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Little Dorrit
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Buddy Read of Little Dorrit mid-Sept onwards with Janelle, Bridget, Lori and others
This chapter had me laughing aloud with Mrs. Plornish “speaking Italian”. HilariousI’m sure the railway failures were in Dickens mind as he was writing. Good thought Fiona! It occurs to me that investment fever is not an epidemic of the past, but a current fever as well.
Thanks Jean and Lori. I’m struggling to keep up with both threads but will definitely read about this. Sorry if I’m being annoying :/
Not at all, Fiona! I am impressed that you and Bridget and Daniela are able to read both. I tried but gave up probably way too quickly.
Mod
A quick scroll to pick out the good info and discussion there might still be worth it now and then Lori (or anyone). That way you'll pick up the railways info, and about John Sadleir for instance. I'm not surprised you're finding it tricky though ... I hadn't realised you'd be writing summaries every day!
Every time I come on this thread I want to say what a fantastic book this is :D
As I read this chapter I was reminded of the Ponzi schemes which I believe began early in the 20th century. Only the original or early investor(s) survive intact in a Ponzi scheme. Since no one is paying the Plornishes for their food and whatnots, will that family end up in Marshalsea. And we know that Mr. Dorrit was going to approach Merdle about investing his money. I’m hoping that Arthur remains skeptical of the idea given how down he was and he appeared concerned about Pancks.
Now I am also wondering if there is any connection between Mrs. Clennam/ Blandois/Flintwinch and what may be happening with Mr. Merdle. Is something criminal going on with Merdle or a potential financial bust?
Sue, I love your thoughts. This Merdle Mania does have the Ponzi scheme feel. Pancks is so certain that Merdle is 100% reliable. I hope he is right but I'm concerned. What kind of connection with Mrs. Clennam/Blandois/Flintwinch and Merdle are you thinking? They are all on our list of nefarious characters so anything is possible!
I don’t know. It just seems so spspicious to have Mv Merdle with unexplained money and Mrs. Clennam Et al so
Whoops, sorry…I clicked in the middle o my response. I guess, it all seems too coincidental. These people do have money, or ways to access money. . Merdle has ties to people we know are unscrupulous ((all the Barnacle clan), while we know that Blandois has killed before and Flintwinch already beats his wife and appears capable of so much more.
Edmund Sparkler's new position is talked about in very mocking ways but Mrs. Merdle is spreading the good news and making a very big deal of it. Thus the Bosom; accomplished in the art of seeming to make things of small account, and really enhancing them in the process.
Henry Gowan, on the other hand, is rather sarcastic and denigrating in his manner of congratulating Sparkler. I would have expected this type of reaction from him having been turned down and tossed aside by his relative Lord Decimus. So naturally he would be resentful that it was not he who had gotten the position.
Everyone knows that Sparkler admires Fanny and she hasn't let up on her meddling with him and torturing his emotions. She knows he is ridiculous and simple but she also thinks this is the type of man she would best match with.
She enlists the help of Amy who she asks for her advice. Fanny does all of the talking discussing all of the problems of their family and their new situation and gets rather hateful and nasty to Amy at one point but quickly gets herself together and apologizes. She feels as if she must be the one in the family to carry them through. Fanny's goal in a match with Sparkler is that she can outshine and put Mrs. Merdle down by being younger and better.
Finally, Fanny announces to Amy that she and Edmund Sparkler are engaged. And Fanny has chosen her way in life.
It was the last time Fanny ever showed that there was any hidden, suppressed, or conquered feeling in her on the matter. From that hour the way she had chosen lay before her, and she trod it with her own imperious self-willed step.
What a life Fanny has chosen- a life of vengeance against Mrs. Merdle. How exhausting that will be! Fanny is so self-centered and she is not fooling anyone with this match.
I liked how Fanny and Amy have grown into a close relationship. Fanny is at least being open and truthful with Amy. It seems like it’s a comfort to Amy to have Fanny to look after and care about.
Is Fanny entirely self-centred though, Lori? She says to Amy, It then becomes a question with me…….whether I shall make up my mind to take it upon myself to carry the family through. She knows her father and Edward don’t really convey the image they’re trying to project and Amy certainly doesn’t. Although probably in her own interest as well, I wonder if she feels she has to marry Edmund to elevate her family’s standing in society? Is there at least an element of that or am I being totally misled?
Mod
Fiona, I see what you're saying but I still view Fanny as being self-centered in her decision. The quotation you shared reads as self-centered to me and maybe I'm not reading it correctly. Maybe it's just that she is domineering and wants to be in control. She is very smart even though she has a hateful streak which she demonstrated toward Amy in this chapter. Even at the end she wouldn't let Edmund say any kind words about Amy or his mother.
Do you think she is marrying him because she wants to? I'm not certain she is. I think she is putting herself and the family in a bad situation by marrying Edmund and her reasoning is to exact revenge against Edmund's mother for slighting her when she was a dancer.
Fanny is a very complex character and maybe she will grow to love Edmund. I was thinking Henry would be a good match for her, but he might be too much like her for it to work. He and Minnie have a similar relationship in which he is domineering but much meaner than Fanny.
Lori - I don’t think Fanny would do anything she didn’t want to! I think she sees this as her way out of having Mrs General for a stepmother and of elevating her family simultaneously. Edmund’s new position is probably the deciding factor. You’re right that she wants to be in control and Edmund is putty in her hands, poor sap! As for Henry and Fanny being together, I think they would kill one another before long!I do think you’re right in saying Fanny is self-centred so perhaps this decision is more about self preservation than anything else.
Jean - thank you so much for the link. Excellent!
Yes, one of the factors that Fanny mentioned was leading vs following and that she wanted to be a leader in any marriage. If I remember correctly, Amy had wondered aloud to Fanny if she could find some other man, who wasn’t Sparkler and whom she could love and lead. It may have been after that part of the conversation that Fanny began talking about how she could afflict Mrs. Merdle with all those side hand insults. I have to say, Fanny is definitely smart. She has come up with some good ways to attack her future mother-in -law without openly insulting her.
Mod
I think I see Fanny much like you do, Fiona. She doesn’t want a husband where she’ll have to be meek and quiet. With Sparkler she will definitely be the boss, muck like Mrs Merdle is in her marriage, probably why Mrs Merdle dislikes her so much, but even she was coming round to complimenting Fanny.Fanny has chosen her husband and the life she wants to lead, perhaps for selfish reasons, but most women didn’t get choices in those days.
Jean I will continue for 3 more days. Bridget and I worked this out. I will post the link in the morning and will try to get a short summary before church. If I don’t have time I’ll at least have the link for anyone who is ready for discussion before tomorrow afternoon US.
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Bionic Jean, "Dickens Duchess"
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You'll have spotted that installment 15 actually has 4 chapters, and ends with chapter 18 of Book 2. (So you're switching mid-installment ... maybe this will make for an even smoother transition, who knows!) That pattern of 4 chapters continues through to the penultimate installment which is 3 chapters, and then a whopping 5 chapters to finish off.
Charles Dickens nearly always has a cliffhanger at the end of his installments, and then a "double issue" at the end of the serial - perhaps before the reading public got too demanding in wanting to know what happens to their favourite characters!
I forgot that we gained an hour last night so I have had time to write the summary. Fanny and Edmund (when she allows him to present himself or to talk) announce to Mr. Dorrit that they are to be married. Wanting to ensure that everything is done properly, Mr. Dorrit wishes to ask Mr. Merdle's consent before making it official in Society. He speaks at length to Sparkler and to Mrs. Merdle and wants to make sure that Fanny will be treated well. The Bosom is "charmed" but cannot speak for her husband. This match makes Mr. Dorrit extremely proud as to the connections his family will not be privy to.
Mr. Dorrit and Mr. Merdle correspond via letters but Mrs. Merdle made sure that her husband received one from her first.
Mrs Merdle concurred with all her heart—or with all her art, which was exactly the same thing—and herself despatched a preparatory letter by the next post to the eighth wonder of the world.
When Mr. Dorrit wants to inform Mrs. General of the impending marriage, he and Fanny have a little tiff and Fanny lets it be known that she is very tired of Mrs. General. She acquiesces to her father's wishes but not without putting Mrs. General down.
Now that it is time for Sparkler to return to England to begin his new position with the Circumlocution Office, Fanny begins to plan when the wedding should take place. She feigns advice from Amy as to whether she should marry now in Rome or wait until spring when everyone will be returned to London. Fanny exclaims that (or makes up an excuse so that she doesn't have to wait) she doesn't trust Edmund and maybe she should be going with him to London. Thus, the marriage should happen now.
Fanny and Edmund marry in Rome and go to Florence with Mr. Dorrit joining them and Amy wanting to be included is left to remain with Mrs. General. Fanny has given her instructions on how to react if Mrs. General tries to worm her way into becoming her new mama. She must stand against this from happening.
Wedding preparations begin and on the day of the wedding, we hear that
a handsome chariot … after rolling for a few minutes smoothly over a fair pavement, had begun to jolt through a Slough of Despond, and through a long, long avenue of wrack and ruin. Other nuptial carriages are said to have gone the same road, before and since.
Amy is sad and misses so much her old life and equates the ruins of Rome with images of her past. Before joining Fanny in Florence, Amy and her father talk about his desire for her to be married as this marriage has made him so very proud.
I loved Dickens using a bit from The Pilgrim's Progress. The last quotation in the summary describes the wedding chariot going smoothly but then jolts through the Slough of Despond. This does not sound good for Fanny's marriage. Jean mentioned in the original thread that this was Dicken's own voice rather than the narrator's because he was having marriage problems of his own. We all want happiness for Amy but each chapter seems to lead her down a path of despair. Now that her father wants to find a suitable match, she only wants to care for him.
He has a particularly bleak view of marriage in this book, doesn’t he?!!How poor Amy can be left behind and her father and sister seem to think it’s appropriate amazes me.
As Fanny, Sparkler and Mr Dorrit are going to be living in the Merdle house I look forward to the return of the parrot :)
Oh the parrot! Yes! There are so many open-ended storylines that we still know nothing about. I'm still wondering about the box and the Flintwinch double, what Miss Wade is up to with Tattycoram, will Arthur ever find happiness, what is his mother's connection to Blandois, what is left in Cavalletto's story, will Pancks return and make any more valuable discoveries, and what will come of the investments with Merdle? I'm sure I've missed something.
I’m still hoping that Arthur will detect the love oozing out of Amy’s letters and come to rescue her. What craziness will happen in the Merdle household! All of those people in one place should be grounds for all kinds of strange activities, especially if Edward returns and takes Sparkler out gambling. I imagine Fanny will prevent that from happening though.
Mrs. Merdle and Mrs. General in the same room, interesting conversations about nothing at all.
And Lori, I’m wondering about all of those things too.
Lori - like Sue, I look at how much we have still to read and wonder how Dickens is going to tie everything up in that time. He will, of course, but it must all happen very quickly!My favourite quote is at the end when he describes Mrs General as a Ghoule in gloves. It will surprise me if Mr Dorrit marries her as not only is she a misery but is she really of a high enough social status? Both his situation and Fanny’s encapsulate the old saying, Marry in haste, repent at leisure!
I’m sorry for the delay today. I’ve had an appointment for my car that is taking forever. If you’d like to start discussion I can edit this message with the link when I get home for Chapter 16.
I’m happy to wait for you, Lori. These things happen. It’s life!
Mr. & Mrs. Sparkler arrive in London with Mr. Merdle awaiting them in his home while Mr. Dorrit is staying in a hotel. Mr. Merdle decides to visit him there and there is a great following of the coach by onlookers and the hotel workers are in awe:Merdle! O ye sun, moon, and stars, the great man!
Mr. Dorrit actually trembles to find out Mr. Merdle has come to visit. Mr. Dorrit notes that Mr. Merdle does not look well and asks him if he is well.
There were black traces on his lips where they met, as if a little train of gunpowder had been fired there; and he looked like a man, if his natural temperament had been quicker, would have been very feverish that morning. This, and his heavy way of passing his hand over his forehead, had prompted Mr. Dorrit's solicitous inquiries.
Finally the matter that Mr. Dorrit wished to present to Mr. Merdle, how to manage his money, comes up and Mr. Merdle is happy to be of assistance.
Mr. Dorrit is then presented with the use of Merdle's carriage and this enables Dorrit's ego and vision of his status in the eyes of onlookers to increase. He is completely wrapped up in this new acquisition of being Merdle's friend and how Fanny has helped to make this occur with the marriage.
Everybody, wanted to make or improve Mr Dorrit’s acquaintance … the name of Dorrit was always a passport to the great presence of Merdle. So the dream increased in rapture every hour, as Mr Dorrit felt increasingly sensible that this connection had brought him forward indeed.
However, Mr. Dorrit is still consumed with worry over whether the Chief Butler at Merdle's home knows all about his past.
So, wondering if Merdle is actually well or not? Fanny has taken to her new lifestyle quite naturally.
It’s interesting that Mr Dorrit just can’t shake off his feelings of inferiority, or is it that he feels like a charlatan? His ego is definitely boosted by his new relationship with Mr Merdle but it doesn’t seem to sit comfortably with him. Fanny, on the other hand, has taken to the Merdle family like a duck to water! Poor Sparkler is irrelevant. [I know it’s childish but the name, Fanny Sparkler, makes me chuckle!]
Great quotes there, Lori, particularly Merdle, the great man one. He seems such an unconfident man, but he’s obviously good at getting money from people. But he does seem to have some guilt about it, perhaps that’s making him unwell? I read this chapter almost like I was watching a pantomime, wanting to yell at Mr Dorrit , “don’t give your money to Merdle!”. So many bad vibes, the crash must be soon.
Fiona, I like your thoughts about Dorrit possibly feeling like a charlatan. Psychologically he may be feeling like he's deceiving others when he gets paranoid. And Janelle, I like the idea that Merdle's lack of confidence may be tied to some guilt. He is also not very confident when he's in the same room with his Chief Butler.
Both of your comments lead me to think that both of these men have something in common, more so than being rich gentlemen. Each of them have something they are trying to hide. We know what Dorrit is trying to hide and we have a good idea that Merdle may know something bad is coming (at least his mannerisms lead me to think this way).
Great comments!
They’re both intimidated by the butler. I don’t think the butler is doing it deliberately, it’s just Merdle and Dorrit are trying to hide something, so they’re paranoid.
Good thoughts about Merdle being like Dorrit in being worried. At first I thought maybe he was ill and his sickness or death could bring down his bank since everyone believes in him personally. Now I wonder if perhaps he sees the end coming to his financial success. I noticed that his words to Dorrit regarding Dorrit’s potential investment weren’t particularly enthusiastic. He accepted the idea but didn’t offer to help him with the process.
I think Merdle was being clever there, Sue. I’m sure he really needs Dorrit’s money, he’s posing like he doesn’t care to kinda lure Dorrit in. If he was too pushy, he’d come across as desperate. Maybe not, maybe I’m just a suspicious person!
Good observation, Janelle, and wise to be suspicious of so many of these people.
Sue and Janelle - I had been thinking that Mr Merdle was an introvert as it seems he has never enjoyed socialising but what you’re saying has made me think. You’re right that he’s hardly encouraging Mr Dorrit but I wonder if that’s because, as Sue says, he knows his scheme is about to crash and that Mr Dorrit will lose his investment but obviously he can’t tell him.
Mr. Dorrit receives a visit from Flora Finching who completely amazes him with her wordiness.Mr Dorrit stood rooted to the carpet, a statue of mystification.
He does, however, learn that she used to pay Amy for her sewing services. She also mentions the names of Arthur Clennam and Pancks which put Dorrit in a bit of concern to find out why she is here.
She had seen in the newspaper that he was returning to Italy and was there to elicit his watchfulness in the mysterious man who has gone missing by the name of Blandois. This sets Dorrit to wanting to know more. He mentions that he is acquainted with him through another gentleman.
Being out of sorts, Mr. Dorrit decides to follow up on getting more information for Henry Gowan and after a nap, goes to find the house of Clennam and Co to inquire. Taken by the dismal look of the house and welcomed by the curious Affery, he meets with Mrs. Clennam and learns a little information but not a lot. Finally Affery hears the mysterious sound to which Dorrit believes he hears it as well.
There were also two men lurking around which cause Dorrit to begin to be paranoid again.
Such a curious chapter and one that I'm not completely sold on as far as whether Mr. Dorrit's actions are within the characterization Dickens has given him. Would Dorrit go investigating like this to a strange place? I never expected Flora to be a part of moving the storyline towards the mystery with Blandois.
Hmm, lots to think about on this one.
And who are these 2 men lurking?
I found this chapter rather confusing. I don't understand why Flora is so interested in Blandois that she goes to Mr Dorrit's. What does she have to do with Mrs Clennam's household if, as we seem to understand, they are suspected of having something to do with Blandois's disappearance? It seems to me that the connection between the disappearance and Arthur is too weak to justify her interference. And in the same way why does Mr. Dorrit go to Clennam's house? It then surprised me that Mr. Dorritt walked in and out without Mrs. Clennam and Mr. Flintwinch knowing his name. Is it perhaps that it is not the right moment yet? Will something happen when they recognize each other?
Daniela, I’m with you that this chapter was out of character for Mr Dorrit. I also haven’t figured out why Dickens chose to use Flora to advance this very dark side of the story. Maybe it’s because she’s a comic character. I didn’t realize Dorrit’s name hadn’t been mentioned. Excellent observation!
I’m with all of you on this. It seems a strange turn of events. The only thing I could think of is that Dorrit obviously knows the Clennam name through Arthur and therefore felt he could approach them but he’s been so dismissive of Arthur post Marshalsea so that doesn’t make sense either.
I agree with everyone’s comments. Very out of character for Mr Dorrit. He is so worried about diminishing his reputation, I find it hard to believe he would have even gone to this section of town. In regards to Flora, again why the interest? If I had to be in a room with her, and listen to her babble, I would go out of my mind.
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Books mentioned in this topic
Bleak House (other topics)The Holly-Tree (other topics)
The Chimes (other topics)
Little Dorrit (other topics)
Dombey and Son (other topics)
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Charles Dickens (other topics)Charles Dickens (other topics)
Charles Dickens (other topics)
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Charles Dickens (other topics)
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So since Fiona doesn't read it, I directed her to you, or your links. Or Fiona, you can use the search facility to find them :)
Edit - no sorry don't use the search field! I've just realised that you might find the one I mentioned earlier, from further ahead!