Breaking Dawn (The Twilight Saga, #4) Breaking Dawn discussion

Basically, this book sucked. It was practically saying the same thing throughout the whole book. *May contain spoilers*

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message 1: by [deleted user] (new)

Bella being pregnant? I mean. Really. Thats all they talk about. That and her being good at hunting. I mean, couldn't they talk about something else? No. They have 500 pages about her being pregnant. 100 about her being so tame as a vamp. 50 about gathering the people for vulturi. 5 about the actual fight. Couldn't Stephanie Meyers say something besides those three things. Really. And they all have something to do with fighting the volturi, which was about five pages. Or maybe its just me getting paranoid.

Leslie Come on....a nearly exploding uterus is pretty exciting!

Corinne Glad to know i wasn't the only one WTFing about that the entire time.

message 4: by Ruby (new) - rated it 1 star

Ruby i just couldnt believe bella got pregnant in the first place. wasnt it meyer that said vamps cant have kids? WTF?

Pachia yes, meyer did say vampires couldn't have kids. it was in her "faqs". but that blog got taken down. I can't seem to find it anywhere now.

message 6: by Ruby (new) - rated it 1 star

Ruby I can. in a number of different interveiws. not just her blog.

Natalie I was so disappointed with this book. So completely disappointed, I joined this site to see if others felt the same. Bella being pregnant? This huge staging for a fight that doesn't even happen...did anybody else throw the book across the room after they spent all night reading it? I had to drag myself through the middle of the book, it seemed to drag on forever. And how about the wedding! No leading up to that, it was in the first part of the book! Hey, we're married and pregnant, lets surround the rest of the plot around that. And JACOB! Who is completely and absolutely in love with Bella, and runs away because he can't stand to see Bella with someone else, is now bound to her daughter? Creepy factor, anyone? I looked forward to this book for so long, and honestly, I could slap myself.

message 8: by [deleted user] (new)

The book was ok...but what really got me confused was bella's pregnancy. I thought vampires couldn't have kids.Well, at least everyone got their happy ending, including Jacob when he imprinted on Renesmee.

message 9: by Toni (new) - rated it 1 star

Toni Is it really? I downloaded the original correspondence where she gave her explanation just in case it happened, but I didn't think it would.

Oh wow...

message 10: by Toni (new) - rated it 1 star

Toni Wait, here's the link to the original correspondence where she specifically states that no, male and female vampires CANNOT have kids:

She says, and I quote:

"And since we’re talking physiology…I’ve had tons of people ask if vampires can have babies. The answer is no."

Although she discussed why female vampires couldn't become pregnant, she made it pretty clear that neither gender could reproduce.

I'm still wondering why no one has called this woman for kicking a big hole in her own fandom.

message 11: by Sarah (new) - rated it 1 star

Sarah Poor Jacob's character got the shaft in this book. He had become such an interesting charcater and so full of depth by the end of "Eclipse" and then in this book once he imprinted that was the end. I loved JAcob and didn't like seeing him kindof go away like that.

message 12: by Melissa (last edited Aug 05, 2008 10:10AM) (new) - rated it 2 stars

Melissa I was really hoping for a big fight too. At least let Jacob run off the the kid and let there be more books about Belle and Edward trying to find them. I thought surely with a build up like that there should have been a fight. I was actually a let down at the end. :0(

message 13: by Janet (new) - added it

Janet Thanks Natalie, for articulating EXACTLY what I felt after finishing Breaking Dawn. HOLY HELL! I was so extremely disappointed w/the direction she decided to take the story in. Bella being pregnant??? NO! I had to put the book in the freezer at that point b/c I was so frustrated.
And I agree, she breezed right thru the was so anti-climactic.

Bella becoming a vampire was also somewhat of a disappointment. It completely changed the dynamic of Bella & Edward's relationship; that was the thing that always defined them & made their attraction so forbidden & exciting.

I spent most of this summer eagerly waiting to read this book & I seriously feel funk'd out!

message 14: by keb (last edited Aug 05, 2008 12:09PM) (new) - added it

keb well... it looks like she changed her mind about the whole vampire's getting pregnant didnt she... well its her book she can do whatever she wants with it... people that are obsessing over stupid things like the science isnt right.. it is a FICTION book :)

message 15: by Ruby (last edited Feb 25, 2009 02:36AM) (new) - rated it 1 star

Ruby im honestly dissappointed about the whole no fight thing. im mean since new moon, its kinda been setting up: a fight between the volturi and the cullens or whatever.

come on! u cant have a fight scene in every other book and when the biggest and 'final' fight comes up, u just say 'o u kno what? i think ill make her use her retarded power and protect everybody. no fight.'

r u kidding me?

message 16: by Lori (new) - rated it 4 stars

Lori Regarding Stephenie Meyers' comment on the fact that vampires cannot have babies - They can't. There was no vampire in this book that had a baby. I have to admit, when Bella got pregnant I had to put the book down and work things out in my head before I could continue on. That really upset me. I had a theory about this while reading Twilight and dismissed it because it was impossible. So this is what I came up with. Edwards sperm has been frozen for a century. People freeze sperm all the time for future use. The fact that he has not had sex before Bella was a set up for the release of said sperm. Bella's body must have thawed it. (reaching, I know)
So, I was okay with this enough to finish the book. Until the other half vampire came into the picture and said he had three sisters. Then it didn't make sense to me any more because males are producing sperm all the time. Therefore, once the frozen sperm was released, there would be none left. Meaning only one sexual encounter could have produced a baby. Every other sexual encounter he basically would be shooting blanks, so to speak.

I liked that Bella had a baby. Maybe because I'd thought about it before. But I really didn't like the name - not even the nickname. I liked Carlie, however. That has nothing to do with the book, though.

Alexa Hill I really liked that Bella was pregnant and had a baby. Nessie is adorable. I don't understand why everyone is freaking out. We don't have to get into science and all that. It's a fantasy novel. Vampires don't really exist so I'm pretty sure we shouldn't get all technical and worry about sperm and how that wouldn't work out. Just love the book for what it is, a happily ever after for Edward and Bella. Perhaps Stephenie meant two vampires couldn't have children...she never said a vampire and human couldn't.

message 18: by Lori (new) - rated it 4 stars

Lori I know vampires don't really exist. However, things in the book still have to make sense in the world she has created. Don't you think?

message 19: by keb (new) - added it

keb I totally agree with alexa... the book does make sense in its own little world.. just go with the flow and read the book, when did she ever state in the previous books specifically that vampire male couldnt... and everyone else was just as surprised as edward and bella...

message 20: by Kat (new) - rated it 2 stars

Kat Helgeson The book DOESN'T make sense in it's own world, that's the problem. Although Meyer didn't specifically say word for word "Vampire males cannot have children" she did say the following things:

-Vampires cannot have children
-Vampires do not experience change or growth

Science tells us that sperm GROWS inside the male.

Now, if Meyer wanted to write a story about vampires who can reproduce, fine. But to justify it by saying that men don't NEED to grow and change to reproduce is just silly. She should have either not touched the subject at all, or else extended her fantasy world to include fantasy vampire sperm of some kind

message 21: by Monica (last edited Aug 06, 2008 09:33AM) (new) - rated it 3 stars

Monica I completely agree with you Sarah. Jacob's "Book Two" was wonderful and definitely a highlight for me. But once he imprinted on Reneesmee he got boring. And FAST. I will still love Jacob but it's just not the same... I think Jacob's change in character is the most disappointing of all.

message 22: by Lori (new) - rated it 4 stars

Lori Helkat14

NO VAMPIRE HAD A BABY IN THIS BOOK. That seems to be the point everyone is missing. Bella was not a vampire when she had this baby. This is what SM stated. 'Vampires cannot have children'. And NONE DID. She did not contradict herself. And sperm does grows continually in a male. However, this is just my theory, Edward's sperm stayed frozen for 90 years. It was never released in order for more to grow. After that sperm was released, of course, he could not produce more because he is a vampire and in a frozen state.

The only problem I have with this theory is this, however. When the boy, Nahuel, told of his sisters, that contradicted my theory. Because there is no way for more sperm to develope. So I am in need of some more explanation. I'm sure SM has thought this through. If that were left out of the book, I would have no problem with this.

I really enjoyed the book. Like I've said before there were some things in it that made me put it aside to think about before continuing. But the more I think about it, having finished it, I want to read it again.

Did no one find that fact that Bella and Edward could do things together that they never could do before exhilarating? Not just being intimate. Running, Jumping, etc.

message 23: by Jenn (new) - rated it 2 stars

Jenn Well, it's her book, and her world, so if she wanted to change it, then she can. Personally, I liked the book.

And... Uh...
Haven't you read LOTR, POTC? Those movies/books were set up for fights at one point.


They happened, didn't they?

So, um, you know... Another book? Didn't you get the clues about there being a fight and the Volturi being overthrown? So, maybe in another book about it, there will be a fight or something.

As far as the science goes... Well, men get told they're 'shooting blanks' and get something pregnant, and people are told they can't have kids and they do. Things happen that can't be explained, especially in science. It really is not that big of a deal.


message 24: by Kat (new) - rated it 2 stars

Kat Helgeson Lori - Of course a vampire had a baby. Women don't have babies spontaneously of their own accord. Men have babies WITH women. Yes, the women carry and deliver the babies, but men are a pretty important part of the process.

Jenn - Things don't happen that can't be explained in science. Things happen that we haven't yet figured out HOW to explain. And if that had been the answer, I would have been fine with it:

Edward: Wait, how did I manage to get Bella pregnant?
Carlisle: Well hell, I don't know!

This is unsatisfying, but it is better than:

Bella: Oh, I get it. Edward was able to get me pregnant because men don't need to have changing bodies in order to reproduce.
(...statement goes unchallenged, despite its making absolutely no sense.)

And yes, Meyer is entitled to change the rules if she wants to, but I'm saying that she should have included some explanation of what the new rules were, and why.

An example, borrowing Lori's theory since I think it's pretty good:

Edward: Wait, how did I manage to get Bella pregnant?
Carlisle: Well, I never really thought about it, but you know how the hair you had on your body when you were bitten is still there? Maybe the sperm you had at that time was still there too.
Edward: Can that happen?
Carlisle: I don't know, I'm guessing. I'm also guessing that Bella's body warmed it up to the point where it was able to be active again. You probably couldn't conceive a second child.
Bella: But shouldn't that have been human sperm? And the baby have been fully human? Since it's left over from Edward's human days?
Carlisle: Yeah, maybe the venom did something to it. I dunno. This is all guesswork. But at least we're trying!

message 25: by Lori (new) - rated it 4 stars

Lori Helkat14

I LOVE it. Your whole dialogue. I agree that it should have been addressed more in the book. But, like I said, I was okay with it until the end with the boy and his sisters. Don't get that.

message 26: by keb (new) - added it

keb But its a freaking book and you dont have to understand the science of what happened...

message 27: by Janet (new) - added it

Janet Bella's pregnancy seems to be causing a lot of discussion...I get what some ppl are saying about how the book is fantasy so we've gotta suspend belief right?? I agree, but not when it comes to Bella getting pregnant.
Meyer makes a point of always going on about how Edwards not human...he has no heartbeat, he can't cry, blah, blah, blah. That's what defines him & Bella's relationship thru-out the 3 books...she's human/he's a vamp.
SO.....if he has no bodily fluids how r we supposed to believe that he's got any "swimmers"...sorry, i don't mean to b crass, but like, WTF?!

message 28: by Kat (new) - rated it 2 stars

Kat Helgeson Keb - no I don't have to understand the science of what happened.

But if the author is going to bring science into it, which Meyer DID, then that discussion does have to make sense.

Honestly I'm getting tired of people saying "it's just a book, it doesn't have to make sense!" Good books DO make sense.


Jessica Dabovich stephanie meyer cheated her way through the book every chance she could. allll because she wanted her fans to have the happy ending. well not too many people were happy.

she clearly abused all her beliefs,rules, and character personalities in BD. i mean bella and edward didnt even seem that much in love after she got pregnant. she loved the baby even more than him! WTF. and somehow, miraculously jacob and bella werent in love with each other any more.??!? another easy excuse SM used to get out of the love triangle that edward, jake and bella had.

its like it was a different author who wrote the book. this isnt SM's writing!

and honestly, i have no problem with the sex parts either. BUT, bella alwayys wants to have sex with edward now. they have sex and then dont talk the rest of the day. is that all they are about now??! sex and nothing elsE? what happened to all the love that SM was always so eager to show to the world?

message 30: by Beth (new) - rated it 3 stars

Beth I think that part of what made the books appealing was being able to picture the possibilities and to believe in the fiction. When the story took this turn in this last book, it just made the possibilities a little too outrageous to be believed. Inconsistencies began cropping up along with contradictions.

I can understand that this is SM's story and she wrote it because she wanted to share that story, but to me, the fact that she is changing her own rules in the 11th hour to make the story turn out the way she wants, it's just poor writing.

Sure, it's a book, it's fiction, but think of all of the other fictional stories that would be resolved neatly and cleanly if the author stopped following conventions laid out throughout the plot? What if Harry Potter had an elixir of life and went and poured it on everyone's limp bodies and tombstones at the end of that series? What if Claire Frasier drove a hummer through the stone circle in the Outlander series and eliminated the need to trek around on horseback? It's just stupid and I was disappointed, I expected more.

message 31: by M (new) - added it

M The books started to suck as it progressed as if it wasn't thought out well enough. It seemed to me that it was as though the author just wanted to end the book already, or maybe just get on with another book.

Captmashpea Natalie wrote: "I was so disappointed with this book. So completely disappointed, I joined this site to see if others felt the same. Bella being pregnant? This huge staging for a fight that doesn't even happen...."

i totally felt the same way

message 33: by Lena (new) - rated it 3 stars

Lena Several times while reading this book I had to resist the urge to throw it against the wall. I definitely slammed it shut and screamed, "That CANNOT happen!" more than once.

Sure, it's fantasy. Sure, I can suspend a lot of disbelief. But your book has to make sense. Just because it's fantasy doesn't mean you can throw anything in there and expect people to believe it. It has to be believable in the context of the world you've built. I didn't think this book was. I still don't believe Bella could have a baby. To whoever said 'no vampires had babies in this book,' do you not consider Edward a vampire? Because when a couple gets pregnant, the man says 'we're having a baby' too. SM didnt say 'vampires can't give birth.' She said they can't have babies. That would lead ppl to believe that none of them can, male or female.

I also agree w/ the ppl who didnt like the easy out w/ Jacob. First, it's creepy. By the time that kid's ready to marry, he'll be weirdly old, even if she does grow fast. And it would be weird and awkward all around for everyone involved. This is one book where it seemed like the author was trying to make everyone happy instead of writing to the characters and the story. It seemed like instead of writing the truth about what would really happen, she tried to do what she thought everyone wanted. Everyone just wanted to know the truth of what happened, not be pacified.

Or at least that's what I wanted!

Torie Ruby wrote: "i just couldnt believe bella got pregnant in the first place. wasnt it meyer that said vamps cant have kids? WTF?"

Right, vampires can't have kids. But humans can. So a vampire and a human would logically have a half-vampire half-human kid.

Ariel I'm the type of reader that "goes with the flow" I just follow the story along and think of things that I enjoyed about the book (you know, no question a lot) and I personally liked BD. o-o

Torie Hey, good for you!

Shivani Vampires can't have kids, BUT they both weren't vampires. Bella was human at the time!!

message 38: by Lena (new) - rated it 3 stars

Lena So, is a vampire kid half dead? Lol

message 39: by Latanya (new) - added it

Latanya I think what Meyer did was she brought in a couple characters in the other books an spent alot of time on then. And then in BD she just dropped them out. Like with Jacob.... But hey it was an ok book mostly.

Torie Lena wrote: "So, is a vampire kid half dead? Lol"

You mean a half-vampire, half-human kid? No, because vampires aren't dead and humans aren't dead, therefore their kids would be alive. :p

message 41: by Lena (new) - rated it 3 stars

Lena Vampires are dead. or undead. Their bodies are dead. Or that's how the vampire lore is 'supposed' to be. Although I know of course SM took a lot of liberties w/ her vampires. I never understood the dampiers or whatever they are called, in any books. A body that is dead shouldnt be able to produce offspring. Period.

Vampsessed Lena wrote: " A body that is dead shouldnt be able to produce offspring. Period."


Torie Ok well it all boils down to the fact that it's a FANTASY story, and therefore, we have no need to argue about how "realistic" it is. If it's all about how "realistic" the story is, then we have to start with "Why are there vampires in this book!?!? THAT'S UNREALISTIC!!"

message 44: by Lena (new) - rated it 3 stars

Lena Torie wrote: "Ok well it all boils down to the fact that it's a FANTASY story, and therefore, we have no need to argue about how "realistic" it is. If it's all about how "realistic" the story is, then we have to..."

There is a difference. Reading fantasy requires you to suspend more disbelief than realistic fiction. But an author still has to make the story believable to the world she created. And for a lot of people, SM didn't do that.

message 45: by Karen (new) - rated it 1 star

Karen For me it wasn't about "realistic" fantasy vampires or even the author adhering to her own original concept; the problem was we, the readers, were given 754 pages of boring! About half way through I starting thinking ... "The mind of Bella Swan Cullen, what a terrible waste of space."

Gypsy I got bored of the book after a while. I quickly read it a few months ago and thought 'why did I waste my time' no offence to Steph Meyer but the book just carried on and on and on and on and on about Bella's pregnacy. I think that book could have been a little smaller. I was kind of expecting a war at the end but nothing happened, it was a huge let down. It's still my least favourite book in the series.

Nurlely There are so many topics about Stephenie's fantasy flaws. The marble stone skin with some exceptions, the funny glittering skin and the worst ever, the pregnancy.

I did think that Stephenie wrote good romance novels with Twilight series but she better stays away from fantasy.

Caity(: ♥ My Name Is Caroline ♥ wrote: "The book was ok...but what really got me confused was bella's pregnancy. I thought vampires couldn't have kids.Well, at least everyone got their happy ending, including Jacob when he imprinted on R..."

Caroline.. You have to admit that it was a little weird that Jacob imprinted on Bella's daughter.. Right? Or am I the only one thinking this. I'm still Team Jacob!

Rebecca I loved all of her books. And yes it was said that vampires can't get pregnant, but Bella was not a vampire, she was human. If you think about it vampires are ice cold like a freezer, just like freezing sperm in a clinic, so the possibility is there. And half the book talked about Jacob's side. Which we needed to know about since he plays a key role for a reason, we just did not know the key till the baby girl was born.

Raigen i love all of her books too and in no way did this book suck. the book talked about jacob, his pack, the fight, bella and edward, edward and his family, and many more things ! i <3 this book :)

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