The Readers Review: Literature from 1714 to 1910 discussion
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Basil
Wilkie Collins Collection
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Basil - Week 1
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In modern times, Basil's actions seem creepy, like stalking, and his sneaking around to see her (with the help of the maid) is manipulative.
We know from a few comments by the narrator that things aren't going to end well. But so far, I don't care for him at all. It serves him right if he gets his comeuppance. I just hope Margaret isn't hurt, as she is the innocent victim here. Her father basically sells her for money and title.
My initial impressions of the story and characters pretty much mirror Robin's. However, while Basil's actions do make him seem a bit creepy, he's not as creepy as his future father-in-law, who I'm visualizing as an older Uriah Heep. Good questions, Deborah. I will have to monitor the story to see how it compares to Collins' own lifestyle. I do know Collins was personally a bit liberal on the idea of love and marriage.
In the movie Invisible Woman, about Dickens' secret love affair with Nelly Ternan, Collins, portrayed by Tom Hollander, is shown at the home he keeps his long-time mistress, Caroline Graves. I know he lived with Ms. Graves while also keeping another mistress and 3 children elsewhere.
As to rank, while rank still plays some role today, it is not quite as rigid and is more fluid than earlier. It plays a big role here in Basil and it will be interesting to see how it plays out in this story.
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He actually had two common law aka just living with a woman relationships.
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Perhaps he was taken by what he sees as exotic and mysterious in Margaret. Although several times prior to the wedding he seems to have some doubts.
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It’s significant to me that Basil is a writer. People of certain temperaments, often called “artistic temperaments,” like to amplify whatever emotion they’re feeling, even a feeling they intend to eventually get rid of. Basil initially fully intends to not pursue Margaret, but he wants to feel his feelings first, go see her house at night to amplify them, and this gets him into trouble, and he’s no longer able to resist.
Basil is the type of guy who seems almost perfect in a romantic story, but in real life might end up being a mentally unstable partner. The way he's ready to marry Margaret right after seeing her reminds me of Romeo and Juliet, and we all know how that ended.
I'm very curious to know about the terrible thing closing in on Basil during the time he is writing this. At first I thought it was a terminal illness. Given his nervous attack at the end of this section, I still think that's possible. I doubt anyone from his own family would be trying to harm him. His father is more the "pretend my son is dead" type. Will he do something to anger the Sherwins? Will Mr. Sherwin keep making demands on him, perhaps for money (he may lose money in his speculations)? It doesn't seem that his feelings for Margaret have changed at the time of his writing, but evidently something terrible will happen within the year.
I agree with Brian that Mr. Sherwin gives off Uriah Heep vibes, and he's obviously terrible to his wife.
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I actually like Basil too, flawed as he is
Lori wrote: "I guess I'm the odd one this time in that I so far like Basil!."Deborah likes Basil too so you are an even two rather than "the odd one."
Also, even though I think Basil is a bit of a creepy narrator that doesn't mean I won't enjoy his story - I did enjoy Lolita :)
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Interesting. I’m thinking something bad will happen to Basil because of his alliance with Margaret. We will both have to wait and see. I’m just starting next week’s segment so I truly don’t know. It’s a first read for me.
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I don't think Basil has described his own looks, right? I don't remember seeing it.
I've found it interesting how some authors describe their characters physically and some don't. Trollope, Hardy, and Eliot did. Austen rarely did, or she only included one feature (for example, she says that Emma has hazel eyes).
Lori wrote: ".. it seems that the illustrators and cover designers do not read the physical descriptions of the characters (many forget that Madame Bovary had black hair and Anna Karenina was full-figured)."As do movie casting directors, so we get Keira Knightley as Anna K.
Speaking of inept Cover Designers, I ran into this book yesterday when shopping for a copy of the Longest Journey on AbeBooks: abebooks.com/servlet/BookDetailsPL?bi...On Goodreads it is:
. So either the designer made a mistake or thinks that Forster depicts his character as looking like W.B. Yeats.
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One of the worst of those is when Henry Fonda was cast as Pierre in the movie of War and Peace. The one thing that Tolstoy tells us over and over is that Pierre is fat.
I posted somewhere (maybe in the Coffee, Tea and Croissants thread ) a link from about a month ago showing terrible covers of classic novels.
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I think I pictured someone like a young Gerard Depardieu (large and kind of awkward) when I read War and Peace. I agree, Henry Fonda is way off for Pierre.
Yes, I remember those covers as well, Robin. :-D
On the other hand, sometimes some good can be done by casting characters that might not look like how they were originally imagined. I doubt Charles Dickens had someone like Dev Patel in mind for David Copperfield, but I'm looking forward to seeing it. I think the problem with the other examples is that they were departing from the descriptions to reinforce a very narrow idea of beauty that's still current in Hollywood instead of grabbing an opportunity to expand it.
Robin P wrote: ".One of the worst of those is when Henry Fonda was cast as Pierre in the movie of War and Peace. The one thing that Tolstoy tells us over and over is that Pierre is fat.."As I said in another Goodreads group read of War & Peace some years ago :
"I wanted to read W&P before I saw the iTV series and still question why Pierre is always described as fat and then is played by Henry Fonda (1956) and Paul Dano. How about James Coco and Oliver Platt, something closer to Tolstoy's vision?"
EDIT: A friend who just finished reading W&P suggested the weight enhanced Brendan Fraser as a good fit to play Pierre.
I thinks its because the film's intent is to portray the plot as a romantic triangle and the audiences in 1950s and today have difficulty accepting a fat actor in such a story. Physical standards change. In 1910 America I'd be considered attractively prosperous.
This chapter was odd, in certain sense, but interesting as well. It was good to read your comments because I did not get the idea that something will happen to Margaret by my reading.
So far this story reminded me of other Collins novels. Romantically inclined hero falls head over heel in love with mysterious woman. And the hero is so much enthralled with his beloved, that he agrees to some preposterous arrangements. Viewing it from today’s perspective, this is rather ludicrous, but for the period this novel is set in, it’s not so farfetched. I still wished that Basil would have made some inquiries into the family he was marrying into. He also should have tried to get more of an idea who Margaret really is, before agreeing to marry her on the spot.
As it is usually the case with Collins I expect the plot to thicken and some terrible secret will be revealed. But it all makes for good reading.
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His books are definitely fun to read. Good point about how little he knows about Margaret
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It sounds like Basil hasn't had much experience with women, since this is the first time he fell in love-at first sight, or should I say touch?
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I agree with those of you who found Basil somewhat creepy-his accosting Margaret in the street/bribing her servant was startling, and his convincing himself that a lifelong love with someone outside his station could be based on her appearance is incredibly naive. While he and Margaret have 7 evenings in which to "converse" I expect that mostly amounted to Basil speaking and Margaret nodding and smiling so he will have no way of judging whether she will suit him, particularly if they end up cast off from his family and mildly impoverished .
Basil's ready capitulation to Mr Sherwin's demands was a huge surprise-he can defy his father and possibly put himself beyond the pale socially, but can't stand up for himself against a tradesman?
I am particularly concerned about how a young woman, raised by a vulgar, abusive father and a cowed and likely weak mother, will turn out as a wife. She clearly will have had all the rough social edges smoothed off her by her finishing school education, but I don't expect that will extend to her moral education. Definitely a tragedy in the making!
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I agree with those of you who found Basil somewhat creepy-his accosting Margaret in the street/bribing her servant was startling, and his..."
Great observations. It’s a very quick read so you should easily catch up.
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The Readers Review: Literature from 1714 to 1910
Books mentioned in this topic
The Longest Journey (other topics)Lolita (other topics)
Basil is the narrator of his own story. He is the younger son of a gentleman with a brother and sister. He starts his story telling us “an enemy, determined and deadly, patient alike to wait days or years for his opportunity, is ever lurking after me in the dark.” ( part 1, section 1). The stage is immediately set by this quote along with background information on all the characters.
Basil is a writer whose life is changed by the casual sighting of a beautiful woman, Margaret. She is described as dark and mysterious. A shopkeeper’s daughter whose social rank is considerably lower than Basil’s. He says it’s love at first sight. He proposes to Margaret, with the approval of her father, with some rather odd agreements and in complete secrecy from his family.
1. In section 2, Collins writes “we can neither no nor judge ourselves; others may judge us, but cannot know us...”. How does this impact Basil’s narration. Is he a reliable or unreliable narrator?
2. What, if any, parallels do you see between this story and Collins’ life?
3. Does love turn people selfish as Collins indicates in section 7? Why?
4. What role does societal rank play in today’s society?
5. What do you think is the meaning of the dream in section 8?