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[2024] Poll 12 Results
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Jackie, Solstitial Mod
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Sep 10, 2023 06:55AM
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I had the same question about African authors. The two I am interested in, Ben Okri and J. M. Coetzee, both live outside of Africa but their Wiki pages list 2 nationalities including the African country where they were born. I’m assuming that means they have dual citizenship. Re the Edgar Awards, I rarely read crime fiction but did find several books in the Best Critical/Biographical category that look really good and I’ve added them to my TBR. I’ve already read Killers of the Flower Moon but the author David Grann has a new book out The Wager: A Tale of Shipwreck, Mutiny and Murder which is getting a lot of positive attention. I’ll likely read it or one of the winners in the Biographical category (and save my Stephen King book for a different prompt.) Thanks Kristin for this prompt!
Pam wrote: "I had the same question about African authors. The two I am interested in, Ben Okri and J. M. Coetzee, both live outside of Africa but their Wiki pages list 2 nationalities including the African co..."Pam- may I ask which Stephen King it is?
NancyJ wrote: "Nnedi Okorafor and Lauren Wilkinson appear to be American..."Lauren Wilkinson, yes. Okorafor is trickier. She was born and raised in the US by Nigerian parents, who were not able to return to Nigeria due to the political situation there. Nnedi herself returned to Nigeria regularly to visit family there. She has dual citizenship. To me that suggests she could legitimately be considered an African author.
I count as born or currently living in a country as being from there for a prompt. I put notes on Tade Thompson and T.L. Huchu on the listopia as to the fact they now live in the UK, but I believe they lived in Nigeria and Zimbabwe as children.
LeahS wrote: "Nike wrote: I'm not at all interested in reading something that takes place in a bar and even though I wouldn't mind reading something that has to do with a ballad I don't think I will find somethi..."I don't know of the ballads ", Molly Bawn" and "Tam Lin", they are not known where I live and I believe they must be US ballads? And as I've written a few times - I use the prompts for helping me choose among my own books in my shelves. I've probably got seven hundred physical books not read (I've dedicated my life to creating my own library and I'm very happy with it) as well as many e-books and I've got tremendous difficulties in choosing what to read next. I focus almost entirely to pick books that I already own. But thank you anyway 🌷
I find the author from an African country prompt super limited so I’m stretching it to include diasporic authors and fantasy based on African mythology. I think some books that fit that criteria better capture a “sense of Africa” than books that fit the prompt more strictly (like a crime novel by a white South African author, for example).
I'm happy with the winners. I did down vote the Buffett one, as I had never heard of him, but as it is opened up to other subjects, it's fine.Well done to Kirstin. Great choice.
I’ve never heard of those ballads either. They sound English or Irish to me. A ballad doesn’t have to be old, it’s basically a song that tells a story. Many pop albums have some some ballads. If you have a book that reminds you of a particular song, or a book with a musician character, that might work. Boats and beaches are well represented on my tbr, as are musicians. If you like romance, many of them are considered beach reads.
Nike wrote: "LeahS wrote: "Nike wrote: I'm not at all interested in reading something that takes place in a bar and even though I wouldn't mind reading something that has to do with a ballad I don't think I wil..."The ballads mentioned are Irish and Scots, though I fully appreciate why you'd want to use your own book collection! Hope you can find something that suits.
dalex wrote: "I find the author from an African country prompt super limited so I’m stretching it to include diasporic authors and fantasy based on African mythology. I think some books that fit that criteria be..."There is no need to stretch it as you call it since there are a great number of African fantasy writers. It doesn't have to be set in Africa, the prompt is about the author so African fantasy is a part of the prompt 🙂
NancyJ wrote: "I’ve never heard of those ballads either. If you have a book about a musician, or a book that reminds you of a particular song, that would work. Boats and beaches are well represented on my tbr, as..."I really loath romance novels. It's a big No for me. I will maybe read a book with old Swedish Ballads from the 18:th century, however - I believe a book like that is not for reading but for playing the melodies on a guitar for example. I haven't read the Hunger Games but if I don't find anything that fits I might consider borrowing the first one with the Ballad title from the library.
LeahS wrote: "Nike wrote: "LeahS wrote: "Nike wrote: I'm not at all interested in reading something that takes place in a bar and even though I wouldn't mind reading something that has to do with a ballad I don'..."Aha, ok 🙂. Yes, Ireland are well known for their ballads.
Emily wrote: "If an author was born in an African country but then moved to the US, I feel like they would still qualify? Or do y'all think no? For example, Yaa Gyasi was born in Ghana but was ..."Personally, yes I would count any author born in an African country, and any author who moved to an African country and is currently a resident. To me, Yaa Gyasi, Abraham Verghese qualify, as do Lauren Beukes, Isak Dinesen, Chinua Achebe, Wole Soyinka, Nadine Gordimer. Kwei Quartey, Namwali Serpell, Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie, Ayọ̀bámi Adébáyọ̀, & Akwaeke Emezi. Several of these authors were born in an African country, but raised elsewhere. Some were born and raised in an African country, but later moved elsewhere.
IMO authors that are NOT from an African country include: Tade Thompson (born and raised in Britain) and Nnedi Okorafor (born and raised in the USA)
Thomas - The Stephen King book on the list is Mr. Mercedes but the book I bought recently is The Dead Zone. I’ve read a lot of his books but not that one. I really liked the movie and can never find the book so I wound up buying it.
Re 'bars' in the Jimmy Buffet' prompt, I suppose these could refer to musical bars and also to something or someone being 'barred'. The musical bars one would definitely fit with the general musical theme of the prompt.
Nadine in NY wrote: "IMO authors that are NOT from an African country include: Tade Thompson (born and raised in Britain)..."I ummed and ahhed over including Tade, but he did spend his formative years in Nigeria. Most bios just say he was born in London, but his parents moved back when he was little, so he seems like he counts as much as someone born there who left when they were a baby.
I just came up with an excellent idea for my problems concerning the Jimmy Buffett prompt! Sweden has - as well as Ireland - a vast history of ballads from the Middle Ages up til now and I just read through a list of our most well-known ballads and I will choose a book whose title is connected to one of our ballads. That must be okay, right? (A question about correct English, have I used the word "whose" correctly above? Can I use that word after an object or does it have to be a person? Thank you)
Being English, I've had to look this up in The Guide to Good English: English Usage in the 1990s!That book says that there is an argument that 'whose' applies to people and 'which' to objects. The author says that rule is 'pedantic and obscure' and it is perfectly ok to use 'whose' with objects.
And yes, I think your idea fits perfectly.
Ellie wrote: "Nadine in NY wrote: "IMO authors that are NOT from an African country include: Tade Thompson (born and raised in Britain)..."I ummed and ahhed over including Tade, but he did spend his formative ..."
He was one of the first authors I thought of for "African author" since his books are set in Nigeria, so I was disappointed when I found he's British! I did not know he lived in Nigeria as a child. You're right, living in Nigeria for 20 years means he "counts."
LeahS wrote: "and I will choose a book whose title is connected to one of our ballads. That must be okay, right?(A question about correct English, have I used the word "whose" correctly above? Can I use that word after an object or does it have to be a person? ..."
LOL good question!!!
If you asked me without an example, I'd kneejerk respond: "which applies to objects, whose applies to people." BUT your sentence makes perfect sense to me and did not at all jump out at me as awkward English. So apparently I'm perfectly comfortable using "whose" to apply to objects sometimes. I think it feels natural when using it to apply to objects that have a personality of sorts, not necessarily just anthromorphized objects, but any object that instills a lot of emotion and could be said to "own" what is within it. If that makes sense.
LeahS wrote: "Being English, I've had to look this up in The Guide to Good English: English Usage in the 1990s!That book says that there is an argument that 'whose' applies to people and 'which'..."
I actually knew this. Maybe I'm starting to get senile! Lol. (I'm in the menopause and I've read several times that memory can gets affected during this period in life but will go back to normal afterwards. I hope so.) Thank you for looking it up ❤️
Mandy wrote: "Here’s a link to a ballad book shelf listhttps://www.goodreads.com/shelf/show/..."
Aha, there was one! Personally I prefer the Swedish ballads but I didn't even think that there actually existed a listopia. Great 🙂
Nadine in NY wrote: "LeahS wrote: "and I will choose a book whose title is connected to one of our ballads. That must be okay, right?(A question about correct English, have I used the word "whose" correctly above? Can..."
Yes, it does.
By the way, I believe my English is good but maybe I'm making errors I'm not aware about and since I want to speak/write/understand it as good as possible you are all very welcome to correct me if you see that I'm making mistakes. Maybe I make a lot of mistakes while praising myself of my skills 🥴
(For example it's probably better with "of" instead of "about" after aware. The more I look at it I'm sure I've made a mistake there 🧐)
Nike wrote: "I don't like the Jimmy Buffett prompt at all. I didn't know who he was and when I watched the video someone linked to I was made aware the he's s country artist and I so dislike country music (and ..."I know I'm not going to convince those who are already against the prompt. But while Jimmy started out as a country artist, he is most definitely not that anymore (or was - sob). The songs he's known for have more of an island vibe, I guess what you'd call trop rock.
Anyway I'm obviously thrilled this got in, and happy with the other winners as well. I was against mushrooms in the beginning but was convinced by the thread and now I'm sad it didn't get in! Would love to see it submitted again.
For Jimmy Buffett created a whole Margaritaville hospitality thing. Margaritaville are pretty popular. So books with restaurant owners could work as well. He was vocal about and involved environmentalist activities so could got that route.
LeahS wrote: "Re 'bars' in the Jimmy Buffet' prompt, I suppose these could refer to musical bars and also to something or someone being 'barred'. The musical bars one would definitely fit with the general musica..."There's also the legal profession, at least in the UK, they are members of the bar association and take the bar exam. It always make me think they do their exams in a pub! But for the purpose of the prompt, a legal drama could fit.
Nike wrote: "By the way, I believe my English is good but maybe I'm making errors I'm not aware about and since I want to speak/write/understand it as good as possible you are all very welcome to correct me if you see that I'm making mistakes. Maybe I make a lot of mistakes while praising myself of my skills"Your English is very good. Your question re 'about'. I would say 'of' there, and I think that's the most correct. However, I think it sounds rather clumsy, and 'about' sounds better! It should be 'as well as possible' rather than 'as good'. I would lose 'myself of' from the last sentence, just 'praising my skills'.
As I said though, your English is good, so don't worry.
Ellie wrote: "LeahS wrote: "Re 'bars' in the Jimmy Buffet' prompt, I suppose these could refer to musical bars and also to something or someone being 'barred'. The musical bars one would definitely fit with the ..."Ellie- barristers are yes and in America all these are members of the bar
Mod
That book says that there is an argument that 'whose' applies to people and 'which'..."
Then you'd have to say "the title of which is. . " which sounds incredibly formal and awkward.
Nike, your English is excellent. I had no idea you weren't a native speaker till you mentioned it a while back. You may have noticed that some of us don't always use entirely proper grammar, like saying "good" for "well" or mixing up similar words (affect/effect, counsel/council, etc.)
Robin P wrote: "Nike, your English is excellent. I had no idea you weren't a native speaker till you mentioned it a while back. You may have noticed that some of us don't always use entirely proper grammar, like saying "good" for "well" or mixing up similar words (affect/effect, counsel/council, etc.)"I agree absolutely! I imagine most people who learned English later probably speak it a lot better than most of us native speakers!
Jennifer W wrote: "Robin P wrote: "Nike, your English is excellent. I had no idea you weren't a native speaker till you mentioned it a while back. You may have noticed that some of us don't always use entirely proper..."learned and learnt is another example
I think an author born in Africa counts as being "from" there. Just my personal view.
I really like the prompts this time! And I love the Edgar prompt!! I'm glad Jimmy Buffett's prompt got in, even though I'm actually not a fan of his. I think it'll lead to some fun options.ETA: I do like his song Coastal Confessions, which would let you read a book about religion. Though if he's to be believed in the song, he's not a model to emulate! :)
Here are some more ideas relating to the Jimmy Buffett prompt:1. He died at his home in Sag Harbor so you could read a book set on Long Island, which there are many including Colson Whitehead’s Sag Harbor, The Great Gatsby, and Montauk.
2. A lot of his songs have to do with drinking alcohol. Someone this year and in a previous year had suggested a prompt relating to addiction, which some members objected to. You could read a book with a character who is an alcoholic or lives a partying lifestyle or by an author who has/had a substance abuse problem (some are well known).
3. Caribbean island or Florida setting
4. Character who is a musician
5. Make a connection to one of his song titles. Some words include pirates, volcano, and paradise.
I’m really curious to see what members come up with since we are such a creative group!
LeahS wrote: "Nike wrote: "By the way, I believe my English is good but maybe I'm making errors I'm not aware about and since I want to speak/write/understand it as good as possible you are all very welcome to c..."Thank you so much for your input! It means a lot.
Robin P wrote: "LeahS wrote: "Being English, I've had to look this up in The Guide to Good English: English Usage in the 1990s!That book says that there is an argument that 'whose' applies to peop..."
Thank you so much. 🌻
When I was a child we started to learn English in third grade. Nowadays the kids doesn't start learning English until fourth grade. Then we may choose if we want to learn yet another language in seventh grade (German, Spanish or French). But English is something that one comes across all the time, in movies, music and online so that's so much easier to keep intact. My knowledge of French and Spanish is locked in a small cupboard somewhere in my brain and is unfortunately used very, very seldom.
This reminds me that someone suggested a prompt connected to language but it didn't make it to the poll. Maybe we can suggest that again. I don't remember that we discussed it though but I'd love such a prompt. I don't know how it ought to be formulated. Maybe it was just as simple as that - "a prompt connected to language"?
Nike - Since you are interested in African authors, here is a book that also works for the Jimmy Buffett prompt. I know nothing about the author or the book other than it was on a list of 10 essential African novels and the title Tram 83 refers to a bar. The author is Fiston Mwanza Mujila.
I found a 2017 article from Publishers Weekly that discusses 10 Essential African Novels. The choices came from five novelists, each from a different African country and with a new novel out at the time (spring 2017). If you include the 5 novelists' books, there are 15 books mentioned. I've only read the first one on the list, Disgrace by J.M. Coetzee, which I highly recommend! There are also 2 on the list, which are pretty well known, that I have on my TBR. The rest I have no familiarity with at all! I'm up for looking into them and, hopefully, finding a really good one. I'll add them to the Listopia.
Tracy wrote: "Yes, I was really surprised Jimmy Buffett got in given the number of people in Wild Discussion who had absolutely no idea who he was - as opposed to other pop culture prompts where people had heard..."Yes--I wouldn't have voted had it just been Jimmy Buffett, but adding that variety helped a lot. I don't remember how I voted, though. I just know that there is nothing that won that disappoints me.
I personally only added books by authors born in Africa not by roots. But for me it would also have to be someone who spent enough years living in Africa to be called an African by Africans. My kids all have dual citizenship, but if any of them were to become writers I would classify them as American authors.
Nike wrote: "I don't like the Jimmy Buffett prompt at all. I didn't know who he was and when I watched the video someone linked to I was made aware the he's s country artist and I so dislike country music (and ..."I abhor country music too...I would not categorize Jimmy Buffet as a "County artist" by any means. His style was laid-back, easy going with more of a Caribbean or Reggae feel than "country". Of course, my favorite was "Margaritaville".
Emily wrote: "Yea, I'm just trying to see what the group thinks. This is one of the few prompts that I don't own any books that fit, so I'm trying to figure out where to draw the line for myself."Remember that the Middle East is also part of Africa. Might look at authors born in one of those countries, like Israel or Egypt
Robin wrote: "Emily wrote: "Yea, I'm just trying to see what the group thinks. This is one of the few prompts that I don't own any books that fit, so I'm trying to figure out where to draw the line for myself."..."
Egypt is part of the African continent but Israel isn't; Israel is classed as west Asia.
Jill wrote: "Jennifer W wrote: "Robin P wrote: "Nike, your English is excellent. I had no idea you weren't a native speaker till you mentioned it a while back. You may have noticed that some of us don't always ...learned and learnt is another example"
"learned and learnt" is just an example of American vs British English.
I love the Edgar Award prompt! What an amazing pick! I'll probably pick up Notes on an Execution for that.I was nervous about the African authors prompt before I actually looked at the list. Turns out I already own some books by African authors.
I'm personally very meh about the other two. I agree that Jimmy Buffett (may he rest in peace) could be a bit too similar to the "related to the sea" prompt, but I think I'll look for a book that more encompasses his vibe.
And I read a lot of fantasy so finding an author who is known by their initials isn't much of a challenge for me, but it'll get something off my shelf for sure :)
Robin wrote: "Emily wrote: "Yea, I'm just trying to see what the group thinks. This is one of the few prompts that I don't own any books that fit, so I'm trying to figure out where to draw the line for myself."..."
the Middle East is part of the Asian continent.
North Africa and the Middle East are often grouped together because they have a lot of similarities, but they are two different continents.
Aimee wrote: "Robin wrote: "Emily wrote: "Yea, I'm just trying to see what the group thinks. This is one of the few prompts that I don't own any books that fit, so I'm trying to figure out where to draw the line..."Yes, Africa above the Sahara is Africa, too! I've been meaning to read Albert Camus's The Plague for years and he is Algerian, so that might be my pick. I've enjoyed several Egyptian authors, and Moroccan (my heart goes out to the area around Marrakesh right now, it's one of my favorite places to visit and I've met so many wonderful people there).
Nadine in NY wrote: "Jill wrote: "Jennifer W wrote: "Robin P wrote: "Nike, your English is excellent. I had no idea you weren't a native speaker till you mentioned it a while back. You may have noticed that some of us ..."Exactly. It is different but we both know what it means.
Nike wrote: "I just came up with an excellent idea for my problems concerning the Jimmy Buffett prompt! Sweden has - as well as Ireland - a vast history of ballads from the Middle Ages up til now and I just rea..."Don't worry Nike - your use of "whose" is perfect!
And re: your earlier concern about Jimmy Buffett being a "country singer" - like authors and books, a musicians "genre" can often be described in many ways. I never would have thought that he was a country singer, but I can see how someone would think that. He's from the South, and his voice, with the right lyrics, could sound country. And of course if you google it, the simple answer given IS country.
But on Wikipedia, other genres used to describe his music are: tropical rock, country rock, folk rock, calypso, easy listening, and pop.
Although I like his music, I'm more of a casual fan, so I may not know the full range of his songs. If had to choose one of the associated genres I'd probably lean toward "tropical rock". I know you found a solution using Irish or Swedish ballads, but should that not work out for some reason, maybe thinking of his music as "tropical rock" or one of the other genres will help you.
Around the Year in 52 Books
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Authors mentioned in this topic
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Nawal El Saadawi (other topics)
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