The First Read of 2015: Othello!

[Christine]

Great BBC program! Othello is a very haunting play. Some scholars say it is the most tragic of all Shakespeare's tragedies.

Candy -- I have been thinking about the context of the military -- as you say, 'the way we program soldiers'. It strikes me that Othello may have not worked as a believable character were it not for this military context. AND the military context makes it even more tragic, the fact that Othello could only really trust death and the power to inflict death, rather than the uncertainty of human emotions.

I am still trying to work out the concept of 'honest Iago'. Cleary Iago has told some blatant and fabricated lies! I am still wondering why Shakespeare chose the repetition of the word 'honest'.

Heavy stuff. I am so glad to have read this with the group.

[Candy]

Yes, I'm not sure I have a firm grip on either rOthello or Iago. David Harewood said in the BBC program (I guess its also PBS?) that knowing Othello is knowing oneself or paraphrased....thats intriguing and challenging.

I have another thing haunting me....

Okay...so Iago was turned down for promotion, right?

Why? Was Othello directly responsible for that?

Iago hates Othello. We don't know exactly why.

I have a couple impressions/theories.

Iago was turned down for promotion...I believe that is a potential sign of his character. As the audience we are the only ones who know he hates Othello...and he is resenting his lack of promotion....perhaps....his lack of promotion is because he shouldn't be promoted! Intuitively, he wasn't assigned a higher status with more power because his personality was already perceived either overtly, or unconsciously.

And if he wasn't promoted....why did Othello who believes in rank....in society...trust someone who wasn't promoted?

I think the idea of relationships and intimacy is so important here in this play. Desdemona should have been "ranked" higher in Othello's life.

This is my second feeling...that Othello wasn't sophisticated in relationships. He didn't know how to re-evaluate priorities.

He gave in to someone who did not qualify for advancement under his leadership....his real allegiance should have been to Desdemona.

Is this an issue of transitional mind? His mind is still in crisis? From war? From culture change? From being an outsider?

Somehow...trust and vulnerability are a part of the lesson in this play...

[Lea]

Ok, after all these recommendations, I just watched the BBC/PBS Shakespeare Uncovered Othello episode. Out of order as I'm still trying to catch up with Season 1

But anyhow, yes, it was very good. and the whole thing is unnerving/frustrating all over again.

Why didn't Othello trust Desdemona is a very good question. Why wasn't she "ranked" higher in Othello's life? I don't know. Maybe it's the day I'm having (some sexist comments by colleagues this morning), but maybe it is because Desdemona is a woman? Simply that. Women are never constant and trustworthy, of course, but didn't you know that?

[Christine]

Yes, I am sure it has something to do with the idea of women never being trustworthy. (Oh Eve, you ate that apple! :P)

Othello should have trusted his wife. The idea of trusting your wife was perhaps an outrageous concept? Ahead of the times?

I am reminded of the song from 'Much Ado About Nothing'. Remember, 'Men were deceivers ever ... One foot at sea and one at shore and constant to the same never...'

Maybe the whole point was that husbands and wives should learn to trust each other. I still say Shakespeare was really ahead of his time.

[Candy]

Joseph, can you move this comment over to Twelfth Night topic....I tried but can't seem to do it without making a mess. I think accidentally it got posted here....

:)

[Candy]

Yes, when I woke up this morning....I immediately was thinking about the characters here.

I think Shakespeare has made characters that he doesn't explain. And I think he does it so wonderfully...

We don't know why Iago is bitter, and conniving. I don't think it's enough that he didn't get a promotion. Lots of people work the same regular jobs, sometimes repetitive ordinary jobs like in a factory. And yet they have a dignity about their work. They don't blame others or regret not having promotions.

I think Iago's decision to do such a game on Othello is evidence enough of a disturbed mind. Period.

(I think we can learn to build our own sense of right and wrong and loyalty by rejecting Iago utterly.)

Othello....we don't know why he is so passionate...yet so able to believe someone he shouldn't. I think it's a patriarchy thing...but it's still not enough. there are thousands of partners, and husbands, who put the value of their trust in their wives and believe them...and would have told their wives of the rumors etc. Or just out and out dismissed them!

And as for Desdemona...I don't see her at fault or weakness here at all. Maybe she could have said "I haven't done anything"....but she sort of really did.

Christine, aside form a Christian idea of women untrustworthiness...I can extend the concept further back in time, and into a physical reality....of the actual physical mystery of women.

Women are always going to be mysterious....to men...and a potential for distrust because a man has no way of knowing if his wife is carrying his baby.

End of the day, bottom line...men don't trust women because for ever...we can not know who is at the parent/father of a baby. The way we know and have faith is built upon huge customs of behavior and loyalty...in deeds, in marriage contracts, in personal accounts and the reference system among families and neighbours.

One of the reason Maury Povitch has such longevity with a very vulgar, loud, aggressive tv show....in the United States is because he programs most of his episodes around paternity. DNA is his main cartel with groups of people who have not had conventional healthy social communities. The basic suspicion against women is that they can hide paternity. Period.

We need our customs and behaviors of loyalty embedded within strict taboos. Humans will break taboos....they will act impulsively and selfishly or in ignorance. If we don't protect each other within our communities....then we can monitor and protect our loyalties.

I think the breakdown in Othello is that hidden scary feeling that our customs, our promises and taboos...are victim to human error and Othello ultimately did not trust people.Iago played upon that fear.

If we don't clearly understand the line between childhood wounds and heal them...(we can know that both Iago and Othello have unresolved pasts in childhood because of their poor opinion of other people)

If we don't heal those mistrusting in others...we will project a negative opinion on others.

We have negative opinions of other people and we enable other people when we believe that humans are ultimately bad.

When we believe humans have the capacity for good honest loyal living....we can forgive our childhoods...and we can trust and recognize good people. And recognize distrurbed people.

[scherzo♫]

Thanks Candy for these insights into men's fears about women.

[Christine]

Candy wrote: " Women are always going to be mysterious....to men...and a potential for distrust because a man has no way of knowing if his wife is carrying his baby..."

Ahhh, good point, Candy. It is like a built in question of mistrust, which can only be overcome by transcending the ideas of doubt and jealousy. (And in Shakespeare's time, wow! Sex outside of marriage was a HUGE issue because of the importance of blood lines.)

I keep thinking of the 'Green eyed monster' the jealously and vulnerability in all of us.

[Candy]

Hey...I am half way into HOUSE OF CARDS season 2....and isn't it very likely that Kevin spacey's character is inspired by Iago?

James...you should get a hold of the series for your mum!

It's really brilliant. The opening credits are of D.C. filmed from angles that emphasize the concept of fascism in architecture.

Great show!