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message 51:
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Carol
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Jan 13, 2010 07:58PM
William Faulkner
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Oh, I LOVE Faulkner. His short story, "A Rose for Emily" is a true masterpiece.
Just to comment on Hemingway; a pretty twisted soul if ever there was one! Not that I particularly care to disparage the dead. I did find Old Man and the Sea
gripping, and despite myself, a good read, I felt the salt, the pain, the stare of the sun, despite the fact I (probably) would not care to share a drink with the guy had he not shot himself and spared one the bother.
I liked The Old Man and the Sea as well, but it's the ONLY Hemingway piece I've actually enjoyed.
...just as a P.S. my son made a series of prints when he was at the Royal Academy of Art in London before his graduation, for their Summer Show. He too, though not by my say so at all... I was 7,000 miles away when he made the prints... was inspired by this difficult but talented b*****d!
mmmmmmmmm Nice discussion! Must bone up on Angela Brazil... there has to be some material there!
Mod
Do you like any Faulkner, NE? I'm just curious.
Thank you. Most people who like Hemingway don't like Faulkner and vice versa. I love Faulkner, but don't care too much for Hemingway, but you'll never hear me say he's not a good writer. He was superlative, just not my cup of tea.
Mod
If I had to make a choice, I take Hemingway's short stories over his novels as well.
Ah I like them all. I use to have them all. They moseyed out of the house and never came back,when we moved. I guess someone else like Hemingway also.
I love the way Steinbeck stories evolve. I am drenched and filled up . His books feed my inner self. Hemingway does the same thing as does Faulkner. They speak of hard scrabble exsistance and the failures and triumphs of man.
I think one of the wonderful things about literature is that it offers something for all of us. I appreciate all authors who write well, whether they're my cup of tea or not.
Autodidact. Now that`s one I always liked. It would be defeating its purpose if I explained it away. But then again, everyone knows it already.
Steinbeck, in my opinion, did it better than Hemingway or Faulkner. Self-absorbed Hemingway and self-indulgent Faulkner - neither seemed to be concerned about the reader, which is maybe why the critics think they're wonderful. I say, if you want to write for yourself, keep a journal. Steinbeck gives the reader something to chew on.
Mod
Steinbeck plays second fiddle to Hemingway, imo. Faulkner's not even in the band.
Aren't we all, after the age of 25 or so.Best Hemingway novel vs. best Steinbeck novel?
Let the music play . . .
Mod
But what would be Steinbeck's best? I defer to you, Scout.
Impossible to say, Newengland. take your pick, THE PEARL, Of MICE AND MEN or GRAPES of WRATH. Or even TORTILLA FLAT.No, I have to heartily disagree. Steinbeck is the better novelist, Hemingway is the world´s preeminent short story writer.
I know IMO the worst Steinbeck novel Is The Winter of our Discontent.
When I get back to Blighty. I am going to stock up on some Steinbeck and solve the problem! :)
Mod
None of them holds a candle to the aforementioned Farewell to Arms or The Sun Also Rises. The characters are real to me with Hemingway. Steinbeck... I don't know. There's something staged and "novelly" about his stuff, like you can sense the planning, the execution, and the midnight oil.
Newengland wrote: "Best Hem novel is The Sun Also Rises (A Farewell to Arms arguable). But what would be Steinbeck's best? I defer to you, Scout."
I've tried to reply twice and lost both (my laptop mouse has a mind of its own, it seems). So, here goes, again. I've been thinking about your opinion that "you can sense the planning, the execution, and the midnight oil" in Steinbeck's writing. After looking back at some of my favorite passages, I have to agree, but I don't think that's a bad thing. Much better, I think, than something unexamined, self-centered, or stream-of-consciousness, anyway. When Steinbeck writes, it seems to me that he's trying to express something more than his own point of view. His writing sometimes reminds me of Emerson's in that I recognize something I already knew. This quotation from Sweet Thursday is, I think, a good example:
Where does discontent start? You are warm
enough, but you shiver. You are fed, yet
hunger gnaws at you. You have been loved,
but your yearning wanders in new fields.
And to prod all these there's time, the
bastard time. The end of life is now not
so terribly far away - you can see it the
way you see the finish line when you come
into the stretch - and your mind says,
"Have I worked enough? Have I eaten enough?
Have I loved enough?" All of these of course,
are the foundation of man's greatest curse,
and perhaps his greatest glory. "What has
my life meant so far, and what can it mean
in the time left to me?" And now we're coming
to the wicked poisoned dart: "What have I
contributed to the Great Ledger? What am I
worth?" Men seem to be born with a debt they
can never pay no matter how hard they try. It
piles up ahead of them. Man owes something
to man. If he ignores the debt it poisons him,
and if he tries to make payments the debt only
increases, and the quality of the gift is the
measure of the man.
As for his best, I guess I'll go with the Nobel committee and say The Grapes of Wrath, but I most enjoyed reading Cannery Row and Travels with Charley.
Here's a treat I found while reading excerpts. This is from Steinbeck's Nobel acceptance speech:
"Faulkner, more than most men, was aware of human strength as well as of human weakness. He knew that the understanding and the resolution of fear are a large part of the writer's reason for being."
Hmmm.
Three cheers for the man. I have always enjoyed Steinbeck . He is in the favorite list of mine.
Mod
The Grapes of Wrath was a good read but rather hokey and propagandistic in the end. Woody Guthrie did the whole story in a seven-minute song.
Mod
Time to turn the tables. Time for a Tolstoyan novel based on "Mary Had a Little Lamb." "It was early spring. The steppe was a vast ocean of mud. Sadness dripped out of an endless leaden sky. In the early morning, just before dawn, a peasant nursing a huge hangover trudged wearily along the road, followed by a ragged little girl, who held a rope tied to a muddy, bedraggled lamb. Every now and then the peasant would stumble, take a swig of vodka, curse, and rain blows on the little girl and her pet . . . "
Mod
Duel,Duelistu·el (dl, dy-)
n.
1. A prearranged, formal combat between two persons, usually fought to settle a point of honor.
2. A struggle for domination between two contending persons, groups, or ideas.
v. du·eled or du·elled, du·el·ing or du·el·ling, du·els
v.tr.
1. To engage (another) in or as if in formal combat.
2. To oppose actively and forcefully.
v.intr.
To engage in or as if in formal combat.
[Middle English duelle, from Medieval Latin duellum, from Latin, war, archaic variant of bellum.:]
duel·er, duel·ist n.
Newengland wrote: "Yay, Woody. And it's telling that Steinbeck hearts Faulkner. Very telling."I was going for irony.
Mod
Sorry!
I can make you feel like a real woman!Iron this shirt!
Mod
They used to come in avocado and harvest gold.
David's dating himself:) Sorry, David - and yet, I sometimes date myself.
Newengland wrote: "Oops. Irony and the Internet make for strange bed jolly-good-fellows.Sorry!"
No worries. I agree that the Internet doesn't allow for nuance - or maybe it's just that short messages don't allow us to know each other well enough to get it without explanation.
I thought it was ironic that I appreciate Steinbeck, who appreciated Faulkner, whom I don't appreciate.
Ruth, how do you think Hemingway's shorts compare to Maugham's?
Mod
Apropros to short stories, which is where we began.
Mod
Not pronounced like its eponymous namesake, Quixote, but pleasingly odd nonetheless, like this meandering conversation.
I like the word meandering, it conjures up happy trails weaving among the flora and fauna.
Mod
Is the Mississippi considered an old river, Ruth? The Amazon is isn't it?
Language & Grammar
Books mentioned in this topic
Shrubbery Skulduggery (other topics)The Grapes of Wrath (other topics)
The Old Man and the Sea (other topics)
