Apocalypse Codex (Laundry Files #4&3.5) & Overtime (Laundry Files #3.5)[April 8, 2023]

[Yanique, Thread Master]

This is a Buddy Read for The Apocalypse Codex and Overtime by Charles Stross starting April 8, 2023.

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

I have a feeling Choko won't be too happy with the focus of this book... Eldritch cults misusing Christianity / Prosperity Gospel...

This is definitely one of the books in the series I remember pretty vividly... except for the parts I confuse with the plot of The Delirium Brief, a much later entry in the series...

I'm around 75% through already...

By the halfway point in this book, it should be pretty clear that (view spoiler)[Bob didn't shrug off the events of the previous book as cleanly as the end of the last book implied... he dealt with the infected law enforcement officers pretty easily, like a baby Eater or Souls...

There's actually a theory I discovered, while skimming reddit after the previous book, when I was posting links to popular theories... the theory is basically that Bob died permanently in the previous book, and from here on out, he's actually the Eater of Souls in a Bob Suit, with a copy of Bob's personality layered on-top...

Charles Stross stresses all the time that Bob is a pretty unreliable narrator, and not aware of his own scariness/etc...kind of inevitable when you deal with these dangerous threats to the world all the time, and keep surviving...

It makes me think of the revelations Harry Dresden starts having in the later Dresden Files books, about how others perceive him... (hide spoiler)]

I read Overtime last month, and discussed it in the previous thread... scary interpretation of santa... that seems to be the formula for all the short stories... scary interpretation of ______________ (Santa, unicorns, etc)

[Nirkatze]

Going to be pretty late here, probably next week.

[Choko]

So, it has been 10 months since the major clusterfuck from last book... I can't wait to see what, apart from the nightmares, is different with Bob now...

Ch. 1... As always, we are thrown into the action with no idea what is going on:)))

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

I think most of Bob/Mo's happy marriage happened between books 2-3... there was a 5+ year gap in book releases, and I think there might have been a similar in-world time gap before things start heating up with these Eldritch threats... (view spoiler)[between Bob's nascent Eater of Souls abilties, and Mo's hungry/jealous violin, it's put a real crimp on their marriage... (hide spoiler)]

[Tonari no Emily]

I think I'm paying much better attention in this one compared to the last! I'm 55% in (view spoiler)[ I really like the interactions between is it Johnny and Persephone, the prologue drew me in pretty quick.

I can see what Iain was saying about the comparison of Bob to Dresden... His scariness is creeping up.

Also why parasitic brain worms?? Frickin yuck! I'm wondering why the sedated pregnant women didn't get the brain worms so they could be "followers" too? Maybe pregancy is too much stress on the body with a brain worm? And I SO feel Persephone's disgust/anger at this stupid cult. There's been a lot of cults in these books, hasn't there...

That scene where Mo is crying about not being able to have children got me :( Do they really believe its that hopeless that the world will end? Do they both agree that children are off the table, or is it more Bob?

I feel like we have a bit more translation from Bob whenever there's technical jargon which has been nice so things being said aren't just word salad to me lol (hide spoiler)]

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Tonari no Emily wrote: "I think I'm paying much better attention in this one compared to the last! I'm 55% in..."

(view spoiler)[this book is parasitic tongue-replacement worms... wait until Delirium Brief, with the (view spoiler)[parisitic dick-replacement worm(s) (hide spoiler)]... now that I've read Equoid this time around, I'm seeing some real comparisons there...

And I think it's Bob+Mo on the baby front... Earth's increasing population is causing the increased Eldritch threats, as computing power and worldwide brain power reach a threshold... really similar to the Peter Clines books, altho I think these might have come first... (hide spoiler)]

[Tonari no Emily]

I really need to read the last two books in the Threshold universe...

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

The 4th one, especially... it ties alot of elements of the first 2 books together... the 3rd book is largely standalone, taking place on the moon in the future...

[Tonari no Emily]

Maybe I'll get to it this year... Kind of want to reread the first two because I really love those :D

[Choko]

I am up to Ch. 7... Yeah, those religious cults get me all riled up! Thank goodness we have some balance with Persephone and Johnny...

Bob and Mo... (view spoiler)[ Her crying over choosing not to have kids - it got me too... Not anymore, but back in the day I used to get really depressed over not being able to have kids... It didn't help that my marriage broke down, because my husband wanted sons... Bulgarian men still attach their worth to having male offspring... My brother also doesn't have kids and all his friends from the old country constantly tell him he doesn't "know anything", since he hasn't fathered children... He resents that a lot and gets very depressed. But our world is so overpopulated, it is OK not to!

So, her violin is jealous! It is an entity??? Wow! That's all they need, seeing how their jobs are damaging their physical and mental health already... Now he is who knows what, she is a violin assassin, and they both have to deal with Eldridge creatures who are gunning for them and the world, I say children should be the farthest thing from their minds...

The little we have gotten from the priest so far creeps me the hell out! And what exactly was that "mortification" she performed on his missing dick spot? Is she some type of creature? I can't wait to see what the hell is going on there...

Johnny talking about Calvinism - I can spend days discussing the religious bases of capitalism in North America!!! The way we have installed in our culture that the migration to this continent was for religious freedom, while it was known in Europe as immigration for the practice of extreme and cult religions, all of that, gets my blood boiling.... We have allowed to build and worship a cult to "prosperity", which is one of the most inhumane philosophies we could have come up with... Just so sad... No wonder dark creatures would have a much easier time to corrupt an already corrupted system... (hide spoiler)]

[Choko]

What is Bob becoming?!??! And I feel bad for the American operatives - their Control is/are bastards!!! With allies like this, who needs enemies?!

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Choko wrote: "I am up to Ch. 7... Yeah, those religious cults get me all riled up! Thank goodness we have some balance with Persephone and Johnny...

Bob and Mo... Her crying over choosing not to have kids - it..."

Did some googling, since I'm trying to avoid spoilers for later book... but the googling seems to indicate it's just being super vague here and what I thought was from a later book might be here, too... (view spoiler)[it's either monk-like mortification of the flesh (ritualized whipping/pain, or pleasure through pain...

Or Schiller has a dick parasite, too, as the leader of the Eldritch cult... my visual on that is like the alien popping out of the guy's stomach in Alien... also, the horrible visual from Equoid, when the Eldritch unicorn used a dick-tentacle to mount the pre-teen girl in Lovecraft-era and use her as a ventriloquist meat-puppet to try and seduce Lovecraft closer...

This series has alot of fucked up mental imagery, between Equoid, which I skipped last time, and these when you think about them for more than a few seconds...

Prosperity Churches really get my goat, too... especially the harm they do... and how ridiculous it is that one of the mega-preacher in real life is named Creflo DOLLAR...

I think the next book is Mo's POV, and you learn alot more about the violin... the 2nd half of the series spends alot more time in other POVs, as Bob grows more powerful (too powerful to not just show up and solve things too fast for a whole book)... Mo gets a book, crazy ex-girlfriend Mhari gets a book... actually, from here on out, Bob is more of a side character, except for in the Brexit Book, where he's mired in bureaucracy... altho, he'll be returning in the finale, when the threats are big enough again for him... there's 2 more books left to write... I think 1 of them is going to be mostly POV'd by the Senior Auditor... from what I remember, it's envisioned as (view spoiler)[one of those prison confessions, where the main character explains what he did and why through flashbacks... I have a Tom Hanks movie in my head right now, but I can't remember the name of it... (hide spoiler)] (hide spoiler)]

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Choko wrote: "What is Bob becoming?!??! And I feel bad for the American operatives - their Control is/are bastards!!! With allies like this, who needs enemies?!"

Just wait until The Labyrinth Index :D

[Tonari no Emily]

Choko wrote: "I am up to Ch. 7... Yeah, those religious cults get me all riled up! Thank goodness we have some balance with Persephone and Johnny...

Bob and Mo... Her crying over choosing not to have kids - it..."

Love hearing your thoughts about religious cults!

[Tonari no Emily]

Timelord Iain wrote: "Choko wrote: "I am up to Ch. 7... Yeah, those religious cults get me all riled up! Thank goodness we have some balance with Persephone and Johnny...

Bob and Mo... Her crying over choosing not to h..."

Huh interesting that Bob won't be MC in future books... I didn't read your nested spoiler though.

Also I think I might skip Equoid if its not too relevant to the overall story cuz thats a bit much.

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Tonari no Emily wrote: "Timelord Iain wrote: "Choko wrote: "I am up to Ch. 7... Yeah, those religious cults get me all riled up! Thank goodness we have some balance with Persephone and Johnny...

Bob and Mo... Her crying ..."

it was... ALOT... I had a hell of a time reading the book... it was an ebook, the Lovecraft sections were verbose, and the unicorns were hard to read about...

[Choko]

I finished and absolutely loved this one! It might be my first 4.65* in the series so far ...

I loved how clueless Bob is about his own growing power, as you guys said, similar to Dresden... I loved Persephone and Johnny and I really hope we get more of them in the future.

(view spoiler)[ Bob's change of designation, now being moved with the External Agents, gives him an opportunity for much more freedom of choices when he is in the field and I hope P+J give him some much needed better training. As they said, he is still very virginal in the way he goes about eliminating the bad guys and entities...

So, the American Black Box agency wanted to revive this Sleeper and supposedly control and use it. WTF?! I was so pissed when I found that out!!! What are they thinking?! Why are people so arrogant as to think they are always at the top of the food chain?!?! I was beyond mad reading this, and it kind of made sense then, why they killed Johnny's friend and his wife, but I don't like and will never trust them again!!!!! I wish Control would get what is coming to them!!!

And we didn't get a conclusion to the Preacher and the Sleeper, which has me thinking they actually got both of them and will go ahead with that brainless idea to try to mold it in their service, and I will not be surprised if it comes and bites everyone in the ass!!! We will be fighting this creature again, I am pretty sure...

Good to hear we get a Mo+Violin book. I am a bit sad to know that Bob becomes more of a background character, but as long as he is still around, I will take it. Plus, this author has shown me he does a good job with strong female characters and I would love to get more of those! (hide spoiler)]

Overall, very satisfying read and I am so grateful to have Iain as a guide here as well!!!!!<3

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Choko wrote: "I finished and absolutely loved this one! It might be my first 4.65* in the series so far ......"

I mean... (view spoiler)[the American Black Box Agency is BLUE HADES, the one they've worked with in the past 2 books... Control are them tentacle creatures living deep under Earth's seas... they view the Sleeper as beneath them, because he kinda is similar to them...

Bob just calls them Naz'gul...

And, there's a reason I keep mentioning #8, the Delirium Brief ;) (hide spoiler)]

[Choko]

Looking forward to it:)))

[Tonari no Emily]

Finished a few days ago! Agree with Choko (view spoiler)[ about the American agency.. I have to say I'm a bit confused about all these code names though!

The way this ended was interesting... We were in the climax of the book and then it just jumps to the epilogue and we are kind of filled in on what happened... (hide spoiler)]

Looking forward to the next one!

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Stross comes up with alot of code names for Doomsday Scenarios... and they honestly don't get much page time in the series...

They're mostly clustered under CASE NIGHTMARE RAINBOW and GODGAME RAINBOW protocols...

(view spoiler)[

NIGHTMARE GREEN = stars align and elder gods awaken, people start gaining magic superpowers
NIGHTMARE YELLOW = nerd apocalypse, Skynet, AI, Singularity, etc
NIGHTMARE RED = alien invasion, multiverse invasion
GOD GAME BLACK = Sleeper Under the Pyramid infiltrates Earth (Raymond Schiller)... harbinger of worse threats...
GOD GAME INDIGO = (spoilers)

and the rest are undefined so far, and likely to never be, considering how close the series is to done, and where it's ended up... (hide spoiler)]

[Nirkatze]

Tonari no Emily wrote: "Maybe I'll get to it this year... Kind of want to reread the first two because I really love those :D"

I haven't read any Threshold... I'd be down for a from-the-start-BR. I'm pretty sure I picked it all up on a sale due to Iain & Soo's recs last year.

[Nirkatze]

And starting this today! Excited to be back in the humor.

Prologue--I appreciate the brief recap. I honestly didn't remember that the Eater of Souls was actually Bossman Atherton.... I only remembered that Atherton was not-quite-human.

And I love the opening quote: "In a hierarchy, people will always rise to the level of their incompetence." I've heard the quote before, but didn't know it was called the "Peter Principle" and it has an extra special meaning in the context of the Laundry...

[Tonari no Emily]

Nirkatze wrote: "Tonari no Emily wrote: "Maybe I'll get to it this year... Kind of want to reread the first two because I really love those :D"

I haven't read any Threshold... I'd be down for a from-the-start-BR. ..."

Lets try to do that later in the year when things die down a bit? Maybe in September/October? They go pretty fast. And I honestly can't wait to read 14 and The Fold! Those are soooo much fun :D

[Tonari no Emily]

Timelord Iain wrote: "Stross comes up with alot of code names for Doomsday Scenarios... and they honestly don't get much page time in the series...

They're mostly clustered under CASE NIGHTMARE RAINBOW and GODGAME RAIN..."

Thanks for clearing some of that up :)

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Tonari no Emily wrote: "Nirkatze wrote: "Tonari no Emily wrote: "Maybe I'll get to it this year... Kind of want to reread the first two because I really love those :D"

I haven't read any Threshold... I'd be down for a fr..."

There's nothing like your first readthrough of these books... I've read them 2-3 times now, and vividly remember that first time, still...

[Tonari no Emily]

RIght? I wish I could read them for the first time again...

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Tonari no Emily wrote: "RIght? I wish I could read them for the first time again..."

Sometimes I envy Choko's ability to forget books so completely as to be able to basically read them for the first time, every time...

[Nirkatze]

A little over halfway now, in Chapter 10--been pretty brain-dead the past few weeks, so I haven't had many commentworthy thoughts, but I'm enjoying the story. This chapter though... (view spoiler)[women turned into paralyzed baby-factories... that's my personal nightmare... being locked in my own body and used as a womb...

I really hope Persephone gets to take them down in the most painful way possible... (hide spoiler)]

[Nirkatze]

One quote made me laugh--"Lead me to your taker." LOL Laundry Files seem to do a lot of little twists like that...

[Nirkatze]

Timelord Iain wrote: "I have a feeling Choko won't be too happy with the focus of this book... Eldritch cults misusing Christianity / Prosperity Gospel...

This is definitely one of the books in the series I remember pr..."

Ooh, fun theory--and I like your note on unreliable narrator and comparison with Dresden... (view spoiler)[I was also thinking it interesting how Bob is referred to as the "apprentice to the Eater of Souls"--not just Atherton's underling or understudy, but full on Eater apprentice... (hide spoiler)]

[Nirkatze]

Tonari no Emily wrote: "Nirkatze wrote: "Tonari no Emily wrote: "Maybe I'll get to it this year... Kind of want to reread the first two because I really love those :D"

I haven't read any Threshold... I'd be down for a fr..."

Sept/Oct sounds good to me for Threshold!

[Nirkatze]

I finished yesterday and really enjoyed it. I opened everyone's spoiler tags and really enjoyed those too... but goodness even second-hand that unicorn tentacle imagery Iain shared from Equoid is--hold on, I've gotta go throw up now--

(that was mental/emotional, not literal, just in case you were worried)

Really intrigued by the hints on the future trajectory of the series, and looking forward to Mo books! and mo' books!

Really liked P&J, and was very disappointed not to get to see (view spoiler)[a painful dismembering end for preacher dude...

Also, the whole Control scene--totally agree, that made me very mad... not quite women-paralyzed-and-used-as-baby-makers-mad, but up there. This poor woman had been battling cancer, and Control just "oh, what's that noise?" turns around and shoots her with her husband's body? Someone needs a fist to the face. (hide spoiler)]

Please tell me everyone gets eaten from the inside by tiny razor-mouthed beetles?

[Choko]

I second your wish, Nirkatze!!! They all have to die!!!

[Nirkatze]

I feel so much better about my bloodthirstiness when you join me, Choko!

[Choko]

Hahaha! It's so funny, because I can be the nicest person in the world, but when something happens that I perceive as an evil injustice, I go all Vengeful Spirit and am ready to die and kill for it! Really shocks the majority of folks, since 98% of the time I am all mill and honey:)))

[Timelord Iain, Tech Support]

Choko wrote: "Hahaha! It's so funny, because I can be the nicest person in the world, but when something happens that I perceive as an evil injustice, I go all Vengeful Spirit and am ready to die and kill for it..."

milk and honey and POISON... dun Dun DUN!!!

[Choko]

Hahaha! Exactly!

[Tonari no Emily]

Timelord Iain wrote: "milk and honey and POISON... dun Dun DUN!!!"

LOL yes, perfect description

[Nirkatze]

LOL Makes Choko sound like one of those Black Widow serial killers, putting arsenic in your tea... but only when you've earned it, oh naughty characters...