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Book Issues > What to do about unpublished ISBNs?

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message 1: by Jessica (new)

Jessica | 963 comments Hey guys-
I keep running across ISBNs for books that never got published. I make it a habit to refresh the data, since they sometimes get updated, but a lot of the time you can tell the book has been published, just not using that ISBN. For example, you might see "Untitled #4" and book four is out, but the ISBN goes to an audio cd or some such thing.

I don't want to convert it to the correct title, even if it's available, since technically it didn't get published under that ISBN. And often they can't get deleted, since they are still in amazon's records.

Do we have a policy for this? If we don't, could we do something like we do for NAB? I hate seeing them show up in the author's profile, but I also wouldn't want to delete that info. I don't have any bright ideas though.


message 2: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 42507 comments Mod
Can you provide an example or two. I'm not sure what you mean -- it sounded at first like you're saying the ISBN was used, and then that it was not.


message 3: by Jessica (new)

Jessica | 963 comments Sure. Here's one example that's already been combined with a work:
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/20...

It's used in the sense that it's associated with an author and has a pub date, but the title never gets associated with it. If you do a search for "untitled" you'll get a bazillion results.

I've run across a few that when I refresh the data, it'll write over or add a cover, from which I can get the title, but most don't.


message 4: by Jessica (last edited Mar 08, 2010 12:56PM) (new)

Jessica | 963 comments Here's another example:
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/43...
When I refreshed the data, a description came in for a Robert Harris book. But nothing else (and the author didn't change), and note the publication date of 2002.


message 5: by Cait (new)

Cait (tigercait) | 5005 comments If you can find an association of the ISBN with a title, I'd say go ahead and update the book record with the title and any other information -- it was probably picked up on an initial publicity release and never updated in GR's system. If there's no title at all that can be put to the ISBN and the publication date is several years past, it's probable that the publisher changed ISBNs before releasing the book, so that should be NABbed. (I'll add that to the NAB list for the manual, in fact!)


message 6: by Cait (new)

Cait (tigercait) | 5005 comments Jessica wrote: "Here's another example:
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/43...
When I refreshed the data, a description came in for a Robert Harris book. But nothing else (and the author didn't chan..."


"The second book in the stunning Roman Empire trilogy by Robert Harris" turns up Lustrum on Google, but the pub date doesn't match at all, you're right. Looks like a phantom in the works: I vote NAB.


message 7: by Cait (new)

Cait (tigercait) | 5005 comments Jessica wrote: "Sure. Here's one example that's already been combined with a work:
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/20...

It's used in the sense that it's associated with an author a..."


I'm getting a number of Google hits on that ISBN linked to "Heart and Soul", and the pub dates match -- the book record should probably be updated with better edition details.


message 8: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 42507 comments Mod
Jessica wrote: "but the title never gets associated with it."

On Amazon, maybe. I found a number of UK sites where it does.


message 9: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (last edited Mar 08, 2010 01:21PM) (new)

rivka | 42507 comments Mod
The author will never change with an Amazon refresh. That capability was deliberately disabled because it was undoing librarian edits.

Keep in mind that Amazon is far from the only source for book data, especially for non-US editions. WorldCat, Google Books, and plain old Google can be very helpful in nailing down some of the books like these.


message 10: by Jessica (new)

Jessica | 963 comments What's weird is I just checked out a whole bunch. I refreshed data on amazon, and either a summary or cover would show up, but the title wouldn't change. But if I googled the ISBN, the title comes up on Amazon. These are for more newer releases.

So far:
If the ISBN can be linked with a title, update it with the title (which I was doing).
If refresh does not give any new information and the publication date is several years past, NAB it.

I'd like to change "Untitled" in the ones we NAB to "Unpublished" so that it will be easier to search for these puppies. What do you guys think?


message 11: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 42507 comments Mod
Jessica wrote: "If refresh does not give any new information and the publication date is several years past, NAB it."

If and only if you cannot find it listed elsewhere (like WorldCat, GoogleBooks, FantatsticFiction, etc.)


message 12: by Jessica (new)

Jessica | 963 comments rivka wrote: "Jessica wrote: "If refresh does not give any new information and the publication date is several years past, NAB it."

If and only if you cannot find it listed elsewhere (like WorldCat, GoogleBooks..."

Of course, my dear :) Even then I'd make sure the author info was in there, with a note saying why it was NABbed.

I'd much rather see the books updated with the correct info anyway, saving NAB only as a last resort.


message 13: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 42507 comments Mod
Excellent. :)


message 14: by Jessica (new)

Jessica | 963 comments Ok need some advice on this one:
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/49...
Unpublished by Philippa Gregory, but a google search shows a title from the 70s called "Volcanoes."

My first thought is to change the info to match the Volcanoes book. Yes? No?


message 15: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 42507 comments Mod
Absolutely. I'm unconvinced that the data from Amazon in this case has anything whatsoever to do with reality.


message 16: by Jessica (new)

Jessica | 963 comments Great, I will do that. Thanks!


This Is Not The Michael You're Looking For | 949 comments Here is one example: Edgeworks vol. 5. This was part of a planned series of the collection of Harlan Ellison's works. They published four volumes and had announced the 5th, with an ISBN, but for a variety of reasons abandoned the project.

The fact of its non-publication is in the description.

Now, this ISBN does have a specific title/author associated with it, but it has never (and will never be published). So far it's been left as is, but there is part of me that thinks it should be NAB'd since it is not an actual book.

Thoughts?


message 18: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 42507 comments Mod
I suspect NABing it would simply result in phantom, no-ISBN editions being created. By the same folks who rated it . . .


message 19: by Jessica (new)

Jessica | 963 comments Rivka's right. Maybe put before it UNPUBLISHED or NEVER PUBLISHED in front of the title? That way it's blatantly obvious.


message 20: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 42507 comments Mod
Works for me.


message 21: by Lisa (new)

Lisa Vegan (lisavegan) | 2409 comments Jessica wrote: "Rivka's right. Maybe put before it UNPUBLISHED or NEVER PUBLISHED in front of the title? That way it's blatantly obvious."

Works for me too.


message 22: by Jessica (new)

Jessica | 963 comments Ok another question. If it really looks like the Untitled edition is associated with another book, should I just go ahead and change it and put it with that book?

For example (LGT combine page) this author only has a few books, the untitled one looks like it's an earlier unpublished version of another. Refreshing data does nothing, pub date is 2005, and google search comes up with nada:
http://www.goodreads.com/book/combine...


message 23: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 42507 comments Mod
Jessica, I found this, which might be the actual title.


message 24: by Jessica (new)

Jessica | 963 comments Hey, that's so weird. I saw the same thing, sort of, which was just a link, and when I clicked the link it changed to untitled. I'll change it to that.


message 25: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 42507 comments Mod
Yeah, I saw that one too. And then I found this.

Google is weird sometimes.


message 26: by Jessica (new)

Jessica | 963 comments Silly google. Well, see if you can work your magic on this one (LGT again to combine): http://www.goodreads.com/book/combine...

Same as last one, I think it's referring to another book (Untitled on Oil = Crude Oil?).


message 27: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 42507 comments Mod
That seems most likely.


message 28: by Jessica (new)

Jessica | 963 comments I'm really trying to avoid NABing, but I'd like to get these untitled books off. I think I'll put that title in, combine, but leave a note in the description saying this looks to be an unpublished version of the book. Good idea?


message 29: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 42507 comments Mod
Very. :)


message 30: by Jessica (new)

Jessica | 963 comments Thanks for your help :)


message 31: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 42507 comments Mod
De nada!


message 32: by Lobstergirl (new)

Lobstergirl Hmm, here's a book that hasn't been published and isn't on Amazon or Worldcat, no ISBN.

http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/60...

The only evidence that it exists in a pre-published stage is this interview with the author.

http://www.failbetter.com/31/AlexieIn...

Leave as is?


message 33: by rivka, Librarian Moderator (new)

rivka | 42507 comments Mod
Yes.


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