World, Writing, Wealth discussion
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Want to talk about the 2024 election? Possible candidates? Platforms? Predictions?
When times are good, one can argue the more esoteric arguments. However, when times are tough, it is all about safety and the pocketbook.
It's not just the US. Our next election will be decided mainly on the economy. Voters that are having trouble making ends meet tend to be grumpy.
Look at this video of Biden on the campaign trail in 2020 and tell me he's not responsible for breaking our oil industry and causing high gas prices that have driven up prices on everything, driving inflation, while making us dependent on foreign oil and making us weak internationally. It's not Putin, stupid, it's the Democrats.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Slszv...
Scout wrote: "Do you want the FBI to come into your home on the say of a magistrate judge who is the puppet of your future political opponent? Is it okay to have your home invaded by the FBI on the say of someon..."And how is this any different from the way Hilary was treated? An allegation of taking documents in some form or another when they weren't supposed to do so. It was ok to invade her privacy but not Trump's? And everyone, from the FBI to the judicial system, is corrupted by Democrats being in office or in control of a portion of our Congress?
I wonder, if maybe we should never have changed from the original version of an election where 1st place was the President and 2nd place was the VP, because the whole party division thing is big money playing games with our general population suffering the outcomes, as we are all just votes by pawns.
Can't agree, Lizzie. You might recall the one time this applied. John Adams had Thomas Jefferson inflicted on him, and all Jefferson was interested in doing was undermining Adams and getting ready for the next election which he intended to win. And Adams couldn't fire the VP, despite the fact that Jefferson had no intention of Adams benefitting from anything.
Lizzie, Hillary never cleared the use of a private email server with the State Department while she was Secretary of State. When asked for her emails, she destroyed 31,000 of them before handing over the rest. She said they were "private," but there's no proof of that, and no one will ever know what was in those emails. Using a personal server instead of a secure government server gave her the opportunity to do that. Slick.
Lizzie wrote: "Scout wrote: "Do you want the FBI to come into your home on the say of a magistrate judge who is the puppet of your future political opponent? Is it okay to have your home invaded by the FBI on the..."Lizzie,
Let me ask you these questions, do you think Hillary is honest? When you first heard about the server, were you surprised she did that? Do you really think she did not destroy important information on purpose to protect herself?
I am not trying to give you a hard time, but do you remember how everyone yawned and nobody seemed surprised? That was because this is the game she has played for 30 years.
I am not defending Trump, if he did anything wrong, then he pays the freight.
About your comment about a corrupt FBI, there is a major problem with zealots in the FBI out to get Trump and there are plenty of emails to prove it. Even Mueller had to remove a few once it came out. That helped doom his inquiry. The Justice Department and the FBI have to be above it to protect their image and promote fairness. It also is not helping that there are emails coming from Musk showing the back channels with Justice and the others.
What I have noticed in the last few years is that the Democrats are breaking the mores of the office to push their agenda. Pushing their agenda is not a problem, but breaking the rules is a massive problem. The Republicans have taken those broken mores and shove it down the Democrats throats up to their elbow. The Democrats scream how the Republicans are killing Democracy without admitting they were the ones to start the whole damn thing.
My prediction, the Republicans will treat the Democrats about the same way on the Biden investigation as the Democrats did the Republicans on January 6. Basically, a one sided affair to promote an a preferred answer by tilting the investigation to the answer the wanted to start with with no concern with the truth. None. I fully expect the Democrats to have their nominees rejected in favor for Democrats with their own agenda to promote their fortunes. You know what, the Republicans will go out of their way to damage Joe until he is toxic and the Democrats deserve exactly that outcome. They created it.
Respect for independent and logical thinking, Papa. That's a hell of a post.
I like the Taliban 20 label. It seems that winning a majority is something of a poisoned chalice
They are asking for concessions in the House rules; little things like having enough time to read mult-thousand page bills before they are put up for a vote.
I don't see this as a failure of the Republicans if those opposed to McCarthy really want to change things for the better. I don't know enough about what he's done to have a valid opinion about whether he's a good choice for speaker.
Notwithstanding that, it doesn't look good to the rest of the world that a party that has just taken control of the house can't seem to even manage the elementary step of getting started. Apparently they need a speaker before anything else can be done.
I'm sure that the world will get over it. If not, we could start delving into the wonderful moments which various parliaments have given us.
Papaphilly wrote: "Lizzie wrote: "Scout wrote: "Do you want the FBI to come into your home on the say of a magistrate judge who is the puppet of your future political opponent? Is it okay to have your home invaded by..."I didn't like Hilary. I didn't like Trump. They both deserve what they get. What they both did is create such a divide between the everyday citizens that we can't have real conversations as everyone holds to their own biases. My point was simply, regardless of who is in office, this seems to be the norm for the past decade plus. The root problem of this - parties. We need more candidates like McCain and less Trumps.
The Trump effect spreads. Brazil has had right-wing rioters trying to promote Bolsinaro by rioting against Lula. I am unsure that parties are the problem - it is that leaders seem to have gone to more extremes and ordinary civilized behaviour seems to have been abandoned.
The parties rock the boat in tune with populations' sentiment. The higher echelons and party leaders are mostly comprised of elites who wouldn't storm Capitol or ravage a city in BLM march, nor they have any reason to, as they are well off as they are. However, they encourage or at least make do with extremist behavior of many/some of their supporters. The general feeling is that the "system is profoundly rigged" and that any morality is not required anymore neither from people nor from their leaders, enhanced rightly and wrongly by different media, which all results in frustration, violence, aberrant behavior, mistrust and enmity between different members of society and towards once respected institutions, still semi-encouraged from above lest lose in popularity. Still "normal" people feel the need to adopt and change to cope with those violent, which again enhances violence. A vicious circle.
Pride and a community feeling based on common values is eroded/gone.
Many politicians that wouldn't pass any bar even 20-30 years ago, get a free pass today
The basic advantage of the representative republic is it gives a route to get rid of politicians so you are not stuck permanently with a bad leader. The basic disadvantage of the representative republic is that politicians do not want to be got rid of, and they have power. Early on in the life of said republic, politicians think that doing a good job is the key to staying, but as things develop they learn that there are a number of sneaky things that give them an advantage. Once upon a time they had to present themselves to the public but now they can do it all through prepared media or mass rallies. They use their power more to get re-elected than to do good for the community. And what they do for the community tends to involve base motives. Give them a tax reduction and don't worry about the declining service.
Ian wrote: "Notwithstanding that, it doesn't look good to the rest of the world that a party that has just taken control of the house can't seem to even manage the elementary step of getting started...."Oh I do not know about that one. It seems to me this is Democracy in action and the country did just fine. It will remain to be seen if the Republican controlled House holds together. I am not nearly as worried about this as others.
Uncle Joe's is busy rigging the coming primaries in order to hand on to the White House.https://youtube.com/watch?v=tArbNK477...
J. wrote: "Uncle Joe's is busy rigging the coming primaries in order to hand on to the White House.https://youtube.com/watch?v=tArbNK477..."
This is not rigging the election. The Democrats have the right to change their voting schedule. This has been talked about by both parties. I do think it may cause problems witin at first, but that remains to be seen.
During the 2020 primaries, people were placing odds on Uncle Joe bowing out. Then they hit South Carolina and Biden was suddenly the front runner. Now, he wants to make SC the first state.🤔
J. wrote: "During the 2020 primaries, people were placing odds on Uncle Joe bowing out. Then they hit South Carolina and Biden was suddenly the front runner. Now, he wants to make SC the first state.🤔"As I said before, it is their right and this is not the first time this has been discussed. Iowa and New Hampshire have been thorns in the sides to deal with as small states with outsized influence.
I agree, Nik and Ian.Should Joe run again? Why or why not? If not, who should be the Democratic Party candidate?
I think someone other than Joe, but since I am not an American, that opinion is not really relevant.
Scout wrote: "I agree, Nik and Ian.Should Joe run again? Why or why not? If not, who should be the Democratic Party candidate?"
I don't think he should. With all due respect to elderly, you don't really want (I hope :)) a geriatric department, as your leadership. If he runs against Trump, he can just do it again, however against a younger reasonable prospect from reps he'd really struggle. I don't know prominent dem figures. Progressives seem to set the tone, but they stand no chance (I hope) on a national level. Others - they sure must have some normal dudes and gals
Ian wrote: "I think someone other than Joe, but since I am not an American, that opinion is not really relevant."Your opinion is as relevant as all the others.
I don't know of any "normal" Dems presently, meaning moderates. Hopefully, it won't be Buttigieg, current Secretary of Transportation who's been in charge while air transport has failed so many and who currently doesn't seem concerned about the train derailment that's displaced many citizens. And hopefully not California governor Gavin Newsom, who dined maskless while shutting down the state. People are fleeing the state in droves to live in free states like Florida and Texas. Do we want a president who's made a mess in his own state?
I should say that I liked Nikki's act when she was US representative in the UN. She strikes as a good candidate.I hear from a friend who lives there that it's not very comfy to be white in a California. Many thought racial equality should do, but once it was achieved, stage 2 for some is revenge
I don't think Nikki Haley will get much traction. I think a candidate like Kristi Noem would fare better. The only Nikki Haley stories I am hearing in the wake of her announcement are discussions about the Don Lemon comments. Her announcement, her positions, her ability to set herself apart from other potential candidates, that's all getting lost.The other problem is that right now the big stories in the US - at least the Eastern US are not about political candidate, they are about balloons, and the horrific train derailment
Tulsi Gabbard spoke at CPAC, again.https://youtube.com/watch?v=ImWpbmGMf...
For my tastes, she is playing to close to the evangelicals, and her timing and delivery have a bit to go before she can really own a room. But she is definitely building towards something with the American right.
I am not a fan of Gabbard, and like I said, I don't think Haley will go far. But last night, I saw an interview with Vivek Ramaswamy and he was pretty impressive. Someone who heard his announcement for a '24 presidential run said he's really running for Vice President.
I originally thought Gabbard was quite impressive, but of course Gabbard now appears to be somewhat different from Gabbard then. I don't think the changes are going to do her a lot of favours.
Folks I'm learning a lot from you and I appreciate it! I hope it's OK if I say this: I'm a centrist. Not a Democrat Centrist. I wanna say it's something like Centrist.org. The site that keeps me informed. I am a US citizen. If this post isn't okay please take it down and I'll redo it!I gotta get more real information on these candidates. I'm rather ignorant about who the candidates are. Does anyone have a link so I can see who's running? or where to start?
Many thanks.
Your post is perfectly fine, as any political affiliation or an apolitical approach. Except for the obvious two decided or undecided , the rest are only now starting to turn up . I’m sure most will get their share of light
Thank you! Learning so very much!!!
☆Samantha☆ wrote: "Folks I'm learning a lot from you and I appreciate it! I hope it's OK if I say this: I'm a centrist. Not a Democrat Centrist. I wanna say it's something like Centrist.org. The site that keeps me in..."It's still early in the cycle. By this autumn, we should have a good idea who will be throwing themselves into the meat grinder.
On the Dem side, Uncle Joe is the presumptive candidate. However, one registered Democrat has declared her candidacy, Marianne Williamson.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=GV1fMrWfr...
This link leads to her campaign's website:
https://marianne2024.com/
The Republican side is full of folks jockeying for position, and deciding if they want to duke it out with Trump in the primaries. I about laughed myself silly when Jeb Bush endorsed Desantis as a candidate because Jebby was early roadkill under the wheels of the Trump bus in 2016. It's like being called a great driver by Archduke Ferdinand's chauffeur.
We won't know who's on deck for the Libertarians, Green Party, etc. Until next year.
On a related note, I'm starting to look for book titles for my 2024 Election Insanity Reading List. Any suggestions from the group?
Samantha, you don't have to be worried here about your post being "taken down" because of your political stance. Luckily, this is not like Twitter.
Does anyone think Trump can win the election for president if nominated by the party? I don't, but maybe some of you do?
J. wrote: "On a related note, I'm starting to look for book titles for my 2024 Election Insanity Reading List. Any suggestions from the group?"Do you want primers or in depth? Newer or anything?
Scout wrote: "Does anyone think Trump can win the election for president if nominated by the party? I don't, but maybe some of you do?"I worry about Trump from this point. He reminds me of the Clinton's in this manner. He has a fairly substantial following. Not enough to win the general election, but enough to cause the Republicans to lose. I cannot see him going into the night quietly.
☆Samantha☆ wrote: "Folks I'm learning a lot from you and I appreciate it! I hope it's OK if I say this: I'm a centrist. Not a Democrat Centrist. I wanna say it's something like Centrist.org. The site that keeps me in..."Your opinion is as valid as all the rest. All that is asked is that you show all opinions the same respect you expect for your own.
Papaphilly wrote: "Scout wrote: "Does anyone think Trump can win the election for president if nominated by the party? I don't, but maybe some of you do?"I worry about Trump from this point. He reminds me of the Cl..."
Papaphilly, could you explain something to me? I assume the republicans will select the candidate from primaries, and assume Trump is not the candidate. Are you assuming that Trump would either directly or indirectly sabotage the actual candidate?
Scout wrote: "Does anyone think Trump can win the election for president if nominated by the party? I don't, but maybe some of you do?"Doubt it, but what do I know
Papaphilly wrote: "J. wrote: "On a related note, I'm starting to look for book titles for my 2024 Election Insanity Reading List. Any suggestions from the group?"Do you want primers or in depth? Newer or anything?"
The general interest is American politics be it history, theory, philosophy, opinion, or comedy. So far I've procured copies of Red-Handed: How American Elites Get Rich Helping China Win and Democracy in America. I'm looking for hardbound copies of The Federalist Papers and The Anti-Federalist Papers. I'm also considering Thirteen Days: A Memoir of the Cuban Missile Crisis as a nod to our current dance with Thanatos.
In asking for recommendations, I'm seeking books that aren't on my RADAR in the hope of expanding my understanding and hopefully preserving my psyche. Because Shattered: Inside Hillary Clinton's Doomed Campaign was recommended last time, I learned who Robby Mook is. And reading The Righteous Mind: Why Good People Are Divided by Politics and Religion has me evaluating politics in new ways.
There are two authors whom I am discounting. Tucker Carlson can't be bothered to make proper citations, so I can't be bothered to read his "work". Joe Biden is a known plagiarist whose book about a heartfelt family tragedy made me despise him as a self-aggrandizing swamp creature.
Scout wrote: "Does anyone think Trump can win the election for president if nominated by the party? I don't, but maybe some of you do?"I honestly don't know. The MSM have so rent credulity that the opposing narratives are divorced from reality.
The most likely sequence of events leads to an Uncle Joe v. Orange Man rematch. So, stock up on popcorn and whiskey because this is going to be a s*** show.
World, Writing, Wealth
Books mentioned in this topic
The Anti-Federalist Papers and the Constitutional Convention Debates (other topics)The Federalist Papers (other topics)
The Anti-Federalist Papers and the Constitutional Convention Debates (other topics)
Hillbilly Elegy: A Memoir of a Family and Culture in Crisis (other topics)
Fear and Loathing: On the Campaign Trail '72 (other topics)
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Authors mentioned in this topic
J.D. Vance (other topics)Tulsi Gabbard (other topics)
Smedley D. Butler (other topics)
Robert Iger (other topics)
Larry Elder (other topics)
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Wouldn't expect anything, but. Thanks. The war is a real issue, and economics are too, both too big to be treated just as distraction from one another, in my humble opinion, of course... As corona buried Trump at the money time, I guess economics would hurt dems in the nearest round.