January 2021 - Song of a Captive Bird

[Sarah]

One of the group reads for January is Song of a Captive Bird by Jasmin Darznik. Please discuss the book in this thread.

Katrisa will be leading the discussion.

In order to receive a badge you must:
1. have read the book before or during January 2021.
2. discussed it in this thread. Discussion must be more than "I read the book and I liked it". Discussion requires something more substantial and analytical of what you read, for example, thoughts, opinions, impact it had on you, what was your favourite part, was it what you expected it to be like etc. You may also like to review the book and post a link to the review in this thread. Please refer to our group spoiler policy for further information.
3. Report that you have read AND discussed the book in the reporting thread (include a brief summary of what you thought of the book).

A note on discussion: Discussion must be more than "I read the book and I liked it". Discussion requires something more substantial and analytical of what you read, for example, thoughts, opinions, impact it had on you, what was your favourite part, was it what you expected it to be like etc.

In addition to this, the group reads are meant to be a "read along" so it is preferable that you discuss the book as you read rather than wait until you've finished the book.

And finally, discussion is not about just listing your thoughts. Please interact with the other group members, comment on their thoughts, and if they comment on yours, respond to them. This is what makes a good book discussion!

You may also like to review the book and post a link to the review in this thread.

Please refer to our group spoiler policy for further information.

General Rules:
1. Please mark your spoilers with the spoiler tags along with mentioning what stage of the book you are at so other's don't get a nasty shock. Chapter numbers/titles are generally best as they are the same across all formats and editions. See our spoiler policy
2. The book may be combined with the Year Long Challenge, Topplers, and Monthly Challenges.

Happy reading!

[Katrisa]

Hi Everyone! I am looking forward to reading this book, but I have a bunch of library books that I have to read before they take them away so I won't be starting this until probably the second week of January.
I did find this book club discussion guide though

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Z9s-...

It has some cool pictures of Forugh

[Vicki]

I'm in on this one. Probably going to start tomorrow though I'm a pretty slow reader,

I'm not going to read the questions till afterwards because they usually have spoilers but I took a look and there are recipes at the end! Super excited about that, I'll try the jeweled rice and the tea though the tea doesn't look too different.

I am not familiar with Forugh Farrokhzad so this shall be enlightening.

[Katrisa]

Vicki wrote: "I'm in on this one. Probably going to start tomorrow though I'm a pretty slow reader,

I'm not going to read the questions till afterwards because they usually have spoilers but I took a look and ..."

Oh ya! I forgot to mention there were recipes! I am totally going to make at least one of them!

[Marnie]

I started reading this before coffee and well...chapter 1 would probably be best read after a cup or two. Some novels open slowly, let you dip your toe in, this one tosses you into the deep end. The scene is set.

[Marnie]

Finished chapter 5

The writing is very good and paints quite the picture of Forugh’s early life. (view spoiler)[ The author is so matter of fact describing the abuses but it doesn’t lessen their impact.

The couple sentence description of Forugh shredding her poems into ribbons then tossing her confetti poems off her roof to hide them. I had to put the book down and take a break. (hide spoiler)]

[Jenn]

I have this on hold at my library, but with their reduced hours for contactless pickup I won't have a chance to get it until next Saturday :(

[Marnie]

I am through Chapter 10
(view spoiler)[ Forugh is married now and living in a small town with her mother in law. Her already small world just got smaller. You can feel the pressure mounting and I’m interested to see how she changes her circumstances. (hide spoiler)]

I’m reading this in short bursts. It’s heavy right now and I’m glad for other books to bring relief.

[Marnie]

Through Chapter 17

This has become my morning coffee read

(view spoiler)[ The abuse Forugh is suffering is hard to read about. Not only from her parents but her society as well. Her spirit is all the more impressive to me... when she stands up for herself, knowing the physical costs to herself... it’s amazing.

She has just been sprung from the mental institution and I’m hoping we are getting to the triumphant part. (hide spoiler)]

[Vicki]

Marnie wrote: "I started reading this before coffee and well...chapter 1 would probably be best read after a cup or two. Some novels open slowly, let you dip your toe in, this one tosses you into the deep end. Th..."

Chapter 1 (view spoiler)[ I was imagining somethin much worse (FGM) so that when we finally realized what was happening I thought it was such a relief and wondered why she was fighting so much. Especially since she was a virgin. I hope this outcome isn't going to come back and haunt her later. (hide spoiler)]

Chapter 3 (view spoiler)[ My heart is going out to the poor mother. She is beaten and neglected and the daughter is sickened by her mother's begging. He tore down her garden that sounded like paradise for a stupid lawn. I am making the assumption that the Colonel has another family or two and that is why he is away. (hide spoiler)]

[Marnie]

Vicki wrote:

About your spoiler 3 (view spoiler)[ I found my impressions of the mother to be complicated. I had such sympathy for her- she had a difficult life and her one joy, the garden, when it was destroyed I felt her anguish. I also understand why she was hard on Forugh she lived in an unforgiving world and her resistance to that was dangerous. I wish she found a way to show some softness as a mother. I struggled with that a bit. Even though I assume I know her reasoning (hide spoiler)]

[Katrisa]

Marnie wrote: "I am through Chapter 10
[spoilers removed]

I’m reading this in short bursts. It’s heavy right now and I’m glad for other books to bring relief."

Good to know! I'll try to choose a lighter book to intersperse! It sounds like it will be a good listening book for my drive home.

[Katrisa]

I am feeling good about finishing my current other holds, so I should be able to start this one either this weekend or Monday.

[Marnie]

I was glad I read this one. It was not something I would have ever picked up by myself. The second half of the book read much faster for me. I’m curious if others find that to be true too.

Katrisa, I’m curious about what you think of the audio version.

[Kay]

Marnie wrote: "Finished chapter 5

I agree Marnie, the author has a very matter of fact approach to describing the abuses and restrictions in Forugh's life. I find it helps me to appreciate that these were her accepted norms and it is hard at times to keep reading.

[Kay]

Marnie wrote: "I am through Chapter 10
[spoilers removed]

Regarding Chap 10 (view spoiler)[ What a lonely existence. Her mother in law is so painful, her husband distant, judged because she ventures out by the entire town. Despite it all she is still intrinsically driven to want and seek more, strong character. (hide spoiler)]

[Kay]

I'm up to Chapter 19. (view spoiler)[ I was sickened by the facility they trapped her in. I've read so many true stories now where men have put women away to be drugged and given electro shock therapy simply because they were a nuisance or inconvenience to them. I can't describe the fury I feel when I read stories like this. Forugh was fortunate that someone who had met her only a couple of times, had the humanity and power to help her. (hide spoiler)]

[Marnie]

Kay wrote: "I'm up to Chapter 19. [spoilers removed]"

I agree with you (view spoiler)[ It’s outrageous! I could go down a very dark alley thinking of all the people lost to this. It’s a crime against humanity. Her friend who rescued her... so thankful for people like her. (hide spoiler)]

[Jenn]

I pick up my library hold yesterday, but need to finish my current read before I start another

[Dawn]

I just started it last night and read Chapter 1. I had the same thoughts as Vicki.
I love all the mentions of the typical food and drink.

[Grainne]

Vicki wrote: "Marnie wrote: "I started reading this before coffee and well...chapter 1 would probably be best read after a cup or two. Some novels open slowly, let you dip your toe in, this one tosses you into t..."

I read up to chapter 3 last night. I've just started it as well.

Chapter 1 (view spoiler)[ It felt like a splash of cold water when she describes how her womanhood ended. I have mixed feelings about the Mom in the story so far. She married at 15! It's so young to be responsible for a household.

Chapter 2-3 (view spoiler)[I loved the description of the gardens in Tehran with the cypress and pine trees. I can almost imagine the scents in the garden. What a lovely place to be unfortunately, it seems that they were all dug up to "modernize Iran." I thought the same thing about the Mom and Dad; does he have a second family?! (hide spoiler)] (hide spoiler)]

[Katrisa]

I started this yesterday. I am up to ch 12. I am enjoying the audio version. It is just what I hoped for as far as a commuting listen. So far (view spoiler)[ I really like Forugh's character. It is kind of amazing that she was as free-spirited as she was with her strict upbringing. I feel so bad for her about how her marriage went down. I wonder how it would have gone if she hadn't had her incident during her purity check.
I am loving the bits of poetry. I am for sure going to get a book of Forugh's poetry so I can spend some more time with it.
I just got to the part where she decided to go visit her home and left her son. I don't know why she wouldn't take her son - especially with how her mother-in-law obviously wants to oust her from the relationship with her son. (hide spoiler)]

[Katrisa]

Marnie wrote: "Finished chapter 5

The writing is very good and paints quite the picture of Forugh’s early life."

I agree - I think the author does a wonderful job with the tone even with the heavy material.

[Katrisa]

Vicki wrote: "Ch 3..."

RE Ch 3 - (view spoiler)[ Tearing down the garden made me so sad! (hide spoiler)]

[Marnie]

Katrisa wrote:

I particularly enjoyed the poetry included at the beginning of some chapters. I’ve thought about checking out a book of her works but would need an annotated copy. Wonder if that even exists?

[Grainne]

There's some useful websites that have samples of her poetry like this one http://farrokhzadpoems.com/poems/
and this one https://forughfarrokhzad.org/forughsl...

They might have affiliate links where you can buy her poetry or find it some other way. I also searched my online library but it only has this book and not any of her poetry books. Maybe yours might.

[Grainne]

Marnie wrote: "I am through Chapter 10
[spoilers removed]

I’m reading this in short bursts. It’s heavy right now and I’m glad for other books to bring relief."

Chapter 10 (view spoiler)[ Her world has completely shrunk. She is restricted to her house and the small town where she knows nobody except her in-laws. I wonder why her and her husband no longer exchange poems and poetry together. She obviously loves poetry and he used to enjoy it too. When they have such a strong common interest, it's curious that they don't write and read more poetry to spend quality time together. (hide spoiler)]

[Marnie]

Grainne wrote:

Your chapter 10 comment (view spoiler)[ I think the wedding night completely changed his view of her and their relationship. I also think the Mother-in-law is doing her very best to ruin any chance of him softening his view.

It’s always very sad when the relationship before marriage is completely different than the one after the vows. Has to give a person emotional whiplash. (hide spoiler)]

[Katrisa]

Oh man! I just went to check Kindle for a book of her poetry and they did have Another Birth and Other Poems
but I clicked on it to make sure it was in English and there was a big spoiler in the first sentence of the blurb! Boo! So don't read the blurb if you don't know about Forugh's life!
I am still going to buy it.

I made it through Ch 17 today (view spoiler)[ I mean, I figured Nassir (Sp? I am listening to the book so I am not sure how to spell the names) was a punk, but that betrayal was hardcore! It is so sad how women who were just trying to be themselves were often put in psych wards back in the day. I wonder how her experience in the hospital will affect her now that she is being released. (hide spoiler)]

[Katrisa]

Marnie wrote: "Through Chapter 17."

I agree 100%!

[Dawn]

Did anyone else watch her documentary The House is Black on youtube? I guess that is her voice doing the commentary in some parts.

[Katrisa]

Dawn wrote: "Did anyone else watch her documentary The House is Black on youtube? I guess that is her voice doing the commentary in some parts."

I will check that out!

[Katrisa]

I am almost done with Ch 22. (view spoiler)[ One sort of issue I have when I read historical fiction about real people is it's hard not to get sucked in like it's a memoir. In the book when it talks about her relationship living with Layla how it was intimate but not quite an actual "relationship" - I feel like it probably was. I can see possibly Forugh not writing about it as I am sure that a female same sex relationship was even more taboo than having an affair.

Now she's out at the burning oil fields talking to the women because the men won't let her be with the rest of the filming crew. (hide spoiler)]

I am just so impressed with Forugh's spirit so far. I know we still have a way to go for equality for genders, but I am glad that I live in a time and place where the strictures constraining women are much more loose.
The poetry pieces that have been in the book so far are just amazing especially knowing the society circumstances and time period she wrote in.

[Katrisa]

I finished this book today. I really enjoyed it. The last bit of the book was intense! (view spoiler)[I was so sad when Layla was killed! I wonder if that letter she wrote after the protest is available to read somewhere? I am interested in what it said. In the poetry book of hers that I am reading the biographical section at the beginning said that she adopted a child from the leper colony. I wonder why the book didn't address that more. (hide spoiler)]

[Vicki]

Katrisa wrote: "I started this yesterday. I am up to ch 12. I am enjoying the audio version. It is just what I hoped for as far as a commuting listen. So far I really like Forugh's character. It is kind of amazin..."

I've started listening to it on audio because I haven't been making time to read lately.
I'm in chapter 12 (view spoiler)[ My thoughts were very similar to yours Karista. How brave she was to behave so outside her upbringing. What a disappointing marriage. What a shame Parviz couldn't trust her and defers so much to his mother. I'm at the part where she has taken the train to Tehran. Leaving her son is going to have consequences. The publishers might not even like her poetry. Seems a big risk but she seems naive despite all she's seen. (hide spoiler)]

[Katrisa]

Vicki wrote: "Katrisa wrote: "I started this yesterday. I am up to ch 12. I am enjoying the audio version. ..."

Are you liking the audio Vicki?

[Vicki]

I am liking the audio.

I've finished ch 16
(view spoiler)[I'm sorry to hear how used she was by that Nazzer guy. You have to wonder how long he'd been planning that and grooming her to debut scandalously. We knew he was bad news from the start but it's unsurprising that if you completely shelter women that they will be more vulnerable. And of course any woman who wants to be independent *must* be a lunatic!

How different her life might have been had her husband trusted her and believed her on their wedding night.

I wonder how many of the small details in this novel are accurate such as the wedding night incident. I know she died young and still don't know how so I'm wondering how much of her life she had made public and I feel pretty weird reading a novelization about a real person. I know I must have read so many books based on real people but this one just seems so intimate that it would be a shame to get it wrong. (hide spoiler)]

[Katrisa]

Vicki wrote: "I am liking the audio.

I've finished ch 16
."

I have similar feelings about historical fiction about real people. This book really makes you feel like you are in Forugh's head. I felt the same way when I read Alice I Have Been - more like I was reading a journal rather than a novel

[Vicki]

One benefit from basing the book on a real woman's life is that I might have had a hard time believing all these things happened to one person in one lifetime otherwise.

[Grainne]

Vicki wrote: "One benefit from basing the book on a real woman's life is that I might have had a hard time believing all these things happened to one person in one lifetime otherwise."

I prefer books that are based on real people that stay true to the history of the time and place. It has a 'walk in her shoes' feel to it that attracts me to this kind of historical fiction, quite intimate at times though. As Katrisa was saying, it's like your in her head.

[Grainne]

Grainne wrote: "Marnie wrote: "I am through Chapter 10
[spoilers removed]

I’m reading this in short bursts. It’s heavy right now and I’m glad for other books to bring relief."

Chapter 10 Her world has completel..."

On the mother-in-law (view spoiler)[ Absolutely, it must be some shock. It's almost like there are three people in the marriage, and the strongest partnership remains that of the son and mother throughout. I am not sure there ever really any room for a wife in that household, except for bearing a child. (hide spoiler)]

[Grainne]

Katrisa wrote: "I am almost done with Ch 22. One sort of issue I have when I read historical fiction about real people is it's hard not to get sucked in like it's a memoir. In the book when it talks about her rel..."

On her relationship with Layla (view spoiler)[ Do you know, that thought never occurred to me about it possibly being a same-sex partnership. To me, it seemed friendly and close like sisters but not lovers. I thought it was written in as an example of a close female friendship between two women. In contrast, at that time there were two main types of female relationships in adulthood:
a) wife-wife-wife-husband or
b) daughter and mother-in-law relationships.

Women rarely owned property or lived alone in Iran at the time. It seemed that there was nothing beyond that in the story, from my reading of it. It's so interesting how people interpret it differently. (hide spoiler)]

[Marnie]

Grainne wrote: "Grainne wrote:

On the Mother-in-law (view spoiler)[ I know different cultures have different norms but if I had to live with my MIL I’d have ended up divorced too. I related to her a great deal on that score. (hide spoiler)]

[Vicki]

Through ch 24

About Layla

(view spoiler)[I never thought of them as lovers. It's possible they were but I just thought they were kindred in being independent women, something of outsiders for their time. Farough sure owed a lot to Layla, she saved her life and gave her shelter. So many women didn't have that option. (hide spoiler)]

[Marie (UK)]

I am just starting this - it is strange but my last book has a very similar storyline

The opening chapter is stark and eye opening - Forugh's ordeal is harrowing. I feel immediate sympathy for her

[Grainne]

Vicki wrote: "Through ch 24

About Layla

[spoilers removed]"

Definitely Vicki. I thought the same. (view spoiler)[ She owes so much to Layla especially as she rescues her from the mental treatment center. Those electric shock treatments sound horrendous. She is also an older sister/friend looking out for her and at one point in the book she asks her, "are you sure?" or something similar when Farough is making a big life decision. (hide spoiler)]

[Grainne]

Marnie wrote: "Grainne wrote: "Grainne wrote:

On the Mother-in-law [spoilers removed]"

Luckily, things have progressed and people have more freedom to choose how much time to spend with extended family. More recently though, with the pandemic, extended family is becoming more important and I realize how lucky I am to have some of my elderly relatives to chat to on the phone.

[Grainne]

Marie (UK) wrote: "I am just starting this - it is strange but my last book has a very similar storyline

The opening chapter is stark and eye opening - Forugh's ordeal is harrowing. I feel immediate sympathy for her"

It's a very sudden and deliberate opening chapter. I thought so too. It felt like a splash of cold water about her reality.

[Marie (UK)]

I have read to the end of chapter 6 - OR should I say listened as I have the audio version.

First off I like the narrator I like how she isn't trying too hard to have different voices but letting the words speak for themselves.

For me I am not really keen on such harrowing fiction I like a book to take me away from all that BUT i know this sort of book is important in telling the reader about the culture and practices of a nation. I suppose we could compare it to stories of slavery in that both situations are built on two opposing views of what is acceptable. By that I mean for a long time a great majority of civilised people believed slavery was a good thing and it is only changing world attitudes that will change accepted practice.

I have not read all the reading group questions but felt the first one was really pertinent to this section.

Is Furugh the only captive bird here? Which other characters are trapped? and how do they cope with that captivity

(view spoiler)[ I would argue that most of the main characters are trapped. Yes even the ones doling out the punishment are trapped by their desire to get the best for their daughter in the cultural world they live in. Furugh's parents deal with that by conforming and to some extent so does her sister but Furugh is not one to conform.

I thought about Vikki said when she said she imagined worse and wondered why she fought so much. Post 10 under the chapter 1 spoiler I tried to put myself into Furugh's place would I fight or submit hoping the outcome would be easier? I think she fought precisely because she had no idea what was to happen - it could have been worse but she was not to know that. (hide spoiler)]

I cannot say I am enjoying the books so far and I will have to layer it in with other books so that I can cope but it is certainly thought provoking

[Katrisa]

Marie (UK) wrote: "I have read to the end of chapter 6 - OR should I say listened as I have the audio version.

First off I like the narrator I like how she isn't trying too hard to have different voices but letting ..."

I agree - I thought the audio narrator did a great job. Also, I had to layer this book with others as well. This was my drive home book.