Japanese Light Novel Book Club discussion
This topic is about
A Certain Magical Index, Vol. 1
Light Novels
>
A Certain Magical Index, Vol. 1
This is going to be so exciting! I can't wait to read this book and actually join a group discussion about it. This will be the first time I've ever done a group read.
The prologue is so short that it's hard to get a taste of the book from it! I do admire how snappy it is- the dialogue works pretty naturally, even if it is stuffed with exposition. The bold print was driving me crazy, though. I know that it was being used for effect, and not badly, either, but it looked like something straight out of Microsoft Word.Still, I'm really looking forward to the next chunk of this. It's long enough that I think I'll be able to come to more of a conclusion about the book after that.
I do agree with you on the bold print. It's even weirder because they use both bold and italics, like they were testing to see which would work better and forgot to switch them or something.I still enjoyed the prologue, though. It was a nice, quick introduction that introduced Touma as the main character and explained the setting of the story well enough that I wasn't confused. It was short, but the next chapter is a lot longer, so that makes up for it, I think.
Re: the schedule, chapter 1 is pretty long so me & Selena felt that it would be better to leave the prologue separate. Also, the bold doesn't bug me at all. I think its cool. And italics are for thoughts and sound effects (something the Japanese have a lot more of in text than we do), which is much better than setting them aside in quotes or leaving them undifferentiated.
They did quite a lot of exposition and got some action in.
biri biri
That is true. And I do like the italics and sounds effects. I also think I snickered a bit when I read biri biri. For some reason reading that part made me smile.Do you know what the bold is for? I thought it might be to emphasize certain points, but I can't always tell because some of the emboldened areas don't seem all that important. Maybe that's just my perspective and I'm looking at it wrong, though.
Brandon wrote: "That is true. And I do like the italics and sounds effects. I also think I snickered a bit when I read biri biri. For some reason reading that part made me smile.Do you know what the bold is for?..."
I'm SO glad they left biri biri untranslated. I've seen it translated before as "the shocker" or "zap zap" neither of which are nearly as fun. Biri biri by the way is Japanese onomatopoeia (which they like to use a lot) for the electric noise she makes, so zap zap would have been an appropriate localization, like I said it doesn't have the same ring (or should I say shock) to it.
Most of the bolded text is important I think, but for different reasons. For example "His only thought had been saving the boys who'd crossed her path" is really important for the situation at hand, especially since it contradicts what you've likely been thinking up to that point and it also is important for Misaka's character in that she's really strong and fearless to the point that punks need saving from her (an essay about how that makes her awesome will come later).
Some seem to be points that just need plain emphasis how he didn't have a scratch on him after being hit with a zillion volts because of his right hand's power to cancel out supernatural stuff.
Others could be set up for later, like when they mention the effective range and speed of Misaka's railgun.
Lastly, some seem important to the overall plot of the book/series like "...quit being human, like the hero of a comic book."
(view spoiler) (dunno if this is quite spoiler but here I'm using knowledge of the rest of the series)
and especially "...try and go beyond that."
Actually, looking at all of these, there is mostly a common reason. It seems like in many cases its what's most unbelievable.
Parker wrote: "Brandon wrote: "That is true. And I do like the italics and sounds effects. I also think I snickered a bit when I read biri biri. For some reason reading that part made me smile.Do you know what ..."
I know that in the anime, Touma calls Misaka Zapper. You're right, though, zap zap or any other Americanized word wouldn't have the same ring to it. It would probably sound weird reading out loud, too, where biri biri just sort of flows off the tongue.
So, basically, the bold text is a sort "suspension of disbelief" for certain occasions where you just can't believe something is happening? Something like that?
Zapper? Wow. I don't recall that one. Is that in the dub?Its for things you can't believe (mostly I think). but that doesn't mean they're things that are impossible.
Parker wrote: "Zapper? Wow. I don't recall that one. Is that in the dub?Its for things you can't believe (mostly I think). but that doesn't mean they're things that are impossible."
Yes, it's in the dub. In the dubbed anime Touma calls Misaka either Zapper or Bug Zapper, which is pretty much the same thing.
Makes sense.
Has anyone else gotten started on chapter 1?
Brandon wrote: "Has anyone else gotten started on chapter 1?"I just finished chapter 1, and was quite charmed by it. At first, I thought it might be a little too breezy and casual for its own good, but then I got into it and have to admit that, in anime and manga, the way that Western religions are presented are among my favorite things. I was sold on the series as soon as that stuff started coming up in conversation. Plus, with no visual reference, I really like the cleaning robots! In my head, they're very cute.
The author also has quite a skill for coming up with casual metaphors to describe the supernatural. The whole, "I don't need a blueprint of a cell phone to send a text message" thing (not an exact quote, I know) was really good, I think.
I'm still not sure about the style this is written in. It's so short on description that it almost feels like I'm cruising past the story instead of observing it normally. This works well for action, but in conversation, it doesn't seem optimal. I'm still enjoying this a lot, though. I look forward to next week's chapter.
Allison wrote: "Brandon wrote: "Has anyone else gotten started on chapter 1?"I just finished chapter 1, and was quite charmed by it. At first, I thought it might be a little too breezy and casual for its own goo..."
I finished chapter 1 last night.
Index especially does an interesting job of portraying western religions. I think the Japanese find it fascinating more than anything.
This author does his research on religion/mythology even more than the average LN author.
There are some good metaphors. This battle has something I love in that its not a contest of strength, but rather about figuring out your opponent, finding their weakness and outsmarting them. I like battles that have components that are mind games.
My favorite thing about the writing style is how the author doesn't always refer to characters by name, or pronouns. He gives them titles. He just says things like "Imagine Breaker and Railgun turned around". This keeps things fresh and helps establish a character identity.
In a later book he never even names the character, but just says "the level 5". But from that and his actions you know instantly who it is.
Allison wrote: "Brandon wrote: "Has anyone else gotten started on chapter 1?"I just finished chapter 1, and was quite charmed by it. At first, I thought it might be a little too breezy and casual for its own goo..."
I have to agree on all accounts. I really enjoyed the way Western religions, particularly the Catholic Orthodox Church is presented in this. I find the concept of Necessarius, a church of "necessary evils" to be utterly fascinating, and it creates such a stark contrast between the scientific characters and magical characters. Oddly enough, Touma is sort of like this middle ground where science and magic collide.
It does feel a bit barren, but I've read light novels with less descriptions in them before. At least with this one it has a decent amount of attention to detail. A few that I've read are pretty bare-bones when it comes to describing anything.
Parker wrote: "Allison wrote: "Brandon wrote: "Has anyone else gotten started on chapter 1?"
I just finished chapter 1, and was quite charmed by it. At first, I thought it might be a little too breezy and casual..."
Lol. Try not to spoil us too much. I haven't even gotten to book two yet.
Ah sorry. I'm the kind that instantly realizes the translators made an error when they say an eighth of the population are students, knowing its actually 80% (top of page 41).Did anyone else catch the great JoJo's Bizarre Adventure reference (pg 33)?
I wonder if anyone at a store has ever tried to scan Stiyl's barcode...
Parker wrote: "Ah sorry. I'm the kind that instantly realizes the translators made an error when they say an eighth of the population are students, knowing its actually 80% (top of page 41)."Hahahaaaa... when I read that, I thought, "That's so unimpressive! That's just like an American college town! I'm not totally sure why the author is telling us this." If it's supposed to be 80%, though, that makes a *lot* more sense.
I caught the Jojo reference, but my favorite tiny detail is that he accidentally dropped his yakisoba in the sink when draining the noodles. Seeing a fictional character do that somehow made me feel better about my life.
Touma makes us all feel better about our lives. Except we don't have cute freeloading nuns, loli school teachers, and electric tsunderes after us... or have the power to dispel acts of god.
I didn't catch the JoJo reference, but now I'm gonna go back and check it out. I'll probably slam my head into a wall for missing something like that.And yea, Touma always makes me feel better about myself. He's just such an unlucky guy that every time I see his bad luck shine through, I can't help but think, "I'm glad I'm not that guy."
Of course, then I see him living with a cute nun, having a cute tsundere chasing after him and I think, "I kinda wish that would happen to me."
XD My thoughts weren't even "I'm glad I'm not him!" It was just being glad that someone else loses their ramen noodles to the bottom of the sink. Having the power to dispel all that stuff would certainly make up for the lost noodles, so in that respect, I have to admit that Touma does have me defeated. I kind of like Biri-Biri. She's aggressive, but really determined, and has a lot of energy. (That pun was not intended, but now that it's there, I'm not deleting it.) Her disregard for appearances is a lot of fun.
Allison wrote: "XD My thoughts weren't even "I'm glad I'm not him!" It was just being glad that someone else loses their ramen noodles to the bottom of the sink. Having the power to dispel all that stuff would cer..."I'm on the fence about Misaka biri-biri Mokoto. Tsundere doesn't really do it for me, which explains why I'd never want someone like The Biter living with me. I feel sorry for Touma, always getting bitten on the head and stuff. I think out of all the females presented in the first novel, the one I like the most is Kaori Kanzaki. I think her moral compass actually matches Touma's the closest.
I'm a huge fan of tsunderes, but that's just me. I like Misaka as a character because unlike every other "strong" female character, she doesn't suddenly get helpless when surrounded by street punks hitting on her. Instead she goes out and beats them up.
Parker wrote: "I'm a huge fan of tsunderes, but that's just me. I like Misaka as a character because unlike every other "strong" female character, she doesn't suddenly get helpless when surrounded by street punks..."I like mild tsundere characters such as Rin Tohsaka from Fate/Stay Night. Misaka isn't as bad as some, like Lousie Francoise or Taiga from Toradora, but she does have a tendency of trying to zap Touma a lot, even if she's unsuccessful.
I do like how she's not helpless. One thing I dislike about a lot of stories is how a strong female heroine suddenly becomes helpless in a situation, and you know the only reason for it is so the hero can save her. I can appreciate how Misaka doesn't fall under that category.
Brandon wrote: "I like mild tsundere characters such as Rin Tohsaka from Fate/Stay Night. Misaka isn't as bad as some, like Lousie Francoise or Taiga from Toradora, but she does have a tendency of trying to zap Touma a lot, even if she's unsuccessful."But Louise is so cute! Ok she's a bit too tsun for me. Biggest downside to tsunderes though is not really the abuse, but the denial of feelings. Its like "seriously you clearly love the guy, just admit it already at least to yourself"
I have a really hard time seeing Misaka being a damsel in distress.
(view spoiler)
Parker wrote: "Brandon wrote: "I like mild tsundere characters such as Rin Tohsaka from Fate/Stay Night. Misaka isn't as bad as some, like Lousie Francoise or Taiga from Toradora, but she does have a tendency of ..."Louise is cute only when she's not violently beating Saito with a whip, or making him explode with her magic. The problem is she's just too violent. It's like watching Narusagawa Naru Punch Keitaro for the 100th time.
I don't mind the denial as much, provided that she eventually stops denying, which rarely ever seems to happen. Oddly enough, Louise is one of the few tsunderes who's actually admitted her feelings for the person she loves.
Yeah, Misaka is definitely not the damsel in distress type. Having not read past volume 1, I can't say anything about the Touma-to-Misaka save ratio. The anime only goes up to the start of World War III. I know the LNs have around 22 (?) volumes, so there's probably plenty that I don't know.
Yeah the whip & explosions are a bit much... And yeah Louise eventually admits it. Eventually. The ZnT LNs have more romance too. The anime goes up to Side Story 1 which is between volumes 13 and 14. The anime kind of leaves off in a weird place, but things get CRAZY starting shortly after. The LNs have 22 volumes plus two side story books, which are actually important and just as good as the rest of the series. After that though they switched to a new name, Shinyaku Toaru Majutsu no Index (A Certain Magical Index New Testament or NT for short) that continues the story. As of now that has 11 volumes with a 12th due in March. NT3 is one of my favorites of the entire series.
(view spoiler)
That's when World War 3 starts, right? I'm not too familiar with it, because all I know is what's on wiki, but I think the anime leaves off just before the war between magic and science.
Brandon wrote: "That's when World War 3 starts, right? I'm not too familiar with it, because all I know is what's on wiki, but I think the anime leaves off just before the war between magic and science."After the anime leaves off there are 6 more volumes before WWIII formally begins (which happens in Volume 20), but a lot of them are lead up to it so yeah its all the science vs. magic war. God's Right Seat's invasion of Academy City at the end of the anime is basically the first shot.
Parker wrote: "Brandon wrote: "That's when World War 3 starts, right? I'm not too familiar with it, because all I know is what's on wiki, but I think the anime leaves off just before the war between magic and sci..."Oh, okay. Now I really want to get the other volumes. Man, it really sucks how volume 2 isn't coming out until Feb. 24th.
So what did you guys think of the battle between Touma and Styl? I thought it was pretty interesting how Kamijou managed to figure out how to defeat Innocentius by utilizing the sprinkler system. One of my biggest issues with most Shonen stories be they LNs, manga or anime is how it almost always becomes a battle of power levels and oneupmanship. It's very rare to see fights that are based almost entirely on out thinking your opponent.
Brandon wrote: "So what did you guys think of the battle between Touma and Styl?"I liked the end of it- I've done enough cooking with printed off recipes to know how those things go- but it left me with the slight concern that they blew a really good fight right at the start of the book. I'm excited for the new chapter tomorrow, though!
I've seen fights that awesome as the climaxes of books, and here we get it in the first chapter.The whole thing almost makes Stiyl like an IRL magician: trying to cover up how he actually does his tricks with big flashy things.
Allison wrote: "Brandon wrote: "So what did you guys think of the battle between Touma and Styl?"I liked the end of it- I've done enough cooking with printed off recipes to know how those things go- but it left ..."
I can see your point, but they haven't introduced all of the cast yet. There's still Kaori Kanzaki, who's way more powerful than Stiyl. And if the LN is anything like the anime, then there are plenty more surprises in store.
@Parker, I think that makes this LN unique. How many books/movies/anime/manga give you a fight right at the beginning? There's usually a build-up, but here they throw you right into the action. It doesn't waste time, that much is for sure. Though, it does leave me concerned about the character development. Still, this series has, what, 24 volumes? There's plenty of room for a character to develop with that many volumes.
I just read chapter 2, and though I'm too sleepy to have fully processed it yet, Kaoru Kanzaki is pretty boss. I can't say much else that I thought without spoilers, so I'll keep my fingers from typing more for now.
Allison wrote: "I just read chapter 2, and though I'm too sleepy to have fully processed it yet, Kaoru Kanzaki is pretty boss. I can't say much else that I thought without spoilers, so I'll keep my fingers from ty..."Kaori Kanzaki is my favorite character in A Certain Magical Index. I'll even admit that I've got a bit of a crush on her.
Gahh it's really hard to get an impression of an LN on just the first book. Especially since this is often compared to Mahouka in terms of ENGINEERED MAGIC+INFO DUMPS. Mahouka's start was pretty darn bad and I grew into liking that series but this first book didn't really hook me, it could get good but right now ehh.I have a feeling this will be like Mahouka where I will end up going man lots of really good stuff surrounded by really bad.
Aaron wrote: "Gahh it's really hard to get an impression of an LN on just the first book. Especially since this is often compared to Mahouka in terms of ENGINEERED MAGIC+INFO DUMPS. Mahouka's start was pretty ..."I don't think it will be quite the same, especially when you take a look at the "magic system" in this LN. In Mahouka, magic and science are basically blended together. In Magical Index, magic and science are on opposing sides and follow vastly different mechanics. There also aren't as many info dumps in index, and when there are, it usually has some humor involved to make the dumping easier to read, like when Index is trying to explain that magicians are real to Touma and then bites his head because his Imagine Breaker destroyed her Walking Church.
Aaron wrote: "Gahh it's really hard to get an impression of an LN on just the first book. Especially since this is often compared to Mahouka in terms of ENGINEERED MAGIC+INFO DUMPS. Mahouka's start was pretty ..."I don't think Index is anything like Mahouka for a few reasons. 1. As Brandon said, science and magic are on opposite sides vs. being combined. 2. Index doesn't have really LONG dialogues. 3. The main characters in Index don't have god-level powers.
Kanzaki is awesome. She's a magician who's a physical badass. There's also some good character development around her. And dat outfit...I like Komoe-sensei. So cute but so adult at the same time!
What I found interesting is the notion that magic was developed for those without power so espers can't use it. Does that mean that espers have been in the world even longer than magic? There's got to be some story to that and what exactly lead to people developing magic.
Parker wrote: "Kanzaki is awesome. She's a magician who's a physical badass. There's also some good character development around her. And dat outfit...I like Komoe-sensei. So cute but so adult at the same time!..."
That is true. Touma's Imagine Breaker might be capable of killing a god, but he's a far cry from Tatsuya who, lets face it, has already beaten Kirito for Gary-stu of the month.
And I agree, Kaori Kanzaki is awesome. She's probably my favorite magician character... and not just because of her outfit, though that is a part of it.
It does seem odd, right? In most stories, magic was only wielded by those who had the talent for it. In this, they're basically saying magic is used by people who don't have talent. It's a change from the usual science was created by those who couldn't use magic spiel that most stories have. It also makes me wonder... were there espers before Academy City? How did they develop their powers? Did magic come first or were magicians born as a consequence of people trying to combat the progression of science?
Brandon wrote: "That is true. Touma's Imagine Breaker might be capable of killing a god, but he's a far cry from Tatsuya who, lets face it, has already beaten Kirito for Gary-stu of the month..."Should I start a Mahouka thread since it seems like a lot of us have read it/watched the anime? I'm in the process of reading it myself.
That outfit... I'm pretty sure tight jeans would get in the way of a martial artist.
In SS2 there's a great side story about her outfit.
Well, if magic was for the talentless, that implies that there's the talented. Now, Index says he can't use it because he's an esper. That would require her knowing what an esper is and what happens when one tries to use magic. Which means at some point before that, an esper has tried to use magic. I don't think its mentioned exactly how long she's been in Academy City, but she's been on the run so I don't think she'd have the time to learn what espers are there.
Espers outside of Academy City is actually addressed in Volume 2.
I think the real reason why espers can't wield magic is more of a practical one. Its to set up the two sides of the fight. That and no one wants a Misaka who can summon Innocentius.
Ehh I really don't have any experience with Index outside of a few episodes of the anime which failed the 3 episode test, so what your saying is probably right. Just that's the comparison I have seen before, and based off the big world building that's going on I'm just expecting high levels of inconsistent quality. Especially since I don't really like this first book much, but it's such a long running/popular series.Well Espers are "science" right and Magic is fantasy and as well all know from tropes that science and magic distort each other and blah blah blah. I'm sure some real explanation will appear soon.
Parker wrote: "Brandon wrote: "That is true. Touma's Imagine Breaker might be capable of killing a god, but he's a far cry from Tatsuya who, lets face it, has already beaten Kirito for Gary-stu of the month..."..."
Misaka summoning Innocentius is definitely not a pleasant thought. And speaking of, what do you think Last Order would do if she summoned Innocentius. "Burn the non-believers, Misaka-Misaka says while smiling happily as she reads from the script that the strange redheaded person is putting in front of her."
Out of curiosity, does anyone know the word count for A Certain Magical Index?
Brandon wrote: "Misaka summoning Innocentius is definitely not a pleasant thought. And speaking of, what do you think Last Order would do if she summoned Innocentius. "Burn the non-believers, Misaka-Misaka says while smiling happily as she reads from the script that the strange redheaded person is putting in front of her.""LOLs. Last Order would be adorable doing anything, even something like summoning an angel to destroy the world.
Oh, here's another terrifying magic combo: Accelerator with the body of a Saint. Or Kanzaki with Accelerator.
@Aaron The first book is not the best of the series. In my opinion, they get better and better as the series continues. Also some more detailed information on how their magic works comes eventually; I don't think its in this book. There's also a good description of how esper powers work sometime too and in the A Certain Scientific Railgun manga, and how they really are science.
Parker wrote: "Brandon wrote: "Misaka summoning Innocentius is definitely not a pleasant thought. And speaking of, what do you think Last Order would do if she summoned Innocentius. "Burn the non-believers, Misak..."I know. Last Order is so adorable. My inner fanboy squeals whenever I see her. Ahem. I-I mean, she's a cute kid.
That would be rather terrifying, and not just for the reasons most people would think. Seriously, I just got this image of Kaori and Accelerator doing this strange DBZ-style fusion. It's a very disturbing mental image.
I find that the first books of a series are never the best, especially a light novel series because of how short they are. We're only given a glimpse of the overall story, which means we're left with an incomplete picture until we read the next few books in the series.
Brandon wrote: "Parker wrote: "Brandon wrote: "Misaka summoning Innocentius is definitely not a pleasant thought. And speaking of, what do you think Last Order would do if she summoned Innocentius. "Burn the non-b..."As suggested by Selena, I think we should split this off into a thread dedicated to the Toaru series as a whole, while here can be strictly about volume 1 (since that's in the title of the thread after all). There's a reply there.
We are definitely given an incomplete picture of the universe. World-building takes time.
So, when you guys read chapter 3, did you know what was going to happen? I didn't, so I was really taken aback by it! Everyone in this book needs a hug.Really, though, it was quite a good plot twist! It made sense in context and it really upped the stakes for the end of the novel. I look forward to seeing how this all ends next week!
Allison wrote: "So, when you guys read chapter 3, did you know what was going to happen? I didn't, so I was really taken aback by it! Everyone in this book needs a hug.Really, though, it was quite a good plot tw..."
Are you talking about how Index's memories have to be erased every year because her brain can't handle anymore information due to how she has all of those grimoires stored in her memory? I'll admit, that was a pretty surprising plot twist.
@Parker indeed, world building takes a good deal of time, and there's so much that can't be built for a world like this. I just finished reading volume 1 and I'm looking forward to reading the rest of the series.
Allison wrote: "So, when you guys read chapter 3, did you know what was going to happen? I didn't, so I was really taken aback by it! Everyone in this book needs a hug.Really, though, it was quite a good plot tw..."
I was really surprised by the "wait they're good guys?"
That and the thought of either Kanzaki or Stiyl saying tearful goodbyes to Index is... hard to picture.
I also think the
"her brain will explode in 3 days"
*Touma faints, wakes up*
"how long was I out for?"
"3 days"
"oh *#&$"
is pretty funny
Parker wrote: "I also think the "her brain will explode in 3 days"
*Touma faints, wakes up*
"how long was I out for?"
"3 days"
"oh *#&$"
is pretty funny "
I laughed so hard when I read that- it's a beautiful summary.
Heeeheeehee, it's perfect.
Discuss A Certain Magical Index here!
Tentative reading schedule:
1/11-1/17 Prologue
1/18-1/24-Chapter 1
1/25-1/31 Chapter 2
2/1-2/7 Chapter 3
2/8-2/14 Chapter 4 & Final Chapter (Epilogue)
Also so you know, you don't have to follow the reading schedule. That's just an easy way for the group to know when most people are where.