Commercially Published Authors Group Discussion

[Alice]

Anyone interested in discussing things specific to having an agent and a commercial publisher?

[Mellie]

Does your publisher or agent not provide an author group? I think the authors who are most active on GR are indies. If you want agented/trad deal authors only you probably want closed groups set up by either your agency or publisher.

Any such group/discussion on GR runs the horrifying prospect of us indie authors eavesdropping...

[Alice]

Hi A.W.
Have never heard that goodreads is primarily for self published authors. Goodreads is primarily a site for readers of all books. My publisher and agents suggested to me that I make my presence known here. How could I discuss my publisher and agents if they are my hosts?


A.W. wrote: "Does your publisher or agent not provide an author group? I think the authors who are most active on GR are indies. If you want agented/trad deal authors only you probably want closed groups set up..."

[Bobbi]

I have been traditionally published many times, but now I'm an indie. At least, for the time being. Sure, I'll participate. There's no reason why indies can't learn from traditionals and veesa versee. It's not like either group has cooties.

Hm. Or do they...??

[Bobbi]

(Just to protect myself here, yes, I misspelled vice versa on purpose. Because.)

[Mellie]

Alice wrote: "Have never heard that goodreads is primarily for self published authors."

Please re-read my post. I never said GR was primarily for self published authors. I said the most active on Goodreads are indies. If you only want to talk to other agented/traditionally published authors this might not be the best venue.

Alice wrote: "How could I discuss my publisher and agents if they are my hosts?"

Why could you not? Or are you implying your agent/publisher doesn't want their authors talking to one another? If you don't feel you can speak freely in such a group then that's kind of sad. Also if that is the case, do you think it would be a good idea to discuss your publisher/agent on a public forum?

[Christine]

A.W. wrote: "Does your publisher or agent not provide an author group? I think the authors who are most active on GR are indies. If you want agented/trad deal authors only you probably want closed groups set up..."

I don't believe GR is dominated by SP authors. Given the 30 million members, I would guess it is primarily dominated by readers.

I also don't think Alice needs to hide in a private group because she is traditionally published. There are a good number of TP authors on this site. I have never heard of any publisher providing an author group - most just use Goodreads.

Is there a reason you are trying to dissuade her from starting such a group? You seem put out by the idea. If you are an Indie author - why would you care? Its got nothing to do with you.

Alice wrote: "Anyone interested in discussing things specific to having an agent and a commercial publisher?"

I am a contracted author and an avid reader. I would enjoy discussing various specific items that are only inherent to traditionally published authors.

[Jon]

Bobbi wrote: "There's no reason why indies can't learn from traditionals... It's not like either group has cooties."

Laughed. During Mass. Now I'm goin' to Hell and it's all your fault.

[Alice]

With a debut novel, my expectations of promotion and publicity seem out of touch with the reality of today's publishing market. I have no track record, am not Stephen King, so I understand they are not going to roll out the red carpet, but would still like to know what's possible (Stephen King need not respond).

I am interested to learn what other author's TP do for them in those areas--getting the books to the best and most appropriate readers, reviewers. Were you provided advertising? Interviews? Readings and signings beyond local?
Was there further promotion by your publisher when your book went into paperback? Does your publisher keep you apprised of exactly what they are doing on your behalf? How often do you speak with your publisher?

[Rachel]

I don't know that i have much to add to this discussion as yet, but I am interested in these kinds of topics. I am an agented author with a novel out on submission.

I suppose it could be a separate group, but i don't know that it has to be. It could just be a tag that gets added to the subject line when what you are wanting to discuss is specific to traditional publishing--that's a standard that some mailing lists and Usenet newsgroups i read use.

So like, a subject line might say, "[trad-pub] publicity expectations?" and then you post your questions in the body like you've done in this thread.

For the record, my agency doesn't host any special invite-only author community here. Basically, i follow fellow authors in their list on Twitter, and i'm friends with them here on Goodreads, and that's how/where we interact digitally.

[Rachel]

Alice wrote: "With a debut novel, my expectations of promotion and publicity seem out of touch with the reality of today's publishing market. I have no track record, am not Stephen King, so I understand they are..."

Like i said in my other comment, i have no personal experience to offer as yet, since my book is currently out on submission, but I've been educating myself as best i can about what i might expect in terms of publicity/marketing (and where i might help out) when the novel is picked up.

I've read Jodee Blanco’s Complete Guide to Book Publicity, M.L. Rose and Randy Susan Meyers’s What to Do Before Your Book Launch, and Lissa Warren’s The Savvy Author’s Guide to Book Publicity. All three of these books are great in providing an overview of what to expect, but I think the Rose and Meyers title is the most up-to-date, since it came out in 2012. The other two are still full of valuable info, but they were published before things like the demise of Borders or the loss of most book review columns, so some of the info you need to parse through the lens of history.

Here are those books' pages on here:

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2...
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1...
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2...

[Alice]

Thanks, Rachel, for these good reads suggestions. I would agree that it's best to begin with the most up-to-date "What to Do Before Your Book Launch " (M.L. Rose and Randy Susan Meyers).

Rachel wrote: "Alice wrote: "With a debut novel, my expectations of promotion and publicity seem out of touch with the reality of today's publishing market. I have no track record, am not Stephen King, so I under..."

[Alice]

This fascinating article which appears in today's New York Times leads me to wonder where this will end for self-published authors?

Imagine? They are dividing their books into 100 page segments—something like Perils of Pauline.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/28/tec...

[Christine]

Alice wrote: "With a debut novel, my expectations of promotion and publicity seem out of touch with the reality of today's publishing market. I have no track record, am not Stephen King, so I understand they are..."

I think you are heading in the wrong direction. You need to work with your publisher for the promotion of your book. I have a liason at my publisher who answers all my questions very promptly and explains my role and responsibilities.

Your publisher should be directing the promotion because they hold a financial stake in your book succeeding. If you proceed on your own, you may spend money and time unnecessarily and/or duplicate efforts. Most of the books and articles regarding promotion and current trends are designed for self-published authors. Your publisher will have their own methods and you need to co-ordinate with them.

You should also check your contract - it should outline very clearly what your responsibilities are in regards to promotion. I do not have an agent. I work directly with the publisher. You should check and make sure you are being kept informed of all interactions between your agent and your publisher.

Other than my input on cover and blurb, my publisher handles everything and makes the final decisions. Remember when you go traditional - you have contracted your book to them and they have the final say in all aspects of publication and promotion.

[Alice]

Christine,
While I thank you for your advice, I am confused that you write that I am “heading in the wrong direction.” Perhaps my posting was unclear.

Publishers, large and small, provide different services and promotions to their authors, and I am interested in hearing from other TP participants about what their publishers provide for them.

In personal discussions with other traditionally published (TP) authors it has been interesting to learn what P & As are doing for them in 2015, which is, in many cases, significantly different and less than—say 2013. So I am putting the questions out there:

• Advertising?
• Interviews?
• Readings and signings beyond local?

Some publishers, like mine, are only providing local Book Launch Events (unless, as I wrote, you are Steven King), because people are not showing up when it’s not the author’s “hood.” There have been hysterically funny articles in the Times about no-shows, other than homeless and a few relatives at book signings at B&N in NYC. One well-known author told me there was one person at her reading in a far-away city—and that one person was dead!

• How often do you speak with your publisher? Promotion/publicity director?
• Does your publisher keep you apprised of exactly what they are doing on your behalf?
• Was there further promotion by your publisher when your book went into paperback?

The contracts with both my publisher and agent are excellent, very clear, and negotiated by my literary attorney. That said, my publisher is a large one, with many subsidiaries, juggling many balls at once. Inevitably the largest ball gets the best attention (That may not actually be the case in juggling!)

Just asking questions—opening a GR discussion—bringing TP authors together.

[Mellie]

Any advertising/marketing effort by you is going to be hampered by your ability to price pulse. Do you know your current e-book price in all markets? Do you know how it sits compared to other books in the same genre? What reductions do you have planned to increase sales? For example Bookbub is the #1 advertising avenue but you need to be able to set your e-book price to 99 cents (or free) for the period of the promotion.

Do you have real time access to sale data to evaluate the effectiveness of any marketing/advertising promotions you undertake?

While interviews and signings are fabulous for author ego they don't generate much (if anything) in the way of sales. If you have no ability to change price then your publisher will dictate marketing and advertising effort, which is why your questions are better aimed at them.

[Alp]

Alice wrote: "Anyone interested in discussing things specific to having an agent and a commercial publisher?"

What did you want to talk about?

[Aimee]

Alice wrote: "With a debut novel, my expectations of promotion and publicity seem out of touch with the reality of today's publishing market. I have no track record, am not Stephen King, so I understand they are..."

Hi Alice. I've published many books with mainstream publishers as both an author and co-author. The publisher does the basics -- setting the book up for reviews, sending out copies, arranging online book contests, and serializations and articles, as possible. They will try for radio & TV publicity. But they are overworked, juggling books, and will not follow through when the going gets tough. For my last NF book I hired a fabulous publicist who tag-teamed beautifully with my house publicist. It was the hired publicist who got me on NPR and the Today Show--and that was responsible for my rising to the NYT bestseller list. It's expensive, but if you want serious attention, having your own dedicated publicist can make the difference. Just get that person on board EARLY, well before publication, so that everyone can work together and make the most out of the extra hands.

[Rachel]

Aimee wrote: "Alice wrote: "It's expensive, but if you want serious attention, having your own dedicated publicist can make the difference..."

I hope it is not gauche to ask this, but would you be willing to talk about any ballpark figures WRT the expense of your outside hired publicist? Did s/he bill hourly, weekly, by specific tasks/gigs, etc.?

And, how did you decide with whom to contract the extra publicity work?

[Aimee]

Publicists all have different fee structures. I paid a global fee for 3 months of work on my book -- it was about $20k.
Others will bill hourly or by task.

To select a publicist, check the list of books they've represented, get referrals from other authors, make sure they have a solid track record with books like yours. Not many publicists will rep fiction unless there's a very strong NF hook in the author's personal story or within the book itself. But some actually specialize in literary or YA fiction. As always, do your homework.

[Alice]

Aimee wrote: "get that person on board EARLY, well before publication, so that everyone can work together and make the most out of the extra hands..."

Thanks for sharing this info with the group, Aimee.

What you did, hiring someone three months ahead who could work with your house publicist was the smart thing to do, so I've learned.

I was represented literally overnight, my book sold to a publisher a week later—I never knew what hit me.

Before my book is reissued in paperback next year, I plan to start with a BANG three months ahead. I have a better idea of what I, with a capital I, need to do, what I need help with, who my target audience is, and willing to put some of what I call Lottery Money into that effort. (I consider being published as a first time author at 73 a prize!)

My plan is to hire an ambitious, part-time publicity student to help me—to do the things I don't have time or energy to do—the phone calls, the mailings, the follow-up—so that I can spend more time writing.

Now I want to find out more about who you are!

[Alice]

Rachel wrote: "Aimee wrote: "It's expensive, but if you want serious attention, having your own dedicated publicist can make the difference..."

I hope it is not gauche to ask this, but would you be..."

Rachel, I was quoted a similar price for 30-45 days with someone highly recommended in the LA area, but decided that it was too late. Prior to publication would have been a better time. It will be a consideration next year.