Middle East/North African Lit discussion
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Deck Community Chit-Chat (Interesting Random Things)
message 51:
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Marieke, Former moderator
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Sep 01, 2011 02:01PM
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Wendy it sounds like you work place is really nice.
It is a good place to work Sue. I have no idea if it is traditional for people to send cards to friends and family offering Eid wishes, but we make cards for it. Here is a link if you want to check them out. I'm not trying to persuade you guys to buy them, just thought you might like to see them :-)http://www.hallmark.com/Browse/Index?...
Those are really nice. So you work for Hallmark! Well I've been buying their cards for eons.
Thank you for sharing the experience with us Wendy.. And glad you enjoyed the food.. It's probably the best part of Eid :D
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Wendy , thank you for sharing :)
For your friend , It seems that without a room for praying , he would not feel comfortable praying at work , did you see a Muslim pray before ?
Happy Eid to you as well Nile Daughter :-) I agree w/ you regarding praying at work. I felt bad that I think he did not want to come out and say it, but I got the sense that it just wouldn't have been a comfortable set-up for him, so he preferred to wait till he got home. I am guessing that for some eomployers, their idea of a reasonable accommodation for this request may fall short of what would really be ideal. Aren't you supposed to perform some sort of cleansing or bathing prior to prayer? I could see that as also adding to the difficulty of coming up w/ a satisfactory way to do this at work. He did tell me that his wife prays at her place of employment, so I guess there are some places where it one would be made to feel more comfortable about it.I have not ever attended a service at mosque, so have not witnessed Muslims in prayer first-hand. Only seen footage of men praying in a mosque on TV.
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Yes a small ritual cleansing Wudu , it can be done at work (it is easy and fast ) .
I am glad his wife can pray at work. you know ... if she can have a room closed for praying for 5 minitues , this will do it , it does not have to be a praying room only (but in big places , it should be this way to serve so many poeple) , at home we do not have rooms for praying , I can pray at any place at home (Toilettes excluded) , Men can do that or go to mosque .
Next stop is Turkey I hear! Tribute to them kicking out the Israeli ambassador? ;) I was hoping they would have stuck it to them sooner, but I'll take what I can get.
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A coincidence ... but what a timing to visit Turkey!
Really ...the way the relation between Turkey and Israel developed and what we are seeing lately in general is unbelievable , no one knows what is coming next !
Nile daughter wrote: "the way the relation between Turkey and Israel developed and what we are seeing lately in general is unbelievable , no one knows what is coming next ! "True!
Turkey and Israel where the strongest allies in the region.. Even military wise..
Suddenly, this happens!
I wasn't sure which thread to post this on, so hopefully this is the right place. There is a group on facebook called WhamBamIslam about an Islamic comic book that I wanted to share if anyone is interested in checking it out. There is a documentary about the creator of the comic book and it looks kind of interesting.https://www.facebook.com/WhamBamIslam
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Thanks for posting Wndy , I never heard of "The 99" comics before ! I need to read more to have an opinion about it :)
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I must do some more homework ! :D
Marieke wrote: "You never heard about the 99?! wow...they were kind of a big deal here. (yet I have not read them myself)."Funny I'd never heard of it, then saw it mentioned yesterday in an update from my local PBS channel update. They were having some kind of a documentary buy I think I missed it.
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Funny I'd never heard of it, then saw it mentioned yesterday in an updat..."
yes, Wendy linked to info about the documentary above, but i missed seeing it on tv. i WILL see it though. :D
i knew about the comics, but i didn't know that a documentary was in the works.
I just realized that PBS usually makes their programs available online at some point so the documentary may be available at www.pbs.org.
This is kind of a random question, but I've noticed that many of the flags from MENA countries incorporate the same 3 colors -- red, green and white. Is there some significance in these colors? I'm curious to know more if anyone is able to share.
Wendy,I am not sure about the other flags but I can tell u about the meaning of the Palestinian flag. Red is for the blood of those we lost during our struggle. it is the smallest color because we hope it will not be the major part of our history. Black is the color of mourning for our dead people it will remain on the top till we r liberated and the the green will come up. Green is for a better future and the color of our land. White is for hope for a peaceful and better future.
Mod
Wow , I needed to check that ! (thanks for the question Wendy !!)
The Pan-Arab colours of black, red, white and green, all expressive of Arab nationalism ,Pan-Arab colors , A sub-set of the Pan-Arab colors are the Arab Liberation colors, in which green is less significant.
More about Flag of the Arab Revolt where they were first combined .
Thanks Ghada for Palestine flag infor , more about other Arab flags meanings ...and Iran ! :p
Thank you for the links Nile Daughter. i will check them out. Ghada, I love all the meaning and symbolism you shared about the Palestinian flag.
http://tlc.discovery.com/videos/all-a...Check out the new reality show coming to TLC channel. I will plan to watch it. What do you guys think about it? Good idea, bad idea, dumb idea?
Wendy wrote: "http://tlc.discovery.com/videos/all-a...Check out the new reality show coming to TLC channel. I will plan to watch it. What do you guys think a..."
I'm wondering. Some reality shows are OK. Some are so cheesey. I hope this isn't bad. The ads look like it's trying to break up stereotypes which is a good thing. I'm just nervous about having it mixed in with so many other odd reality shows.
I think it is good that they are trying to hopefully break stereotypes, but you are right Sue, it may just be unbearably cheesy. I'm hoping they did a decent job w/ it!
Not sure if I'll watch or wit for reviews here. I can always DVR it.
I was just going to ask you guys about that! :) I'm definitely going to set the DVR. As has been said, some of those shows are cheesy or end up being bad for the family (Jon and Kate, Little People Big World, etc), but we'll see.
Mod
BTW , is Religious conversion - in general - taken easily in USA ?
Not sure if I understand your question ND -- do you mean, are people open minded about the idea that someone might grow up Catholic and convert to Judaism as an adult, or decide to become a Buddhist?If so, then I think the open-mindedness and level of acceptance probably varies depending on each individual. It's weird that the US is such a proponent of the idea of religious freedom and the right to worship in accordance with the dictates of your conscience, yet as individuals, the tolerance threshold is probably not as high as it should be. It probably mainly depends on how strongly you feel about your religion as to whether you are comfortable with someone else converting to another. For myself, I don't have an issue with it. I figure whatever works for you is fine by me -- just so long as it's not pushed down my throat. I have a low level of tolerance for what I would call the religious right who like to go on and on about America being a Christian nation and we need to "get back to our core values" which I think is code for no gay marriage and basically assume that everyone should be Christian and if you're not, then who needs you? That stuff really annoys me and doesn't seem to embody the principals of Christianity so far as I can tell. I think that the more "fringe" your religion, then the lower the tolerance if you convert to it. We are dealing with this a little bit in our presidential elections this time with 2 candidats who are Mormon -- which is viewed as a somewhat more fringe (i.e., less mainstream) religion. And there was a great deal made when Obama won that he wasn't really a Christian because his middle name is Hussein and he lived in Indonesia as a child. OK, as I'm typing this, I guess it sounds like it's pretty intolerant around here. And I probably missed the point of your question. Sorry for the rant!
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I would pretty much agree with Wendy. Issue sometimes can be difficult within the family more than within the community often unless, as Wendy states, we're talking conversion to a "different", non-mainstream religion. Then it can cause more discussion and sometimes public reaction.This country is far more tolerant than when I was young. I remember when John Kennedy had to state that he would not be taking orders from the Vatican. I knew absolutely nothing about Islam then (and not enough now) and not much about Judaism. All Protestants seemed to be the same which of course they aren't.
Of course I live in a diverse part of the U.S. but I get the feeling from things I see and read that the entire country has changed in this way. Sometimes I think much of the country is far ahead of its leaders. There are, however, those centers of un-reason where people have no tolerance of difference. They want everyone to meet some impossible American Protestant ideal that never really existed.
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http://www.cnn.com/2011/12/11/showbiz...Well, here in the U.S. -- a country that prides itself on religious tolerance, an advertiser on the All-American Muslim series has pulled its ads from the show. See the quotes on the attached from the Florida Family Association. I don't know who they are, and I don't know why they think they need to speak for others, but they are no sort of family I would want to claim. This whole thing just makes me disgusted!
Wendy wrote: "http://www.cnn.com/2011/12/11/showbiz...Well, here in the U.S. -- a country that prides itself on religious tolerance, an advertiser on the All-American Muslim..."
That is awful, but I am not surprised to hear that! I think that television should not carry ads at all. Commercials should have no influence on what is being shown on television. Needless to say I stopped watching TV with commercials years ago. I wonder how the stations will react to the withdrawal of funds in this case...? And the fate of the series...
I wrote to Lowe's (it is HQ in my state :( ) and to TLC condemning and praising respectively. :)My post on the Lowe's ad thingy:
http://notanotherpoliticalblog-j.blog...
NC based Lowes pulls funding from show All-American Muslim
Holiday wishes from Lowes!
So, I'm wondering, what do they have the problem with, Americans or Muslims? ;)
Did they buy into that idiotic email about Muslims not being "good Americans"? I (probably unreasonably) have had more faith in people than that recently.
The Florida Family Association will play a role, if you read anything about the controversy. A web search for their campaign/petition text yields a "404 Not Found" message, but this site quotes some of it as well as trying to link to it (full FFA letter)...
Whatever the reason- pretty trashy move, Lowes!
Let's go on and post this link to the petition to talk some sense into Lowes (and contacts for Lowe's and TLC):
http://signon.org/sign/defend-our-ame...
And Lowe's Corporate webform (had to keep deleting, but I got in a few good paragraphs)... or this email execustservice@lowes.com
And TLC viewer relations while we're at it (1500 character limit, I think)...
What do they have to say for themselves (not much- pretty weak, Lowes!):
The North Carolina-based Lowe's issued a statement apologizing for having "managed to make some people very unhappy."
"Individuals and groups have strong political and societal views on this topic, and this program became a lightning rod for many of those views," the statement said. "As a result we did pull our advertising on this program. We believe it is best to respectfully defer to communities, individuals and groups to discuss and consider such issues of importance."
Way to cave to a little pressure, Lowes! So much for socially responsible business. Like Caterpillar and the bulldozing of homes overseas. Wow. NC and Lowes aren't looking too good right about now. All those "Home of this and that" signs across the state might as well say bigot now. "Managed to make some people unhappy"??? I'd rather see "oops, that was racist/bigoted, we'll try and have more respect for fellow human beings in the future, we're sorry for reflecting poorly on NC and the US, guess what we're starting a Muslim scholarship fund (or at least reinstating ads)."
Really?!?! I mean if a bunch of bigoted white people emailed Lowes hate mail about black people, would Lowes fire all black employees? Or stop ads during shows with majority black casts?
Or is it just Muslims that it's OK to discriminate against and or hate?
It's best to defer to bigots? When? On what planet? I mean, where do we live? What decade is this again? We never learn. Come on, Lowes!
On wikipedia:
A chain spokesperson said it was because of "...concerns, complaints or issues from multiple sides of the viewer spectrum", while also telling the association in an e-mail that it had "brought [the show] to our attention."
Multiple sides? Really? Spectrum? Would that be the Christians the hate Muslims, the Jews and hate Muslim and atheists who hate Muslims? I'm afraid I can't fathom more than one side on this. I'd like to see some sort of graph or explanation of the spectrum.
Lowes on Twitter (for even less clarity):
Lowe’s values diversity of thought in everyone, including our employees and prospective customers.
We did not pull our ads based solely on the complaints or emails of any one group. It is never our intent to alienate anyone.
Really, Lowes? Because it looks like either your other comments are a lie or these tweets are a lie. I wonder which it is.
I wonder if Lowes has the same feeling about TLC's other shows- Extreme Couponing (I've got a disease similar to hoarding, but it's cool, I'm saving money), 19 Kids and Counting (trying to make a fringe extremist Christian group mainstream- if I were to make a complaint similar to the AAM haters'), Sister Wives (polygamy is illegal- Lowes wants to promote that but not Muslim Americans??). I really don't know if All-American Muslim is the only show Lowes has pulled it's ads from on TLC or on any other network, but I have to ask.
If you watch the show, you see that that could easily be a show about a bunch of Christian families- maybe different denominations or differing levels of "devoutness." They discuss Islam on the show (both in reality and discussion formats), so you don't have to hear about it from hateful people or evangelicals who know nothing about it. You also see that outside of the religion they also struggle with exactly the same things everyone else does.
And I suppose (with all 3 items) therein lies the danger- once you see others as human and there's no one to demonize, you have to look inward- and we can't have that, now, can we? Who knows what we would find.
Another issue- There are Lowes in or around Dearborn. What are they going to do??? Maybe Muslims shop there. (?!?!? The horror!) Are they going to ban Muslims from the stores to save their sorry image and make this evangelical group happy? Do they accept Muslims' money? Lowes needs to poop or get off the pot. Do you have a problem with Muslims or Americans or peace and understanding? Be consistent. If you get rid of the ads, get on with it, put the sign on your door. Take us back to the pre-civil rights era. Get it out there so we can have this thing struck down. Or you could admit you were wrong and headed in a very un-American direction and make amends yourself.
On a different note: Previews after the 5th episode show what looks like Fouad, the football coach, the cast at a memorial service, with the eulogy including something like "when will the violence end." Yikes. Could be several events crammed together by TLC (like all networks like to do) to look exactly like something it isn't, but it looks serious. We'll see!
Also good points on:
http://thinkprogress.org/alyssa/2011/...
http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/...
http://www.thetakeaway.org/2011/dec/1...
Not to get big brother on you, but my Feedjit tool tells what people search for and some crack me up:
muslims hate lowes
lowes says they hate muslims
what is going on between lowes and the muslims
lowes muslim problem
Haaze wrote: "Wendy wrote: "http://www.cnn.com/2011/12/11/showbiz...Well, here in the U.S. -- a country that prides itself on religious tolerance, an advertiser on the All-Ame..."
Someone bought up the rest of the spots, so in that way the show is covered...
http://blogs.wsj.com/speakeasy/2011/1...
Mod
muslimhulk Muslim Hulk
MUSLIMHULK WANT SMASH @LOWES FOR BEING COWARDS, BUT NOT WANT GET SPLINTERS FROM ALL THOSE 2X4S #ALLAMERICANMUSLIM
Jennifer wrote: "Someone bought up the rest of the spots, so in that way the show is covered...http://blogs.wsj.com/speakeasy/2011/12/1... "
Interesting! Lowe's is way out of line!
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Just sent both letters this AM, so I don't expect it yet. And I can't remember if I checked the box for a response. :) I hope so.
Mod
i hope they respond to you...even if it's a crap response.
here's another interesting thought from twitter:
ibn_adem adem
@AJStream I think Lowe's pulling its ad from #AllAmericanMuslim might have some good in it, now that the show is getting a lot of publicity
Jennifer you are AWESOME :-) Loved your post!I heard one of those FFA people being interviewed on CNN and he actually said something along the lines that this show "wasn't representative of what Muslims are really like. Muslims want to impose Sharia law on us here in the US." Clearly the man has his head up his a$$!
I think you hit the nail on the head -- when you see that these are just regular people dealing with all the same things we all deal w/ (work, family, etc.) then it is hard to demonize them for being "other" b/c they are not so different after all. No wonder that is a disconcerting thing for someone who clearly has no tolerance for anyone who is not a narrow minded bigot. I do like the side effect though of this bruhaha generating some discussion and forcing people to really confront the prejudices that persist.
I had the same thought. I may have said it to Lowe's. Maybe I should have edited better. Or at all. ;)Here it is:
I, a formerly satisfied customer, am writing to inform you of my extreme displeasure in the recent events with which you have been involved: The so called Florida Family Association got you to pull ads from TLC's All-American Muslim, you made a statement admitting as much, then amid backlash you backtracked saying that you received emails from a broad spectrum of customers which actually only amounted to dozens rather than thousands or hundreds of thousands of letters.
The decision to pull the ads was not only hasty and premature, but also bigoted and cowardly. You obviously didn't investigate the claims of your dozens of Muslim hating customers because if you had, you would have found that TLC's show does not advocate one way or the other on any societal or political issues. All-American Muslim simply depicts the daily life of several members of a community many Americans know very little about. This show has much educational value and it naturally prompts discussion of important issues anyone encounters in life. This show is about life in America as much as any other show that you fund with your ads; I'm very confused as to how this one violates your ad guidelines.
I can only assume Lowe's has Muslim customers. I would have hoped, had you acted after some thought, that you would have been able to stand up for these customers who may or may not write to express their displeasure. Your actions rather said you would rather not be associated with one segment of the American population. Is that true? Do you only offer your products to certain people? I expected you to stand up for the fact that Muslim or Christian or anything else- we are all Americans instead of caving to a minority of bigots. I expected a large corporation like Lowe's to have a backbone and be able to stand up to a dozen emailers or even thousands on the very American value of all men being created equal.
Maybe I was wrong to expect your company to stand for what is right and American. Bigotry has won- unless you have a plan to turn this around.
Maybe it is not possible to buy back your ads for All-American Muslim, but what is needed is a massive sensitive, well-thought out apology and/or campaign to repair your image with those who are Muslim, those who are American and those whose intelligence you insulted by siding so quickly and decisively with those who want us to believe all Muslims are terrorists. I wouldn't know where to begin, so wish you much luck with that.
Or maybe your pulling of your ads from All-American Muslim have effectively highlighted the discrimination Muslims face in America and a boycott of your company will be a lesson in human rights and equality for many.
Peace to you,
*** ****
Fantastic letter Jennifer. I've signed a few petitions since yesterday. I'll bet the FFA represents a splinter group with a large bite but not a big population. Sadly some corporations are so scared of coming out on the perceived wrong side of post 9/11 war in this country that Lowe's has fallen into a huge trap. It's the "whose lapel flag is bigger" fight. Well Lowe's has lost this one. They listened to some little voices and ended up as moral midgets. I hope this triples the viewers for the show and sends buyers to independent hardware stores (or H.D. if they must).
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The shocking thing to me was an author of an article I linked to that talked to the heads of Lowe's and found that dozens complained, not thousands and as a result they pulled the ads.I don't know if my copy and paste of my blog post linked to anything, but the article was a USA Today and the authors first name was Suehalia, but not the same one as on the show :)
Thanks for your kind words!
I just wanted to share this link to last night's Daily Show. Jon Stewart took on this issue and definitely brought out the complete lunacy of the whole thing. Hopefully the link works b/c it's pretty darn funny to see him making fun of the FFA and Lowe's :-) http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/tue...
Kind of reminds me of the Rachel Ray keffiyeh blowup. As it turned out, she wasn't wearing a keffiyeh, but a regular scarf, but bigots saw red and Duncan Donuts pulled the ad based on ...basically nothing.http://notanotherpoliticalblog-j.blog...
Kayak.com also pulled ads. They pulled them because of angry emails as well- didn't say how many... AND condemned TLC for "misrepresenting what the show was about." (???) Don't know what that means exactly. I took it to mean the same as teh Florida Family Association's deal about it showing Muslims as people rather than terrorists, but I haven't found anything that gives more info. Also saw a headline that Kayak.com is apologizing, but no time to read now.Sorry no links! No time at the moment...
Jennifer
Middle East/North African Lit
Books mentioned in this topic
Sunset Oasis (other topics)Baghdad Burning: Girl Blog from Iraq (other topics)
The Blood of Flowers (other topics)
Granada (other topics)
Authors mentioned in this topic
Clinton Bailey (other topics)Joseph J. Hobbs (other topics)
Miral al-Tahawy (other topics)
