WE ARE OPEN - WEEK ONE - EISENHOWER IN WAR AND PEACE - February 2nd ~ February 8th - PREFACE AND CHAPTER ONE - Just Folks (xi - 27) No-Spoilers

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

True Ann a truly bizarre choice.

Bryan - spot on.

[Bryan]

Good stuff, Maureen, thank you.

What were your impressions of Eisenhower at West Point? He was lucky about getting a shot at taking a competitive exam even to get in.

[Jerome, Assisting Moderator - Upcoming Books and Releases]

It does seem like a formative experience; it seems like it brought out the best in him for the most part. And, of course, he wouldn't have met Bradley or Patton. And unlike other officers of the time, he did learn about such things as armored warfare.

[Ann D]

Bryan mentioned that Ike was lucky he had the opportunity to get into West Point through a competitive exam. This was not the norm. He was also fortunate that Shaw decided to override the unanimous decision of the medical board not to give Ike a commission after he graduated.

He got some good breaks, but he obviously had a lot of ability. He got good grades without a lot of effort. Smith refers to his "almost total recall" and "ability to focus." Ike got along very well with others. As Bradley said, Ike liked people and they liked him back.

I think Eisenhower would also have succeeded in business like his brothers, although military life gave him a sense of discipline and definite path to promotion.

He sounds like the kind of man it would be fun to know.

[Jerome, Assisting Moderator - Upcoming Books and Releases]

I agree, Ann, he certainly seemed affable; and as World War Two would prove, he was great at dealing with big egos, even if Bernard Montgomery would test this to its limit.

[Erica]

Maureen, I completely agree with your thoughts on leadership. I think the purpose of a leader is to influence other people to accomplish a mission or fulfill a purpose. If leadership is a process, it can definitely be learned and improved. I also think that some leaders are more charismatic than others, and this may be a trait that one is born with or not.

I think that Eisenhower gained the ability to lead through his experiences. First at West Point, and then his subsequent Army assignments as a Lieutenant all the way to five star general. His differing jobs and assignments exposed him to varying levels of responsibility, as well as command of different sized groups of people. He also did a lot of self-development reading, which helped him hone his tactical and strategic craft.

I am really enjoying the book so far, and look forward to continuing the read, as well as everyone's thoughts and comments.

[Vincent]

So I am a bit late but share my thoughts before I go through all of yours my fellow travelers through this book.

As I will leave for vacation this is in Kindle so I have no page numbers.

In the Prologue it becomes quickly apparent that Ike is his own man and knows his mind and the he could resist the wishes of the joint chiefs to use nukes (their relatively new toy).

I also knew about his building the Interstate Highway system but did not know, or forgot, that he was responsible for the St. Lawrence Seaway. I visited there some decades ago with my kids and it was quite an interesting visit. The Eisenhower locks included and I assume the technology has not majorly changed.

I also noted the so well known reference in his farewell address to the military industrial complex. Being an environmentalist I submit to you here another quote from that address:

Another factor in maintaining balance involves the element of time. As we peer into society's future, we – you and I, and our government – must avoid the impulse to live only for today, plundering for, for our own ease and convenience, the precious resources of tomorrow. We cannot mortgage the material assets of our grandchildren without asking the loss also of their political and spiritual heritage. We want democracy to survive for all generations to come, not to become the insolvent phantom of tomorrow.

When we get into chapter one we can see the national loyalty and religious principles guiding the Eisenhower family.

An uncle named Abraham Lincoln Eisenhower. (One of my colleagues at work had a father was born in 1943 or 1944 - and he was Douglas MacArthur - then family name)

Interesting that Ike followed, it seems after leaving home, no religion until he became a Presbyterian after being elected president as he "became convinced the US was a Christian nation" - interesting. So his kids were raised without religion?

Ike's dad David must have been such a disappointment to the family. the family deciding to "cover up" David's business failure is certainly contrary to the truth you would expect from the family.

It is also interesting to me that Ike trudged on in the military, mostly marching time, while his brothers were forging more established roles in their respective careers.

I also wonder that if possibly FDR's exposure to brother Milton - first in the Dept of Agriculture and then in the War Relocation Authority might not have been critical to the final selection of Ike to head up the Allied Forces in the European theatre.

Ike acutally worked for MacArthur, who was a prima donna I think, for years in the Phiippines - I get this from the D'este book on Ike that I read many years ago.

Eisenhower's poker and smoking and sports participation were indicative of a self determined man. That he stopped smoking by "ordering himself to" is so impressive. I quit so many times in the 27 years that I smoked.

by Carlo D'Este

[Vincent]

Bentley wrote: "The Preface begins with the following paragraph;

"Dwight Eisenhower remains an enigma. For the majority of Americans he is a benign fatherly figure looming indistinctly out of the mists of the pa..."

So I am replying to Bentleys two questions -
first I was already 9 when he took office. I remember him as both - the General part was reinforced by his ending the Korean conflict.

Initial thoughts about the book is that it is so well written. I will be likely not signing on much for the next five weeks so I will not be able to interact which much of the commentary until I am in the "spoiler land" of reading ahead.

I now after the Grant book and only one chapter into this one - think that I have to try to read move of Smiths books.

by Jean Edward Smith

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Vince great comments and enjoy your vacation. Smith is a great writer. Quite skilled. Great comments everyone, Maureen, Vince, Bryan, Jerome, Erica (welcome), Ann as always.

[Maureen]

I really only remember Ike as a picture on the wall at school and in my grandmother's kitchen. I was 1 when he was elected and only have vague stirrings of remembrance of him. JFK was the first president I remember and because of he and Jackie's youth and charisma, I think I remembered more about them than I would have an old, stodgy president. I was in 8th grade when JFK was killed and remember that horribly and vividly.

To comment a little more on leadership ability, I think a person has to be naturally outgoing, have a certain amount of confidence to withstand criticism, and then also have superior mental ability - the kind of mind that is quick and can easily see how things work and able to look ahead at consequences. To me, those qualities must already be there and cannot be taught; they can only be brought out and strengthened.

@Vince - I was also amused by Ike's sudden conversion prior to his presidency. That wouldn't be so easy in this day and age, and more's the pity.

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

It is odd but very religious families sometimes have children who rebel against anything religious and go to the other extreme. Ike may have been rebellious and this was his way of exerting himself.

I have a cousin who I just learned gave his recently deceased mother a royally hard time about being part of a formal religious celebration (which for privacy sake I am not identifying) when he was I guess a preteen. He was not going to have anything to do with it and she could not make him. Unbeknownst to any of us he was not only not religious but anti religious until about a year or two ago - he decides to get married and the woman he is marrying is religion X (just for privacy sake) and because he decided he wanted to marry Ms.Y of X religion in her church come to find out he goes through everything and becomes religious to the extreme and goes through all of the religious requirements in earnest that he was vehemently against decades ago. Go figure.

[Brian]

What in their background makes them excel? What an interesting book (so far) and revealing with details that was not known previously. I believe his father's emotional detachment was a difficult situation in the Eisenhower family. The boys all excelled in their own way, and benefited from their mother's love and support, and probably, grandfather's influence. Notice that Ike wasn't a scholar, but had great people skills that gave him many second chances. He was determined. Look forward to continuing the book, and reading the book club analysis.

[Brian]

This week, a controversy at the National Prayer Breakfast over President Obama's remarks. I found an appropriate quote from none other than President Dwight Eisenhower, that may respond to the controversy, "The hope of the world is that wisdom can arrest conflict between brothers. I believe that war is the deadly harvest of arrogant and unreasoning minds. And I find grounds for this belief in the wisdom literature of Proverbs. It says in effect this: Panic strikes like a storm and calamity comes like a whirlwind to those who hate knowledge and ignore their God."
President Dwight D. Eisenhower, 4/4/57 Note: In the book, it was noted that Eisenhower read the Bible 'two times over" - this quote attests to his excellent rendition and perspective.

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Brian wrote: "What in their background makes them excel? What an interesting book (so far) and revealing with details that was not known previously. I believe his father's emotional detachment was a difficult ..."

Brian good posts and analysis. Though Obama's words were true - they seemed off putting to many. I think that ISIS is abhorrent and their deeds so without mercy and compassion that these remarks just riled folks that did not need to be and I agree given Ike's background that what you said is true.

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Eisenhower thread will be up soon today.

[Bryan]

Thanks everyone, great comments.

Erica: great insight into leadership, thank you. You definitely get the impression he has this charisma, but it seems more understated than other "big" personalities.

[Christopher]

Sorry for the late response. I’ve been pretty busy recently and haven’t had the chance to begin Eisenhower in War and Peace until recently. Below are my quick answers to the topics that were given at the beginning of the thread.

1. Who in America could raise seven sons and feed their wife and themselves for ten dollars a week? Of course this was 1890. What would ten dollars a week in 1890 be equal to today?

I checked online with a historic currency converter and according to this site $10 a week would’ve been equivalent to $256.30 a week, which isn’t too bad for a single person. But for a family of seven I can see how times would’ve been lean. Food would not always have been plentiful if not downright scarce. Any good meal that the family had would’ve been a time of celebration most likely.

2. What were your impressions of Eisenhower's parents and their plight. Of Ike's Dad and Mother?

While I don’t think this biography gives an overly detailed description of family life, I found the father to be rather detached from his family. I could imagine if this were a family a century later, he probably would’ve walked out on the family. I think it familial and cultural pressures that kept the marriage together. The mother comes off as the real heart of the family as she is attached where the father is detached. Still, we don’t get a great sense of the dynamics in their marriage in this chapter.

3. Many times exceptional leaders come from extremely poor backgrounds - what in their background makes them excel?

I think that there are two common threads. One is that families of poor background tend to be more strict in handing out chores around the house (and farm if it is a rural family) as they can’t afford someone to do it for them nor can they be slovenly about simple chores. If things aren’t done, then the whole family suffers. This builds a certain sense of order and responsibility into kids. The other thread is that exceptional leaders may have a fear of falling back into the poverty that they grew up in, so they are determined to not fail at what they are doing.

4. I have to tell you the truth - I had never heard of the River Brethren - what was your take on the group and according to Smith it was one of the most complete and perfectly organized colonies to ever enter the country and they were rich too?

I think Smith did good job of describing the group as a pre-Evangelical denomination of Christianity. Coming from an evangelical background myself, many of the doctrines that Smith talked about seemed familiar to me and would not have been out of place in today’s religious landscape. The whole thing about property being a blessing was interesting as it sounds a bit like Wealth and Health gospel, which would also fit in with many of the megachurches that are out there today (Joel Osteen comes to mind, but that might be unfair to both the Brethren and Mr. Osteen).

[Bryan]

Great points, Christopher.

[Rosella]

Christopher wrote: "I checked online with a historic currency converter and according to this site $10 a week would’ve been equivalent to $256.30 a week, which isn’t too bad for a single person. But for a family of seven I can see how times would’ve been lean. Food would not always have been plentiful if not downright scarce. Any good meal that the family had would’ve been a time of celebration most likely.
"
My husband and I have lived on an equivalent income but we relied heavily on my parents and we didn't have three children as the Eisenhower did at the time. I'm sure there are people with children who make this income, but I'm not sure how they survive. They must live in atrocious housing. terrible diet and many untreated health problems.

[Bryan]

Thanks Rosella, it does add to the misery and you can understand why the Eisenhower children left as quick as they could.

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

I want to add on both of the weekly threads - that the Bibliography thread now contains all of the books in the Jean Edward Smith Bibliography in the book.

That is thanks to Teri who did a yeoman's job of adding all of them - A to Z. What a lot of work and that thread contains some great, great book. In fact, I never realized how many books Eisenhower wrote himself. Make sure to check that thread out:

https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...

[Scott]

I finally received the book! Time to catch up! My first thoughts are on Ike and Mamie's religious beliefs and how they seemed to have missed their offspring's generation. I live near Gettysburg, so getting to their summer/retirement home is incredible and his simple lifestyle shows forth in their home and his paintings.

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Wonderful - you are not that far behind and it is a great book. I can imagine it did - I need to go and visit that site.

[Scott]

Bentley wrote: "Wonderful - you are not that far behind and it is a great book. I can imagine it did - I need to go and visit that site."

I added two pictures, one of the camp and the first tank. How can I add them here?

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Hmm - if you have some others than the ones I asked you to add to the glossary - you can add them using html.

It is < img src ="the photo address" / > (with no spaces)

I do not use the width and the height - you have to make sure that the photo address you are copying is a .jpg one.

[Scott]

Bentley wrote: "Hmm - if you have some others than the ones I asked you to add to the glossary - you can add them using html.

It is (with no spaces)

I do not use the width and the height - you have to make sure..."

glossary is fine

[Bentley, Group Founder, Leader, Chief]

Great thanks. Good to have it there. Lots of great entries.