The Dresden Files Read-Along discussion
Open Thread
Does anyone remember Harry's complete set list from the Jury Duty short story; You know when he's 'undercover' as a street busker while surveilling the child's kidnappers with Will Borden as his 'dog'? I remember Hurt, the Cash version; Stairway to Heaven and House of the Rising Sun. However, I seem to remember there are 5 songs in the list. Can anyone close the gap for me?
Lillicat wrote: "I’m on Proven Guilty. Harry says Mac is “downright angelic” when he brings him a much-needed beer. In a later book, an Outsider, IIRC, calls Mac a Watcher. Hmm."I'm really interested in seeing what we learn about Mac in upcoming books - I've been really interested in learning who Mac really is for a while now.
Caryl Huffstetler wrote: "Will wrote: "I don't know if Butcher has said this anywhere, but I feel like The Dresden Files are the journals that McCoy suggests Harry should write."Until Harry's place is firebombed in Change..."
Well, In terms of recreateing the journals after the destruction of Changes, it's important to note that Ghost story is the only volume so far where Harry didn't have a supernatural intelligence with a perfect memory for it's environments as an assistant for his work. So at the very least he can reproduce all his notes by asking them. And of course he now has a child that is classified as such an entity. And let me tell you how much I'm looking forward to seeing what happens there.
For those talking about journals, I think you have a good theory about the Dresden Files being his journals. I am re-listening Ghost Story right now and Butters talks about going through Harry’s notes to make his flashlight. And yeah, I am already way ahead because I have an hour drive to and from work. Then I listen while I crochet. So, I tend to go through books really fast. I love reading these discussions because it lets me see what others have caught on to that I may have missed.
Chris wrote: "Caryl Huffstetler wrote: "Will wrote: "I don't know if Butcher has said this anywhere, but I feel like The Dresden Files are the journals that McCoy suggests Harry should write."Until Harry's pla..."
I hadn't considered those supernatural entities, especially Bonea, as sources until your post. Thanks! Butcher himself said he is having 'fun' writing 'Bonnie'. So I too, am looking forward to seeing what he has done with her.
Caryl Huffstetler wrote: "Yasmin wrote: "Considering Bob's personality is affected by whoever owns him - what does it say about Harry that he has a sex-maniac for a lab assisstant...yeah - Harry's a perfect gentleman, but..."
Highrises are less of an issue as the lack of clear weather up north to make solar panels worthwhile.
Regarding a hot bath - you still have to warm up the water somehow - and now transport them from the shower to the livingroom, which is full of rugs and not ventilated properly...
I guess if Harry really wanted hot water, he could magic them hot - before the shower obiously (running water ground magic).
But it does sound like he prefers cold showers...
Only so much can be explained away as self discipline, or desperate attempts to avoid Bob-level lustiness intruding on everyday life. At least part of the Cold Showers thing has to be masochism. After asking the right question it took only about ninety minutes to finagle a way for adult-version MaggieD to come up with a workaround allowing internet access!
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Also: “Bonnie” is a far better name than “Athena” which is what I’d been calling baby-spirit
Also, also: all his notes being destroyed in CHANGES is not something I’d thought of… same thing happens in Stoker’s Dracula. Main character’s story is being told though letters which are themselves thrown into a fire halfway through the book… Hmm
New microfiction on the site solves the question about kinkaid at the end of Changes. Well - now i wonder about how Ivy knew - although she is supposed to know spoken words as well as written, but a conversation between a winter queen and a spirit guardian?Maybe Mab asked her specifically...
That ending in the microfiction is cold... creepy teanager...
I think the microfiction indicates JB is reading the threads along with us, given this question was just debated. ;-) Hi, JB!
Yasmin wrote: "New microfiction on the site solves the question about kinkaid at the end of Changes. Well - now i wonder about how Ivy knew - although she is supposed to know spoken words as well as written, but ..."I think the ending of the micro fiction leaves Ivy bereft of her protector; reveals that Kincaid has a form of honor but, though he perceives and understands human emotion, experiences none of it.
It looks as though Ivy might have had contact with Mab in order to ensure Dresden's survival and recovery. That's why she insisted on the chest shot, in my opinion. So that she could make sure Mab was johnny on the spot to retrieve Dresden from the lake.
I think it likely she simply listened in to Harry and Kincaid's conversation and worked out the gist or, alternatively, she could read the 'notes' Harry was Going to write. Which would mean she could contain, not only the sum of past and present human knowledge but also, all of future human knowledge as well.
Lillicat wrote: "I think the microfiction indicates JB is reading the threads along with us, given this question was just debated. ;-) Hi, JB!"This is what I was thinking too, ‘cos before the microfiction I was gonna post a detailed reason as to why getting shot in the face shouldn’t matter… now seems kinda pointless! =P
And hey, if you are reading this JB… is Leanansidhe’s real name “Azalea” of the Sithe? ‘cos that’d be super helpful in any attempt to trap the woman in a magic circle, and the plant itself is both red and poisonous
Caryl Huffstetler wrote: "Yasmin wrote: "New microfiction on the site solves the question about kinkaid at the end of Changes. Well - now i wonder about how Ivy knew - although she is supposed to know spoken words as well a..."does she have Future Knowledge? I thought she just has all of Past & Present Knowledge - which would be more than enough to figure out what's going on and make pretty good guesses about possible future.
Also - I'm not sure Kincaid is just faking human emotions - he Doth protest too much...
September twenty-ninth 2020?Does that mean what I think it means!!?!
Jesus—frickin—Christ
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Addendum: Sry Jean, got excited. Though on reflection it seems somewhat worrisome to title the book after next a “BATTLE GROUND”
Just heard the news about Battle Ground and needed somewhere to express my joy! Two books in one year?! YESSSSSSSS!!!!
Paulum Mortis wrote: "September twenty-ninth 2020?Does that mean what I think it means!!?!
Jesus—frickin—Christ"
Please don't assume everyone knows what this means... I don't.
Jeanie wrote: "Paulum Mortis wrote: "September twenty-ninth 2020?Does that mean what I think it means!!?!
Jesus—frickin—Christ"
Please don't assume everyone knows what this means... I don't."
September 29, 2020 is when Battle Ground comes out which means that we get TWO books this year instead of one.
Have you seen the book trailer that was released today?
https://io9.gizmodo.com/check-out-our...
hour long interview with JB and Daniel Greene on Youtube only a few hours old; JB said that Peace Talks took a 'skew' and got too long and therefore got broken up into 2 books. Yay! Pre-orders available on Amazon already! Also, JB's son is writing and may soon be published.
that trailer is gorgeous - love it - everybody should see, and then help analyze the spoilers...saw it yet? ok, here goes...
What did Thomas get involved in, and yeah, I bet Lara draged him into it in the 1st place - she seems to like doing that to her court.
Marcone is doing the peace talks? really? what does he get out of it, and who's the other side in the conflict? The Fomor or the Denarians?
What is that thing Murphy's holding? some sort of cutter?
Of course Harry is trying to help Thomas - even if it means going up against Carlos and Ebenezer (although I don't think the latter will resist too much - Thomas is his grandson too).
Of course the peace talks will not succeed - so the next book will be Battle Ground...
Lara and Harry... I think she's in real danger of burning herself - he's with Murphy now...
can't wait to read the book.
Whatever Thomas is involved in could be related to Justine's pregnancy. Add a read of chapter 1 to the trailer and POW!No idea what's in it for Marcone yet.
Murphy is holding a Dremel tool - per the Q&A with Jim and Priscilla- She's probably cutting off that hip to ankle cast she's wearing in the couch scene. Why? Because, as usual, Harry's going to need all the help he can get. If she's had that cast on for the whole month since the end of Skin Game, and she probably would have had, it means she hasn't had a chance to make Harry's dream come true, which means he's not protected against Lara's machinations; no true love protection against the White Court!
Could anyone tell if that was Carlos or Thomas who was so beat up, possibly dead when Harry rolled him over?
Lastly, is the Spiderman singing scene from Battleground? It could be according to hints in the Q&A.
Ooops, I lied, one more thing: I've already pre-ordered Battleground? Who's with me?
I knew there was something I was forgetting. I watched the trailer then went running off excited that there was going to be a book coming out almost immediately after peace talks that I forgot about reading the first chapter. ooops lol. Getting Battleground as an after birthday present as it is set to come out the day after
Chris wrote: "I've actually always wondered why he didn't set up a Thaumaturgical solution to the cold water thing a long time ago. If he can store Kinetic energy in a ring there should be no reason why he can't..."Martyr complex or streak of masochism?
Yasmin wrote: "Regarding Mac - he is not human, but we still don't know what his deal is. We do know he has a neutral accord ground establishment - so whatever he was, he wants out.I wonder how long he can stay ..."
Loved JB's comment at a recent Con when he said maybe it's just Mac filling out the paper work and paying the fee.
Caryl Huffstetler wrote: "Whatever Thomas is involved in could be related to Justine's pregnancy. Add a read of chapter 1 to the trailer and POW!No idea what's in it for Marcone yet.
Murphy is holding a Dremel tool - pe..."
Oh, I've totally preordered both books.
I'm just wondering where Elaine is going to show up...
Meryl wrote: "Caryl wrote: "I'm just wondering where Elaine is going to show up... You here Jim in the interview talking about “The Good Place” and how through story structure and pattern matching he wrote down the shocking twist for the end of Season 1?
Yeah, I totally have a wrinkled piece of paper in my pocket about dear Elaine’s part to play in upcoming books, and it’s been there for 6/7 years now!
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Also, isn’t Sarissa’s father an Austrian composer who burned out young? Mozart/Strauss/Schubert
Paulum Mortis wrote: "Meryl wrote: "Caryl wrote: "I'm just wondering where Elaine is going to show up... You here Jim in the interview talking about “The Good Place” and how through story structure and pattern matchin..."
I'd love to know chapter and book for Sarissa's father, just so I could reread that part.
Meryl wrote: "Lillicat wrote: "I’m on Proven Guilty. Harry says Mac is “downright angelic” when he brings him a much-needed beer. In a later book, an Outsider, IIRC, calls Mac a Watcher. Hmm."I'm really intere..."
JB has said that he has a whole backstory for most of his characters but, I suspect, that unless that backstory is going to move the main story along we, the readers, will never know them. That said, I have a few random speculations regarding Mac:
1) Who or whatever he is, he has declared himself a neutral to all and sundry, an uninvolved party who merely watches and does not engage in magical politics
2) He has or has had children in the past. I base that on his, Mac's, speech to Harry in Changes when Harry tells Mac that he just found out he has a child.
3) He may be an ancient Sumerian or Egyptian deity tied to beer making. Historians say that Sumer is the birthplace of beer and that Egyptians so excelled at the art of brewing that part of any workers pay was in beer and that trade in beer made up a large part of the Egyptian economy. Of course, beer has had a huge part in the culture of both Eastern and Western Europe since before written history also. So the beer making is a part of who Mac is but doesn't narrow down his origins.
Caryl Huffstetler wrote: 1) Who or whatever he is, he has declared himself a neutral to all and sundry, an uninvolved party who merely watches and does not engage in magical politics2) He has or has had children in the past. I base that on his, Mac's, speech to Harry in Changes when Harry tells Mac that he just found out he has a child.
3) He may be an ancient Sumerian or Egyptian deity tied to beer making. Historians say that Sumer is the birthplace of beer and that Egyptians so excelled at the art of brewing that part of any workers pay was in beer and that trade in beer made up a large part of the Egyptian economy. Of course, beer has had a huge part in the culture of both Eastern and Western Europe since before written history also. So the beer making is a part of who Mac is but doesn't narrow down his origins.
My pet theory on Mac has always been something similar. Not necessarily an Egyptian or Sumerian deity (since that's never been my area of expertise), but perhaps some form of Greek deity or entity similar to Argus. Or, given that Uriel seems to have a vested interest in Harry's well being, one of his spooks who has been in Chicago since before Harry got there to make sure that the city was safe for Harry and to keep an eye on him, make sure Harry didn't get himself in too much trouble. (Not it that it worked...but that'll get us down a theological rabbit hole of free will, etc...)
Meryl wrote: "Lillicat wrote: "I’m on Proven Guilty. Harry says Mac is “downright angelic” when he brings him a much-needed beer. In a later book, an Outsider, IIRC, calls Mac a Watcher. Hmm."I'm really intere..."
I think the two key words are "angelic" and "Watcher". In the Book of Enoch, which is a Hebrew religious text that most see as apocryphal, refers to angelic beings sent to this world as Watchers. I can't remember if they were the fallen angels and made Watchers or if the Watchers fell, but they remained on earth, married--or at least had children with--humans, and were said to have introduced all sorts of knowledge to humans.
Jeanie wrote: "Meryl wrote: "Lillicat wrote: "I’m on Proven Guilty. Harry says Mac is “downright angelic” when he brings him a much-needed beer. In a later book, an Outsider, IIRC, calls Mac a Watcher. Hmm."I'm..."
Hmm, sounds like the kind of arcane info JB might have access to and would have worked into the Dresdenverse.
The trailer "improvement" is funny - like the Burger King crown at the end - nice shoutout.
Yasmin wrote: "The trailer "improvement" is funny - like the Burger King crown at the end - nice shoutout."But don't forget that in WHITE NIGHT, Harry promises himself he's going to get himself spurs and a 10-gallon hat. Twice.
Wordwizard wrote: "Yasmin wrote: "The trailer "improvement" is funny - like the Burger King crown at the end - nice shoutout."But don't forget that in WHITE NIGHT, Harry promises himself he's going to get himself s..."
At least the 10 gallon hat will make him fit with the cover art. ;-)
Caryl Huffstetler wrote: "Does anyone remember Harry's complete set list from the Jury Duty short story; You know when he's 'undercover' as a street busker while surveilling the child's kidnappers with Will Borden as his 'd..."The Full set list is:
1. Hurt (Cash Version)
2. Behind Blue Eyes
3. Only Happy When it Rains
4. Stairway to Heaven
5. House of the Rising Sun.
Thank you so much. My playlist thanks you too. Now to comb through the versions to find the one (or two) that land best on my ear.
Caryl Huffstetler wrote: "Thank you so much. My playlist thanks you too. Now to comb through the versions to find the one (or two) that land best on my ear.""House of the Rising Sun" I have two suggestions for you: the most common on is the version by The Animals from 1964. The other one? The piano cover of the Westworld Season 1 soundtrack.
Here is the score so far for Harry's rune colors:Storm Front : not mentioned
Fool Moon: Incandescent White
Grave Peril: White-->Scarlet (Kravos)
Summer Knight: Scarlet
Death Masks: Bright red
**Enter Lash at the end of Death Masks**
Blood Rites: Cinder Red / Ember orange
Dead Beat: Hellish Scarlet / Sullen orange
Proven Guilty: Ember orange
His white energy to start the series echoes his ability to make the sunshine in a hanky spell I think.
Zachary wrote: "Here is the score so far for Harry's rune colors:Storm Front : not mentioned
Fool Moon: Incandescent White
Grave Peril: White-->Scarlet (Kravos)
Summer Knight: Scarlet
Death Masks: Bright red
**En..."
You've got to be really happy to be able capture sunshine in a hanky. Can't remember where that is but it's there.
The Hellfire in Proven Guilty is also making his formerly invisible force energy glow red.
The sunshine in a hanky thing is explained in Blood Rites during the IHOP scene with Kincaid and Murphy. Murphy asks him if he can do that thing with the hanky and he explains he can't because he's not truly happy.
Thanks for helping me locate that tidbit.
Joe wrote: "Caryl Huffstetler wrote: "Thank you so much. My playlist thanks you too. Now to comb through the versions to find the one (or two) that land best on my ear.""House of the Rising Sun" I have two s..."
Ah, but Harry plays a 6 string. So I'll look for a finger style version. Do we think Harry was singing or just playing? I don't think he was singing because Harry says many times that he tends to hum off key or flat. And if he does sing, in what voice; tenor, baritone, bass? Opinions welcome.
"Yasmin wrote: "The trailer "improvement" is funny - like the Burger King crown at the end - nice shoutout."Wordwizard wrote:
But don't forget that in WHITE NIGHT, Harry promises himself he's going to get himself spurs and a 10-gallon hat. Twice.
Caryl Huffstetler wrote:
At least the 10 gallon hat will make him fit with the cover art. ;-)
That's the point. Jim Butcher is poking metafun.
Chris wrote: "The sunshine in a hanky thing is explained in Blood Rites during the IHOP scene with Kincaid and Murphy. Murphy asks him if he can do that thing with the hanky and he explains he can't because he's not truly happy.."He explains that it turns out you have to be happy to be able to do that. It's an oblique reference to what happened to Susan and hence, to his love life. He hadn't actually wanted to mention that to Murphy, who he also is not involved with, alas, but she pressed for an explanation he didn't wish to give.
Between WHITE NIGHT and SMALL FAVOR are two short stories in SIDE JOBS, "It's My Birthday, Too" and "Heorot." Is discussing them a spoiler no-no in the no-spoiler thread? Or is there a date by which it's allowed? Between SMALL FAVOR and TURN COAT there are likewise FOUR short stories in SIDE JOBS: "Day Off," "Backup," "The Warrior," "Last Call." Same question.
On the no spoiler threads: Just my opinion mind you; Wait until the Small Favor thread to discuss It's My Birthday, Too and Heorot and wait until the Turn Coat thread for the other 4 short stories. However, there Are discussion threads that allow spoilers and there is this open thread. So discuss away on those.
Does anyone who's read the short story "Heorot" in SIDE JOBS that takes place after White Night but before SMALL FAVOR who is better-versed than I about Beowulf, etc., know who The Geat is (Beowulf?) and exactly what the family connection is between Sigrun and the grendelkin? The Wikipedia entry on Sigrún is NOT helpful.The story itself hints they're related in some way. "Family feuds are always the worst." The grendelkin is a scion of Grendel, who raped a human woman (in fact, several). She's a scion of the Geat (Beowulf or a descendent of his?) She was able to sense the grendelkin when Dresden could not—perhaps through a mystic connection, perhaps a blood relationship? Perhaps the grendelkin's mother was her kinswoman?
Cliffnotes informs us that the Geat are the tribe of which Beowulf was king, making him "The Geat". Not the only one but at the time of the saga.Grendel is a direct descendent of Cain according to ancient-origins.net
Sigrun is a Valkyrie, descended of moral kings but a kind of daughter to Odin -Donar Vadderung-
Grendel was a foe of Beowulf's. This makes all the descendants of Beowulf enemies of all the descendants of Grendel. Sort of a feud situation.
All of the above info is available on https://www.timelessmyths.com/norse.html.
Caryl Huffstetler wrote: "Sigrun is a Valkyrie, descended of moral kings but a kind of daughter to Odin -Donar Vadderung-."No, at the end of the story, she clearly states that he is NOT her father, although sometimes he likes them (the Valkyries) to call him "Daddy." She also warns Harry not to believe everything he reads.
Well there you go; the Dresdenverse not conforming to other websites. But in Dresden's world all is as according to JB.
Paulum Mortis, I would love to share a few cocktails with you and get you to spill your secrets! I’m dying to know what line in Grave Peril you think will cause the divergence of Mirror Mirror. And I want to know what you think Elaine’s part is in the upcoming books. And why the weird obsession with Trixie Vixen? I NEED THIS INFORMATION!
yeah - Harry's a perfect gentleman, but the cold showe..."
Chicago has too many high rises to make a solar heater work for a basement apartment, especially in the area of town Harry describes.Also, a solar water heater doesn't require electricity of any kind. Though why he doesn't just get a metal tub and bathe in front of the fire as Luccio did is beyond me.