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Can I get a little help?
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You don't need money to self-publish in this age of ebooks and createspace. I now have 14 books published and available on Amazon, Barnes and Noble and Books A Million. I have spent $0.
Personally I don't support kickstarters, I'm saving my pennies to pay for my own covers and editors. Have you thought of promoting your first novel and using those sales to pay for book 2?
Peggy wrote: "You don't need money to self-publish in this age of ebooks and createspace. I now have 14 books published and available on Amazon, Barnes and Noble and Books A Million. I have spent $0."And I published three books last year, two of which cost me $0 as they went through small publishers.
But doesn't change the fact that I still require the funds for professional editing and a book cover because I know no one of that calibre who could do it for me for nothing.
A.W. wrote: "Personally I don't support kickstarters, I'm saving my pennies to pay for my own covers and editors. Have you thought of promoting your first novel and using those sales to pay for book 2?"And it makes me physically ill to ask for said assistance. Unfortunately, real life has continued to be a female dog since I released The Rogue King last year. Savings are ... well, I won't bore you with all that.
I have, however, been able to kick promoting all my novels up a notch since regaining the internet I'd lost for about six months.
Ask for beta readers here on goodreads, most of us can't afford professional editors, swap manuscripts and reviews with other people, join a critique/review group, you'll gain friends by working for it rather than asking for handouts.Believe me, a great many of us are in the same boat, and a lot of people would find you asking for money, instead of practical help off putting, if not rather offensive.
You can pick up a decent a pre-made cover for $40 -$60, some in matching series, or make your own as you have been.
May I also suggest you completely finish each series before starting another? Many readers won't start a book if it's clearly part of a series and there is only one book published, they don't want to waste their time on what looks like an incomplete story.
good luck.
well if u can write.. u can imagine.. if u can imagine.. it wont take much to put it on paper.. design a cover urself.. keep it simple.. funny.. and do it from the bottom of ur heart.. that saves cost.. i know what a single penny means.. so if i come up with something creative or helpful.. i will definitely get in touch.. i am a yet to be published author.. and i have edited.. re-edited.. again and again for about 15-20 times.. just to save editing cost...
just have faith in ur writing skills and style.. everything else will fall in place..
so think.. think hard.. try your drawing skills.. at least give it a try.. something migh come up :)
Emma wrote: "Ask for beta readers here on goodreads, most of us can't afford professional editors, swap manuscripts and reviews with other people, join a critique/review group, you'll gain friends by working fo..."Firstly, I don't see how asking for assistance is offensive and I apologise if that's how you took my request. I have, in the distant past, aided a number of authors who asked for such assistance (and got their book in return when they published, which is what I offer for everyone who helped me). Hell, I wouldn't be asking if I could do this another way as it truly does make me feel like dirt to do so.
And I have completed the series, hence my wanting to publish. The next two books in this series are just waiting for the chance to be polished and published, the last one is currently going through the whole beta/CP wringer.
The two books I've got published are the ones that happened after this story and got snaffled by small publishers whilst I was in the middle of preparing The Rogue King for release. I'm in the middle of writing their sequels, but this series is just sitting there and, like you said, I want to complete the series.
What I'm looking for from editing is the in-depth look that the editor I worked with in the first book gave me (picking up problems that no one else did). When if comes to betas and CPs, I doubt I could squeeze in another person on a like-for-like basis, let alone more than one.
Finally, premade covers, although lovely, aren't exactly an option given the subject matter. If I ever found one that did resemble what I have in mind, I'd probably die of shock. My own are ... terribly amateurish. Tell me, honestly, would you pick that cover up? I doubt it. They make me cringe.
While I never like to see someone with good intentions getting a drubbing in a forum, I think you've misfired with this thread, and it's probably time to walk away.I'm lucky in that my sister-in-law designs my covers for free and happens to be a professional book designer who's worked on some of the 21st Century's biggest children's and YA titles. But even there, she has more than one approach. Because I had no budget for images, etc, she gave my short story collection a graphic treatment, along with the little silhouette illustrations that she already had on file.
And simplicity really works. 80% of your potential readers are going to see the book in thumbnail for the first time. No image and big text that's still legible in thumbnail will often work a lot better to sell your book than the most beautiful painting that can be commissioned.
Editing is a constant challenge, but if you can't afford anyone, self-editing isn't impossible. I recommend sticking the manuscript in the digital equivalent of your top drawer for a couple of months and then reading it over with fresh eyes. Work on the sequels to your other projects in the meantime to increase your distance from this book and get a more objective viewpoint.
And best of luck, really!
Pratik wrote: "well if u can write.. u can imagine.. if u can imagine.. it wont take much to put it on paper.. design a cover urself.. keep it simple.. funny.. and do it from the bottom of ur heart.. that saves c..."I applaud your faith. Truly I do. But I have none, especially not in my drawing skills.
I've spent eighteen years on this novel. Writing, re-writing, doing it all again from scratch, twice, I've sought every opinion I could and tweaked over and over until I'm blind to flaws. Almost two-thirds of my life has been dedicated to this.
But as far as doing my own covers goes, allow me to show you these:
They are my mock-ups. They are the pinnacle of my skills. And they are crap.
I do them for fun. To keep my spirits up. I wouldn't dream of putting them on a book.
Andrew wrote: "While I never like to see someone with good intentions getting a drubbing in a forum, I think you've misfired with this thread, and it's probably time to walk away.I'm lucky in that my sister-in-..."
Misfired? I think we went well beyond the realm of misfired. It seems the answer would be not so much a staunch "no" but more of a "don't try doing as millions of others have done and ask for help". I realise no one said that, just how it feels.
And yet, $2 is less than what my first book costs on Amazon and if donated via Pubslush, is exactly what you would get in return. An instant 33% saving as it were.
Even the amount I asked for is low compared to what I've seen raised by others and participated in raising (again, in the distant past). The bare minimum required to get everything done and give the rewards. I didn't take this option lightly. I backed out of clicking submit many times in search of alternatives.
But after my car breaking down, twice in one year, the trees taking out our boundary fences in the storm and the fiasco with our internet provider stinging us for money when we couldn't even use it, I thought "It couldn't hurt to try. That maybe just this once things might actually work". Apparently, I was wrong.
My apologies for dragging all of you into my shit year.
Oh, before I forget, I've done the "top drawer" thing many times over the past eighteen years and the first book still had spots that required ironing out when my editor got to it. I've a blind spot to keeping my worlds confusion free. Unfortunately, having such knowledge hasn't yet helped in curbing it. Perhaps, by the time I reach my tenth novel, I might not need the editor so much.
Aldrea wrote: "Pratik wrote: "well if u can write.. u can imagine.. if u can imagine.. it wont take much to put it on paper.. design a cover urself.. keep it simple.. funny.. and do it from the bottom of ur heart..."i dont think they are crap.. they are just 2D 3D without latest tech and skills.. i think sometimes a sketch merely drawn by hand and pencil is worth more realistic...
i admire your determination... eighteen years.. i mean i am just 21 right now.. and its almost my entire life's work i would say.. so your patience is something i cannot even imagine.
i wrote my first novel... i started it at the age of 19.. it took me a year and a half to complete it.. than critics from friends killed me.. but i fought.. if you dont get screwed up by your own people.. you will never rise up..
when someone of our own points out a fault.. we have to work it out.. becuase an editors charges money.. a publiher rejects your most ambitious project.. and the readers who spend their hard earned money on your book for the sake of entertainment in their busy lives.. if they are not satisfied.. than its the end of your career..
so give it to your friends, co-workers, relatives, cousins anyone you feel close and trustworthy.. as them to read and criticise you harshly..
that will bring the best out of you... it will also fine tune your work eliminating the need of an editor...
i am a middle class indian.. i dont even have a TV at my place.. but i wrote my novel.. sent the query to publishers and guess what??
One of them accepted it in 14 days.. imagine that.. just 14 days.. he approved my work.. and now m waiting for a contract.. now.. if an 21 year old guy like me can do it in 2 years.. then this is more than a motivation for u to start fighting the odds again..
i know it takes a lot.. my words might be just words.. you might have been through a lot.. but falling and rising up again is the process.. and we all have to go through it.. give your best shot once again.. who knows.. this time it might work.. luck by chance.. :)
Pratik wrote: "Aldrea wrote: "Pratik wrote: "well if u can write.. u can imagine.. if u can imagine.. it wont take much to put it on paper.. design a cover urself.. keep it simple.. funny.. and do it from the bot...":) My dear, your enthusiasm is infectious. We shall see what attempt ... #12 has in store.
And do let me know when your novel comes out.
It's not so much the fact you're asking for help people object to. It's the fact you're asking for cash.There are people out there willing to help with editing and cover design for either just a copy of your finished book, or for a small fee (which some people will accept payments for in small instalments). Perhaps ask for that kind of help instead?
You don't definitely don't have to have your central character on the book cover, you can have an object such as a sword etc instead, maybe with a snakeskin background as you're going for a Reptilian theme? The main problem with your covers is the typography, which can be very easy to fix.
Victoria wrote: "It's not so much the fact you're asking for help people object to. It's the fact you're asking for cash.There are people out there willing to help with editing and cover design for either just a..."
Exactly what I meant, but perhaps I worded it poorly.
Victoria wrote: "It's not so much the fact you're asking for help people object to. It's the fact you're asking for cash.There are people out there willing to help with editing and cover design for either just a..."
I feel people didn't go to the page I'd linked (which is now dead, btw, don't try). I wasn't asking something for nothing. I wouldn't expect that. But the point is moot, now.
Emma wrote: "You don't definitely don't have to have your central character on the book cover, you can have an object such as a sword etc instead, maybe with a snakeskin background as you're going for a Reptili..."The main use I have with symbolism is that lots of people use it, especially for spec fic, and they use it far better than I. Even then, my eyes tend slide over those covers in preference for the less symbolic ones. Don't get me wrong, I've seen some symbolic covers that I've simply adored, but they were ... different.
And I know the typography is off. I'm still not sure why because the explanations for typography that I've read up on so far might as well be in another language, but I'm trying to figure that part out so I can fix it.
Ugh, it's 1:30 am here, I'm out.
You can design your own covers on createspace. Just follow the directions. It cost NOTHING. I don't spend on editing. What I have is better than an editor. I have a wonderful supportive writers group It is led by a retired editor. Amoung the members ae: A retired college professor, a retired English teacher, a retired lawyer and many good writers. Find a writers group for yourself. Once they are done with my book, I feel it's go to go. You really don't have to spend a cent.
Perhaps this is the wrong group to ask. There is actually a thread for science fiction and fantasy Kickstarters on the Science Fiction and Fantasy Book Club. You might have better luck there. It's at https://www.goodreads.com/topic/show/...
Peggy wrote: "You can design your own covers on createspace. Just follow the directions. It cost NOTHING.And if you want to publish as an eBook KDP don't offer the same designs. It cost me $12 for a good quality photograph to DIY a cover that's different, and expresses what I want. The old boring one still appears on Goodreads but you can see the new one, and a DIY video, on my profile page.
I used the covers on createspace until my books started selling and then I hired a cover designer. CreateSpace really does give you enough variety so that your book doesn't look like others.
Shomeret wrote: "Perhaps this is the wrong group to ask. There is actually a thread for science fiction and fantasy Kickstarters on the Science Fiction and Fantasy Book Club. You might have better luck there. It..."Not being part of that group, I was not aware. Thank you for pointing that out to me.
Peggy wrote: "You can design your own covers on createspace. Just follow the directions. It cost NOTHING. I don't spend on editing. What I have is better than an editor. I have a wonderful supportive writers gro..."Sounds like a dream group you have. Unfortunately, writers groups of any kind are rather thin on the ground here and, if I could find one, I've a fair idea of my partner's reception towards driving out to town and back to participate.
And my experience with online writer's groups is that they tend to fizzle after a few chapters and that's not much help. But if you, or anyone, can recommend a place, I'm willing to investigate...
Covers, per se, aren't my main issue. If push came to shove, I could probably work with what I have until I'd gathered the vastly smaller funds a cover would require.
I have a writers' group and I think it's well worth the trouble, plus it's a lot of fun as we also have lunch together before the group. Critiquing each others' work can also be fun. We have a lot of laughs. Many of the members support each others' endeavors by going to their readings, book launches, etc. It's less expensive and more thorough than hiring an editor.
Lenita wrote: "I have a writers' group and I think it's well worth the trouble, plus it's a lot of fun as we also have lunch together before the group. Critiquing each others' work can also be fun. We have a lot ..."There are no writer's groups nearby that I can participate in. I think I'm very much stuck with online alternatives.
Aldrea wrote: "There are no writer's groups nearby that I can participate in."I have the same issue being stuck in rural Canterbury. There are plenty of forums which offer CP/Beta reader match up services. For example: Absolute Write, Query Tracker, Agent Query Connect, Ladies Who Critique and Author Salon.
There are hundreds (probably thousands!) of FB writing groups. Just start plugging some keywords in the search bar and see if you find something that suits you and what you are looking for.
A.W. wrote: "Aldrea wrote: "There are no writer's groups nearby that I can participate in."I have the same issue being stuck in rural Canterbury. There are plenty of forums which offer CP/Beta reader match up..."
The joys of rural, yeah?
I've tried Absolute Write once, it was a bit daunting. I got a few of my current CPs via Ladies Who Critique, it seemed rather quiet last time I was there, but that was some time ago.
I wasn't aware Query Tracker had such a service.
I've never heard of Author Salon or Agent Query Connect, though. Will look through those. I've only just gotten into using Facebook for ... anything really. Am a little clunky in doing much with it. Will try.
Aldrea wrote: "I wasn't aware Query Tracker had such a service."You need to use the Query Tracker forums, not the agent database side of their site.
querytracker.net/forum/
Author Salon is for serious critique work on your manuscript.
http://www.authorsalon.com/
I joined a few years back and you form a critique circle within the site and they have guidelines as to the type and depth of critique you have to do. It is a lot of work but I got a lot out of it.
A.W. wrote: "Aldrea wrote: "I wasn't aware Query Tracker had such a service."You need to use the Query Tracker forums, not the agent database side of their site.
querytracker.net/forum/
Author Salon is for s..."
Ah, I never ventured far into the query tracker forums.
I'm scrolling through Author Salon's Critique Guide right now. But I think I might hold off on diving in until school starts and settles down. That's what? A month away? Not long.
Aldrea wrote: "Victoria wrote: "It's not so much the fact you're asking for help people object to. It's the fact you're asking for cash.There are people out there willing to help with editing and cover design ..."
Oh, I know you weren't asking something for nothing. And - for the record - personally think a kikstarter to raise money was a great idea. I was merely explaining why I think some were offended by it; particularly those not familiar with the process. As Shomeret pointed out, this is obviously not the right group for a kickstarter, but there are people out there who may be more receptive to the idea on other groups.
Also, as I mentioned in my previous post on this thread, there are alternative options you can explore, which will allow you to get the services you need without costs being suchhan issue.
Anyway, I hope you can findsome way to get your book ready for publication that works for you.
Aldrea, I don't know if you still check this thread, but I think your covers are great, and yeah, if I saw them on the shelves of a store, I'd pick them up. I've heard of people getting low cost ones on freelance sites like Fiverr and 99Design, but have never used them myself. Outsourcing is great and all, but there is also satisfaction in having done it yourself! I'd argue that's part of the charm of a self-published book.
I personally haven't used it, but I've heard there's a website called WattPad that connects readers and writers, and I know of someone who got a publishing contract through that by getting voted the best fantasy writer on the site. It might be worth checking out if you're looking for some publisher backing._____________________
Colleen Fleshman
How to Become a Successful Kindle Author -- FREE report!|http://selfpublishing.gr8.com
My apologises if I offended you. That was most certainly not my intention and the query has been withdrawn.
However, editing is still my major setback. I've exhausted all friends & family and I'm at my limit in like-for-like trades of beta reading and critique partners. Local writer's groups are also non-existent. I've tried the "letting it sit and come back" method, but I don't trust it that much.
What I'm trying to say is: If anyone knows of another option, please tell me.