Women and Men Group Read - 2021 discussion
General Updates
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George
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Jan 17, 2021 08:51AM
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This Friday will be the official start of our group read of Women and Men by Joseph McElroy! Thank all of you for joining us. This message is to welcome you and provide a recap of our schedule and resources. We’re using the Dzanc paperback; however, George was kind enough to include chapter titles and/or sentence fragments for those using other editions, or the e-book:
- Week 1 (Jan. 22-28): pp. 1-162
- Week 2 (Jan. 29-Feb. 4): pp. 163-291 “Dividing the Unknown Between Us”
- Week 3 (Feb. 5-11): pp. 292-432 “Meanwhile, beyond the resumed Bases game where Braddie soon got tagged out…”
- Week 4 (Feb. 12-18): pp. 433-576 “Between Histories:Breathers Thick and Fast”
- Week 5 (Feb. 19-25): pp. 577-733 “the message for what it was worth”
- Week 6 (Feb. 26-Mar. 4): pp. 734-858 “The Hermit-Inventor of New York, The Anasazi Healer, and the Unknown Aborter”
- Week 7 (Mar.5-11): pp. 856-992 “daughter of the revolution”
- Week 8 (Mar. 12-18): pp. 993-1,142 “news”
- Week 9 (Mar. 19-25): pp. 1,143-1,293
Of course, George and I are available on Instagram @george.salis and @therepublicofbadtaste. Remember: for social media, our hashtag is #McElroy21
Finally, I was hoping to host a series of video chats for those who might be interested. I think it’d be a great opportunity for us to talk in real time about the book and to get to know one another better. I thought that 3 meetings (~90 minutes each) on Feb. 13 or 14, Mar. 6 or 7, & Mar. 27 or 28 would be feasible. Please fill out your availability via https://bit.ly/3suiWJH (times are EST). While we likely won’t find a time that work for all, hopefully we find some that work for most. Also, my plan is to record these sessions and post them on YouTube, in the hope that other readers will be able to benefit from our insights! So, please keep this in mind when considering if you’d like to join. Please don’t hesitate to contact us if you have any questions or concerns.
Best,
Ryan & George
Ryan wrote: "Hi Everyone, This Friday will be the official start of our group read of Women and Men by Joseph McElroy! Thank all of you for joining us. This message is to welcome you and provide a recap of ou..."
Thanks for the reminder on the timeline. I'm plowing through my current book and may be tempted to jump in before Friday. Hold me back :)
I must admit, I jumped the gun, and started reading a couple of days ago, though I haven't made much progress yet. This is gonna be a doozie folks. I feel like members of this group need to share their origin stories - because getting to this point, reading this book is simply not what the average person does. I'll start: I'm soon to turn 40, living in Nova Scotia Canada, with a wife and three kids, and have been obsessively listing books for years, mixing my own lists, books acclaimed by goodreaders, critics' picks, and other interesting lists from Burgess, Barthelme, Rabelais' Codpiece, interesting printers and other sources. I like bold ideas, and lean to avant garde, but also try to explore and cover off essentials. A minor in Latin American studies, a shelved goal of reading the top lit prizes top to bottom, and a goal to have some clue of Canadian poetry's magical waters, also define my reading. I also speak French and Spanish and use those languages to dabble on the sides occasionally. I think in general I have a fear of missing out about reading over my lifetime.
What about others?
Mod
Thanks for your introduction, Andrew. I agree, we've above-average people, huh. ; )
Jokes aside, where to begin.... Started reading from the Scholastic catalog in middle school. This carried on till high school where I got distracted by the drama of girls and video games, but then, still early on in high school, I began reading science-popularizing books, which continued into college. Near the end of the first quarter of college, I rediscovered my love of fiction and it didn't take long for me to start writing some, which didn't take long for me to write my first novel, Sea Above, Sun Below (about 3 years of work). When that was finally was published, I started The Collidescope, an online literary publication that has been more successful than I ever would have anticipated (an interview with the main man Joe himself is in the works, by the way). My focus for the site is fiction of the Dalkey variety, let's say, and the neglected but visionary variety, the stuff rarely covered by other publications. Currently working on a maximalist novel titled Morphological Echoes. Influences include DeLillo, Calvino, Borges, Joyce, Rushdie, etc. Rikki Ducornet has called it a "book for the ages," which is quite modest, no? I hope to be done within 2 years, after already working on it for around 4-5 years, which means I'll finish when I'm 30 years old. After that, I have planned a novel that I envision as being the 'Greek' Midnight's Children/Ulysses.
I discovered Joseph McElroy here on Goodreads and first read Plus, and here I am, in love with the work of his I've read so far.
Andrew wrote: "I must admit, I jumped the gun, and started reading a couple of days ago, though I haven't made much progress yet. This is gonna be a doozie folks. I feel like members of this group need to share t...""reading this book is simply not what the average person does" made me laugh! I've read a few excerpts of this novel to my roomates and have found much amusement in their bewildered skepticism.
I've got a hell of an origin story... I grew up in a literal cult, living in a cul-de-sac in about a dozen adjacent houses with about half the cult's main body (based in Indianapolis with other branches in Columbus and South Carolina). It was basically the type of thing you read about in the newspapers: the leader/founder had 100% control over everyone's lives and regulated the flow of information. He forced all the women to quit their jobs, drop out of school, divorce skeptical partners. He made all the dozens of families cut contact with any other relatives who hadn't joined the cult. Scary stuff, and I've got stories you wouldn't believe.
All media we children of the cult consumed: books, music, movies, etc. was completely censored, words excised with white out, cleavage covered by black bars on screen, certain songs marked "SKIP", etc. We were essentially allowed to read the Bible, Narnia, and whatever anthropomorphical Christian fantasy novel that the leadership had approved.
Eventually our family made it out of that cult, and around the time I was fifteen and finally allowed to use the internet, I discovered goodreads.com and started reading about all these delightful-sounding books that had always seemed so far out of reach. I ended up stumbling onto the po-mo gang here and was mesmerized by the descriptions of novels like "The Recognitions" and "Gravity's Rainbow." They seemed like texts from another world, books I could never have imagined eisted. Convinced my parents to led me order "The Recognitions", which they allowed me to read so long as I agreed to censor any "bad words" along the way with a Sharpie, an arrangement that persisted until I moved out. I essentially graduated from Narnia to Pynchon overnight haha. I actually own a fully censored copy of "Against the Day", probably the only one in the world lol.
I'm currently 20, living on my own, and enjoying reading whatever the fuck I want to read! I'm a huge fan of Thomas Pynchon, and to be honest I'm still chasing the high of re-reading "Gravity's Rainbow" last year. Almost everything pales in comparison. I've read "Night Soul" and "Cannonball" from McElroy and found both to be intriguing but unsatisfying. I figured I'd give this big one a shot though.
In addition to reading, I also write. When I was 15 I wrote and self-published a young-adult adventure novel called "Shattered Script". Obviously, it doesn't quite hold up in retrospect, but I hold a lot of fondness for the characters.
Right when I turned 16 I started work on some type of Borgesian po-mo fantasy book called "His Unfinished Symphony." I currenly have written about 900 pages and plan to complete the novel this year, but I'm not sure I'm planning to publish it. Needless to say I've experienced seismic change in my life since I began the novel and hardly recognize the person who wrote the first 400 pages. I think I'll finish it as an excercise to further refine my style and then hopefully start work on something new.
Mod
I wanted to send out a reminder about our proposed group video chats. If you're interested in attending, please fill out your availability in the following poll: https://bit.ly/3suiWJH
Thanks to those who have already responded. I'm hoping to finalize the dates/times next week, so please fill it out by this weekend if possible.
Thanks!
Ryan
Andrew wrote: "I must admit, I jumped the gun, and started reading a couple of days ago, though I haven't made much progress yet. This is gonna be a doozie folks. I feel like members of this group need to share t..."Yes, reading McElroy does feel like taking a road less travelled, unfortunately, but maybe that would change if his stuff was actually in print! Alright, my "origin story:" my background isn't especially literary, I've liked reading well enough, but never found the time for it in high school, I was more interested in math and science as far as academics go. I ended up double majoring in physics and applied math, started getting into reading again my junior year of college, mostly light stuff like Steven King. Eventually, I got interested in more literary guys like Cormac McCarthy, read Infinite Jest, then moved on to Pynchon. I think a big reason why I love Pynchon (and DFW to a lesser extent) is his incorporation of math and science into his writing. Anyway, I read most of Pynchon's books and was looking for authors that could potentially scratch the same itch when I stumbled upon McElroy and was super intrigued by his prose. So yeah, here I am! I'm 23, currently working in education, and I plan on starting a masters program in data science this fall.
Hi Everyone, I've just come aboard this reading group. I found my way here after seeing George's updates, as he's a GR friend. I started this one long ago, March 2020. Due to parenting, Covid, work etc. I've stumbled along, reading very slowly. However, I've never found any displeasure in having this foreboding tome encroaching upon my periphery. When I pick it up, I simply return to what I last remember and reread from there. This might mean that a few nights in a row I'll do the same page. Thus, I've reread each page, paragraph or section around two to five times, which sort of places me at about 2000 pages. Worthwhile? I think it might be. It hasn't lacked enjoyment and I've come to appreciate the process, which seems to be a huge, if not the main, aim of McElroy's writing, especially of remembering and making sense. So anyway, I do hope to not take another year to finish this off and am keen to have the group spur me on to get it done by March 2021. Very much look forward to the discussions!
Mod
Do you want access to my interview with the legendary Joseph McElroy ahead of its publication? I've started a Patreon with a range of awesome benefits for your support, including editorial services, handpicked invisible books in the mail, and more. See here for more info: https://www.patreon.com/TheCollidescope
Mod
Not available to make the call? Got a question or comment or theory you’re dying to get feedback on? Just want to get off your chest that you hated the book and DNF’d weeks ago? Drop it in the comments below or DM me and I’ll be sure to present it to the group!
And for those who can’t make it, I’ve got a question I’d love YOUR thoughts on:
Given the speculative conceit of men and women being colloidally joined and transported from Locus T across “earth-moon space” and working on weatherless space farms, should Women and Men be considered a science fiction novel? Are “genre” signifiers even relevant?
Thanks for your attention everyone. I can’t wait to hear from you!
