The Classics discussion
Anna Karenina
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I think Anna's basically a passive person. She's allowed herself to be swept along a path she didn't choose by a series of men who are attracted to her; and even when she realizes her life isn't going the way she wanted it to, she lacks the courage to take action herself. I feel awful for her; I don't think she's a bad person by any means. Just...helpless.I understood Levin much better after reading a little about Tolstoy himself. Here's Wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leo_Tolstoy
I think Anna did make a choice when she slept with Vronsky. She also made a choice not to accept her husband when he forgave her. I see her as self-centered. Even though her marriage was not great in the beginning, her husband changed and wanted to make it work, she could have tried to make it work, especially since she "loved" her son so much. But instead she stays in this relationship that doesn't work. And I think she knew that immediately after they consummated the affair.BK 2 CH 11
That which for almost a year had constituted the one exclusive desire of Vronsky's life, replacing all former desires; that which Anna had been an impossible, horrible, but all the more enchanting dream of happiness -- this desire had been satisfied.Pale, his lower jaw trembling, he stood over her and pleaded with her to be calm, himself not knowing why or how.
She had no one else in her life now except him -- looking at him, she physically felt her humiliation and could say nothing more.
"Everything is finished," she said. "I have nothing but you. Remember that."
"How can I not remember what is my very life? For one minute of this happiness . . .
"What happiness?" she said with loathing and horror.
I don't think Alexei wanted to "make it work," exactly; Tolstoy makes it clear that a large part of his desire to keep the marriage intact was to punish Anna. Not really the best foundation for a renewed marriage.And I think, in the beginning, she was in love with Vronsky.
She had choices - divorce her husband, give up the affair, etc. - but she refused to make them. Each time something momentous happens in her life, it's because someone else has insisted on it.
I certainly agree she's self-centered, though. :)
Alex wrote: "I think Anna's basically a passive person. She's allowed herself to be swept along a path she didn't choose by a series of men who are attracted to her; and even when she realizes her life isn't g..."
I think Anna shows symptoms of being bipolar. At times, she can be self assured and self centred, and at other times emotional and unable to make rational decisions.
The husband is too consistent (boring) to be hardly tolerable to her. She did, however, marry for convenience rather than love. In those times, upper class women were considered settled when married but often not complete until they had a lover. Not that unususal, but Anna is not dealing well with it. The husband's approach I would say was not that uncommon at the time. Just live with it if you can, or forgive and forget. Bury it! He is more worried about losing face. With Anna's attitude, do you think he really can make her happy? He cannot change his basic personality.
He's internally living mostly in a rational world (proabably more so, than many men) trying to figure out a wife who is living in a much more emotional(more than many women) world. As I have said before Tolstoy's real wife had emotional problems and Anna is somewhat like her. Tolstoy's wife did threaten suicide once.
Levin is probably the more important character in the novel as many believe that he closely resembles Tolstoy himself. He is attempting to understand the world of the serfs. He sees the rapture of physical labour but only when he can do it at his discretion. He feels things have to change but he's not sure how. He attempts to make change in his own world with little success.
I think this novel and "War and Peace" (which I preferred) give us a good view of Russia's internal problems which eventually led to the Russian revolution. There are parts of A.K. which I think are quite remarkable that have little to do with Anna but relate to W and P. The disparity between the rich and poor in Russia was too large for anyone to understand each other.
We are worrying about Anna. As comfortable 20th century people, we can relate more to Anna than the majority of Russian women of her time. The great majority of women in Russia would wonder what her problems were. They had few rights and their husbands often had a severe problem with alcohol because of subsistence living. Unfortunately that led to domestic violence.
If you want a contrast from A.K., I would recommend " Germinal" considered one of Emile Zola's greatest novels. It will show you how coal miners wives had to live in the 19th century. It discusses more directly the conflict between the classes and the huge gap in the understanding of each other.
I like Russian authors and think they have quite a bit in common with French writers. Neither seem to me as optimistic as the majority of English or American writers. That proabably reflects quite well to their history. Or perhaps I'm just reading the wrong books. Anyhow Zola, often gives the reader more reality than she wants.
I think Anna shows symptoms of being bipolar. At times, she can be self assured and self centred, and at other times emotional and unable to make rational decisions.
The husband is too consistent (boring) to be hardly tolerable to her. She did, however, marry for convenience rather than love. In those times, upper class women were considered settled when married but often not complete until they had a lover. Not that unususal, but Anna is not dealing well with it. The husband's approach I would say was not that uncommon at the time. Just live with it if you can, or forgive and forget. Bury it! He is more worried about losing face. With Anna's attitude, do you think he really can make her happy? He cannot change his basic personality.
He's internally living mostly in a rational world (proabably more so, than many men) trying to figure out a wife who is living in a much more emotional(more than many women) world. As I have said before Tolstoy's real wife had emotional problems and Anna is somewhat like her. Tolstoy's wife did threaten suicide once.
Levin is probably the more important character in the novel as many believe that he closely resembles Tolstoy himself. He is attempting to understand the world of the serfs. He sees the rapture of physical labour but only when he can do it at his discretion. He feels things have to change but he's not sure how. He attempts to make change in his own world with little success.
I think this novel and "War and Peace" (which I preferred) give us a good view of Russia's internal problems which eventually led to the Russian revolution. There are parts of A.K. which I think are quite remarkable that have little to do with Anna but relate to W and P. The disparity between the rich and poor in Russia was too large for anyone to understand each other.
We are worrying about Anna. As comfortable 20th century people, we can relate more to Anna than the majority of Russian women of her time. The great majority of women in Russia would wonder what her problems were. They had few rights and their husbands often had a severe problem with alcohol because of subsistence living. Unfortunately that led to domestic violence.
If you want a contrast from A.K., I would recommend " Germinal" considered one of Emile Zola's greatest novels. It will show you how coal miners wives had to live in the 19th century. It discusses more directly the conflict between the classes and the huge gap in the understanding of each other.
I like Russian authors and think they have quite a bit in common with French writers. Neither seem to me as optimistic as the majority of English or American writers. That proabably reflects quite well to their history. Or perhaps I'm just reading the wrong books. Anyhow Zola, often gives the reader more reality than she wants.
I agree that upper class women were often bored because of limitations of opportunity to have a career etc.. On the other hand, her attitude towards her children was pretty volatile and she was not very self aware. Suicide usually indicates an emotionally unstable soul. In the perspective of people left, suicide is a selfish act. I've never noticed a direct relationship between the degree of unhappiness in a person's life and their situation. In my opinion, their mental health is more of an indicator than their circumstances when committing suicide.
Statistically young men and old men are the prime candidates for suicide. Women are more likely to accept more problems and carry on. As we age, women will often cope better with their pains and more limited life style. Women want to survive. In the book " The Fall of Berllin 1945" it was the German women who were lining up in the face of danger to get their rations for themselves and their children. The German men were finally giving up as they knew the war was lost and were getting drunk.
Perphaps Anna's lack of a strong maternal instinct made her more vulnerable to suicide.
She could have another life but it was devastating for her to think about her new circumstances.
I actually found Levin a little difficult to like as well. In some ways, I agree, that he and Anna are alike. They are not very accepting of the culture of their own time. Levin had the advantage that he could do some things about it. He gave up a ittle too easily, and had an bit of an indealistic view of the serfs.
Bertrand Russell, the 20th century philosopher,considered boredom, one of three most important aspects of life that people will have to find a coping skill. In this modern age, we seem to concerned about the opposite which is fatigue from too much work/responsibility/ lack of time. With the great loss of people's savings and unemployment, I think boredom will begin to be a more significant problem.
Thanks for the comment.
Have you read " Main Street" by Sinclair Lewis? I thought it had a lot more to say about womens' frustration with the status quo. To me, he was one of the first male authors that treated women more like people in his novels. Of course, Tolstoy, can't compete with Jane Austen, the Bronte sisters, or George Eliot when developing the social problems of women in the 19th century.
I guess that's one of the reasons, I prefer War and Peace. I think Levin was a better developed character than Anna.
Statistically young men and old men are the prime candidates for suicide. Women are more likely to accept more problems and carry on. As we age, women will often cope better with their pains and more limited life style. Women want to survive. In the book " The Fall of Berllin 1945" it was the German women who were lining up in the face of danger to get their rations for themselves and their children. The German men were finally giving up as they knew the war was lost and were getting drunk.
Perphaps Anna's lack of a strong maternal instinct made her more vulnerable to suicide.
She could have another life but it was devastating for her to think about her new circumstances.
I actually found Levin a little difficult to like as well. In some ways, I agree, that he and Anna are alike. They are not very accepting of the culture of their own time. Levin had the advantage that he could do some things about it. He gave up a ittle too easily, and had an bit of an indealistic view of the serfs.
Bertrand Russell, the 20th century philosopher,considered boredom, one of three most important aspects of life that people will have to find a coping skill. In this modern age, we seem to concerned about the opposite which is fatigue from too much work/responsibility/ lack of time. With the great loss of people's savings and unemployment, I think boredom will begin to be a more significant problem.
Thanks for the comment.
Have you read " Main Street" by Sinclair Lewis? I thought it had a lot more to say about womens' frustration with the status quo. To me, he was one of the first male authors that treated women more like people in his novels. Of course, Tolstoy, can't compete with Jane Austen, the Bronte sisters, or George Eliot when developing the social problems of women in the 19th century.
I guess that's one of the reasons, I prefer War and Peace. I think Levin was a better developed character than Anna.
I finished on the train returning home from Sendai three days ago and there is so much I can say about this amazing novel, but I'll try to be concise.In the process of reading Anna Karenina I could not help but notice how little of Anna's background and motivation was provided. Apparently, I have discovered through my research, Tolstoy the writer deliberately decided to conceal this and present her actions, leaving us to judge. As a result, she does not come across as sympathetic as Madam Bovary or Edna Montpellier - two more famous adultresses of literature past. That makes me agree with Glen, in terms of her character not being well developed. Her descent happens so freakishly and I find it jarring, especially when compared to the trials of her virtual Doppelganger Levin. The latter (maybe as a result of being a literary personification of Tolstoy) is well delineated and thus, more sympathetic. He is clearly the heart of the novel. Their struggles with life are depicted in depth, one overcomes and finds peace with existence, the other fails.
Do you feel bad for Anna or has she brought her situation on herself?
Is Levin and more or less awesome on his farm?