World, Writing, Wealth discussion
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Want to talk about the 2024 election? Possible candidates? Platforms? Predictions?

Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
Amendment II
A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.
Amendment III
No Soldier shall, in time of peace be quartered in any house, without the consent of the Owner, nor in time of war, but in a manner to be prescribed by law.
Amendment IV
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
Amendment V
No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.
Amendment VI
In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defence.
Amendment VII
In Suits at common law, where the value in controversy shall exceed twenty dollars, the right of trial by jury shall be preserved, and no fact tried by a jury, shall be otherwise re-examined in any Court of the United States, than according to the rules of the common law.
Amendment VIII
Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.
Amendment IX
The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.
Amendment X
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

As for what Trump will do about Ukraine, I think he takes freedom seriously, and he will negotiate the best deal for Ukraine and put a stop to Putin's aggression

Regarding Trump and Ukraine, I believe Trump supports freedom and will negotiate a settlement with Putin that favors Ukraine and puts an end to this war.
Imagine, if you will, Kamala negotiating face to face with Putin :-) She'd say something about joy and reimagining and holistic. Imagine the look on Putin's face. Like the wolf looking at Red Riding Hood.

A dockworkers' union strike is shutting down the East and Gulf Coast ports. Remember when the ports shut down for the Coof?
The full impact of Helene is becoming apparent. In North Carolina and Tennessee, one of the two major roads (I 40) has been shutdown from Statesville to almost a third of the way through Tennessee. Bridges and miles of the roadbed itself were swept away in the deluge. It has been confirmed that several small towns, like Chimney Rock NC, have been erased. Local equestrians are organizing mule trains to get supplies into the area. Several of my friends and coworkers not sure that federal government assistance is a good idea. Either way the cost will be in the billions and it will be years before the area recovers, if it ever does.
And on top of all of that, no Kamala supporter has yet been able to explain to me what it was about Biden's debate performance which made him an unacceptable candidate for president but didn't disqualify him from being president.

President Joe Biden is counseling Israel to take a proportional response to this week’s barrage of Iranian ballistic missiles, voicing opposition to a potential strike on Iran’s nuclear sites in the hopes of preventing the conflict that has erupted in the region from widening further. https://www.cnn.com/2024/10/02/politi...
I disagree. This is the perfect opportunity to destroy Iran's nuclear sites. Once they can launch nuclear weapons, we're all in trouble. Does anyone think that Iran having that power will be good for the free world? I think Israel has the guts to destroy Iran's nuclear sites and maybe save the world.

We might have the guts, however I wouldn't know about the capabilities, as some argue underground sites in Fordo and Natanz might be out of reach: https://apnews.com/article/iran-nucle...
I'm not sure, we were allowed to purchase the deepest bunker busters the US has developed.


https://youtu.be/csSph593QcE?si=N4VnO...

So, damned if you do and damned if you don't. If we don't do something to stop Iran, we'll be sorry. I wonder if bombing the sites with our stongest bunker busters wouldn't at least force them to abandon the site if workers can't access what's below ground. Like pouring gasoline on a fire ant bed and lighting it. They may have to move to a new site but they will have to start over. Or am I not understanding? I'm certainly no expert.


According to J above, the deepest bunker busters are 1 megatonne. Do you really want to nuke Iran?

https://variety.com/2024/tv/news/kama...

https://abc7.com/politics/ethel-kenne...
That obituary is wild. They take the time to cite the letter for leniency she wrote for her convicted murderer nephew, but they didn't mention her son, Robert Jr..

So, damned if you do and damned if you don't. If we don't do something to stop Iran, we'll be sorry. I wonder if bombing the sites with our stongest bunker busters wouldn't at least force them to abandon the site if workers can't access what's below ground. Like pouring gasoline on a fire ant bed and lighting it. They may have to move to a new site but they will have to start over. Or am I not understanding? I'm certainly no expert.

My answer is I do not want to use nukes on Iran because the consequences are too awful. Currently nukes work to stop wars, and when there are any, both sodes stay conventional. If you start using nukes on a country that you are preventing from having their own, you open a Pandora's box.
So, I repeat - do you want to nuke Iran? The conventional bombs should be be too weak to destroy a well-designed site embedded in a cliff.
However, if you have an alternative approach, let us know and I might agree with you. I agree we don't want Iran to have nukes.

There is a bit of horrific nuance to the question. Ian, you've posted that you're a chemist. As a chemist, what is the shelf life of nitrate based explosives and propellants?
Yeah, the munitions we've been sending them are coming up on their "use by" dates. Shipping them to Ukraine is cheaper than paying for safe disposal and either way we had to pay to restock them.
The problematic support is money being sent with political strings attached. Most Americans won't grouse too much about feeding and clothing war orphans. But we have real problems with requirements for "equity" in mine clearing or trans rights on the battlefield.

Sorry, but I thought the answer was tolerably obvious. If we assume that the Iranians built their underground operational facilities by burrowing into cliffs , and assuming they did proper sonic testing and found uniform rock, preferably basalt, what could a chemical bomb do? The physics of such explosions are reasonably well-understood. The bulk of the energy first goes upwards, sending a shockwave through the air, and from wave interference, because the explosion is not a point source, considerable wave interference occurs that pulverises the locl rock. A shockwave goes downwards and most of it gets reflected the first time it meets an impedance difference when the bulk of it gets reflected. The energy going back up throws the pulverized rock upwards and you get a crater.
The bulk of the energy goes into shockwaves and rock pulverization on the surface. If the "cave" is well-designed, it will have. a. very smooth roof, preferably with multi layers, and angled to send as much of any shockwave in harmless directions. It may also be possible in certain sites to insert steel rods well above the cave, which, if properly spaced, generate wave interference effects that absorb much of the energy.
Basically, if you have a well designed "cave" with a good supply of uniform rock above you, it would require more energy than is practical for a chemical explosive, and if the surface rock is broken up, such as gravel, the shock wave will be dissipated before it hits the uniform rock through wave interference.
As a further example, I live on a hill, and there are lots of them around here, and the other day we had a 5.75 quake. The rocks experienced no fractures. OK, it was centred about 30 km away, but I assure you a 5.75 quake has energy that no chemical explosive could even dream of registering on a graph scaled to it. My point is, no chemical explosive will do anything to a well-designed cave burrowed deep inside a cliff or hill, and Iran has plenty of mountains.


The goal is to collapse the entrance and air shafts. If you do that, everyone inside will be buried alive in such a way as to prevent timely disinterment or continued use of the facility.
Back in Desert Storm, we used a few shot out old artillery barrels. We milled threading into the muzzles and breaches to mount penetrator tips and control fins, filled them with explosives, and dropped them onto Iraqi command bunkers from F-111s. They completely collapsed the uppermost floors of the target bunkers. To my knowledge, those guys are still down there.

But more importantly, the design should take advantage of a near vertical face. What you describe in Iraq involved simply dropping bombs. With well-designed entrances in a canyon you have the problem Luke Skywalker faced in episode 4. You won't be able to even use glide bombs with any accuracy, and I would assume the Iranians would also have good SAM defences. Because they have either developed someof their own or purchased from Russia or China, the US would not have the advantage given to them in Iraq from the perfidious French who took money from one side for SAM defence and then sold the means of avoiding the missiles to the other side.
It may well be possible to collapse a canyon wall, but it will be extremely difficult, and expensive in pilots' lives. If you think you can fly cruise missiles through canyons and turn them at the appropriate moment normal to the canyon wall, it may be possible But we are asking a very lot of cruise missiles.

By the way, you're assuming environment concern from people who regularly imprison and execute their citizens for such terrible crimes as homosexuality, not covering hair, and questioning the official interpretation of the Prophet's words.

I notice Wikipedia says MOAB was designed particularly for use in canyons and caves. It would be devastating for anything outside in a canyon, other than a road but for a cave system, assuming the presence of blast doors, I can't see it would make. alot of difference.
2. I am sorry, but I don't understand the comment on environmental concern. I thought I was limiting myself to the military situation.

Ian, the reason I didn't answer your question about the use of nuclear weapons is a good one - you put words in my mouth. I never mentioned using nuclear weapons.

Scout, you said the strongest bunker buster, and as J pointed out, that is 1 Megatonne. So I assumed that if you were going to use the strongest bunker-buster, that would be nuclear. If you didn't realize that, then we were on different pages and you did not evade.
I don't think the MOAB is practical, based on delivery problems, but it could be possible to give Iran headaches by consistently causing slips onto road access

We've been wanting Kamala to give a full accounting of her policy positions and plans to carry them out. This is what we got.
https://youtu.be/Hk4ueY9wVtA?si=HTUmF...
Biggun's mama raised him to have Mountain Dew with breakfast.
I'm man enough to tell a politician, who happens to be a woman, to quit the crap and start answering the questions asked.

REF: https://nypost.com/2024/10/13/us-news...
As per my prediction at https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...

The only good thing from my point of view is I can't vote so I spare myself any internal agony.

Kamala Harris 'Smart on Crime' Plagiarism Claims: Everything We Know
https://www.newsweek.com/kamala-harri...

Kamala Harris 'Smart on Crime' Plagiarism Claims: Everything We Know
https://www.newsweek.com/kamala-harri..."
In my opinion, it depends on the length of the alleged plagiarism, and on what. I see no harm in using the same words for a short statement, for example "Mr X said the sun rises in the East". Whyb try to find new words? But if it is a sequence of sentences that is really bad.


Snopes fact checked it.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/kam...
I find it hilarious that they can't confirm that it's plagiarism because Kamala claims it was a story about herself which was told to her by her now deceased mother. And Plato got the story of Atlantis through Solon who was told the story by Egyptian priests...

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/geor...
One side claims the other is sowing chaos. The other side claims their rivals are opposed to a step which could prevent cheating. Both positions can be true.

https://www.speaker.gov/#:~:text=Home...
It bothers me that we only have his side of the unedited interview. That invites claims that he fabricated the footage after the fact.

https://youtu.be/WZCXD7VGTQk?si=Mhpxk...
"When did you first notice mental decline in Joe Biden?"
"Donald Trump! Donald Trump! Donald Trump!"

North Carolina governor candidate Mark Robinson sues CNN over report about posts on porn site
https://apnews.com/article/north-caro...

It could be worse. I could be registered to vote in New Jersey.



It could be worse. I could be registered to vote in New Jersey."
The best way to go to jail in New Jersey is to be elected to office.
Books mentioned in this topic
The Anti-Federalist Papers and the Constitutional Convention Debates (other topics)The Federalist Papers (other topics)
The Anti-Federalist Papers and the Constitutional Convention Debates (other topics)
Hillbilly Elegy: A Memoir of a Family and Culture in Crisis (other topics)
Fear and Loathing: On the Campaign Trail '72 (other topics)
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Authors mentioned in this topic
J.D. Vance (other topics)Tulsi Gabbard (other topics)
Smedley D. Butler (other topics)
Robert Iger (other topics)
Larry Elder (other topics)
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https://youtu.be/P1TUVGq2RAY?si=8vYg_..."
Same everywhere.