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January Outlander Reread - See post 642 on page 13 for this weeks TOPIC!
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Carol L
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Jan 03, 2012 07:22PM
No Shell, there is not. And I've looked hard!!
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Shell wrote: "My favorite Jamie part... the one that totally sold me , was when he was in the alcove with Loighaire, and Claire discovered him, and he just looks over his shoulder at her and smiles.. That entire..."I hated that scene because I already at that point wanted him to be with Claire. I will admit this knowing others won't like it, I didn't really know what the book was about when I started it. I was hoping that Claire would be traveling between times carrying on two relationships. I thought she would not have control of it and would be living two lives one in the past and one in modern times. I'm glad that is not what happened now that I read the series though. I love the world that DG created for me to escape into.
Wendy F wrote: "I wasn't planning on scheduling it that much because I think it's easier for all of us to read at our own pace. The reread will go from January 1st - February 28th, and I think that I'm going ..."
I was assuming that this re-read was for every Outlander book and we had all read them at least once. So there would be no surprises if someone revealed a story line from another book? If so, would there still be spoilers?
This reread is only for Outlander. In March we will do a reread for Dragonfly in Amber. I'm asking that spoilers for future books be spoiler tagged so that someone who's read Outlander but may not have read Voyager yet doesn't see something on accident.
Wendy, I agree on what you said about Frank and Claire's relationship and I too believe he had affairs while separated from Claire during the war years but ofcourse he was not going to admit it. And I didn't see the passion there either. It seemed more like they were best friends than anything else to me. I did like Frank in the beginning and sensed he loved Claire but it was not like the love Jamie would feel for her, and that they would share.And yes I love how Jamie showed off his swords skills to Claire. It made me feel like they started to become closer at that time.
As for Jamie taking Laoghaire's punishment, I never got the feeling that he felt anything for her except made he felt sorry for her or bad because he could not stand for a girl to be punished or humiliated like that. I think he would've done that for any girl.
I believe that is just how Jamie is. Also when Claire found them kissing, I also believe it was Laoghaire who initiated the kiss and ofcourse Jamie being a man was not going to say no.
And one part that I can never forget is when they return to Leoch Castle after Jamie and Claire marry and Claire is angry and jealous thinking jamie went off with Laoghaire and when he returns to the room he starts stalking Claire and she says "i don't want to sleep with with you!' and he saying something like "I dinna intend to sleep Sassenach...not just yet' etc...just the way he acts rather reminds me of a panther or wild animal about to strike his prey or something. I love that part. I love when he makes love to her and says 'I want to own you,to possess you,body and soul.'
and when he wanted to make love to her and she was embarrassed because there were so many men around in the camp and he said 'don't worry, it won't take long.'...lol...Too many memorable scenes.
"you're mine, mo duinne," he said softly, pressing himself into my depths. "Mine alone, now and forever. Mine, whether you will it or no." SWOOOOOOON.
{/I'm testing a spoiler tag} / we'll see.
Carol, ha ha ha, I love that scene! Ohhh Jamie, how I love thee...lol
goodness know that Jaime sure does have a way with words in these books.
Allen, Yes Jamie sure does. That, I think is one of the things we love so much about Jamie.
I love that DG has used her husband for some of the best Jamie-isms both humorous and romantic. ;)
I was struck, anew, by Mrs. Graham's "reading" of Claire's tea leaves and her palm.... I remember thinking the first time I read through these pages, "What has this got to do with anything?" Ha! Little did I know, huh?This time through, I bookmarked the page. But between that and the interesting horoscope info from The Outlander Companion, I wondered just how much time Diana G spent deciding dates, times, and events for these two? From her recent video chat (around Christmas), she said that she doesn't plan things out, but that she writes in scenes. I know it's scandalous of me to say, but can that be true? Or do Jamie and Claire truly want to come to life, and these little details just that much more firmly entrench them into our lives and hearts?
Either way, it's awesome, Lori! These books are MAGICAL!!! Nothing can compare to their breadth and scope, IMO.
Marietta wrote: "{/I'm testing a spoiler tag} / we'll see."Just copy and past this and remove the ! in the first part :)
Put what you want to hide here
Then it will look like this: (view spoiler)
For some reason Leea's link messed up... though it seemed to work good enough. The (hide spioler) part isn't the code.Like this Put what you want to hide here
Then just remove the ! in the first part.
Teresita! I love those scenes too. Jamie is has such an alpha magnatism about him. And yes, he has an amazing way with words. Even just reading your quotes gets me every time.
I'm listening to the audio book. My virgin voyage with audio media. Davina Porter sounds very much like Dame Judy Dench...lovely. I am wondering though, how you can drive and listen. I want to pay closer attention than I should if driving. I'm getting ready for a flight from Rochester MN to Rochester NY and thought it would be ideal for flying. Because I now have a kindle and Outlander in both digital and audio. Who knew it did audio!!!!
Wendy F wrote: "For some reason Leea's link messed up... though it seemed to work good enough. The (hide spioler) part isn't the code.Like this Put what you want to hide here
Then just remove the ! in the ..."
Thanks, I have saved this info to my computer! :)
I love listening to the audio by Davina Porter, but my cd player quit working last night and I didn't have my "fix" of Jaime and Claire for the day. So I pulled out my kindle and read a few more chapters.... LOL.I'm really tempted to rejoin audible so I can get the series in audio and use my kindle or mp3 player to listen instead of having to lug all those CDs from the library around with me.
I'm just getting into the Davina Porter audiobooks. I got them all with my Audible free downloads. Love it! I'm listening to her for this re-read of Outlander. I love her voice! It's so great! I'm curious to see how she does Jamie's voice...that's going to be a hard pill for me to swallow...a woman doing Himself's voice. It won't match what I have in my head I'm sure. LOL
Wendy F wrote: "For some reason Leea's link messed up... though it seemed to work good enough. The (hide spioler) part isn't the code.Like this Put what you want to hide here
Then just remove the ! in the ..."
Sorry, I did it in a rush before leaving the house. Thanks Wendy!
Yes Jen, I agree that Davina Porter does a great job in the Outlander audio's.Also I wanted to comment that I didn't attention to some of the negative reviews on amazon before deciding to read Outlander. I almost declined to read it when I read someone comment about the 'barbaric' way Jamie beat Claire. They made him sound like a total bully or brute who beats his wife. And gave me the impression that Jamie was a total jerk. And I thought he sounded horrible and why would anyone want to be with someone like that. Also I was under impression she lived two lives by going back and forth from future husband to past. I am so GLAD I decided to ignore those reviews and see for myself. Outlander series has become the best I have ever read. Jamie is totally is the best fictional character ever created as far as I am concerned. And I can't wait for book 8. I do hope and pray it comes out end of this year and not next year.
I love reading Outlander again with all the knowledge we have now. I remember upon first reading it that I thought the ghost was Jamie. I'm glad my assumption was proved right! You read it now and the clues are all glaringly obvious: large chap, running stag brooch...Diana Gabaldon is so clever! I can't wait to see the final explanation of that scene.
Diane wrote: "Wendy F wrote: "Really quick, in the mass message that I sent out I said that the reread will be going through March... that was a flub. The reread of Outlander will be going through FEBRUARY! Ma..."for me it was when Jamie took the blame for Claires rumbly belly on the way back from being rescued. I have read this series so many times and listened to the audio books even more times and I always find some little passage I missed the time before because I'm so eager to find out what's going to happen next. I always seem to stop at this part and re read it over and over. lol its silly but it humanizes the situation for me. He doesn't know her or why she is there yet he feels compassion for her pride, which she feels for him later on happens for her many times.
yes Erin, and also when Jamie was going to marry Claire he told Dougal that he would marry on one condition and that was that they get Claire a proper dress to marry in and that she is taken care of. He didn't care so much about himself as cared how she felt. Also right after they married and she fainted Jamie told them he would take care of 'his wife' and while she was unconcious he said that as long as he lived no one would harm her. That he would take care of her. I am not sure if this part was said in Outlander but I know it was in THE EXHILE book.Also I loved when she asked Jamie if it didn't bother him that she was not a virgin and he answered 'as long as it doesna bother you that I am'. lol...and her jaw dropped. 'Reckon one if us should know what they're doing.'
I think we out to have a question asked like 'what song/s reminds you of Jamie or Outlander'? Just a suggestion as another topic when one comes up.
That's a great question Teresita! I'll definitely use it. I'm trying to come up with 8 questions for each book as we reread so I think I'll definitely throw that one in there somewhere.I have to say that as I read I'm finding that I don't really have much of a problem with Frank at all. I read their conversation about the plants falling out of his research book as light hearted teasing, not him being really irritated. And as far as him spending a lot of time on his genealogy, well I think it's nice that Claire doesn't take it as an offence. If I were Frank I'd want to use some time to research. And while I don't like that he may have cheated on Claire during their time apart, when he says 6 years went by and they only saw each other 3 times, and the last time was for one day... if it were me and I found my husband had had an affair during that point. I'd be sad, but I'd likely forgive him. That is a LONG time apart. They are lucky that their marriage even lasted. To much absence doesn't usually make the heart grow fonder, it usually makes the heart grow cold. When I read it I actually think Claire overreacted. Frank was just trying to say that if she DID, that he wouldn't care he'd love her anyway.
Teresita, please spoiler tag that post. That's all stuff that happens in the later books and we may have rereaders who haven't gotten that far.I agree with you completely. That bothered me, but also I found that I was really bothered by his stance on the idea of adoption. I know there are people out there who feel like that. But my own sister is adopted, so it's definitely a hard thing for me to read.
Theresa, we cannot edit your post. So instead of just deleting it. I hid it here in a spoiler.(view spoiler)
Please let's try to spoiler tag anything that goes past Outlander. Trust me the mods don't want to 'police' this issue but we also don't want anyone who is new to the series to read something from another book. It was a major complaint of this Group before we took it over. Thanks you so much for your help.
If you cannot do the spoiler tag, at least *** spoiler *** before it.
*Copy and past this, then remove the !
What you want to hide here
My apologies...I realized after I wrote it that I forgot to add Spoiler Alert and was at work so I could not sign back on til now.Again sorry if I spoiled it for anyone. I will be more careful about that.
Thanks Leea and Teresita!
Boy, you all read fast! Granted this is a re-read, but I only have an hour or two in a day for reading, :). Now regarding Claire/Frank/Jamie, I believe Clarie is very brave. The first time I read this book was in the 90's, I was in my late 20's at the time and the thought of where Claie was physically, her choices presented to her & her age, well, she was lucky she found Jamie.
Dawn wrote: "Boy, you all read fast! Granted this is a re-read, but I only have an hour or two in a day for reading, :). Now regarding Claire/Frank/Jamie, I believe Clarie is very brave. The first time I r..."
Hi Dawn. I don't get much time to read either. Like you I also only have about 2 hours or so to read a day.
I know what you mean about Claire. I think that aside from Jamie finding her beautiful and attractive, I think it's her courage, strength and feistiness that Jamie loves most about her. ****THIS PART I AM ABOUT TO SAY MAYBE A SPOILER ALERT****** but, Especially since Lord John once told her that it was not her beauty that jamie spoke to him about most...
Hi Teresita,We have to keep in mind that her first goal was to go home, but that it quickly changed to survival. (With me re-reading this 20 years later, with the love of my life next to me), we later see how the story changes. When we (or me) get to that part, I stand that she is very courageous still. I will make my point later.
Have to agree that Claire had to be very much focused on survival.The first time I read Outlander, I thought: Wow! This story is so great but there is NO way I would want to live back in the 1700's!
I think I remember DG commenting; possibly in The Outlandish Companion or in one of her blogs; that one of the reasons she cast Claire as a nurse in WW2 is so that she would be "tough" enough to handle the challenges of living in the past.
Hi Peggy...Yes I agree that I would not like to live in the 1700's either UNLESS I was Claire and had my very own Jamie Fraser...lol... The clothing they wore and lack medicines we have now, the diseases no hot baths,etc...would be very uncomfortable for me.But yes Claire's first priority was trying to get back to Frank and then to survive, etc.
And yes I think DG said that was why she gave Claire the career as a nurse, so she would be tough...and i think to help herself and others if she/they became ill.
It's a good point about her being concerned with survival. It's easy to forget that when you are reading a book from the comfort of your livingroom, you know? When I first read the book, I thought even though I WANTED Claire and Jamie to be together, it wasn't truly believable how easily she slipped into her role as Jamie's wife, but if you consider both a) that she and Jamie are soulmates AND b) that she is just trying to survive, her actions are a lot more realistic, IMHO. :)
LOL - I just got to the "beating"... Now, I don't want to rehash the whys or wherefores of it all - I don't condone beating! But as a reader, I do have to laugh. I would have reacted exactly the same way that Claire did.And it amused me to no end how she really thought that by acknowledging his words and accepting them, that she'd talked her way out of the punishment.
I was a child who sometimes faced "the belt". My parents weren't cruel, but they did believe in corporal punishment -- not quite the same as from Jamie's day, but still. So I think my laughing has as much to do with commiseration towards Claire and relating to it as anything else.
It amazed me to see reviews on amazon.com that called Jamie a "brute" and condemned the book and the story because of this incident. IMO, there are a heck of a lot more brutal scenes - with REAL brutality - than this one. No one ever spoke of Jamie's treatment at the end of the book, for example.
I keep hearing Jamie's words over and over again in my mind, about how Claire (and we) obviously live in a much safer time, where we don't even think about the affect our words or actions might have, not only on ourselves, but on those around us. Most of us don't have to watch our backs every moment of the day for feuding clans, the Watch, English soldiers, or even wild animals. I'm so thankful for that privilege, but I wonder sometimes, what the cost of that safety is?
I just have to say (again,LOL) that Jamie, could spank my naked behind anytime he wanted to.
Renee wrote: "I just have to say (again,LOL) that Jamie, could spank my naked behind anytime he wanted to."Hahaha
Lori, I think that's well said! I've always said that I do not condone beatings at ALL, but that the times back then were so different. A man stealing was getting flogged, now we steal and you get community service, not a nail through the hear holding you to a pillory (and that was considered getting off LIGHT!). Was it hard to read, YES. But I never ever felt anger at Jamie. That is what his era taught him was justice. You can't go back to the 18th century and not expect to be treated with the those rules. But, I have to say, I think the reason why people are more appalled at Jamie's actions are because Jamie was the hero. You expect the villain to do awful things. But the hero, well he should always be perfect in every way.
Personally, Jamie's imperfections make me love him more.
I wouldn't have wanted to live in Jamie's time either unless I knew a Claire(as in doctor/nurse) or if I was Claire. In more ways than one, hehe.I am still in the beginning of the reread, Jamie and Claire are not married yet. This reread I am listening to the famous Davina Porter for the first time! When I first started, I followed along with the 20th Anniversary copy, lol. It is so nice to hear those Gaelic words pronounced finally. The first time I read Outlander, the beginning dragged on for me, but rereading it, its not bad at all. That's funny how you see things differently the more times you read.
Yeah I don't understand why some reacted that way to the spanking. I said on another thread, it's all in the context of the story that makes it somewhat understandable.
I can't think off the top of my head which moment Jamie became real for me but as I reread I will keep looking for it. But I know my first Awwwww moment was when she started crying and he comforted her.
I think there is a huge difference with Jamie feeling he has to "punish" Claire and wanting to. It goes along with every story he tells of getting punished himself, from a wee boy to a grown man. It's the way things were handled back then and even still the last thing he wanted to do was hurt her. After all he loved her from the first moment he saw her.
Wendy F wrote: Personally, Jamie's imperfections make me love him more.I am with you on that one. Definitely.
Exactly Lori! My parents also used the belt on us (me and my brothers and sister) but it was like you said corpoarl punishment to them not abuse.But yes some on amazon called Jamie a "Brute" which is one reason I almost didn't read the book.
Yea i didnt see a problem with jamie beating Claire either when you think about the context of the book. It was the 18th century! I thought that part of the book was important in revealing jamie's character. He's a man that lives for his honor, and he'll do anything to maintain that honor. When i first read it i thought he was only kidding i was surprised when he actually did it. I don't think it condones wife beating, Gabaldon was just portraying certain ideals and practices of the time.
For me, it was the honeymoon...during those scenes, the things he tells you about himself there... and the way he wants to please Claire and find out what she wants too - and him taking her fishing and hiking....I loved those moments....I have a hard time with the beginning of the book, it still seems to drag though necessary for the series
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Outlander Series
Books mentioned in this topic
Lover Avenged (other topics)Dragonfly in Amber (other topics)
Timeline (other topics)
The Outlandish Companion (other topics)
