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January Outlander Reread - See post 642 on page 13 for this weeks TOPIC!
She saw Claire's smallpox vaccine scar.
Lotte - Yes, sorry. (view spoiler) Gillian had so many different names, it was tough to keep up with them all! Sorry for any confusion.
Carol L wrote: "She saw Claire's smallpox vaccine scar."I know that is how Claire knew Gellie was from the future. (view spoiler) Does it ever say, or are we just assuming?
I'll have to find it, but in Voyager (view spoiler)...So in a roundabout way and in a twisted sense of time, Claire gave herself away in the past by an action from the future! One that Claire, herself, didn't even know she'd done yet. I think that's why Geillie tested Claire so much at the beginning, and why she drugged her.
I need to go back and look it up. But If i remember right Claire saw Gillie's vaccination shot and asked her what year she came from. So that was Gilli's clue. I think that was right before Jamie rescued Claire but I am not positive on the timing. After dinner I will try and go back and find it. Or perhaps someone else knows as we just did a re-read?
lol we were writing at the same time Lori!
Lori wrote: "I'll have to find it, but in Voyager [spoilers removed]...So in a roundabout way and in a twisted sense of time, Claire gave herself away in the past by an action from the future! One that Claire..."
Wow that is a little hard to follow..but I do:) I found in the book Outlander when (view spoiler)
So I am assuming from these quetions that Gellie already knew who Claire was (view spoiler)
Fawn if I remember correctly, Claire saw Gellie's scar when she was escaping with Jamie and Gellie put her arms up in the air claiming to be a witch and that's when Claire saw it. (I think)
You might be right Sue.Tina: Don't forget at that time Dougal thought Claire to be an English spy. So Giliis could have been trying to find that out.
Tina! Oh yes you did! DG writes so well! It's perfectly worded and completely understandable! If only it didn't get so muddled in our heads!
Lori wrote: "I'll have to find it, but in Voyager [spoilers removed]...So in a roundabout way and in a twisted sense of time, Claire gave herself away in the past by an action from the future! One that Claire..."
Tina is right from Claire's point of view in Outlander, but I love the revelation in Voyager from Geilie, too! I love how things are still relevant in future books...I think that's why we love to discuss them so much :)
Leah wrote: "Lori wrote: "I'll have to find it, but in Voyager [spoilers removed]...So in a roundabout way and in a twisted sense of time, Claire gave herself away in the past by an action from the future! ..."
So true Leah, I just love having back and forth discussing about different things and how everyone interrepts the story in their own way. I also love doing research,. but I am having a hard time finding when Claire and Geilie have their encounter in the future. Hopefully Lori will find it. I would love to re-read that part. I will continue looking as well.
I just finished Outlander for the second time. I am so glad I did the re-read. After reading all the other books, I kind of forgot some of the things that happened in Outlander. One main happening is :(view spoiler)
Now onto Dragonfly in Amber
Tina wrote: "Leah wrote: "Lori wrote: "I'll have to find it, but in Voyager [spoilers removed]...So in a roundabout way and in a twisted sense of time, Claire gave herself away in the past by an action from..."
May I step in for Lori? This scene is at the very end of DIA, chapter 49. The scene you are looking for is probably on page 940 (paperback).
Thanks, Lotte. It would have taken me some time to get there. I'm still reading (re-reading) Voyager... doing the Kindle version, but I'm not that far into the book yet. Was hoping to have more reading time, but, alas!
Thanks. I am on my way to re-read that part.
I was wondering how Gellie knew. I guess I will have to trust it came out during the time she spent with Claire in her attic.I had a new thought now that we all seem to be at the end of the book. Claire did a confession with the Father and (this maybe a stretch) has anyone thought when she goes to the hot spring with Jamie, this was a baptism. A re-birth or start on her life with Jamie?
I had not thought of that, but there is certainly that feel to the whole scene. New start, new family start, all that. Interesting read, Dawn.
Interesting, Dawn! Didn't occur to me, but I like it!
I had not thought about it in the past, But for some reason I thought Claire confessed to Father Anselm was earlier in the book, while Jamie was very sick.Now after she receives absolution, and the water she & Jamie are bathing in is oilly, which may be similar to oil use in the "The Anointing". Plus now she pregnant when we all thought she was bairn.
New Question!Let's talk about Jamie's history... Jamie tells Claire many stories about his childhood, from scraps he got into with Ian to stories of Jenny, which one touched you the most, either because you laughed or cried?
Jamie taking the blame when Jenny broke the vase. Showed his character even young. Love him!!!
Love how close he and Ian were and how Ian would "protect" his weak side. I am also loving the exerpts from Virgins when Jamie and Ian were mercenaries. Every body should have a relationship as close as Ian and Jamie in their life.
When Jamie tried to get him and Ian out of punishment by telling his (Jamie's) father that " beating was uncivilized in order to make your point" and so instead of beating, Jamie's father made them clean the broch.
Ian and Jamie are one of my favorite relationships too. Every time they're together I can totally feel the love pulsing off the pages, almost as much as Jamie and Claire. Diana does great relationships.I'd say one of my favorites is when Ian tells the story of how Jamie argued that beating your child was uncivilized to his father. Then they had to clean the Broch from top to bottom, because it was more civilized.
I also LOVED the story of Jamie's last thrashing. When his Dad thrashed him, wanting him to cry out just once so he knew he made an impression and Jamie said he turned around and said, "Well why didn't you say so, you old fool! OUCH!" I crack up every time I read that.
And, it's not Jamie, but I love so much the story of Jenny proposing to Ian and refusing to say no. How he doesn't remember exactly how it started, but it ended with him nodding and saying 'Fine, we'll be married by St. Martins Day." And how he still stands and stares at her in the distance, surprised that she's actually his. Thinking about this moment is what really breaks my heart in Echo when (view spoiler).
I always loved the stories that Ian and Jamie would tell about growing up together and always sharing in the punishment. When BJR has Jamie at Lollybroch and is going to take him away and BJR is threatening to keep him alive if Jenny goes 'upstairs' with him. All Jamie could think of is his sisters honor, he would have willingly died to protect her. It brings me to tears every time.
Even Jamies vow to protect her with his name and body, even when there marriage was new. He's just an honorable man.
I agree Wendy, I can't wait to read about Ian and Jamie in France - talk about trouble. haha!
I resonated with all those mentioned, and add Jamie's memories of his brother, and the snake that Willy carved for him. A prized possession.
I plan to start my reread of the entire series in June. I will read one book each month so that I will be ready for book 8 in January 2013!
I admire you optimism Theresa.
The first time I read the book, I almost cried when Jamie was telling Claire the story when he was taken from home - with BJR and Jennie. I *did* cry when Jamie finally learned the truth. (And I was furious with Dougal - that might have been when I started to really, really dislike the man.)I *definitely* laughed out loud at the story of Jamie's dad whipping him, trying to get him to cry out! I've actually got a similar story of one of my last spankings, so it reminded me of that.
My heart melts whenever Jamie talks about his past, but I think I was especially touched when Jamie wore his dad's old, patched briefs that were too big for him -- when he was going to fix the mill. It was so like Jamie... such a small thing he did - probably unthinking - but that said so much about him and his love for his father and family.
I agree with everyone's posts! All my favorites have been listed already. I'd like to add this one that makes me cry every time:
Chap. 26, The Laird's Return
"Weel, and if you've been a fool, Jamie, it seems you've paid for it." She laid her hand gently on his back, covering the worst of the scars.
"It looks as though it hurt."
"It did."
"Did you cry?"
His fists clenched involuntarily at his sides. "Yes!"
Jenny walked back around to face him, pointed chin lifted and slanted eyes wide and bright. "So did I," she said softly, "every day since they took ye away."
I love how Jamie and Jenny can fight like cats and dogs, but at the end of the day their love for each other is stronger than anything.
I love that moment too, and then how they bend their heads to each other and talk softly. It was so touching.
When it comes to family, They are both ferocious and yet the most tender a person can be. Don't you think?
Absolutely. It's funny in that whole scene because they both have such similar personalities, it really is like they were locking horns.
When I read that scene, I have a goofy grin and i'm shaking my head because they just wont listen to each other. Plus Ian and the way he tells Claire, give them a minute... then he finally steps in. it's just so funny and heart warming. I always wished J & C could have stayed at Lollybroch, pipe dream I know but I just want them happy :)
I think Jamie's willingness to believe the worst of Jenny and her behavior with BJR and his vehement attack of Jenny reminds us of his youth and failure to assess the situation for himself, rather than believe gossip. And the sources. Later in life he is better at finding out the truth himself before exploding.
Good point, Carol! Even though Dougal has a hard share of blame in this episode, Jamie knew his sister, too. Then again, being so ferocious about family as they both are, perhaps knowing family was exactly what Dougal used and why Jamie believed as he did?
Oh, God I'm not sure.I think I like hearing about his and Ian's escapades the most. The one with the frogs, the one with the owls(that might be in DIA), the tower...
Has it ever struck you as odd that we see WAY more such scenes from Jamie's past than from Claire's? We don't see random scenes from her childhood, her adventures, her uncle, etc...Not even about her meeting Frank. Like maybe she could remember something particular. I remember the scene when her uncle decides to keep her, she only MENTIONS who her first kiss was and where she met Frank. IDK, I would've loved reading about some mischief on a site in Egypt, or something.
I think that could also be part of the reason why I feel like I know Jamie better than Claire.
We certainly know of Jamie's background, then we do Claire's. I mean, we know she was brought up by her uncle, traveled the world with him. We know that she's a nurse, but you're right, how did she meet Frank? What kind of life did she have during the war? She gives us only small snippets of her earlier life.I always wondered why DG doesn't give us more insight into Claire's background.
Never thought of that, but you're right. We have snippets of Claire's past from her narrative and a bit that she's told others. But not nearly the depth or quantity that we have from Jamie. Most of Claire's past is either shared with Jamie or her own memories - like in Voyager (view spoiler).Good thing to wonder about! Has DG mentioned doing much with Claire's family in future? She's said she'll write a prequel to Outlander featuring Jamie's parents Ellen and Brian. Wonder if she's got a similar thing in mind for Claire. We know she plans to fill out Claire's family tree in the Outlander Companion 2 - or I thought I remembered reading or hearing that.
Carol L wrote: "I think Jamie's willingness to believe the worst of Jenny and her behavior with BJR and his vehement attack of Jenny reminds us of his youth and failure to assess the situation for himself, rather ..."Very good point Carol. We do see Jamie mature. We forget how young he is as he had great responsibilities early on (as did Jenny) we really are seeing him grow up aye.
I don't think we see Claire's memories as much because she can't say too much in front of anyone but Jamie. And as far as her parents, I always kind of wondered if they were TT from the past. Came here and had Claire, but really were from the 18th century.
What a curious idea, Sue. Can you say any more about what let you to this line of thinking? If it was just the way DG spins time lines, I could certainly understand that. Interesting indeed.....
Sue, I never thought of that. That's a good theory.To be honest, it kills me to read the 'sneak peaks from book 8' because I know it's over a year off. I havent't read them all only a few.
Carren wrote: "We certainly know of Jamie's background, then we do Claire's. I mean, we know she was brought up by her uncle, traveled the world with him. We know that she's a nurse, but you're right, how did she..."Well we knew she met Frank when he came to see Uncle Lamb. Being a historian, their jobs crossed paths. She does mention that at some point.
There is nothing in the sneak peeks that talks about that. It's just that her parents are such a mystery. And she does well in the 18th century. Just a what if! Also we do know that the TT genes are passed down through the generations.
Another thing is Uncle Lamb doesn't tell her much about them. Just that they were killed in a car crash, but I don't think she has a lot of info on them. And was he her true Uncle?
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Outlander Series
Books mentioned in this topic
Lover Avenged (other topics)Dragonfly in Amber (other topics)
Timeline (other topics)
The Outlandish Companion (other topics)
I was just wondering which husband you ment and DIA... But then I got it you thought of as Gillian Edgars!
This prophecy thing never became clear to me, this will be a nice point to discuss when we do Voyager.