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message 151: by Ken, Moderator (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
I agree. "Barring bad weather" is a participial phrase and absolutes, I thought, need nouns parked out front.


message 152: by Doug (new)

Doug | 2834 comments Its not even a phrase in my thought.


message 153: by Ken, Moderator (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
It's not a complete thought, is it? Doesn't it need a subj./vb combo to be a clause, or are you saying bad weather is doing the barring?


message 154: by Alex (new)

Alex | 9 comments I think Doug means it's neither a phrase nor a clause. But what then? This still troubles me. If you reverse the words you get "bad weather barring," which could be an absolute construction in the sentence "Bad weather (not) barring (the event), our club will fly kites on Sunday.


message 155: by Ruth (new)

Ruth | 16546 comments Mod
As my Italian teacher used to say about language, it is what it is.


message 156: by Ken, Moderator (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
Tues., March 31

minuscule


"So spelled, not miniscule. The word derives from the word minus; it has nothing to do with the prefix mini-. But the word is commonly misspelled."


source: Garner's Modern American Usage


message 157: by Doug (new)

Doug | 2834 comments Newengland wrote: "Tues., March 31

minuscule


"So spelled, not miniscule. The word derives from the word minus; it has nothing to do with the prefix mini-. But the word is commonly misspelled."


source: [book:Garn..."


Several words like molicule, ridicule, hercule, or folicule end in "cule" but I'm not sure of the reason. Does it means "one" or the "smallest part"?


message 158: by Ruth (new)

Ruth | 16546 comments Mod
I think perhaps it's a diminutive.


message 159: by Ken, Moderator (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
It means very small and derives from a medieval writing style that was simplified and small.

Thurs., April 2

point in time

"This phrase, well known as mere verbiage, occurs most commonly in reported speech. But sometimes it sneaks into print... The clumsy phrase is occasionally made worse by being preceded by particular. Stick with simple substitutes such as time, point, now, moment, and the like."

Source: Garner's Modern American Usage


message 160: by Ruth (new)

Ruth | 16546 comments Mod
Newengland wrote: "
Thurs., April 2

point in time

"This phrase, well known as mere verbiage, occurs most commonly in repo..."


An abomination.


message 161: by Doug (new)

Doug | 2834 comments As a child I heard "Once upon a time" so much that, at some point in time, I began to abhor it.

As a child I heard "Once upon a time" so much I began to abhor it at some point in time.

Oh my...:) :)


message 162: by Ken, Moderator (last edited Apr 03, 2015 04:36AM) (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
Fri., April 3


sans


"Sans is an archaic literary Gallicism to be avoided, unless a tongue-in-cheek or archaic effect is intended. Without is virtually always preferable to sans (as long as one is using the English language).... As an English word, it's pronounced /sanz/, not /sahnz/."


source : Garner's Modern American Usage


message 163: by Ken, Moderator (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
Sat., April 4

dialectal; dialectical; dialectic

"These words are frequently confused. The adjective for dialect (= a regional variety of language) is dialectal. The adjective for dialectics (= the art of argument) is dialectical. Broadly speaking, dialectical means "of or relating to logical argument, historical development, or the resolution of contradictory ideas." The term is usually confined to philosophical contexts.

"The term dialectical is often misuse for dialectal.... Dialectic -- a noun denoting the art of rigorously logical argumentation -- is, when used as an adjective, a needless variant of dialectical."


source: Garner's Modern American Usage


message 164: by Ken, Moderator (last edited Apr 07, 2015 02:10AM) (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
Tues., April 7


goddamned; goddam; goddamn adjectives

"Strictly speaking, the first form is the only correct one. Yet because of the way this word is spoken -- the final -d usually being silent -- the latter two spellings commonly appear in print. And since the prose in which such expletives occur is almost always informal, it would be pedantic to insist on goddamned. The more loosely spelled forms make the word seem less literal, and therefore less offensive..."

(It's not often a grammarian gives you leeway. Take it!)


source: Garner's Modern American Usage


message 165: by Ken, Moderator (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
Wed., April 8

lie > lay > lain


"So inflected (except when lie means "to utter a falsity" -- see below). A murderer may lie in wait. Yesterday he lay in wait. And for several days he has lain in wait -- e.g. 'The Ramseys say an intruder may have lay [read lain] in wait for hours before killing the 6-year-old beauty queen.' 'Ramsey's Mission: Find the Killer,' Austin Am.-Statesman, 18 Mar. 2000....

"In the sense of telling an untruth, the verb is inflected lie > lied > lied."


source: Garner's Modern American Usage


message 166: by Doug (new)

Doug | 2834 comments Newengland wrote: "Wed., April 8

lie > lay > lain


"So inflected (except when lie means "to utter a falsity" -- see below). A murderer may lie in wait. Yesterday he lay in wait. And for several days he has lain in ..."

___________________________________

Thanks for putting this one up, NE.
Here's a few of my own observations about "lay" and it's uses.

A person (or object) can also stand in wait (or in line). I have not heard of sitting in wait or resting in wait, but why not? What is the intellective reasoning intended when one uses this word combination? Normally "to lie", by definition, one would be positioned (laying) only. But by inferrence, does it have to do with idleness? No! One could muti-task while laying in wait. Is the writer inflecting his opinion by use of a phrase construction like this? He could be. He has every right to do so in fiction work. In fiction or in non-fiction it might be more interesting to say something else known too, like "the killer arranged the forensic scene (working in wait) for his victim. In that case the horizontal position concept is replaced along with any other possibility like sleep, idleness, etc. Although working while laying in wait seems odd it implies an intellectual lay in wait of time.

The horse stood in wait for a new cavalier. The spurs lie in wait for an heir to don them. They were lain away. Usually the inference of "lay", especially with people, means in a horizontal position but with objects it could refer to a specific place as well as a specific position probably characteristic to the object.

Sometimes old accepted phrases can carry a lot of surreptitious baggage. Their use can force the addition of additional verbiage to clarify them which may be a good thing.

I hope I did not make a mistake or bore anyone.


message 167: by Ken, Moderator (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
Wow. Interesting thoughts, Doug. I've surely never considered "laying in wait" because it brings us to the nasty transitive/intransitive divide again -- a place I'm wary of!


message 168: by Ken, Moderator (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
Thurs., April 9


linking verb

"A verb that connects a subject to its complement. For example, in dinner smells good, smells links the subject with the adjective describing it. Among the common linking verbs are be-verbs, appear (She appears confident), become (They became incensed), feel (It feels gooey), go (The milk went sour), grow (Some of them grew impatient), prove (It proved impossible), remain (They remained steadfast), seem (He seemed happy), smell (It smelled rancid), taste (It tastes bitter), wax (She waxed eloquent). -- Also termed connecting verb; copula; copular verb; copulative verb; equational verb."


source: Garner's Modern American Usage


message 169: by Doug (new)

Doug | 2834 comments Newengland wrote: "Wow. Interesting thoughts, Doug. I've surely never considered "laying in wait" because it brings us to the nasty transitive/intransitive divide again -- a place I'm wary of!"

Thanks. Yes, a wary place for me too, but fun. People have been scared off using "lay" when in fact so much can be be done with it.


message 170: by Ken, Moderator (last edited Apr 10, 2015 02:19AM) (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
Fri., April 10

mien "(= demeanor, appearance, bearing) often carries connotations of formidableness (his imposing mien). The word is pronounced /meen/."


source: Garner's Modern American Usage


message 171: by Ken, Moderator (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
Sun., April 12


hoi polloi "(= the common people, the masses). Because hoi in Greek means 'the (plural),' the hoi polloi is technically redundant. But the three-word phrase predominates and ought to be accepted.

"What shouldn't be accepted, though, is the growing misuse of hoi polloi to refer to the elite. This might occur through a false association with hoity-toity (= arrogant, haughty) or high and mighty..."


source: Garner's Modern American Usage


message 172: by Ruth (new)

Ruth | 16546 comments Mod
Puts me in mind of The La Brea Tar Pits. The the tar tar pits.


message 173: by Doug (new)

Doug | 2834 comments I believe a hottie tottie is a small hot water bottle or a small warm bedtime drink perhaps scotch liquor.

Any other ideas?


message 174: by Ken, Moderator (last edited Apr 13, 2015 02:36AM) (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
Mon., April 13


Semicolon: Part 1 of 4

"This mark -- a kind of 'supercomma' -- separates sentence parts that need a more distinct break than a comma can signal, but that are too closely connected to be made into separate sentences. Typically these will be clauses of similar importance and grammatical construction.

"Four uses are common.

"First, the semicolon is sometimes used to unite closely connected sentences; typically, as in this very sentence, there is no conjunction between the clauses. E.g.: 'But Shakespeare's language appears entirely familiar to us, although it is almost 400 years old; the spelling, the vocabulary, the shapes of the words and phrases seem to have changed but little in that time.' W.F. Bolton, A Short History of Literary English (1972). Often, such a sentence signals an antithesis -- e.g.:

* 'He did not lead; he followed.' John Wain, "Byron: The Search for Identity'

* 'The evil lover is not prudent; he is simply wicked.' W. Ross Winterowd, Rhetoric: A Synthesis

* 'Malamud promises an oeuvre; Bellow, at fifty-one, has already achieved one.' Anthony Burgess

'Some editors would argue that in the first two examples, the clauses are so short and interconnected that a comma could have been used instead of a semicolon, especially since there is no other internal punctuation. But the better practice is to use a semicolon rather than a comma."

Part 2 of 4 tomorrow.


message 175: by Ruth (new)

Ruth | 16546 comments Mod
Hate semicolons, especially in poetry. they're so plug ugly. Always try to write my way around them.


message 176: by Ken, Moderator (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
I like them for a rule yet to appear here, but nothing replaces my favorite -- the dash.


message 177: by Doug (new)

Doug | 2834 comments Not big on dashes. I love the semi-colon because it replaces "for example", "instead of", rather than, and several other weirs in the smoothness of an otherwise choppy river of a sentence.


message 178: by Kenneth P. (new)

Kenneth P. (kennethp) Part one of four? I'm on the edge of my sofa (and I'm not kidding). Poets are lawless Ruth. Your get-out-of-jail card is for life. But I don't blame you; the semi-colon is plug ugly. Before it went onto the side of a milk carton, was it a hedge against sentence fragments? Nowadays writers drop in a period followed by a broken sentence. It's commonplace.


message 179: by Ruth (last edited Apr 14, 2015 07:26AM) (new)

Ruth | 16546 comments Mod
Poetic licenses don't need to be renewed? That's nice to know.


message 180: by Ken, Moderator (last edited Apr 14, 2015 02:30AM) (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
Tues., April 14



Semicolon: Part 2 of 4 "Second, the semicolon sometimes separates coordinate clauses in long, complex sentences. This use was much more common in the 19th century than it is today -- e.g.

'But Elizabeth was not formed for ill-humour; and though every prospect of her own was destroyed for the evening, it could not dwell ing on her spirits; and having told all her griefs to Charlotte Lucas, whom she had not sen for a week, she was soon able to make a voluntary transition to the oddities of her cousin, and to point thin out other in particular notice' Jane Austen, Pride and Prejudice.'"

source: Garner's Modern American Usage


message 181: by Doug (new)

Doug | 2834 comments Can you define coordinate clauses, please?


message 182: by Kenneth P. (new)

Kenneth P. (kennethp) Newengland wrote: "I like them for a rule yet to appear here, but nothing replaces my favorite -- the dash."

Computers won't give us a proper dash. But I'm over it. I'm above it.


message 183: by Doug (new)

Doug | 2834 comments Computers won't give us a proper dash. But I'm over it. I'm above it."


Try ellipses ... or if that doesn't make you pensive long enough, try *** for another tool.


message 184: by Kenneth P. (new)

Kenneth P. (kennethp) Pensive? I need to become pensive? I'll be pensive in the river post-jump.


message 185: by Doug (new)

Doug | 2834 comments Kenneth P. wrote: "Pensive? I need to become pensive? I'll be pensive in the river post-jump."

:) :)


message 186: by Ken, Moderator (last edited Apr 15, 2015 03:18PM) (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
Wed., April 15


Semicolon: Part 3 of 4 "Third, the semicolon separates items in a series when any element in the series contains an internal comma -- e.g.

'Between 1815 and 1850 Americans constructed elaborate networks of roads, canals, and early railroad lines; opened up wide areas of newly acquired land for settlement and trade; and began to industrialize manufacturing.' Sean Wilentz, 'Society, Politics, and the Market Revolution,' in The New American History 62 (Eric Foner ed., 1997)."


source: Garner's Modern American Usage

This is the semicolon rule I admire and use, especially when commas appear in two or more of the items in a series. Too many commas creates confusion. Semicolons restore peace to the land.


message 187: by Ruth (new)

Ruth | 16546 comments Mod
Doug wrote: "Computers won't give us a proper dash. But I'm over it. I'm above it."."

If I hit two n dashes on my Mac, I get an m dash. I think I remember doing on my PC by hitting two n dashes and then hitting the space bar.


message 188: by Ken, Moderator (last edited Apr 15, 2015 02:22AM) (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
The difference between an "n dash" and a hyphen is something I was never taught. Yes, it will be here soon.

As for the dash, two hyphens (or, as Ruth says, n dashes) seems to do it, then hit return.


message 189: by Ken, Moderator (last edited Apr 15, 2015 03:27PM) (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
Thurs., April 16


Semicolon: Part 4 of 4 "Fourth, the semicolon sometimes appears simply to give a weightier pause than a comma would. This use is discretionary. A comma would do, but the writer wants a stronger stop -- e.g. 'There is never anything sexy about Lautrec's art; but there also is never anything deliberately, sarcastically anti-feminist in it.' Alduous Huxley, "Doodles in the Dictionary"...

"The most common misuse of the semicolon is to place it where a colon belongs. Thus, it's not so uncommon to see, in a business letter, a semicolon after the salutation: 'Dear Sarah;....' But the semicolon stops the forward movement of a statement, whereas a colon marks a forward movement. In any given published example, the error might simply be a typographical error. But it happens too commonly to be routinely a typo -- e.g. 'In addition to those whose names appear as contributors, I am especially grateful to the following for their valuable assistance in the preparation of the Second Edition; Luciano Berio, Juilliard School of Music; David Burrows; New York University;....' Willi Apel, Harvard Dictionary of Music v-vi (2d ed., 1972). In that sentence, the first semicolon should be a colon; the others are correct."


source: Garner's Modern American Usage


message 190: by Doug (new)

Doug | 2834 comments Newengland wrote: "The difference between an "n dash" and a hyphen is something I was never taught. Yes, it will be here soon.

As for the dash, two hyphens (or, as Ruth says, n dashes) seems to do it, then hit return."



On my old Windows computer with MS Word:
these substitutions must be (or already are) programmed into the MS Word library you have on your specific machine. You can make more character combination substitutions as you want to make but do not substitute one single character or a common pair of characters for some other combination or you will have problems.

For instance you can make .. change into one period and 2 spaces which speeds up typing. Or you can make any letter following two spaces be capitalized saving you the trouble of hitting the shift key to start sentences. I think newer versions have many of these already ready to be activated. I used to use (c) which changed automatically to a copyright symbol. You can even have it add the year but you have to change it every new years' eve. You can even make "dog" change to "cat". On Goodreads though, you may be using their program real time and not actually the one in your own machine (I don't know) so you can look and try it in your own documents start-up for a test.

Check it out in the "help" menu and see if it will work for you.


message 191: by Ken, Moderator (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
I'll explore this. Thanks! (I work with a Mac, however.)


message 192: by Ruth (last edited Apr 16, 2015 07:41AM) (new)

Ruth | 16546 comments Mod
Will goodreads do an m dash--apparently not.


message 193: by Richard (last edited Apr 16, 2015 11:17AM) (new)

Richard Ruth wrote: "Will goodreads do an m dash--apparently not."

Ruth, press Alt (or Option), Shift and the minus key on a Mac for an em dash. Using two hypens and a space may not work in all applications/situations. However, I agree that Goodreads seems not to allow it — at least in these discussion posts.

Edit:

Or maybe that was an em dash — but it didn't look like one when I was entering the text.

The option/alt keys are next to the Cmd keys on an Apple keyboard.


message 194: by Doug (new)

Doug | 2834 comments Richard wrote: "Ruth wrote: "Will goodreads do an m dash--apparently not."

Ruth, press Alt (or Option), Shift and the minus key on a Mac for an em dash. Using two hypens and a space may not work in all applicatio..."


Thanks Richard,
When I submitted things into Goodreads some of my fancy finger-work was reduced to basics. i suspect that is done necessarily due to all the various formatting styli they receive being too much to monitor and edit.


message 195: by Ken, Moderator (last edited Apr 18, 2015 02:28AM) (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
Sat., April 18


extraneous; extrinsic; external

"These words are closely related. Extraneous = (1) not essential or inherent (she used her discretion in adding some extraneous ingredients); (2) not relevant (he talked at length about extraneous issues); or (3) coming from outside (extraneous matter).

"Extrinsic, which shares senses 1 and 3 of extraneous, primarily means 'not inherent.'' It is the usual antonym of intrinsic (= belonging to the essential nature of something). E.g.: '[In] American culture, in [de Tocqueville's] view,...artistic standard would be determined not by the intrinsic quality of the art but by the extrinsic size of the audience.' Robert Brustein, 'The Decline of High Culture,' New Republic...

"External means simply 'outer, exterior.' It's the usual antonym of internal -- e.g.: 'Just as controversy embroiled its birth, the state of Israel is again racked by internal divisions and external dilemmas with its 50th anniversary fast approaching.' Storer H. Rowley, 'Anniversary Prompts Soul-Searching,' Chicago Trib."


source: Garner's Modern American Usage


message 196: by Doug (new)

Doug | 2834 comments Newengland wrote: "Sat., April 18


extraneous; extrinsic; external

Thanks, NE, for this thread and daily tips. Now I have a question for you, NE, or anybody about this one from Garner's. Are these three words just ordinary definitions or is there something special about them?

Can't you effectively convert almost any verb or noun with the preposition "ex" or prefix "ex-" or"ex_____" and thereby turn it to a negative, opposite, or antithetical, or extrovert it in some way?



message 197: by Ken, Moderator (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
Mon., April 20


Ex-, "when meaning 'former,' should always be hyphenated: 'A bitter exemployee [read ex-employee] can do great harm....[W]hen people feel they have been fired 'fairly'... they will be reluctant to badmouth their excompany [read ex-company].' Mark H. McCormack, What They Don't Teach You at Harvard Business School...

"A problem arises when using the prefix with a noun phrase. Is an ex-brain surgeon a former brain surgeon, one formerly having a brain, or a specialist in head-autopsies? Although a nitpicker might argue for either of the last two, most reasonable readers will understand that ex- applies to the entire phrase, not just to the attributive. By far the better approach is to use former rather than to prefix the first word of a phrase...

"Some copyeditors have learned to use an en-dash when a hyphenated combining form (such as ex- combines with a compound having a space: ex-brain surgeon and the like. The compounds tend to read somewhat better this way. Still it's always bets to look for a solution that won't make the reader do a double take."

source: Garner's Modern American Usage


message 198: by Doug (new)

Doug | 2834 comments I flunked brain surgery. In poetry everybody gets a pass. Thanks for this tip I had never thought about. If I got a brain transplant would it be identity theft or cosmetic surgery?


message 199: by Ken, Moderator (new)

Ken | 18714 comments Mod
It'd be painful.


message 200: by Doug (last edited Apr 20, 2015 10:54AM) (new)

Doug | 2834 comments For someone, I'm sure, but there's no pain in the brain, just the neck.


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