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Claimed by Shadow (Cassandra Palmer, #2)
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The Cassie Books > Claimed By Shadow (Cassandra Palmer #2)

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Scarlet Heavens | 361 comments I don't think Mircea is totally bad, but I also don't think he would willingly turn his taxi-driver to the past. Just saying.

As for Cassie's lifespan, I think we will know that when we know exactly what type of magical beings are the gods. For example, if you drain a magical human of ther magic they will die because the magic is a part of them as air. And in HtM the spartoi that attacked Cassie said that even before Artemis was blown up to pieces she was near her death and that she went to the Pythias court in search for power as a last resort. He also said that the reason for Artemis' loss of power was because she supposedly didn't know that when she banished the gods and sealed the pathways between the worlds she also cut herself off of her own world and source of her magic. But she still managed to live for millenia and more even without that source so I think Cassie will inherit at least that.
I also think that there is a reason why both pritkin and Cassie were 24 when their lives changed(just like the Tower card indicated a change for Cassie in TtD). Pritkin says that his extended life comes from his part-fey mother, not from Rosier, the powerful demon lord, and that might mean that Cassie will not inherit extended lifetime from her Mom if the gods are similar magical creatures to demons(although I doubt we can put them in the same caliber). But I do think that if Cassie has extended lifetime it will make her even more equal to Pritkin.


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Sarah Wilson | 404 comments Zeenat- I agree with your thoughts about Cassie/Mircea.

Part of this book made me think of the recent teaser.Near the end of this book Mircea asks if he'll see her again and calls her little witch and Cassie says, "I'm not a witch" and Mircea says, "I know," made me think maybe he figured out she's a pythia and that's why in the new teaser he was meeting pythias: to see her. Easy answer. Only problem is maybe it's too easy. KC likes to be tricky. My other thought about the teaser is maybe he is planning something we don't know about yet.

Near the end of the book there were a couple inconsistencies that maybe were just author mistakes or something I forgot. Pritkin says there should be witnesses and Billy says, "What am I?" Then the text says, "Pritkin ignored him." So I was confused. Wait can Pritkin hear ghosts, but no, he didn't know Cassie was talking to Agnes so it must have been a writing mistake. But another place after the incubus traps Drac and leaves Stoker's body, Augusta grabs the box but "hesitated when she saw the way the spirit's face changed." So can vamps see incubi outside bodies or was that another error? I know why Pritkin can see incubi.


Lannister (lannisteruk) | 10911 comments Claire wrote: "If Mircea offered to change her, it really would be an ultimate declaration of his feelings. After all, becoming a vampire would eliminate her clairvoyant abilities, which means that Mircea just wants Cassie with him. "

Cynical old me just can't see this happening! :) Not just because I think Mircea wants Cassie's power, but I don't think the Consul would allow such a valuable tool to be wasted. And don't forget that thing about Mircea not having any female vamps.

Sarah wrote: "Near the end of this book Mircea asks if he'll see her again and calls her little witch and Cassie says, "I'm not a witch" and Mircea says, "I know," "

Unfortunately the timeline doesn't work for this. When Mircea says that it's the late 1880s. He's already been looking for Pythias long before this.

On the inconsistencies, I think when KC wrote 'Pritkin ignored him' she was being funny. I took it to mean Pritkin didn't respond because he couldn't hear Billy Joe. Not sure about Augusta though. I haven't got to that bit in my reread yet, but you're right, it does seem inconsistent. Unless Chavez's spirit can make itself visible when it chooses?


Lannister (lannisteruk) | 10911 comments Right, having read on a bit more, here's a few thoughts ...

When Cassie tells Mac & Pritkin that she has to go to MAGIC to rescue Tomas, she says
"It’s about making a statement. Someone who is known to be important to me is being publicly humiliated, tortured and killed. Yet no one - not the mages, not the Senate, not a single individual in the supernatural community - ever once thought to ask my permission!"
"Your permission?" Pritkin looked dumbfounded. "And precisely why would they need that?"
I looked at him and shook my head. Screw this. If I had to deal with all the downsides of the office, it was about time I had a few of the perks, too.
"Because I’m Pythia," I said quietly, and shifted.
I love this. I think this is the first time Cassie asserts herself as Pythia and I like that it's the vamps she takes a stand against (though she's not taking no for an answer from Pritkin and Mac either!) Go Cassie!!

When Cassie gets to MAGIC and learns about the effects of the geis on Mircea, The Consul says to her "I need him, Cassandra! We are at war. I cannot have him like this, not now." So, despite all the paranoia the Consul shows in Death's Mistress, she admits that she needs Mircea. I wonder if it's the fact that she does need him that's the reason for her paranoia. She's aware that he makes her vulnerable. (Not sure if this means anything really, but I just thought it was intriguing that the Consul would publicly admit this.)

Still at MAGIC, the effects of the geis hit Cassie hard...
I realized abruptly that more tears were streaming down my face. It wasn’t from memory of the pain, but from how good, how safe I felt being near him. It was every dream I’d ever had rolled up into one - home, family, love, acceptance - and so exhilarating that it blinded me to everything else.
There's all Cassie wants in a nutshell. No wonder Mircea seems so appealing, since it appears he can give her all that ... for a price.

And now on to Marlowe ...! :D
"The storm didn’t do my head any good," he explained, wincing slightly as his hand brushed a tender spot. "First Rasputin cracks my skull, and now this. You would think someone could aim for another part of my anatomy just once, but oh, no."
I think Marlowe secretly misses Dory and the way she punches him in the nuts!!

Marlowe speaks to Cassie about power:
"And you will need allies, Cassie. No great leader has ever ruled entirely alone. Elizabeth has gone down in history as a magnificent queen, which she was, but one of her chief talents was choosing able people to advise her. She was great partly because those around her were great. You cannot remain isolated. You will not be able to work that way."
Marlowe is talking about Queen Elizabeth I here, but he could just as easily be talking about the Consul. I like that Marlowe admires strong women and it's interesting that he's giving Cassie this speech. There's two ways to interpret this: 1) it's vampire bullshit designed to sweet talk Cassie, or 2) Marlowe really does believe that the Pythia is too powerful to be controlled and it would be better to at least try to be allies on equal footing. We see Mircea try to control Cassie with the geis and Marlowe describes that as "a lapse of judgement". So is Marlowe trying a different tactic to win Cassie over by genuinely respecting her position as a woman of power, or is it just more manipulation and bullshit?


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Bell Curran (Curran_Bell) | 143 comments Lannister wrote: "And don't forget that thing about Mircea not having any female vamps...."

You just reminded me again about that. It is indeed interesting. And it seems strange for Mircea. He loves women. Why doesn't he make female vamps? Does KC ever say (in an FAQ or something) why this is?


Lannister (lannisteruk) | 10911 comments Yeah, we asked in a Q & A one time. This is the answer we got, so take what you will from this ...
We were wondering where Mircea’s female vampires are. The only two we really meet, Sal and Eugenie, were made by Tony. Wouldn’t Mircea want one or two female guards around, for things that Cassie might not want a man for? (Like when she was visiting Augustine and needed to change). Is it simply that Mircea was originally very “close” with the female vampires and doesn’t want to rub his past in Cassie’s face?

Mircea doesn’t have any female vampires watching Cassie because he doesn’t have any female vampires. Some of his master-level servants do, but the whole Sal thing didn’t turn out great, so he prefers only people he directly controls around Cassie now. And that means guys, because that’s all he has. And no, I’m not going to tell you why (although you’ll figure it out eventually).
Beyond theorising that Dorina might have wanted to kill them, we've no idea why Mircea has no female vamps. Any and all speculation is welcome! :)


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Bell Curran (Curran_Bell) | 143 comments That's very intriguing. It could fit with your obsessed-with-dead-wife theory, Lannister. Could be that he's never wanted to have any woman that close to him again. Or that close to him and in his care / responsibility. All the senators he dates are probably either entertaining diversions and/or strategic moves.

Any other theories out there? This seems like it could be a really important clue... though, to what, I don't know!


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Aileen | 867 comments Well, since he can make male vamps, I don't see why he couldn't make female vamps...but...is it possible that he doesn't want any female vamps that he isn't in love with?? Because of the wife thing, and his position of power, if he turned a woman and became attached to her, she could be used as leverage against him, much like what's her face was against LC.


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Bell Curran (Curran_Bell) | 143 comments Good theory, Aileen. I think that's very plausible. Any barely plausible crackpot theories out there?


Lannister (lannisteruk) | 10911 comments I don't think we really came up with anything definitive, though maybe I'm not remembering.

I like Aileen's idea, though I suppose theoretically any of Mircea's vamp servants could be used against him. Although it says in the books that a relationship between a master and his/her new servant is very close, it doesn't always have to be a sexual relationship, so you'd think if Mircea didn't want to get all that close to a female servant, he wouldn't have to (though I get that sometimes relationships take an unexpected path).

I remember we talked about this quite a bit at the time, but I don't really think we came up with anything conclusive. We theorised that maybe Dorina threatened to kill any female vamp, as she was jealous on her mother's behalf, or something like that. The only other theory I remember (and this was probably clutching at straws) was that maybe Mircea actually isn't able to make female vampires. Mircea was cursed with vampirism by a gypsy who thought her daughter had been seduced and discarded by Mircea. So maybe she made it part of the curse that he'd never be able to turn a woman, thus depriving him of long-term close female companionship.

These theories are probably a bit weak, but I dunno what else we have.


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Cameo | 1046 comments Mod
it's good theories Lannister :) but maybe it's because he's like LC, that he doesn't want to be in a woman's bed if she does not want him there, and if he changed them, he would be their master and therefor automatically wanting him in their beds. but as it's a form of force he doesn't want that. all this is of course assuming he only changes women he actually wants to spent eternity with, and by doing so taking away their free will.. you follow me? (I know I'm not phrasing it very well )

or maybe he's secretly bisexual.. intimate feeding scene in ttd and him only having male vamps.. whilst still messing around with female vamps from other courts...

or maybe as you guys said, it's the dead wife and angry Dorina thing...

but on the other hand... gypsy women can be damn spiteful XD

in other words I have no clue... *sigh*

lmao I just LOVE the tattoo parlor scene with Cassie and Pritkin!!!,


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Zeenat (zeekwon) | 6376 comments Lannister wrote: "Zeenat wrote: This isn't actually the case, but it's confusingly worded in the book. "

You're right! I forgot about that completely!

Lannister wrote: "I haven't forgotten how Pythias get a new life after they've served. That may yet be significant. "

Maybe that's how the series will end?


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Cameo | 1046 comments Mod
Ohh and on the subject of Cassie being turned into a vamp - I don't think it'll ever happen, but doesn't her demigoddess DNA work as a kind of shield? or antidote or whatever you wanna call it :p


Lannister (lannisteruk) | 10911 comments Zeenat, it would definitely be an interesting turn of events if Cassie somehow ended up with a second life. Not sure how it works with her goddess status, but if she isn't immortal, then she gets her second life. Them's the rules! (And if she IS immortal, the Silver Circle better get with the program sharpish, cos Cassie's going to be Pythia for a loooong time!!)

Leodora, I think I would have said the same, that Cassie might be immune to vampirism. Tony's bites didn't have any effect on her, so it's definitely possible that the transformation process wouldn't work on her either.

While we're discussing this whole second life thing, I had a thought. Remember how we've speculated in the past about how Cassie's father might be ancient, even though he's human? Even with the longer life mages get, he shouldn't be able to live 'through the ages' as Artemis's companion. When Cassie is in the cell in Faerie with Tomas and Agnes comes to talk to them, they talk about how the Pythia gets a second life. Tomas asks "But if you can do it once ... why can you not continue to do it life after life, century after century?". Agnes replies:
"Think it through! Once our time in service is over, the power migrates to someone else. Without it, we have no way of knowing who is going to die, and therefore no way of choosing another body. It’s a onetime deal."
Tomas gave a short laugh. "You expect us to believe that no one has ever tried to cheat death? To live through many lifetimes by taking whomever they wanted, whether they were doomed or not?"
Agnes shrugged. "That’s one of the many duties of the reigning Pythia - to make sure it doesn’t happen that way."
Artemis is a goddess and seems to be able to use the Pythia power with ease. Do you think she might have been doing something like this with Cassie's father? Maybe she's transferring his soul into a new body every couple of centuries.

I don't know if Artemis was always able to travel through time (i.e. is that something any god can do?) or did she only start doing that when she signed up at the Pythian Court (where her goddess status gave her a natural affinity with the power)?

What do you all think? Is it possible? Something has to be keeping Roger Palmer alive.


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Duca (sapphireofslytherin) | 468 comments Holy shit Lannister I feel like you've stumbled upon a major piece of foreshadowing there! Something about that section of writing gives off some serious plot point vibes...
I am really really liking this as a solid theory!


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Cameo | 1046 comments Mod
Damn, if Artemis is able to do that she is one lucky lady... think about it, you never had to see your man grow old, you could just stick him in a new a wellproportioned body :p

But yeah there has to be something fishy about Roger Palmer... I kind of don't believe the man is FULLY human... something has to give. But vamp is def out of the picture, they don't leave ghosts :)


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Josie | 643 comments I like this theory! Good shout. Could this mean that Roger isn't actually in disguise as Mircea (or whoever it was) assumed?


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Cameo | 1046 comments Mod
Roger as Mircea? Whoaaa... what have I missed? :O


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Lannister (lannisteruk) | 10911 comments Roger could glamour himself to look whatever way he chose, so it doesn't really matter what the body he took looked like. We've already seen him look completely different on two occasions (the guy Mircea remembers working for Tony, and the guy Cassie saw in the Houses of Parliament and with her mother in Hunt the Moon) so maybe he sometimes doesn't use a glamour but just goes with whatever his current body looks like?

I don't know if this whole thing is likely or not, but the passage jumped out at me while I was re-reading. I had thought in the past that maybe Artemis was 'feeding' Roger her power (like what we saw with Jonathan in Fury's Kiss) and this was what was keeping him alive. But doing it that way does have negative effects, and this way would avoid all that.


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Josie | 643 comments No LOL! Mircea says in HtM:

"It is odd, now that you mention it," Mircea said.
"What is?"
"He was slightly swarthy, handsome enough, with dark hair and eyes."
"Why is that odd?"
He shrugged. "Merely that, having seen your mother, I would have expected him to have been a blonde."



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Duca (sapphireofslytherin) | 468 comments oh my god does this mean with our current theory that Cassie was conceived with the sperm of whatever body was that flavour-of-the-decade?!?
Like any one of Roger's previous bodies could have resulted in a completely different looking Cassie XD?!?


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Cameo | 1046 comments Mod
...Kind of Eugh! ... Or maybe Roger isn't her real dad and the ghost thing comes from her actual dad.


Lannister (lannisteruk) | 10911 comments LOL! I haven't really thought through the particulars of how sperm works with a transplanted soul ... but I'll get right on it! :D :D

I guess if an ability with magic and ghosts is tied to the soul, then it doesn't matter what body you use. This sorta came up in the Wheel of Time series, where some characters' souls got put into other bodies after they died. They remained the same personality with the same abilities because the magic was of the soul, rather than of the body. (This point has no relevance whatsoever, since it's an entirely different series, but thought I'd mention it to prove that it's happened in the fantasy genre before LOL!)

It's possible the guy Cassie saw in London with her mother really is her father (both body and soul), since I don't think this was all that far back in time, so he could have been using the same body when he was killed. And when she saw him in the Houses of Parliament, he was supposed to have travelled through time to get there, so he could have come from any time period. So we could still be talking about the same 'body' in all Cassie's dealings.

Or, maybe the whole idea's nonsense, but where else in the world could we speculate about the magical and clairvoyant properties of semen?! LMAO!


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Aileen | 867 comments Lol oh god...all the speculation...and MAYBE, while he was working at Tony's he WAS using a glamour...so when they eventually tried to run away they wouldn't look like what Tony thought, except they didn't get away.

I think there was a Q&A when KC said Roger was human, but...if he is JUST human...Artemis must have had SOMETHING to do with keeping him alive for a long time...the woman had power out the wazzoo when she was heir that we saw, and we aren't entirely sure of what her other power was before that. I think a lot will play into what power she had before she was the Pythian heir, and also what EXACT power Cassie's father had/has. I mean, the ghost thing is very much from her father, the clairvoyance from her mother, but on that note, HOW IN THE WORLD did Roger end up in the basement on Guy Fawkes day???? Wouldn't Artemis have ben peeved if he was trying to mess up the timeline she was supposed to fix??


Lannister (lannisteruk) | 10911 comments I feel fairly certain Cassie's father used a glamour when he was at Tony's. I think that's more or less implied in the text and it's not me theorising wildly. I thought the guy Cassie saw at the Houses of Parliament/the party in London was what he really looked like, because that guy's got blondish hair like Cassie. So even if he was hopping bodies, that body probably fathered Cassie so it makes sense she'd look like him.

I think KC said Roger Palmer was a mage. Basically just a human (not a god) but with magical abilities. But no other human has lived so long, unless he's had a few centuries in Faerie, which I doubt because we don't get any hints that Artemis had been there (and I'm assuming he was never too far off where she was).

On Artemis's own power, we don't really know much except that her power was just about extinguished and she needed to turn to the Pythian Court as it was the only source left on earth that she could use. It would be really interesting to see what kind of stuff Artemis could do when she had more power. I mean, what does a goddess trapped on earth do for kicks? I can't even begin to guess!!

On that Houses of Parliament thing ... who knows? That whole scene puzzles me greatly and I hope we figure out some clues when we get to Curse the Dawn. Cassie's father was a member of The Guild, who were a bunch of crazy fanatics who wanted to continually change the timeline if something went wrong. They don't seem like the kind of organisation a god's faithful companion would join. But ... the biggest question for me is how they actually travel through time? I thought that was a strictly Pythian thing, but it would appear not. None of it makes any damn sense!!


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Claire (claire1) | 4451 comments I've be absent due to the great college move in process, but I'm back!

I don't think time travel can be a strictly Pythian thing. If only Pythias could do it, why would we need them to protect the timeline?


Lannister (lannisteruk) | 10911 comments Claire wrote: "I don't think time travel can be a strictly Pythian thing. If only Pythias could do it, why would we need them to protect the..."

Ha! You're right and it's so frigging obvious that I can't believe I didn't see it LOL! :)

I wish we knew HOW they time-travel. The Pythias were granted power by a god to do it. How does everyone else manage? Do we have any clues?

PS Hope you're settling in again, Claire. When does college start back?


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Zeenat (zeekwon) | 6376 comments I've had that thought a few times. Clearly there needs to be others who mess with the timeline more than bad pythias and bad acolytes... So who?


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Aileen | 867 comments Ahhhh Claire, I feel you with the big move, because of the move I am so behind on the reread!! But I am slowly catching up.

And I THINK they said something about the Guild how they could go back, but not forward?? It's been a while, it will probably be seen when we start the next reread, but I vaguely remember something about how the Guild members prepared to live in the past, since they couldn't get back, and it took tremendous power just to send them and...some other vague stuff is in their too.


Mello ❣ Illium ✮Harry✮ ☀Myrnin☀ Torin Ichimaru | 2012 comments I remember Cassie asking the blond mage what he was going to do to get back to his own time and he said he'd stay in the past. I think it takes a lot of power for the Guild to travel in time and he likely couldn't pull it off on his own, so there would be no going back for him. I can only imagine Cassie saw him later in the future because he escaped after Agnus took him to the future after that she and Cassie finally caught him. I've always wondered how he got away since I remember Agnus shifting away with him.


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Aileen | 867 comments Oh yeahhhhhh...I have a feeling Artemis took him off her hands...ALSO, I just realized this (now that we all know more about Pritkin) Cassie reacted to Casanova, Chavez, and Pritkin, but NOT to Mac...Incubus problems. I wonder how she never noticed that she only reacted to incubus's that day...


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Claire (claire1) | 4451 comments @Lannister I think Agnes mentioned really unstable spells in CtD, which is why the Guild rarely succeeded. They usually blew themselves up first, which explains why more people don't attempt it.

Also, thanks for the college sympathy guys! I start classes tomorrow. Luckily, not until 12:45 so I've got some time to putter.

@Aileen Yeah, Artemis probably did snatch him back up. The question is....why?


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Aileen | 867 comments Well...if he is Cassie's father...I think she had a reason. Namely, Cassie. I think that since Artemis also held the Pythia power she was also clairvoyant, so she maybe saw something that made her able to get him away from Agnes?? Or maybe she saw something that caused him to go back to that time for a reason.

Wait...I thought the heir Agnes was training during that time was Myra...it was Artemis?? I missed that...or didn't think about it...


Lannister (lannisteruk) | 10911 comments Aileen wrote: "And I THINK they said something about the Guild how they could go back, but not forward??"

I think you may be thinking of the spatial shifting (like moving from one side of a room to another, but not travelling backward or forward in time). Agnes said only a Pythia could do that.

On Cassie's father, I can't get my head round him at all. Everything he does is contradictory and nothing about this whole scene at the Houses of Parliament makes sense to me. When Agnes captures him, she presumably takes him back to her own timezone and I suppose he must have been locked up? But, Agnes says to Cassie that her original heir had eloped by this point and she was training Myra. I think I'm right in saying that Artemis was already pregnant when she ran off, and Artemis and Roger were killed when Cassie was four, so we're looking at a period of about five years, give or take, when this scene could have occurred. Roger would have been working for Tony at this point, so could Tony have been somehow involved with The Guild, or was Roger working off his own back? And how did Tony feel about his favourite human getting locked up by the Pythian Court for crimes against the timeline? Did he even know? How long was Roger imprisoned (if he was)? How did he get away? I think KC has said that Cassie's parents weren't always around at Tony's. Is that because they were in jail LMAO!

None of this makes any sense to me!! Hopefully when we come to read Curse the Dawn we can figure it out a bit better.


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Josie | 643 comments Oh I'm so jealous of people who are going back to college/uni! I just graduated this year so no more fun times for me :(

On Rog, for some reason, I've always assumed he's actually "good". I'll probably be wrong, but we've only had the Silver Circle's side (and their actions are questionable). He could've been a spy and they turned on him? It's not like they wouldn't do that, they tried to with Pritkin. We've also never had the full story or circumstances of Artemis and Roger's relationship, such as how they got together or even when. Maybe he hasn't followed her through the ages and they literally just met before Cassie was born.

Either way, I feel like they're going to have a big impact on the war.


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Bell Curran (Curran_Bell) | 143 comments Congrats on graduating, Josie, and Claire, good luck with the new semester! (If you have any anthropology questions when you're studying for exams, you can ask me ;)

I asked KC this question:
Is it possible for Cassie to take someone out of one time in the past and into the future (i.e. into Cassie's own time, not into her own future), and then leave him or her there? With Radu, for example, she saved him from Carcassonne and Mircea then practically sequestered him for a century so he wouldn't change the timeline. Is that because she couldn't just take him out of one era and bring him into another? Or did she / they just not think of that possibility? It might threaten the timeline too much to have someone just disappear from history, but it she were to take someone who was about to die out of the timeline, it wouldn't, right?

Here's what she responded:
I love to be able to answer questions for readers, especially thoughtful ones. But if it isn't something that's been brought up yet in the series, I really can't. Even if it's never used, crossing out an idea could be viewed as a spoiler as much as affirming one, you know? And I try not to spoil my own series! Hope you understand, and thanks for reading!

She's so diplomatic and crafty! Not only does she not give the spoiler, she specifically avoids saying that it is definitely a spoiler. (On her diplomacy and craftiness, I think this makes her the original model for Mircea.)


Lannister (lannisteruk) | 10911 comments Josie, I agree with you that I think Cassie's father is good. And not just because he's Cassie's father (though that did prejudice me a little!) Artemis made a huge sacrifice to help humans, so she seems a good person. I simply can't see her taking up with someone who's evil. And I don't think he'd be able to conceal it from her if he were.

I also think you're bang on that it's the Silver Circle who are painting him black. It's possible it could be a genuine misunderstanding (like he couldn't explain something without giving away Artemis, and they assumed his lack of explanation meant he was working for the Black Circle). Or, yeah, it could easily just be some Silver Circle agenda that we don't know about.

On Roger & Artemis meeting, I'm not sure of their history. KC said this in a Q & A:
Cassie’s father is an interesting individual with a very unusual back-story. But no, he isn’t a god. He is a magical human, like Jonas or Caleb or any of the other mages you’ve seen. Rag (or Garm as his name is translated in Old Norse) was a protector of the goddess Hel, and that is the function Cassie’s father served in this book. As Jonas said, the old legends contain truth, but have to be interpreted. This is my interpretation of that part of the story. You’ll learn more about him in future books.
So does 'protector of the goddess Hel' mean that he's been with her for a while? When KC says she's writing her interpretation of the legends, I think it would mean pretty much anything LOL!

Bell, that was a great question! I love the way you worded it to fish for information but without actually saying what you were after. Mircea would be proud!! :D

I can understand why KC isn't giving anything away. It's very disappointing, but completely understandable.


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Cameo | 1046 comments Mod
Huh... Now, I'm not big on mythology, but Isn't Hel and Artemis kind of the same person (god whatever), and if Roger is the protector, then of course he had to follow her around (Cassie Pritkin assimily anyone?!) and they just eventually... you know, fell in love. It explains how he timetravels - with his person of interest! That actually kind of makes sense... IF I'm not off on the whole mythology point :p


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Zeenat (zeekwon) | 6376 comments What year did Mircea take Cassie back to see her mom? If when she ran away was when she was pregnant, wouldn't when they met be just months before Cassie was born?


message 190: by Claire (new) - rated it 5 stars

Claire (claire1) | 4451 comments This whole thing is very confusing. I really hope that at some point in the series, we get an explicit description of who Cassie's father is.

How is it possible that Artemis has this faithful companion through the ages, and suddenly runs off pregnant?

Oooh, here's a thought: Wasn't Artemis a virgin goddess? Maybe this wasn't just about being independent, but about remaining a candidate for the Pythian power. But after she was the heir, I suppose chastity didn't matter anymore since she finally had access to the power she needed. Hence the pregnancy.

Okay, it really doesn't sound too likely, but that's the best I've got.


message 191: by Aileen (new) - rated it 5 stars

Aileen | 867 comments Didn't they keep saying that Artemis and Roger JUST met and then she suddenly off with him?? But LATER they say it was actually YEARS of letters written to each other??


message 192: by Zeenat (new) - rated it 5 stars

Zeenat (zeekwon) | 6376 comments well there was a gap between when they ran away to when the silver circle admitted they ran away. Which was how Mircea explained the years... I think.


message 193: by Claire (new) - rated it 5 stars

Claire (claire1) | 4451 comments Zeenat wrote: "well there was a gap between when they ran away to when the silver circle admitted they ran away. Which was how Mircea explained the years... I think."

Right! I'd forgotten that part. But that still doesn't explain why everyone thought Ragnar was a new addition if they were supposed to be faithful companions.


message 194: by Kathy (new) - rated it 3 stars

Kathy Davie (kathydavie) | 457 comments Well, I'm thoroughly confused...


message 195: by Claire (new) - rated it 5 stars

Claire (claire1) | 4451 comments Kathy wrote: "Well, I'm thoroughly confused..."

Story of our lives!!


message 196: by Cameo (new) - rated it 4 stars

Cameo | 1046 comments Mod
I'm on the confusion wagon.. better keep reading :p


message 197: by Aileen (new) - rated it 5 stars

Aileen | 867 comments I thought there was not only a difference in when the Circle announced her leaving, but also, a suitcase full of letters?? I really need to reread HtM...BUT, on CbS...I had forgotten how bad the geis was during it...I remember how bad it got during EtN, but...wowzahs. Mircea and Cassie...I love them. It made me very sad though, when she talked about how she didn't even care if he loved her back. I know it was the geis talking, but I realized something...after the geis was put on Mircea in the 1880's, he could not sleep with ANYONE, because of the geis. It would physically hurt too much, EVEN though Cassie wasn't even born yet, it was dormant, but still there. Just something I noticed and got kind of happy about.


message 198: by Aileen (new) - rated it 5 stars

Aileen | 867 comments Funniest thing is Marlowe trying to be sincere. He's all "Cassie, we have no desire to manipulate you. Our aim is to offer you an alternative to domination by the mages. That has been the fate of Pythias for generations, but it doesn't have to be yours."

Then Cassie is all, look here Marlowe, I am not interested in your BS. She is so fantastic. I love Cassie. She doesn't put up with ANYONE's BS, not even Marlowe's.


message 199: by Claire (new) - rated it 5 stars

Claire (claire1) | 4451 comments @Aileen but then there's that part of the story where the geis wasn't activated until Cassie met Mircea again in modern day. Oh good. This is too confusing!


message 200: by Aileen (new) - rated it 5 stars

Aileen | 867 comments Just read something interesting...it said that Louis-Cesare defeated Alejandro, which is how he gained Tomas. Not that he defeated TOMAS as Alejandro's champion...confused...

@Claire, I think after Cassie went back in time (even though it technically takes place AFTER TtD it happens BEFORE she was a child) the geis was always there, dormant, even when she was a kid because she was too young. AND even if Mircea THEN didn't put it on her the geis would have done the same thing it did with Mircea, bouncing onto her because it recognized her.


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