Classics and the Western Canon discussion
Discussion - Moby Dick
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Week 6 - through Chapter 128
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Adelle wrote: "Still, I hold that a good part of why Starbuck didn’t shoot Ahab is that Starbuck is recommitting himself to civilization and laws. If he starts administrating his own justice he’s about the same as Ahab. Otherwise, why couldn’t just anybody start deciding that they know what the truth is and start killing the people they “just know” should be killed. "Starbuck's also a Quaker, and of all the Quakers in this book, one of the only genuinely devout ones. I'd imagine this holds him back as much as secular law.
S. Rosemary wrote: "Adelle wrote: "Interestingly enough, I was thinking along these lines this morning while Iwas grocery shopping. (LOL, like Rosemary...thinking MD all the time!) "
LOL, it's been awfully rainy here..."
I LOVE that!
LOL, it's been awfully rainy here..."
I LOVE that!
S. Rosemary wrote: "Adelle wrote: "Still, I hold that a good part of why Starbuck didn’t shoot Ahab is that Starbuck is recommitting himself to civilization and laws. If he starts administrating his own justice he’s a..."
I kinda thought Starbuck held his religion, well, probably as best he could, but that it was a religion he had simply taken has his own...that he'd never struggled deeply with religion to have it penetrate his soul...(which is what I thought Ahab had a chance to do)...
I thought Starbuck mouthed the right words, and followed the right forms....but held his religion, I thought, more or less mechanically.
And yet, I have seen that some people see Starbuck as quite an admirable character. Different perceptions. Mmm...like someone on another thread had written...so much is our own perceptions.
Edit: LOL, Why, it was YOU, Rosemary, whose post (#46) about perceptions I had read!
I kinda thought Starbuck held his religion, well, probably as best he could, but that it was a religion he had simply taken has his own...that he'd never struggled deeply with religion to have it penetrate his soul...(which is what I thought Ahab had a chance to do)...
I thought Starbuck mouthed the right words, and followed the right forms....but held his religion, I thought, more or less mechanically.
And yet, I have seen that some people see Starbuck as quite an admirable character. Different perceptions. Mmm...like someone on another thread had written...so much is our own perceptions.
Edit: LOL, Why, it was YOU, Rosemary, whose post (#46) about perceptions I had read!
Starbuck was not a Quaker, he was a Presbyterian, and I can't see any reason in the book to think he was less than sincere in his faith.
Laurele wrote: "Starbuck was not a Quaker, he was a Presbyterian, and I can't see any reason in the book to think he was less than sincere in his faith."
Probably just one more aspect of the book that is there for interpretation by the reader. For myself, and speaking only for myself, I was less than impressed with Starbuck. I did grant that he held his religion probably as well as he could....but I never saw him or felt he had a deep faith...a good deal of that is probably a subjective call.
Should you wish, I could point out the passages that influenced me towards my view of Starbuck; but I'm also fine with us just seeing him from different viewpoints. Doubtless there are passages in Moby Dick that would lend a more generous interpretation to Starbuck. I suppose the reader focuses on the one's that resonate as "true" to the reader.
I'm pretty sure though that Starbuck was a Quaker. Ishmael was a Presbyterian, but the first sentence in chapter 26, "Knights and Squires" reads, "The Chief mate of the Pequod was Starbuck...a Quaker by descent" (128).
It's entirely possible that elsewhere in the book mention was made that Starbuck was a Presbyterian...but I don't recall seeing such.
Probably just one more aspect of the book that is there for interpretation by the reader. For myself, and speaking only for myself, I was less than impressed with Starbuck. I did grant that he held his religion probably as well as he could....but I never saw him or felt he had a deep faith...a good deal of that is probably a subjective call.
Should you wish, I could point out the passages that influenced me towards my view of Starbuck; but I'm also fine with us just seeing him from different viewpoints. Doubtless there are passages in Moby Dick that would lend a more generous interpretation to Starbuck. I suppose the reader focuses on the one's that resonate as "true" to the reader.
I'm pretty sure though that Starbuck was a Quaker. Ishmael was a Presbyterian, but the first sentence in chapter 26, "Knights and Squires" reads, "The Chief mate of the Pequod was Starbuck...a Quaker by descent" (128).
It's entirely possible that elsewhere in the book mention was made that Starbuck was a Presbyterian...but I don't recall seeing such.
S. Rosemary wrote: "LOL, it's been awfully rainy here the past few weeks, and my husband has been tromping around in his sou-wester and long slicker and Quaker beard saying, "Hast seen the white whale?" scaring everyone at work. I love it. ."Wonderful! I should try that at Halloween. Make a tight white sleeve for my leg to emulate the ivory leg.
Laurele wrote: "Starbuck was not a Quaker, he was a Presbyterian,...the book to think he was less than sincere in his faith."Are you sure? Ishmael was definitely a Presbyterian: "I was a good Christian; born and bred in the bosom of the infallible Presbyterian Church. How then could I unite with this wild idolator in worshipping his piece of wood? But what is worship? thought I. Do you suppose now, Ishmael, that the magnanimous God of heaven and earth—pagans and all included—can possibly be jealous of an insignificant bit of black wood? Impossible! But what is worship?—to do the will of God—THAT is worship. And what is the will of God?—to do to my fellow man what I would have my fellow man to do to me—THAT is the will of God. Now, Queequeg is my fellow man. And what do I wish that this Queequeg would do to me? Why, unite with me in my particular Presbyterian form of worship. " Chapter 10.
But as to Starbuck, Cha[pter 26: "The chief mate of the Pequod was Starbuck, a native of Nantucket, and a Quaker by descent. "
Everyman wrote: "S. Rosemary wrote: "LOL, it's been awfully rainy here the past few weeks, and my husband has been tromping around in his sou-wester and long slicker and Quaker beard saying, "Hast seen the white wh... EVERYMAN: I should try that at Halloween"
Do it! Do it! Do it!
Not a spoiler...but off topic
(view spoiler)
Do it! Do it! Do it!
Not a spoiler...but off topic
(view spoiler)
Adelle wrote: "Laurele wrote: "Starbuck was not a Quaker, he was a Presbyterian, and I can't see any reason in the book to think he was less than sincere in his faith."Probably just one more aspect of the boo..."
Oh you're right, Adelle! It was Ishmael who was the Presbyterian. Sorry about that!
Laurele wrote: "Oh you're right, Adelle! It was Ishmael who was the Presbyterian."
SO easy to mix up a fact here or there. Lol....I say that because I do it, too! The first half of the book I was mixed up regarding Ahab's wife.
SO easy to mix up a fact here or there. Lol....I say that because I do it, too! The first half of the book I was mixed up regarding Ahab's wife.
Adelle wrote: "Do it! Do it! Do it!Not a spoiler...but off topic "
My similar experience: (view spoiler)
Guess we gotta give up those non-mainstream and/or literary costumes. OR, throw non-mainstream and/or literary Halloween parties.
LOL, it's been awfully rainy here the past few weeks, and my husband has been tromping around in his sou-wester and long slicker and Quaker beard saying, "Hast seen the white whale?" scaring everyone at work. I love it.