immensely grateful for the subjects being discussed. I must say, I am learning much. Jim & John, thanks for posting those links. Interesting stuff!Jim: That Clyde Ford's website sounds intriguing. Would that E-Readers could duplicate something on that scale! Were it so, I think I would get one. Often, when reading books about history, I find myself referring to maps; after all, much of history is explained by geography. Again, if, and when, E-Readers become more interactive; if, and when, those little gadgets can incorporate books like the examples Michael posted, I reckon the time will come when I must finally dismiss the paper-bound book as otiose.
Ó Ruairc wrote: "...Again, if, and when, E-Readers become more interactive; if, and when, those little gadgets can incorporate books like the examples Michael posted, I reckon the time will come when I must finally dismiss the paper-bound book as otiose. "A net book computer can pretty much do everything I pointed out. Just because they can, doesn't mean we want them all to, though. I have a lot of power tools, but that doesn't mean I don't still use hand tools a lot of the time. There are situations where they are better suited.
----------------
Werner, I've been using BookMooch & PBS for 4 or 5 years now. The activity on BM has dropped off quite a bit for me. When I want a book, I always check both for it. Over the past couple of years, BM has it less often than PBS does. If neither has it, I'll put it on a wish list in both. PBS comes up with it sooner almost every time. That wasn't the case a few years ago. I don't think PBS has gotten much better, just BM has gotten worse.
The last time I moved house, I also moved countries. I had to pay to ship a ton and a half of paper books internationally. This is about one third of the books I own. The rest were in storage with friends and relatives. I am an inveterate horder and refuse to throw books out so for me ebooks are a godsend. They don't take up any space in my apartment, where the shelves are already full :). I still buy those special books I want to keep on the shelf. I still buy old books I can only get in print but most of the books I buy are ebooks these days. Hey, it means I can carry around the more or less complete works of Robert E Howard on my phone and never be stuck for something to read!
Threads sometimes go where they will - The Reading Challenge is about reading and the thread is largely about how we read. Let it roll!
Michael wrote: "Threads sometimes go where they will - The Reading Challenge is about reading and the thread is largely about how we read. Let it roll!"What a wonderful attitude, Michael!
Jim, thanks for the feedback on Bookmooch! I probably should consider joining Paperback Swap; but I'm reluctant to belong to more than one such network (postage expense issues), and I do have 26.5 points on Bookmooch to use towards free books. :-)
Werner wrote: "Jim, in the last 2-3 days, I've mooched two books on BookMooch and had the mooches accepted (one has been mailed); and just a few minutes ago, I accepted a mooch from a lady in Texas. So the impre..."I have great need for second hand books in english since most second hand books in actual stores here are translated versions in swedish.
I have got alot of books from Europe,Japan. Its good place for people like us outside US.
Ó Ruairc wrote: "Though these comments are not salient to this particular thread, I am immensely grateful for the subjects being discussed. I must say, I am learning much. Jim & John, thanks for posting those lin..."Ó Ruairc, I appreciate your insights and everyone else's (y'alls here in NC) for that matter. Tangents can be cool.
I had no idea BookMooch even existed ere now.
Michael wrote: "E-readers do have a place, particularly when travelling, but it's those wrinkled, yellow pages for me every time.Plus, you can't replicate books like these electronically:
[bookcover:The Art Of ..."
Werner wrote: "Counting both exclusive and non-exclusive Goodreads shelves, I already have 36! Since I don't really want to add another one just for a challenge, I'll sit this one out; but I'll cheer the rest of..."
I do agree- nothing can replace a well read physical book! I truly view books as works of art- love having my own personal library of over 2,500 volumes
Rick wrote: "Michael wrote: "E-readers do have a place, particularly when travelling, but it's those wrinkled, yellow pages for me every time.Plus, you can't replicate books like these electronically:
[bookc..."
I feel the same Rick, i have just moved to a new apartment and my room felt naked before i set up 3 shelfs of my fav authors, fav works of art. It was heavy work moving 5 boxs of books,books i have saved and not given away mean they are something special to me.
For example i shelf my books according to fav authors, Howard is in the top level, the best central place to see along with Jack Vance,Lord Dunsany,Orwell,Bradbury,Leigh Brackett. Thats the top of my shelf and fav author order. It was fun time to decide which author goes where in the order.
Can you do the same with ebooks? You can just delete any book,author.....
The other problem with most e-books (such as those downloaded on a Kindle) is that they are yours only for as long as you live. You can't pass them to your heirs. They can never be an heirloom. You can't donate your collection to a library. You can't loan them to a friend or family member without passing along your entire e-reader. You don't really own anything with a Kindle library.
The 2013 challenge is now up and running.
By now, I've read pretty much everything Howard ever wrote. I still buy new collections of his works, often because they have new commentaries and introductions, but the stories I already know pretty well.
Charles wrote: "By now, I've read pretty much everything Howard ever wrote. I still buy new collections of his works, often because they have new commentaries and introductions, but the stories I already know pret..."Howard and Wagner are writers whose works I return to repeatedly over the years.
A lot of the new books are coming out with new material no one but the scholars put them together has read before. If you can claim to have read pretty much everything he ever wrote, you must have one of the most enviable REH collections out there.I have an EXTREMELY good collection - and I can only claim to have 84% of his prose output (571 stories, drafts, plays, fragments, articles, and essays out of about 674), and 38% of his poetry - and maybe about a third of his letters. But there is still a lot of unpublished material out there.
Vincent, I was in REHupa for many years. Most of the scholars who are editing this stuff are friends of mine from REHupa. I'm also one of the editors for The Dark Man, The Journal of Robert E. Howard studies. I've probably got about 90 percent of the published material with Howard's work in it. I also spent a month going through the very fine collection of Howard material at the University of Austin and have read that, although I don't own copies of it all. Vincent wrote: "A lot of the new books are coming out with new material no one but the scholars put them together has read before. If you can claim to have read pretty much everything he ever wrote, you must have..."
Agreed on both counts.John wrote: "Charles wrote: "By now, I've read pretty much everything Howard ever wrote. I still buy new collections of his works, often because they have new commentaries and introductions, but the stories I a..."
Cool! You certainly are in an enviable position to have that level of access. Sorry about the skepticism, but I encounter a lot of people who think they've read more REH than they actually have. It's nice to meet someone who can actually back his claim up!
One thing I don't own by Howard are the original pulp magazines that he was in. I have the stories in various formats, and have even read copies of some of the original typed tales. But the cost of the pulps was always prohibitive for me. I used to attend Howard Days in Cross Plains every year, until around the time my wife had a bad spell of sickness. I was even guest of honor one year, a very proud moment of mine. I do want to get back there again soon.Vincent wrote: "Cool! You certainly are in an enviable position to have that level of access. Sorry about the skepticism, but I encounter a lot of people who think they've read more REH than they actually have. ..."
Yes, those would be awesome to have. The closest I have are the three volumes by Girasol (The Weird Writings of Robert E. Howard: Volume 1, The Weird Writings of Robert E. Howard: Volume 2, and The Exotic Writings of Robert E. Howard) which photocopied REH's appearences from the original pulps and bound them. It's neat to read them in that format, with the old style artwork.I haven't been able to go to Howard Days (yet). It just never fell on a week I could get away from classes (I'm a college professor). With your credentials, it's no wonder you were a guest of honor one year! Very awesome and, again, puts you in an enviable position.
What do you teach? I'm a psychology professor at Xavier University in New Orleans. I typically try not to teach in the summer, though. that's mostly when I do my writing.Vincent wrote: "Yes, those would be awesome to have. The closest I have are the three volumes by Girasol (The Weird Writings of Robert E. Howard: Volume 1, The Weird Writings of Robert E. Howard: Volume 2, and Th..."
Robert E. Howard Readers
Books mentioned in this topic
The Weird Writings of Robert E. Howard: Volume 1 (other topics)The Weird Writings of Robert E. Howard: Volume 2 (other topics)
The Exotic Writings of Robert E. Howard (other topics)
The New Annotated Sherlock Holmes: The Novels (other topics)
Romanticism (other topics)
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Authors mentioned in this topic
Clyde W. Ford (other topics)Robert E. Howard (other topics)
Robert E. Howard (other topics)
It's a time of change for the publishing industry, mirroring that of all other areas of the media, and only time will tell how it adapts to the new technology.