The Debate Club discussion
: ̗̀➛ Games and General Topics
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Deep Thoughts
Equality means each individual or group of people is given the same resources or opportunities. Equity recognizes that each person has different circumstances and allocates the exact resources and opportunities needed to reach an equal outcome. Except finding the optimal location is impossible, and everybody has different ooinions, and each persons circumstance is so vastly different it makes more sense financially and morally and ethically to focus on equality
MidnightButterfly wrote: "DEI is an ideology whereby people from "minority groups" are priroritsed over equal or better abled white straight cis males XD"um no? DEI is the program that puts ramps in for wheelchair bound people who can't use the stairs. DEI sets up employee resource groups.
it actually mean that "straight cis males" aren't held in higher consideration that more abled "minority groups" just because of appearance. DEI doesn't ensure certain groups have preferential treatment, but rather that none do, according to the definition 🤷♀️
Thismis how i was taught in school about equity which i was like oh fair. But its in realoty, a lot more political than that and when it becomes an ideology, thats when it is dangerous
Austin wrote: "Well equity is not the same as equality. Otherwise you would be using the word equality"the definition of equity according to merriam-webster:
'Equity refers to fairness or justice in the way people are treated, and especially freedom from bias or favoritism, as in “governed according to the principle of equity.”
yes, they are two different words with different meanings. but the concept is still relatively the same
rainy ୨ৎ {hiatus} wrote: "MidnightButterfly wrote: "DEI is an ideology whereby people from "minority groups" are priroritsed over equal or better abled white straight cis males XD"um no? DEI is the program that puts ramps..."
If it was the case, in application forms they would not ask you your ethnicity. They would completely disregard it as not important, they woukdnt ask your sexuality. They would look at your skills.
But instead they look at it and say oh i need 5 people of "colour" to fill my quota so i get my funding, so i will just recruit these 5 people becuase theyre nit white.
If what you were saying were true, they woukdnt look at race, or gender etc. They would look at skills.
In the modern day DEI is synomisis with discrimination against the majority.
rainy ୨ৎ {hiatus} wrote: "Austin wrote: "Well equity is not the same as equality. Otherwise you would be using the word equality"the definition of equity according to merriam-webster:
'Equity refers to fairness or justic..."
The cincept is completely different
MidnightButterfly wrote: "Thismis how i was taught in school about equity which i was like oh fair. But its in realoty, a lot more political than that and when it becomes an ideology, thats when it is dangerous"
how is it a political ideology? genuine question
rainy ୨ৎ {hiatus} wrote: "MidnightButterfly wrote: "Thismis how i was taught in school about equity which i was like oh fair. But its in realoty, a lot more political than that and when it becomes an ideology, thats when it..."Because it is more about filling in quotas and vindicnation against white people for the past. It isnt actually removing racial barriers etc but putting them in place MORE so that is all we focus on. It is defining people based on what they were born with vs the skills they gained
MidnightButterfly wrote: "rainy ୨ৎ {hiatus} wrote: "MidnightButterfly wrote: "DEI is an ideology whereby people from "minority groups" are priroritsed over equal or better abled white straight cis males XD"um no? DEI is t..."
maybe application forms have those questions so that they know more about who they're hiring? of course you want to know someone's sexuality so you know how to address them
It is political because conservatives dont agree that present discrimination rectifies past discrimination
rainy ୨ৎ {hiatus} wrote: "MidnightButterfly wrote: "rainy ୨ৎ {hiatus} wrote: "MidnightButterfly wrote: "DEI is an ideology whereby people from "minority groups" are priroritsed over equal or better abled white straight cis ..."....no rainy. The questions on application forms are under the diversity and when you read through why they are using your info it is about writing repotts on how many of this category they have in thier company etc. So they get thier funding or they can publicise wooo i have 20 black people so im diverse
And they ask those questions so they know where to fill in their ethicnity
Someone sexuality or race is none of the business of the hiring team. It is the qualifications that matter
Gaps
Also sexuality has nothing to do with how they addres them?
They can go to tknow the persons sexuality once theyve been hired it shoukd have no beraing on whether they are a good canddate or not lmao
The political term for this by the propenets of DEI call it "positive discrimnation" Thats the term they used before they brought in dei because it sounds better but positive discrimnation is the political term and its still the same thing
How deep olivia
MidnightButterfly wrote: "rainy ୨ৎ {hiatus} wrote: "MidnightButterfly wrote: "Thismis how i was taught in school about equity which i was like oh fair. But its in realoty, a lot more political than that and when it becomes ..."idk the definition of DEI and how it has been used in the past is different than literally everything you just said
"It is defining people based on what they were born with vs the skills they gained"
if a Latino man has better qualifications than a white man and gets overlooked simply because he's Latino, DEI was put in place to prevent that from happening
"It isnt actually removing racial barriers etc but putting them in place MORE so that is all we focus on"
isn't DEI put in place to prevent that exact thing from happening?
DEI isn't just appealing to different races or sexualities, it's also in place to help disabled people gain the resources they need. taking away DEI is just to inflate the middle aged white mens' ego so that they feel like they're on a higher podium than everyone else. please just look up the definition of DEI
MidnightButterfly wrote: "How deep olivia"Yes, I am very deep
Austin wrote: "Lol thanks olivia"you're welcome
Rainy the defintion is there, the defintion of everything is there, but its what happens in practice that matters. Nobody is disputing that giving a person who has nonworking legs a ramp instead of stairs is a bad thing. But giving the same person a free pass to a job to do with the mind and not giveanother better qualified candiadte the job because they are able-bodied is wrongHow would they know he is latino? If blind apllications where in place? Imstead, its the opposite of blind.
Austin wrote: "It is political because conservatives dont agree that present discrimination rectifies past discrimination"it's not supposed to be political though. it's supposed to help give "minority groups" an equal chance in the workplace
present discrimination doesn't rectify past discrimination
Lol no rainy like ive said the best way to eliminate bias it omit such things like race and sexuality from forms. DEI regardless of what you have been told is a tool for discrimination and it adds racial tension.
Because now you question every diverse person you see and winder if they earned the position or were given it for a qouta. I have seen many times your DEI just adds corruption and waste to the system.
MidnightButterfly wrote: "Rainy the defintion is there, the defintion of everything is there, but its what happens in practice that matters. Nobody is disputing that giving a person who has nonworking legs a ramp instead of..."no one is getting a free pass at a job? it's just making sure that white people don't get free passes at jobs just because they're white
!!!also I made some new friends today!! I think
A lot of internship opportunites etc. Are only ooen to say idk let me give an example.I wanted to aplly to this internship, long stroy, anyway.
I filled in the form and i had an interciew with an AI who blind screened me so it was great.
Then at the next stage they asked me to fill out a diveristy form so they can "allocate places" and then i filled it in and they said automaticallh "sorry, we are looking for people from other ethnic groups who are disadvantaged e.g. Pakistani, Bangladeshi, Afro-Caribbean. Please browse outr website for more opportunites"
And my white friend didnt get in, my chinese friend didnt get in, my pakistani friend did.
And im ethnically indian
rainy ୨ৎ {hiatus} wrote: "Austin wrote: "It is political because conservatives dont agree that present discrimination rectifies past discrimination"it's not supposed to be political though. it's supposed to help give "min..."
Rainy dei is positive discrimination its what its called look it up what is positive discrimantion it will say dei is the polciy that enabled positive discrimination
Which is a positive thing on the left
rainy ୨ৎ {hiatus} wrote: "MidnightButterfly wrote: "Rainy the defintion is there, the defintion of everything is there, but its what happens in practice that matters. Nobody is disputing that giving a person who has nonwork..."Then how do they know they are white if that just wasnt a question on forms??
okay look, i agree that adding DEI shines an even bigger spotlight on racial discrimination, and that question about sexuality and race should be taken out of application forms. but as far as i know, DEI is not the reason those questions are there. i'm trying to explain that DEI isn't just used to help non-white people get jobs, but make things more accessible for disabled people. taking away DEI affects them, too
olivia ౨ৎ wrote: "!!!also I made some new friends today!! I think"
aw good for you livie 💞
Its already illegal to discrimate against someone so its illegal to give someone a job just because they are white. Thats already a law.Dei says howvee, it is okay to give someone a job if they are black.
Which is racism, no? Its two tier law?
rainy ୨ৎ {hiatus} wrote: "olivia ౨ৎ wrote: "!!!also I made some new friends today!! I think"
aw good for you livie 💞"
yeahhh! it's a group of boys and I gave them my phone number. they're really nice to me
rainy ୨ৎ {hiatus} wrote: "okay look, i agree that adding DEI shines an even bigger spotlight on racial discrimination, and that question about sexuality and race should be taken out of application forms. but as far as i kno..."Even before dei was in place, accessinilty arrangements were a thing, dei didnt bring that in
MidnightButterfly wrote: "rainy ୨ৎ {hiatus} wrote: "Austin wrote: "It is political because conservatives dont agree that present discrimination rectifies past discrimination"it's not supposed to be political though. it's ..."
DEI doesn't come up when i search positive discrimination, the Equality Act of 2010 does, which is different
ray ੈ✩‧₊˚ (hiatus! check bio!) wrote: "MidnightButterfly wrote: "Equal? Or greater?"minorities in american absolutely do NOT have equal access to jobs and necessities. DEI was more of a necessary evil until we could get to a point in ..."
It is illegal to discriminate based on race, sexuality, gender etx. Thats already in place. Its already illegal.
We should move this to a dei discussion.
ray ੈ✩‧₊˚ (hiatus! check bio!) wrote: "MidnightButterfly wrote: "Equal? Or greater?"minorities in american absolutely do NOT have equal access to jobs and necessities. DEI was more of a necessary evil until we could get to a point in ..."
THANK YOU, that's what i'm trying to say
MidnightButterfly wrote: "rainy ୨ৎ {hiatus} wrote: "okay look, i agree that adding DEI shines an even bigger spotlight on racial discrimination, and that question about sexuality and race should be taken out of application ..."yeah but people act like DEI is the reason those questions are there, but it's not
ray ੈ✩‧₊˚ (hiatus! check bio!) wrote: "MidnightButterfly wrote: "Its already illegal to discrimate against someone so its illegal to give someone a job just because they are white. Thats already a law.Dei says howvee, it is okay to giv..."
And DEI does what? Forces people to hire people from certian groups making them nothing better than a skin colour?
rainy ୨ৎ {hiatus} wrote: "MidnightButterfly wrote: "rainy ୨ৎ {hiatus} wrote: "okay look, i agree that adding DEI shines an even bigger spotlight on racial discrimination, and that question about sexuality and race should be..."Rainy those questions are there due to diversity policies
rainy ୨ৎ {hiatus} wrote: "MidnightButterfly wrote: "rainy ୨ৎ {hiatus} wrote: "Austin wrote: "It is political because conservatives dont agree that present discrimination rectifies past discrimination"it's not supposed to ..."
Equality act of 2010 isnt positive discrimamtion, idk if thats the uk law but the uk ewuality act of 2010 made positive discrimantion illegal in the uk
I ALSO ATE CAKE TODAY BECAUSE IT'S SHAKESPHEARE'S BIRTHDAY TOMORROW.
the definition of DEI says equal
i mean, DEI literally stands for "Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion""
Where does it say equal