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What are we reading? 12/08/2024
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Lass
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Aug 21, 2024 05:45AM
Ah, vowel sounds. I was once passing someone in my workplace , and picked up on her East Riding vowels immediately. In fact I accurately placed her city.
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Mod
This is known as the 'trap - bath' split.
"The split appeared in southern English pronunciation in the mid-17th century and it’s not clear why it affected some words and not others, though there is a clear tendency for it to appear in shorter and more commonly used words."
https://pronunciationstudio.com/trap-...
Lass wrote: "Ah, vowel sounds. I was once passing someone in my workplace , and picked up on her East Riding vowels immediately. In fact I accurately placed her city."I accurately placed a fellow traveller to Burnley when I was in China. Unbelievably he had worked with a cousin of mine!!
Gpfr wrote: "Gpfr wrote: "scarletnoir wrote: " Calling a bath a 'barth' has always puzzled me...."This is known as the 'trap - bath' split.
"The split appeared in southern English pronunciation in the mid-17t..."
Do people say 'parth'?
Mod
Certainly do — /pɑːθ/
scarletnoir wrote: "Gpfr wrote: "Gpfr wrote: "scarletnoir wrote: " Calling a bath a 'barth' has always puzzled me...."This is known as the 'trap - bath' split.
"The split appeared in southern English pronunciation i..."
yes..i say parth, all my vowels are long, except oddly Glasgow has a short "a", in my pronouncation until a decade ago, now its GLARSGOW again
Referring to short or long As, a lot of people further north than I am now (including my mother when she was alive) say marster and plarster when normally you would expect them to say master and plaster. It has always puzzled me.
Gpfr wrote: "sInternational House in London, in Shaftesbury Avenue in those days...."Wow I did the course there many years ago, but decided to go into IT instead of EFL. Before that I had taught English evening classes in France (without any qualifications obvs) and I'll always remember hearing the class reproduce perfectly my Midlands 'a' in a word like 'that' (or even worse it might have been 'bath') - we make it more 'open' than southerners.
And one final comment re north and south A sounds. Why do we all say 'farther' for father? In old books it's often written 'feyther' so I presume that's how it started.
And one extra final comment. I've only recently realised that 'one' used to be pronounced like 'own'. Think of 'only' and also 'on your own' - that must have been 'one' not 'own' originally.
Sorry, one more then I'll go. I had no idea until I left Derby that most people don't say the G in a word like hanging. I've tempered my pronunciation now but the G is still there - the first one especially.
FrancesBurgundy wrote: "Gpfr wrote: "sInternational House in London, in Shaftesbury Avenue in those days...."Wow I did the course there many years ago, but decided to go into IT instead of EFL. Before that I had taught ..."
In the ex-dominions (CAN, AUS, NZ, SAF), only Canada has totally lost the longer vowel forms. In Australia they seem all over the place, some friends of mine mix long and short vowels in same sentences and i see it happen a lot regionally from state to state New Zealand has a similar mix
South Africa oddly has an almost 100% long vowel sound among whites(especially Afrikaaners) and pretty much 100% amongst other races. The origins of this interest me as its easily the most diverse of the old dominons but it seems that maybe the bulk of white immigrants in the formative years 1870s-1910s were maybe of southern descent
Mod
Wow I did the course there many years ago, but decided to go into IT instead of EFL. Before that I had taught ..."
I did it in 1969, just after finals, then went to Lisbon and then Paris where I stayed :), still doing EFL teaching and teacher training.
Gpfr wrote: "I did it in 1969, just after finals..."My finals were also in 1969 but I then spent a year as a lectrice at a French university (where I moonlighted as an unqualified English teacher of adults in evening classes). Then International House in 1970 but they wanted me to teach in London which was not part of my plan, so I looked for and found IT work (in London!).
Many years later I went back to language teaching, but this time even more fascinating than English - shorthand.
Gpfr wrote: "scarletnoir wrote: "Do people say 'parth'?..."Certainly do — /pɑːθ/"
Haha! It gets better.
AB76 wrote: "yes..i say parth, all my vowels are long, except oddly Glasgow has a short "a", in my pronouncation until a decade ago, now its GLARSGOW again."I wonder if the Scots would have a problem with that?
Occasionally, tourists have asked me the way to 'somewhere', but have so badly mangled the correct Welsh pronunciation that I have no idea where they want to go!
scarletnoir wrote: "Occasionally, tourists have asked me the way to 'somewhere', but have so badly mangled the correct Welsh pronunciation that I have no idea where they want to go."Not surprised, Welsh is one on its own. When driving on holiday in Wales a year or two back I had to remember to read the road signs from half way down.
Mod
Not surprised..."
My mother, sisters and I were on the train, going to join my father (army officer) who'd been posted to Tywyn (spelt Towyn in those days, 1955, before Welsh spelling on road signs etc.) The ticket inspector, on his way out of the compartment, said "You have to change at (gobbledygook)." and whisked off out of sight. Panic ensued, but fortunately, the other passengers were able to tell us that the change was at Machynlleth — a station you must know, scarletnoir. I did learn how to pronounce it subsequently and have changed trains there many times.
At school we had Welsh lessons, but never learnt anything we could really use outside the classroom, it was all things like how to say "The black dog is outside the white house".
I was in fact born in Wales, in Pembrokeshire, but we left there when I was one.
Gpfr wrote: "Machynlleth — a station you must know, scarletnoir.Indeed... madame taught there for 20 years or so. We have some real beauties in Wales, including a local village with a nice pub - Llanfihangel y Creuddyn. Down in south Wales, there is Ynysybwl - and so on.
As for Tywyn/Towyn - if they did change the spelling, it may have been to avoid confusion with the Towyn which exists on the north coast near Abergele.
scarletnoir wrote: "Gpfr wrote: "Machynlleth — a station you must know, scarletnoir.Indeed... madame taught there for 20 years or so. We have some real beauties in Wales, including a local village with a nice pub - ..."
Is it pronounced Macunckluth
Mod
"Once, it was also known as Towyn, but in 1968, a referendum was held to clarify the name’s pronunciation and spelling. The vote came in favour of Tywyn – a fully welsh word reflecting her coastline of seashore plus dunes."
from Welsh Country
I have my DNA results back. Nothing very surprising. 42% Scottish, (Dads side I think) 38% England and Northwest Europe, A bit of Belgium in there somewhere (mums side) 12% Ireland. 4% Sweden and Denmark, and 4% Welsh. I guess thats the Viking bit. Though the Scottish/Irish bit would be a bit hazy, as the plantation of Ulster was when the toffs kicked the crofters off their land in favour of sheep, though those same crofters were quite likely to have been Irish in origin anyway. I'm not much of a fan of Viking culture of olden days, but I do like Yggdrasil, 'The Tree of Life', and have dreamt of it from time to time.'Numerous animals are said to live among Yggdrasil’s stout branches and roots. Around its base lurks the dragon Nidhogg and several snakes, who gnaw at its roots. An unnamed eagle perches in its upper branches, and a squirrel, Ratatoskr (“Drill-Tooth”), scurries up and down the trunk conveying the dragon’s insults to the eagle and vice versa. Meanwhile, four stags – Dainn, Dvalinn, Duneyrr, and Durathror – graze on the tree’s leaves.' I feel that I know the un-named eagle, Ratatoskr and Nidhogg the dragon very well. And Gudrun comes to visit, from time to time... https://i.postimg.cc/cJM0nMVq/images.jpg
I wonder who would prevail, the Irish Danu or Viking Jörð, when the chips are down? Alas they did not give me any info as to whether I have Neanderthal genes tucked away somewhere. I screwed up there, as it was the main reason I took the DNA sample, (I obviously neglected to read the small print!) and it was a special offer, cheap deal!.., but I have downloaded my results and can send them off to another company, for free, as to the Neanderthal question. I 'm hoping those results might come back with a nice picture of a wooly mammoth, well one can live in hope!...
Tam wrote: "I have my DNA results back. Nothing very surprising. 42% Scottish, (Dads side I think) 38% England and Northwest Europe, A bit of Belgium in there somewhere (mums side) 12% Ireland. 4% Sweden and D..."those are very specific, i did one about a decade ago that had me 72% British, with a lot of Scando-Baltic as well. I would prefer one that shows how much Scots or Irish acnestry i may have, i cant remember who i used.
My fathers paternal line was Illryian and quite rare, originating in what is now the Balkans(thats the aincient bit)
I was away for a couple of weeks and will try to catch up on some of the topics and discussions I missed later but for now - is anyone having trouble adding books to Goodreads or even just clicking on them to see details? Last night and today, every time I click on a book I get a "403 Bad Gateway" message.
Just started The Penguin Modern History of Spain
which i found by chance and hadnt seen reviewed, oddly as i read so many reviews in TLS-LRB and NYRBI'm not too keen on compressed popular history, covering 100 years in 400 pages, i prefer shorter historical periods with 400 pages. However Penguin have bene producing some excellent books like this(albeit i am only 16 pages in), where ideas are being discussed alongside the A to B of the popular history books.
Nigel Townson, the author, starts with 1898 and the loss of the last significant Spanish colonies and whether it was as big a crisis or a decline as history has treated it. He comments that actually in the period over the next 2 decades, only Italy matched Spain for progress in Southern Europe and evidence of a decline is greatly exaggerated.
What has always fascinated me is how low Spains population was by 1900, far behind the UK, Italy or Germany and behind the ever retracting population of France. I dont know if i will find an answer to this in Townsons book, though emigration must play a part
An interesting area in the post 1898 world is that Spain lost its Catalan influenced business links to Cuba, which historically was seen as a real problem but Townson thinks Spain swiftly found new ways to trade and adapt with the loss of Cuba , Phillipines and Puerto Rico. reminding the reader they were far smaller than the large empire lost in the South American wars
Names of places: On D-Day, American paratroopers were dropped all over the Continin peninsula. One group of lost paratroopers and a friendly Frenchman tried their best to make out where they were and where they needed to go. The Frenchman finally ripped a map out of his telephone directory, and they set off...
Finally finished reading The Secret Hours by Mick Herron, Yes it was good to have a lot of back history filled in but there seemed to be a lot of padding in the middle. Or perhaps I am just impatient. A few things didn't add up(view spoiler)
Robert wrote: "Names of places: On D-Day, American paratroopers were dropped all over the Continin peninsula. One group of lost paratroopers and a friendly Frenchman tried their best to make out where they were a..."love that Robert....hope late summer isnt too hot in your neck of the woods?
Berkley wrote: "I was away for a couple of weeks and will try to catch up on some of the topics and discussions I missed later but for now - is anyone having trouble adding books to Goodreads or even just clicking..."Never mind, it's back working again now. Must have been a temporary glitch with Goodreads.
giveusaclue wrote: "Is it pronounced Macunckluth?"Nope. A lot of nonsense is posted online, isn't it?
I found this clip of the name being pronounced correctly on YouTube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ojWz0...
Note in particular that the 'c' sound is wrong - 'ch' is very different - and that 'ckl' is a long way off the sound of 'll'.
'ch' is a sound which is found in other languages; AFAIK, 'll' is peculiar to Welsh and is pretty common since 'llan' means church and is found in any number of place names, usually followed by the name of a saint.
Edit: one of the most annoying mispronunciations (to me) is that of the village Abersoch on the Lleyn peninsula - most English visitors pronounce it to rhyme with 'sock' (FFS!!!)
This is how it should be done:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YIVuo...
Gpfr wrote: "scarletnoir wrote: "As for Tywyn/Towyn - if they did change the spelling - ...""Once, it was also known as Towyn, but in 1968, a referendum was held to clarify the name’s pronunciation and spelli..."
Thanks for that.
AB76 wrote: "behind the ever retracting population of France."Surprised to read this, so I checked - the online graph I found appears to show gradual growth with a faster growth post-WW2 apart from a drop around the time of WW1:
https://www.statista.com/statistics/1...
Robert wrote: "Names of places: On D-Day, American paratroopers were dropped all over the Continin peninsula. One group of lost paratroopers and a friendly Frenchman tried their best to make out where they were a..."Think you have a typo here - you mean 'Cotentin', I believe:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cotenti...
giveusaclue wrote: "Finally finished reading The Secret Hours by Mick Herron, Yes it was good to have a lot of back history filled in but there seemed to be a lot of padding in the middle. Or perhaps I am just impatie..."Fair comments - I felt the same about this one.
scarletnoir wrote: "giveusaclue wrote: "Is it pronounced Macunckluth?"Nope. A lot of nonsense is posted online, isn't it?
I found this clip of the name being pronounced correctly on YouTube:
https://www.youtube.co..."
🤣 Not that far off!!
How is the knee by the way?
scarletnoir wrote: "AB76 wrote: "behind the ever retracting population of France."Surprised to read this, so I checked - the online graph I found appears to show gradual growth with a faster growth post-WW2 apart fro..."
French emigration was never as large as from Spain or Italy, which is another area i would expect to have an impact. Townson quotes that 2.5m Spanish emigrated from 1885 to 1913, with 10m emigrating from Italy between 1881 and 1910. But Italy kept growing and in 1931 had eexceeded d France with roughly 40-41m ppl(according to my 1931 Italian census)
Post WW2, France began to grow well exceeding the UK population growth btw 1970-85
i think the effect of WW1 is sometimes understated with France, Germany obviously lost millions but it seems it affected the pysche of France even more and despite being a victor, its losses were considerable. A french statsbook i found recorded a population of 41.5m in 1912 and just 38.6 by 1919(Germany went from 66.1 in 1912 to 62.8 in 1919)
Every year from 1914-1919 saw a "negative change" in the french population, while Germany only saw that from 1915-1918
Rough stats by my estimate show that France "remade" the 1912 figure by 1940,Germany remade their 1912 figure by 1933
Mod
This book, Motives for Murder, A Celebration of Peter Lovesey on His 80th Birthday, is a collection of short stories by members of the Detection Club. I like Peter Lovesey's Peter Diamond novels, set in Bath.The Detection Club consisted at first of only detective story writers, then membership was extended to writers of thrillers and spy stories, among them Dick Francis and John Le Carré. Members have to be nominated and then elected.
At the end of the book, Peter Lovesey writes some reminscences of the club. I was amused to read this about a writer by whom I've read 2 books recently:
... Michael Gilbert once revealed in an interview that he did all his writing on his commuter train, the 8.37 to Victoria. ('If you can write a page and a half in fifty minutes, as I do, you can finish a novel in just thirty weeks, which makes me extremely interested to know how full-time writers fill their time.')This rubbed some of his fellow members up the wrong way.
Just watched the Klitschko documentary about Vitali, ex champion boxer and Mayor of KyivA sobering watch, i have tried to read as much about Ukraine in the last decade as possible but when it comes to books, i have only read Belarousets short stories of the early 2014 conflicts in the East
There is a stoic discipline to Klitschko that impresses me, in the face of appalling times. He is divorced, making soup in a microwave on his own, his sons say he spends all his time working. 6ft 7, clumsy but endearing, he has been a visible sign of Ukraine in the last 3 years.
Mod
But, at the end of the day, it is a journal, not a novel. It has no overall structure, and it promises no progression or resolution. We are in 1931-32, at the height of the Depression, and yet nothing exists outside an endless round of conversations and cafés and drinking, as Henry Miller and his wife June tear each other to pieces, and Nin acts as a super-sensitive mediator and confidante to both - after which she goes off to see her analyst to review the effect of it all on her own inner life.
Those sessions on the analyst’s couch reveal her fragile sense of self, or rather her several selves, as she feels like a broken mirror, lacking all assurance, despite her outward attractiveness and style. There are piercing recollections of her parents and the lives they lived.
Then it’s back to the Millers, where Nin disagrees with him over the value of intensity in literature – it is an error, she protests, to leave out dullness and boredom – life cannot be a succession of scenes out of Dostoyevsky.
At one point Nin wonders if Miller’s writing will suffer the same weakness as Joyce and Lawrence and Proust, and become a monstrous over-development of the self. She might have posed the same question of her own Journal.
A glance through the second half indicates a more varied cast, but it’s not enough to tempt me to read on. A glance at Wikipedia, and also a long article in The G from 2015, suggests an extraordinary talent for mendacity, which I hadn't picked up, and other matters such as adult incest and bigamy.
Logger24 wrote: "I’ve now read half the first long volume of the Journal of Anaïs Nin, and I’m going to leave it there. It was interesting to learn why this dense work drew attention and some admiration. She has a ..."I know I saw the film Henry and June, but I have forgotten it completely except for a vague memory of the poster. I read a bit of Nin's erotica (in Delta of Venus), but nothing of Miller. I don't think I've ever read a writer's journal.
Mod
I read I don't remember how much of this in my early years in Paris, borrowed from the library of the British Council — a rather weird and wonderful collection of books which was closed down in favour of computers many years ago now. At the time I had little money to buy books, so ended up reading things I would probably not have otherwise read.
I have to say I don't have clear memories of the journal, except that I won't read it again :)
giveusaclue wrote: "🤣 Not that far off!!How is the knee by the way?."
Well, I beg to differ on that!
As for the knee - there is a little improvement every day, and I could actually lift my foot when sitting this morning... and have made it upstairs for the last two nights (sleeping in a recliner is OK but not ideal). Thanks for asking.
(I think it's a cunning plan by an underfunded NHS to 'allow' patients to get better on their own with no intervention, as I have yet to be given a scan and have no diagnosis.)
AB76 wrote: "Rough stats by my estimate show that France "remade" the 1912 figure by 1940,Germany remade their 1912."I think the methodology used by the graph person differs from that used by your source(s), though the overall pattern is similar. Using the slider on the graph, the population of France, there are some undulations with the population first reaching 40.4 million in 1907, dropping slightly then again in 1929, then up to 40.7 million in 1932 before dropping slightly again... the variations are small. The graph doesn't show much of a drop in WW2, which makes me wonder!
scarletnoir wrote: "giveusaclue wrote: "🤣 Not that far off!!How is the knee by the way?."
Well, I beg to differ on that!
As for the knee - there is a little improvement every day, and I could actually lift my foot..."
🤣
Glad the knee is feeling easier. I hope the improvement continues.
Logger24 wrote: "Then it’s back to the Millers, where Nin disagrees with him over the value of intensity in literature – it is an error, she protests, to leave out dullness and boredom – life cannot be a succession of scenes out of Dostoyevsky..."It certainly seems as if Nin was true to this view of writing in her journals, from what you say!
Thanks for the interesting review. I have never read Nin, though knew of her affair with Miller and in a general way of her numerous sexual encounters... glancing at her Wikipedia entry, it seems that her analyst(s) were also bedded... not professional on their part.
I read many Millers a long time ago, and liked most of them. IIRC, it was quite difficult at times to make out who 'Mona' was in the books - his wife, or his (unnamed) mistress, who I now take to be a reference to Nin (not sure if I knew that back then). Perhaps this ambiguity was deliberate.
A cartoon about holiday books:https://www.theguardian.com/books/pic...
Our holiday home contains many of our old books, including childhood ones (we ran out of room here). It can be useful - last holiday, I ran out of new ones and so reread a Chandler.
Mod
Some of the bodies picked up after a collision between a ferry and a bateau mouche weren't drowned ...
I think they've been translated into English..."
I've now finished this — quite a tense and exciting read. A plot to kill 2 passengers on a bateau mouche resulted in the deaths of most of a party of Japanese schoolchildren when it collided with a ferry.We get taken back to events when Danish forces were on a UN peace keeping mission (which should maybe be in inverted commas) during the war in the Balkans. Previous police investigations also come up.
If anyone wants to try this series, it needs to be read in order.
Mod
https://www.theguardian.com/books/pic......"
Thanks — I somehow missed this one!
Glad to hear your knee's improving.
scarletnoir wrote: "AB76 wrote: "Rough stats by my estimate show that France "remade" the 1912 figure by 1940,Germany remade their 1912."I think the methodology used by the graph person differs from that used by you..."
i tend to use official census data wherever possible, retraction was the wrong word to use about the french population mind you (and that was my wording). what i find with things like statista is they can be unreliable. you are correct though that my officila date shows small nuances over selected periods, not a decline, and post WW2 France showed impressive growth again.
the good thing with census data and analysis is you get an introduction and explanations for changes, unlike a dry graph
as for WW2 change, in 1936, the population was 41.9 and in 1946 it was 40.5. In the decade from 1936-46, 11 of the top 16 french cities saw a decline in population linked to the war, of which Marseille, Lyon and Le Havre had the highest fall. In terms of regions Normandy and the Marseille region saw the largest % fall in population. (i would imagine that by 1946, a lot of refugees were still living outside the provinces they left)
Statista doesnt show that overall population change, maybe the 1946 stats were re-calculated later, not sure. The statista blurb says their data is estimated populations
re translations of french classicsmy zola novel is beckoning me but i have Heath and then Boll to read beforehand
my question is, was there an equivalent of Constance Garnett in french translations, as there was for the Russian classics. My Zola is a 2018 translation by Andrew Rothwell but i was thinking more of a translator of french classics in the 1880-1940 period
Logger24 wrote: "I’ve now read half the first long volume of the Journal of Anaïs Nin, and I’m going to leave it there. It was interesting to learn why this dense work drew attention and some admiration. She has a fine sensibility and good insight into emotions and character.But, at the end of the day, it is a journal, not a novel. It has no overall structure, and it promises no progression or resolution. We are in 1931-32, at the height of the Depression, and yet nothing exists outside an endless round of conversations and cafés and drinking, as Henry Miller and his wife June tear each other to pieces, and Nin acts as a super-sensitive mediator and confidante to both - after which she goes off to see her analyst to review the effect of it all on her own inner life.
Those sessions on the analyst’s couch reveal her fragile sense of self, or rather her several selves, as she feels like a broken mirror, lacking all assurance, despite her outward attractiveness and style. There are piercing recollections of her parents and the lives they lived.
Then it’s back to the Millers, where Nin disagrees with him over the value of intensity in literature – it is an error, she protests, to leave out dullness and boredom – life cannot be a succession of scenes out of Dostoyevsky.
At one point Nin wonders if Miller’s writing will suffer the same weakness as Joyce and Lawrence and Proust, and become a monstrous over-development of the self. She might have posed the same question of her own Journal.
A glance through the second half indicates a more varied cast, but it’s not enough to tempt me to read on. A glance at Wikipedia, and also a long article in The G from 2015, suggests an extraordinary talent for mendacity, which I hadn't picked up, and other matters such as adult incest and bigamy"
Did she intend these journals to be published - did she try to write them and form them into a shape that would be suitable for publication? If not, the fault would seem to lie with her editors not with her. As you say, a journal is not a novel, so we shouldn't expect it to meet the demands of a novel, whatever we think those might be.
Her comments about Miller are interesting , as I've found the two books of his that I've read (two of the "Tropics of __") start very strongly and then kind of peter out, as if he couldn't sustain that intensity he was striving for or didn't understand the need for peaks and valleys in any extended, novel-length narrative.
But I think that his writing might be one of those things that has to be appreciated in terms of the times in which he wrote and the standards of that time. Possibly it's impossible for anyone today to feel as strong an impression as someone like Graham Greene did at the time.
I've never felt much more than a mild curiosity about Anaïs Nin or her work but your mostly negative comments have had the perverse effect of raising the level of that curiosity just a shade. If I ever get around to immersing myself in the 1920s and 30s, as opposed to just sampling this and that, I might give her a try.
Mod
Did she intend these journals to be published - did she try to write them and form them into a shape that would be suitable for publication?...
I think the answer is yes, eventually, because having written a journal since childhood she published several volumes from her adult years while she was still alive and edited them herself (e.g. cutting out any reference to her then husband), which suggests that the later volumes at least must have been written with an eye to publication.
I too enjoyed reading some of Miller years ago. Tropic of Cancer was the best. I remember thinking Tropic of Capricorn was already a bit weaker. and less interesting. What mostly I remember, and liked, was the intense zest for life. I had never read anything like it.
I wouldn’t discourage anyone from trying Nin. I’m pleased to know a bit more about her.
Mod
my zola novel is beckoning me but i have Heath and then Boll to read beforehand
my question is, was there an equivalent of Constance Garnett in french translations, as there was for the Russian classics. My Zola is a 2018 translation by Andrew Rothwell but i was thinking more of a translator of french classics in the 1880-1940 period"
The early translations make for quite a story. I think you would find most of them very unsatisfactory. The following is from The Oxford Guide to Literature in English Translation (2000):
The first English versions were made in America; from the mid-1870s numerous translations (many under the pseudonym John Stirling) were published, often shortly after the originals. Their popularity and perceived inadequacy led the publisher Henry Vizetelly to launch a large-scale translation in London. Subtitling all the books ’a realistic novel’, he issued between 1884 and 1888 a total of 18 titles, 15 of them from Zola’s great Rougon-Macquart series, an epic of French life under the Second Empire. These texts, rapidly translated by unnamed authors, billed as complete, but lightly expurgated, sold extremely well. Too well, so that a National Vigilance Association, outraged by The Soil (1888), a translation of Zola’s shocking novel of peasant life, La Terre (1887), took Vizetelly to court. He gave an undertaking not to sell objectionable works, but was again prosecuted (and ruined) after he had reissued his Zola titles, incompletely bowdlerized by his son Ernest (who tells the story at length in his Emile Zola, 1904).
Ernest went on to “edit” many of the earlier translations, bowdlerizing as he went, and to translate others for the first time; his translations are if anything less adequate than their not very brilliant predecessors. His brother Edward also translated Zola, producing in 1901 a remarkably unexpurgated version of Zola’s Jack the Ripper novel, La Bête Humaine (1890), as The Monomaniac. Meanwhile, by a nice irony, the Lutetian Society had produced in 1894-5 an unexpurgated, but limited, edition of six very popular novels. The translators include such illustrious names as Ernest Dowson, Havelock Ellis, and Arthur Symons. Ellis’s Germinal and Symons’s The Drunkard (from L’Assommoir) have stayed in print, in revised versions; Symons’s in particular is a fine eloquent rendering, though its dialogue inevitably seems outdated now.
The Guide goes on to consider more modern versions. Taking L’Assommoir as an example, Leonard Tancock (who did several in Penguin Classics) is said to be lively and natural; Peter Collier over-translates; Gerard Hopkins is fluent and elegant; and Margaret Mauldon is said to be much more scrupulous but still very readable.
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