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Lost City Radio - Whole Book
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I've probably now listened to too many Alarcon interviews and read too much about Peruvian history to be objective about the book. But I do think that there is a universality to the type of civil war he describes and how it impacts those not directly involved and that he has captured that.
It's a little odd, but I had read through 2/3 of the book and was getting lost in the rhythms. I then read Linda's collection of reviews and took a break. When I returned, it took 20 pages before I was back in his magic, with a feeling of peeling an onion, each new fact illuminating what had seemed minor details of the story. I can't say why, but the feeling is like reading one of Kipling's Just So Stories. Perhaps it started with the fantastic image of the erasure of every city and village's name. Perhaps it's Norma's magical voice, shining with more than oriental splendor. Come to think of it, Rey could be the cat who walks by himself.
I often hear that critics tend to overpraise debut novels, especially literary fiction. Maybe, but in the case of young Daniel Alarcon I think this book mostly deserves the strong reviews it has received. It’s well-written, with richly described characters and settings and it hooks the reader right away with a number of intriguing questions. Likely inspired by the 1980s Shining Path (Sendero Luminoso, S.L.) guerrilla warfare in the author's native Peru, and the repressive government actions during and thereafter. For my full review: https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...
Nice review Gregory. You note that Norma is a city girl who is nervous in the poorer areas of her city. I noticed that too. Norma seems to represent the clueless middle class that is as deeply affected by the war as the poor people of the villages. Do you think she was cognizant of how she was furthering the government strategy in her radio shows? Why did she marry Rey and why did Rey marry her?
I've finished Part I and have read into Part II...I can't say I'm really drawn to the story yet. It's well crafted...stylistically it's a little herky-jerky sometimes, but I can accept that as a device to simulate how the past always intrudes on the present.Maybe I just have to read a little further to find an aspect that stands out. (view spoiler)
LindaJ^ wrote: "Why did she marry Rey and why did Rey marry her?."Good question. That's one issue I had with the novel. I don't think it was developed enough. I don't think it is clear why she found him so attractive or why she put her life on hold and waited for him for ten years. I also didn't like Rey very much since he cheated on her and continued to lie about it.
But all that was beside the point for me because what I found so powerful in this novel was his depiction of what it means to live under a tyrannical government. His description is universally applicable. I have family who lived under these same conditions for many years in Iraq during the era of Saddam Hussein. His depiction resonated strongly with me. I understand the fear and the terror. It is unfathomable to me the cruelty human beings are capable of perpetrating on each other. Sadly, there are people across the globe who currently live under the same fears and oppression.
Sorry. I don't mean to turn this into a political discussion. I just want to say I think he did an admirable job of capturing the fear of living under tyranny.
My review: https://www.goodreads.com/review/show...
For all its strengths, the story would have opened more interesting possibilities if Norma was portrayed as less passive in the face of Rey's long absences. Why didn't she insist on sharing some of his "research" trips to the jungle? If she was so beloved by masses of her radio listeners, why didn't she at least develop more close friendships with some of them? I agree that her sudden, unbreakable attraction to Rey is hard to understand for a reader, especially once we know what he is up to when away from Norma -- not just a long affair and a child, but putting both their lives at risk through his messenger missions.
Finished the book last night. I'm not sure what to add to what's already been said...I did find Tamara's comment interesting, about the fear of living under a tyrannical government resonating with her. Other than perhaps near the end, when Norma and Manau and Victor had to go through the roadblock, I didn't really feel like the atmosphere was oppressive. Yes, Norma felt obligated to flee with Victor from the station, but I never really felt that they were in that much danger. I thought Zahir was the most interesting character. He seemed the most real to me--I thought his motivations and his actions made sense from his point of view. In a way, he's like a fulcrum for the story--not really a part of either side, he's still the one to suffer mentally and physically.
One of the breathtaking parts of Alarcón's writing is his ability to transition between time frames. Here, in chapter 14, Norma is dozing, remembering being with Rey when they were first reunited: He would tell her, Rey said, but not then. He made her promise not to be frightened.
"I won't be," she whispered. She was stroking his face, his eyes were closed, and he was nearly asleep. "I won't. I won't ever be afraid."
"Are you awake?" Manau asked.
Norma opened her eyes. The boy was still there. She was in the same strange house.
Bryan "Other than perhaps near the end, when Norma and Manau and Victor had to go through the roadblock, I didn't really feel like the atmosphere was oppressive. Yes, Norma felt obligated to flee with Victor from the station, but I never really felt that they were in that much danger...."Norma and others who live under authoritarian governments don’t have to experience oppression all the time. They internalize it in the same way some people internalize racism and/or sexism. They live in fear of it and experience its presence in all aspects of their lives. They modify their behavior accordingly and engage in self-censorship. I think Norma and her boss are walking on egg shells, carefully monitoring what is said on the air so as not to offend the authorities. Otherwise, why was she cautioned against mentioning her husband’s name as a missing person?
Coincidentally, I was listening to NPR this morning when a dissident from Hong Kong was speaking. He said his concern is that fear of reprisals by the Chinese government because of the law that was just passed will cause opposition groups to engage in self-censorship. Just the fear of incarceration is sufficient to stifle opposition and keep the population in check.
Bryan "I thought Zahir was the most interesting character. He seemed the most real to me--I thought his motivations and his actions made sense from his point of view. ..."I think Zahir is interesting because, as an informant, he has to come up with something that will satisfy the authorities. So he fabricates something about Rey, suggesting he is involved in nefarious activities even though he has no proof. He just tosses it out and doesn't think much about what he has done at the time. Nor does he consider the consequences of his actions until after Rey has been killed. That's why he feels such guilt.
Again, Alarcon has captured the impact of living under a totalitarian government. Neighbors will turn against neighbors; family will turn against family; and people driven by fear will say anything to ingratiate themselves with the authorities.
It's pretty terrifying and Alarcon has done an amazing job of capturing all of that.
Hi TamaraI don’t disagree with what you are saying about living under a totalitarian gov’t. I can believe all that is true. I just didn’t think Alarcón brought that home to me like he did for you
Bryan, no worries. I'm sorry if I come across as too vehement. I grew up in England, so I never experienced any of this directly. But I grew up surrounded by family members and friends of family who experienced it. I heard stories of unspeakable horrors and atrocities. It's the sort of thing that scars you for life.
The novel brought all this up for me. I think that's why I'm finding it difficult to disengage.
I'm really sorry. I'll continue to read the comments, but I think it's best if I bow out of the discussion until I can get some distance.
Again, my apologies.
There is nothing for you to apologize for, Tamara. It may be that I came across as insensitive without being aware of it—I definitely do not want to minimize anyone’s real world experiences.
Excellent discussion on the book - thanks for all of the powerful insights so far. What did you guys think of people getting sent "to the moon?" I thought that was an interesting aspect of the book.
Alarcon seemed to take much of the symbolism of war and a tyrannical government and translate them into something literal. Towns suddenly have no names, just numbers. People get sent to the moon.
I spent most of the book unsure if I liked it, but by the end I realized it definitely had an impact on me. I liked that Alarcon grabbed me as a reader with interesting writing style and complex characters.
Sorry to have been missing for a couple of days -- had to work on meeting my bicycling and walking goals.I've been thinking a lot about Tamara's comment about how well Alarcon did with showing what its like to life under a tyrannical government, especially how fear is used. I'm inclined to agree. While Alarcon does show how both sides used fear and violence, the State was portrayed as being much worse. The State did increasingly use its power to instill fear. The trips to the Moon increased and even impacted those who were not involved and that violence created fear. But perhaps more subtle was how the fear created self censorship. I think Norma is tied into showing that.
Before meeting Rey, Norma was like so many clueless citizens. She had never been into poor areas of the city and, apparently, never given the people who lived there any thought. Her life was good. Then she was shocked when sent to report on the fires and saw a man being allowed to burn up. For years she read the news and did her show according to the "party line." And she never insisted that Rey tell her what happened when he was sent to the Moon. When he went on trips to the jungle, she allowed herself to believe he was doing botanical research. I think she started to see the truth when she visited the prison to see if Rey and been "mistakenly" taken there. She turned a blind eye until she no longer could. Then it took years, until Victor arrived for her to take action. And when she did, she did it emphatically.
I think I can see how Norma was attracted to Rey and Rey to Norma. Norma represented the life Rey wanted. Perhaps Rey had a tendency to cut off his nose to spite his face or perhaps Rey was acting as a messenger for the IL to get back at the State for what it had done to him and, especially, what it had done to his Uncle.
As many of you imply, Alarcon has created complex adult characters, none of whom are all good or all bad. Zahir is a good example of that, but so is Norma and Rey and Manau and Rey's Uncle.
Bretnie, you talk about the town's losing their identity by having their names changed to numbers. That reminds me of the change to Russian cities when the communists assumed power, and how Constantinople became Istanbul and Saigon became Ho Chi Min City when the governments changed. Here, I think, the names became numbers for a similar reason. I think it is a way for the victors to stake their claim.
I heard a blurb on NPR this morning about Chile and one thing struck me as illustrated by Norma pre-Rey. The reporter commented that there were well-off people in Santiago (Chile's capital) who had no idea how many poor people were living in the Santiago and had never seen any of the less savory areas of Santiago because the neighborhoods were so segregated.
LindaJ^ wrote: "I heard a blurb on NPR this morning about Chile and one thing struck me as illustrated by Norma pre-Rey. The reporter commented that there were well-off people in Santiago (Chile's capital) who had..."I think that's very true. The middle and upper classes live in segregated neighborhoods cushioned by a bubble of their affluence. They have no clue the extent of the poverty and misery outside their neighborhoods and so are shocked if and when an uprising takes place.
In searching the web for reviews and interviews concerning this book, I cam across website that had three teachers opining on what are the important things a reader should take away from this book. One of those things was the importance of understanding the history of a county. Alarcon notes in one of his interviews that knowing South American history is important to understanding why the rebels in the Peruvian civil war resorted to violence. I think this comes through in the book in a sort of reverse way -- no one seems to be particularly aware of the country's history. Anyone have any thoughts on this?
That's an interesting point Linda, and so relevant to conversations around race in America right now. We're at a boiling point and so many people don't fully understand the history behind why we're at a boiling point.Which could get me off on another topic all together - when we say stuff like "confederate flags and monuments and statues are important because it's about history" when there's so much we don't get taught about our own country's history (from the perspective of minorities and the injustices our own government let alone its citizens have enacted over the decades and centuries).
Bretnie,I think that's part of the universality of Lost City Radio - the history that isn't known because it isn't taught or spoken about and how the non-acknowledgement of the history almost assures it being repeated. Certainly there is much American history that is not acknowledged, such, as you note, racism. I have learned a lot of race history from books - fiction - rather than school, including the Tulsa Massacre (from a Dennis Lehane novel), internment camps for US citizens whose ethnicity was Japanese (from the novel Snow Falling on Cedars). I think about Spain and how Spaniards avoid the horrors committed by both sides in their Civil War.
After a busy start, we seem to have stagnated - must be the hot, humid weather (at least in East Coast US)! I want to go back to the third question I posed at the beginning of this thread -- Alarcon, while discussing violence (in response to two separate questions), says that "violence is an assault on free discourse and the exchange of ideas," that "violence is almost always arbitrary," and that in the novel, there are "almost no good guys" and "many atrocities" by the State and by the IL to condemn. Alarcon condemns violence "as a tool for political discourse on both sides." Do you think that comes through in the novel?" -- but I want to look at it from a different angle. I think Alarcon is right about violence but I want to step back and look at the use of fear by those in power to keep those not in power "in line" and how it can lead to violence. Two things I saw on TV last night caused me to think about this. First was the political ad showing a home invasion and the woman in the home calling 911 and being told no one could take her call because the police had been defunded. The second was the TV show Snowpiercer, Episode 8, when the Rear and 3rd Class arose and attempted to take over the train. Do you think fear was one of the IL came into existence and resorted to violence in response the violence-induced fear?
Oh man, those are good and relevant questions Linda.So relevant to the protest right now also. The violence the police create results in violence against the police. But the police are the ones with more power.
I don't have any deep thoughts, just nodding in agreement that you've made good points and are asking important questions.
I haven't commented on this novel since I had a difficulty with Alarcón's style that interfered with my appreciation for what he wrote. In reference to Linda's question on violence, I recently read and recommend Marie Arana's Silver, Sword, and Stone: Three Crucibles in the Latin American Story, which delves into that question. U.S.\Peruvian Arana has a Howard Zinn like approach that links present day violence to the Spanish conquistadors' success in domination and suppression on Indigenous peoples and culture. I also recommend, with a Chilean viewpoint, Isabel allende's A Long Petal of the Sea, a much more conventional novel with a different approach to authoritative police violence.
LindaJ^ wrote: "I think Alarcon is right about violence but I want to step back and look at the use of fear by those in power to keep those not in power "in line" and how it can lead to violence..."I agree with you and Alarcon about violence. But I'm wondering what options are available to people who revolt against authoritarian governments.
An authoritarian government has many tools available in its toolbox to keep a people in line. This includes torture, incarceration, disappearances, informers, censorship, etc. all of which are designed to create a climate of fear among the people to subdue them. What options are available to you if you want to fight that? You can engage in civil disobedience. You can demonstrate. But you have to have great courage to do that. We get a daily dose on the news of peaceful demonstrators being bulldozed by the military and a militarized police force.
I don't have the answer. I'm not advocating for violence. And I'm not disputing that atrocities are committed by both sides in Alarcon's novel. But I think something happens to a people who experience so much oppression and violence and inhumanity. It's as if they become desensitized to it and retaliate in the only way they know how. They have to struggle long and hard to fight the inclination to perpetrate violence on others.
When you are surrounded by injustice, when you are surrounded by so much death, when you live in a state of constant fear for your life, you risk losing something in your core that connects you with your fellow human beings. You possibly risk losing some of your own humanity.
Sam, I just started A Long Petal of the Sea. It had been a while since I'd read an Allende book and so far it seems to have the same writing style that I love about her.
Bretnie wrote: "Sam, I just started A Long Petal of the Sea. It had been a while since I'd read an Allende book and so far it seems to have the same writing style that I love about her."I'm on a wait list for it in the library. I'm #64.
Just a caution on my recommendation of A Long Petal of the Sea. My recommendation was because Allende's characters' response to political themes and authoritative violence was a bit different than Alarcón's. The novel is fairly traditional and more of a book club read. I liked it and found it quite pacifying during the early Covid moments, but I think some would consider it a lower tier novel. I don't think I wrote a review and should get around to it. It was a good 3 1/2 -4 star read for me.
Thanks Sam for the recommendation. Tamara, good points.
This interplay of fear and violence is shown in Lost City Radio but the book only at the end does it touch on how that cycle is broken, as the much wiser Norma takes action and does her radio show with Victor reading the names that Elmer told her could not be read. Norma's action is brave and exposes her. But perhaps her popularity will make it harder to deal with her? Alarcon does not tell us her fate.
The subject of fear and violence and the attempt to break the cycle is a theme in Colum McCann's new novel Apeirogon. It is an unconventional novel that has at its core the true the stories of Israeli Rami Elhanan and Palestinian Bassam Aramin, each of whom lost a daughter to the conflict between the two peoples, and their efforts to move their people from fear and violence to real conversation. The men believe the fear and violence are making both sides less human, from the inside out.
LindaJ^ wrote: "The subject of fear and violence and the attempt to break the cycle is a theme in Colum McCann's new novel Apeirogon. .."That looks really interesting. I've put it on hold in the library.
Thanks for the recommendation.
Sam wrote: "Just a caution on my recommendation of A Long Petal of the Sea. My recommendation was because Allende's characters' response to political themes and authoritative violence was a bit different than ..."Totally noted :) I've read almost all of Allende's books, so I know what I'm getting into, and yep, continuing to appreciate pacifying books as this pandemic continues to weigh on our minds!
Thanks to all who joined in the discussion of Lost City Radio! While the "official" time for discussion has ended, not to worry. The threads will remain open and I'll be checking in regularly. Stay safe and well.
21st Century Literature
Books mentioned in this topic
Apeirogon (other topics)Silver, Sword, and Stone: Three Crucibles in the Latin American Story (other topics)
A Long Petal of the Sea (other topics)
From Alarcon's interview in connection with CA Reads (posted on General Thread), I've come up with three points that might make for some discussion, but feel free to ignore them and raise points that you think are important.
First, Alarcon says the book is about Norma and that the central question of the book is how Rey's name (not Rey but the other name that we are never told) got on the list that Victor brings from the village, and answering that question leads to an exploration of the unnamed country's history, of the political conflict in the country, and how things fall apart. In connection with this premise, what do you think about Norma as a character? What role or roles does she play in the novel?
Second, Alarcon also says that he does not discuss the ideology of either the IL or the State. What is your response to this?
And third, Alarcon, while discussing violence (in response to two separate questions), says that "violence is an assault on free discourse and the exchange of ideas," that "violence is almost always arbitrary," and that in the novel, there are "almost no good guys" and "many atrocities" by the State and by the IL to condemn. Alarcon condemns violence "as a tool for political discourse on both sides." Do you think that comes through in the novel?