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message 1: by Kitty G Books (new)

Kitty G Books (kool_kat_kitty) | 671 comments Mod
Discussion of Chapter 13 ONLY please, no spoilers for any other part of the book!

message 2: by Kitty G Books (new)

Kitty G Books (kool_kat_kitty) | 671 comments Mod
Well I have no idea if it's just me still reading this book but I have to say it's well worth talking about and updating my thoughts any way and so I plan to do that even if it is just me ;)

I LOVE this book. I am pretty certain that this is going to get a very good rating from me, and I will say that this story is just so well written and told that I am truly enjoying it.

I am both reading sections of this book and listening to the audiobook too and I think this is really helping to immerse me in the story and bring to life the characters.

I love the magic. There's so many types and fractures and bonds which we've now learned about. I love seeing all of the Nuns and the Abbess and Mag and The Red Knight and Harmodius take on Thorn. I enjoyed seeing the way they each crafted their own mind palaces. I loved seeing the sharing of information and thoughts. I love their plans.

Basically, I think that the magic and the way it works with both the power of the Wild and the power of the Sun is really really cool. Plus we have the physical power which Mag has and that's something she doesn't really understand yet but it's certainly mystifying!

I liked learning about the past of the Red Knight and seeing his true name and heritage which was really wonderful. I never suspected that he was a bastard and bred to be a terror and commander of the Wild by his mother and those revelations have been really wonderful.
I also enjoyed his reconnection with his brother and even though they're in the midst of battle their forgiveness of one another and their conversation was heartfelt and wonderful.

Seeing Amicia healing The Red Knight's brother was really wonderful too. She's clearly seriously strong and badass and I like her character more as we go one because of how wonderful she seems. It also seems like she's destined for great things and I can't wait to see more of her.
I also think their 'sort of' relationship is pretty funny and they always seem to argue, but it's a fairly realistic portrayal of the situation! I hope that maybe they get a proper chance at love, but again who knows because a war can leave many things to chance!

Seeing the Queen as she journeys to meet the King is good, although we've not seen her for a little while by the end of the chapter as the focus is on the battle with Thorn. I think she will bring confidence and help to the King's army and I hope that they do indeed make it to Lissen Carak to relieve and assist the Red Knight and the Abbess.

I think there are a lot of great characters in this and it makes me truly love reading it because even though there's a lot of battle scenes the characterisation and development that we constantly get is so wonderful and truly fleshes this book out.

Gaston and Jean's story line is at the moment one of the most odd because they constantly seem to want different and yet similar things. Gaston is always trying to control his cousin who is always doing the most outrageous thing. I do like seeing Jean's Angel though and I want to learn more about what's really going on there for sure!!

So far I'm enjoying nearly every section and I think it's wonderfully written. I can't wait to finish it up and see how it goes and I have book 2 on standby for whenever I need to continue on desperately :)

message 3: by Dale (last edited Mar 04, 2015 12:45AM) (new)

Dale Nevin | 20 comments Hi Kaitlin still along for the read here. Trying to get finished asap as i have lots to get through for March. I am really enjoying this book so far. I had heard great things about it from a local radio station and hasn't disappointed. I agree with your views of the writing and after coming from the Malazan series it is refreshing not having to re read passages to try and understand what is going on lol.
Great characters and everyone we meet it feels as if you really get to know them. Even if they only have a tinny part. Again I put this down to the writing.

Overall so far im expecting to give this a pretty high rating as well

message 4: by Kitty G Books (new)

Kitty G Books (kool_kat_kitty) | 671 comments Mod
Awesome it's not just me Dale! I'm glad you're enjoying it too!! :-)

message 5: by D.H. (new)

D.H. | 7 comments I’m still reading it as well. I love this book. I just read it so fast that I did not post in every thread even though I usually have a lot to say after each chapter.

How do you like Michael's diary about the Siege of Lissen Carak? I wonder why the author decided to add that since a lot of the times Michael just shares information we already know. Maybe it will be important later, since it's a 5 book series or the author just wanted to explain strategies to us once more and make sure that we get it.

I think it's interesting that the Abbess knows Thorn (formally called Richard Plangere as we now know) and did not want to share her information at first. One would think the safety of everyone is more important than any secret. And not only did she know him, but she was his lover.
I like how she also knows Harmodius. She has led quite an interesting life it seems before she became a nun.
I think the scene with Harmodius, the captain and the Abbess was very interesting because he also knows who the Red Knight is. I found it interesting how shocked the Red Knight was that Harmodius knows his identity and how horrified he was that he could reveal him. And it seems like the captain has a new person to spar with verbally. I like their dynamic.

I also admired how the Red Knight dealt with Sym after his attempt to force himself on that woman. It must be hard to keep all those former criminals in line. I think he does a splendid job. Yet, his rage at Sym's behavior did not cloud his judgment as someone who needs to get through a siege, so he decided he still needs Sym’s sword arm. I thought his “Evil is a choice” speech to him was great, especially because he also speaks about himself.

A very interesting part was the way Prudentia warned the Red Knight about keeping his door open. He wanted to reach out to Amicia and Thorn used that open door somehow and almost killed him. Harmodius saved him and once again tells him that he knows who he is. This is also the first time someone says his whole name out loud, which is Gabriel Murien. We find out quite a bit. That he faked his own death, for example, but that he actually meant to go through with it. That he once tried to kill himself was not new though. We found out about that back in chapter 10, which was a really sad scene to read.
I liked how his old valet Jacques came to support him and pressured Harmodius not to reveal anything.
Harmodius apparently knows Gabriel’s mother, too. He does not seem to like her. It’s sad to see how vulnerable and therefore aggressive Gabriel turns whenever Harmodius mentions his mother. She must have been horrible.

We also find out that what the Red Knight did with Pruedentia is not considered normal or even “accepted” in Hermeticism. According to Harmodius it’s considered heresy, necromancy ad maybe kidnapping. This makes me believe that while magic is not forbidden, it can still be dangerous to cross some lines and I wonder if people in this world are persecuted and executed for some things. We don’t know much about that yet.
Harmodius tries to find out how powerful Gabriel is and seems very impressed. He asks why he is not "the shining light of Hermeticism" and Gabriel says it’s not what he wants. This makes sense since he wants to get away from the path his mother chose for him. The magus also tutors Gabriel and pressures him to stop wallowing about his past and use his powers more. Gabriel listens to him and says he only rebels against Harmodius because he reminds him of his not-father. Harmodius answers that he does not drink enough to remind him of his father, so we know that he knows Gabriel’s supposed father as well. But from the way he reacted to Gabriel at first, I wonder if the magus also knows who Gabriel’s real father is. This is a secret that still needs to be revealed.

I was right about Gawin being the Red Knight's brother. I like this development at lot. I liked their brotherly scene as well. When he visitis his brother I think he is determined to keep his distance and keep hating him. But Gabriel surprises us. Right from the start he helps him up and even fluffs his pillows. I think that really shows some strength of character. We find out more about their sad childhood and what his parents and his brothers did to Gabriel. His brothers killed Prudentia at his mother’s orders. Gawin realized his mother lied when she said she corrupted Gabriel and that they murdered her. I think the fact that Gawin didn’t truly know what he was doing makes Gabriel forgive him that fast. That and probably his desire for some family.
I wonder what else we don’t know. There are so many secrets we still need to be told about. For example when Gawin says he now realizes that they had been lied to by their mother to kill Purdentia, Gabriel thinks to himself that “the truth was that the truth was too horrible to share. Shameful, horrible, deeply wounding to everyone it could possibly touch”. But all he says to Gawin is that Prudentia knew something she shouldn’t have. So what was it? Also, why didn’t his own brothers know that he was trained as a magician? My dislike for their mother is ignited once again when we find out that while training him she kept telling the other boys that Gabriel is weak, effeminate and a poor knight and we find out that Gabriel always (probably had to) let Gawin win in sword fights.
We once again hear the story about why Gawin went to die out alone in the Wild. That he couldn’t live with himself when they found Gabriel’s dead body. He realized how all of them hated him “into death”, which I found a sad way to describe the situation.
We also find out how highly born he truly is. Apparently he is the heir of the Duke of North and the king's sister's son.The Captain makes a sarcastic comment about being the "son of the king’s sister all right" and only then does Gawin realize that they don’t have the same father. I think it’s interesting that he didn’t know they're only half-brothers, either, because at first I thought that this was the reason his brothers hated him. Lots of secrets in this family... Considering the secrets I noticed one more thing. Gabriel tells Gawin that he knows what the enemy thinks. Gawin asks why and Gabriel/the author does not tell us yet again. He knows what they think for the same reason he curses God every day (and probably the reason for his glowing eyes and the beasts always coming straight for him?). I still think the fact that he was trained as a magician is not the extent of it. I have a feeling that there is a little more and hopefully we will find out soon.
Oh, one more thing about their scene that I liked was that not only did he forgive his brother, but he directly starts being a good brother by listening to his troubles and problems and comforts him about the incident with Jean.

The conversation with his brother causes Gabriel's new problem with Amicia, who overheard everything. She is nice to Gawin and shares her secret with him by healing him.
However, after she is done, she confronts Gabriel and her rejection hit him hard. She thinks that seeing as he is some lost prince and she was an Outwaller, that he might only play with her, that he could have any rich, well-born girl he wants. I think she was being unfair here, especially when she then plays down his demons of the past and thinks he was just a rich boy who fought with his brothers occasionally and whines about it now. But I also understand her. I like that she thinks about whether a relationship can work and that she does not just throw away her life as a nun because she fell in love. And knowing that he is even related to the king and she was just an outwaller, I do understand her hesitations.
I think Amicia will be a great character in the following books. Even the Abbess states that Amicia is greater than any of them, which surprised me.
Gabriel was quite heartbroken about this situation. I really hope that things will work out for them.

We also get Sauce’s POV more now, too. I like her and am kind of rooting for her to prove herself to those men. I also have the feeling that there will be something between her and Bad Tom. Despite teasing her, he does seem to respect her.

Thorn is getting more aggressive now. He destroyed the villages. I think his trick with the poison was good, even though with Amicia's and Harmodius' help, the captain could prevent a disaster.
I agree with you that the magic is really interesting. I also like how they all can communicate “telepathically” and enter each other's places now.
Harmodius also taught the captain to “divide himself”, but not to use it for his emotions because their humanity is all they have. Yet, the captain uses it the minute Harmodius left. He is very sad because of Amicia’s rejection, yet he knows that he needs to concentrate on holding out until the king arrives. I understand him using his abilities to not feel all those emotions, but I hope this does not become a real problem. But he thinks to himself that he needs to control this, so I believe as long as he knows that this is wrong and should not be done often, he is good.

Gabriel had to deal with disobedience in these chapters as well, because his mercenaries are scared (I don't blame them. What were the odds the captain said at one point, I think they were outnumbered at least thirty to one?). I liked how he put Jehannes in his place when they discussed the holding of the Lower Town. I also liked the confrontation with Ser George. He seems determined to win.

We also get another glimpse at how powerful the Abbess is. I think there are more secrets about her as well, because after seeing her magic, Harmodius asks her, despite knowing her, who she is. The author really reveals all those things slowly.

I personally really like the battle scenes. I think especially in this book they are so well written.
One thing I forgot to mention in earlier threads is the fact that Miles Cameron does a really good job at showing how hard being a knight really is. Gabriel is how old? 20? And after wearing that heavy armour and fighting, he has problems with his knee, with his hip. The author also describes how hard it is to breath when the visor is shut, how bad you can really see through those tiny holes etc.. That is something I rarely see in other books. In a museum for medieval warfare I once tried to put such armour on. I couldn’t even stand straight because the chain armour itself was so heavy and pulled me down, that I decided not to put anything else on.
One can really tell that Miles Cameron knows about warfare and armour and all other things medieval.

I find Gaston’s and Jean’s storyline a little odd as well. Right now, I still view Jean as a psychopath. But I’m interested to see where it all leads. I remember Jean saying that he is the best knight in the world, and the Red Knight saying he wants to be the best knight in the world, for one reason or the other. So I’m thinking at one point in this long series there will be a major confrontation. Also, right after Gabriel forgave Gawin, he made his brother’s enemy (Jean) his own enemy. I would like to see such a confrontation.
I'm sure there was more I wanted to say, but this post is long enough and filled with too much gushing. ;-) But I truly don't have any criticism yet.
I'm glad you enjoy this book as well. I think it's a pity this book is not more popular!

message 6: by Kitty G Books (new)

Kitty G Books (kool_kat_kitty) | 671 comments Mod
Oh I 100% agree with you on everything D.H! You said it all much better than I did and went into detail and even picked up on a few things I wanted to say but forgot to like the (possible) fight and confrontation between Gabriel and Jean which I agree I hope we see at some point.

I just love this book and writing and I will 100% be reviewing this when I finish it up on my Youtube channel in the hopes of raising awareness of this really brilliant book.

I hope I can finish it up today but we will see :D

message 7: by D.H. (new)

D.H. | 7 comments I'm glad you'll review it. Looking forward to your video!
I'm always afraid that when books are not sold enough, the publisher will simply not buy the other books in a series and I won't get a sequel.

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