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Dombey and Son
Dombey and Son
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Dombey, Chapters 26 - 28
Joe B. Is Sly, Sir, Devilish Sly
Chapter 26
Mr. Dombey introduces his daughter, Florence
Chapter 28
Tristram wrote: "Dear Fellow Pickwickians,shadows, shadows, shadows, and some ray of light at the end - this is what these three chapters hold in store for Florence (and the sympathetic reader).
In Chapter 26, w..."
The mention of Carker gaining power over people is further reinforced when we find out he enjoys playing chess. I see the mention of chess as a metaphor for how Carker is, and will, in the future, play with, manoeuver, and use the other characters as pawns in his game to control Dombey. When Dickens writes about Carker that "one might have thought that the white teeth were prone to bite the hand they fawned on" the reader clearly sees that Carker intends evil and destruction upon all who come within his grasp. At the end of chapter 26 Carker looks into his chamber's mirror and sees a false reflection and imagines "crowds of people ... at his feet." Any game Carker plays, he intends to win.
Edith is a most interesting character. She is enigmatic, and yet candid and practical. She comments to her mother "you know he has bought me" and furthers her candid self-appraisal by observing "[Dombey] sees me at the auction, and he thinks it well to buy me." She is chattel, a product to be bought, but there are tender moments when she first meets Florence. It is the first instant that Edith has shown any true emotion. As haughty as Edith appears externally, there is within her feelings and tenderness. The initial meeting of Edith and Florence takes place within the framework of Dombey's mansion being totally renovated in anticipation of his coming marriage. How ironic that Dombey is in the process of restoring his house when the reader knows that Carker appears to have plans to totally destroy the firm of Dombey and Son.
The fact that we have learned from Susan Nipper at the beginning of chapter 28 that Dombey is totally dependant on Carker makes this reconstruction of the house sit very precariously on its foundation.
Kim wrote: "Mr. Dombey introduces his daughter, Florence
Chapter 28"
Again and again, thank you Kim for the posting of the illustrations.
Kim wrote: "Joe B. Is Sly, Sir, Devilish Sly
Chapter 26"
For the first time, the illustrations aren't showing up for me.
The passages of Mrs. Skewton being prepared for bed were totally gruesome. I like the Major, and now I have to hope that he never actually marries this woman who is such a completely false front for what she truly is.
The passage about Edith and her mother talking about the expected arrival of Dombey's proposal was extraordinary. I emerged from it with much greater respect, and also pity, for Edith. Her mother has made any other course of action than selling her position and beauty to a wealthy man impossible, but she isn't going to use that beauty to try to snare the man. If he wants to pursue and capture her she will -- perhaps can -- do nothing overt to resist it, but she has enough self-respect not to huckster herself on the marriage market. Pretty amazing exchange.
So the proposal has been made and accepted, off stage as it were. (Interesting that Dickens, who is so active in portraying all the details of his characters' lives, doesn't give us this important moment. How did Dombey go about making his offer, and how did Edith receive it? I would love to have heard that conversation.
Will the marriage actually take place? Or will something intervene to prevent it?
I'll try the illustrations again from another site, if I can remember which one I used in the first place. :-}
Joe B. is Sly Sir, Devilishly Sly
Chapter 26
Mr. Dombey introduces his daughter, Florence
Chapter 28
As long as I'm illustrating, here's Fred Barnard's for this installment, if it shows up that is.
"Thank you. I have no desire to read it," was her answer". - Chapter 26
"Go and meet her!" - Chapter 27
"A child!" said Edith, looking at her. "When was I a child! What childhood did you ever leave to me!"—Chapter 28
Kim wrote: "I'll try the illustrations again from another site, if I can remember which one I used in the first place. :-}Chapter 26"
that worked. Thanks!
Did everybody catch this little vignette from Chapter 26?As Mr Dombey dropped his eyes, and adjusted his neckcloth again, the smiling face of Mr Carker the Manager became in a moment, and without any stage of transition, transformed into a most intent and frowning face, scanning his closely, and with an ugly sneer. As Mr Dombey raised his eyes, it changed back, no less quickly, to its old expression, and showed him every gum of which it stood possessed.
In case anybody still wondered about Carker, this should settle it.
Shakespeare had it dead on (and I suspect that Dickens may well have had this from Hamlet in mind when he designed Carker:
O villain, villain, smiling, damnèd villain!
My tables!—Meet it is I set it down
That one may smile, and smile, and be a villain.
I stopped my Dickens quote too soon. It goes on a few lines later: 'I took the liberty of waiting on her,' said Carker, 'to inquire if she could charge me with any little commission. I am not so fortunate as to be the bearer of any but her—but her dear love.'
Wolf's face that it was then, with even the hot tongue revealing itself through the stretched mouth, as the eyes encountered Mr Dombey's!
and even more a few lines on:
'By Gad, Sir!' said the Major, staring, 'you are a contrast to Dombey, who plays nothing.'
'Oh! He!' returned the Manager. 'He has never had occasion to acquire such little arts. To men like me, they are sometimes useful. As at present, Major Bagstock, when they enable me to take a hand with you.'
It might be only the false mouth, so smooth and wide; and yet there seemed to lurk beneath the humility and subserviency of this short speech, a something like a snarl; and, for a moment, one might have thought that the white teeth were prone to bite the hand they fawned upon. But the Major thought nothing about it; and Mr Dombey lay meditating with his eyes half shut, during the whole of the play, which lasted until bed-time.
Call it Carker Revealed. We know him now, don't we?
And what is most frightening about it is that I believe he has his eyes set on marrying Florence. Can she escape her wiles? Or will Dombey see handing her over to his most trusted lieutenant to be a smart move to cement his commitment to the house of Dombey and Son?
Is Dickens capable of such an outrage as to subject poor, sweet Florence to be ensnared for life as the wife -- more probably slave -- of Carker?
Ah, Shakespeare"False face must hide what the false heart doth know"
I wonder how broad were Macbeth's smiles towards Duncan?
If Carker takes even one tiny step towards Florence he will have both Diogenes and me to deal with!
From Chapter 27, Dombey and Edith:So unmatched were they, and opposed, so forced and linked together by a chain which adverse hazard and mischance had forged: that fancy might have imagined the pictures on the walls around them, startled by the unnatural conjunction, and observant of it in their several expressions. Grim knights and warriors looked scowling on them. A churchman, with his hand upraised, denounced the mockery of such a couple coming to God's altar. Quiet waters in landscapes, with the sun reflected in their depths, asked, if better means of escape were not at hand, was there no drowning left? Ruins cried, 'Look here, and see what We are, wedded to uncongenial Time!' Animals, opposed by nature, worried one another, as a moral to them. Loves and Cupids took to flight afraid, and Martyrdom had no such torment in its painted history of suffering.
Is there any hope for this marriage at all, assuming it actually comes off?
But Dombey seems satisfied with a loveless marriage.
Mr Dombey was far from quarrelling, in his own breast, with the manner of his beautiful betrothed. He had that good reason for sympathy with haughtiness and coldness, which is found in a fellow-feeling. It flattered him to think how these deferred to him, in Edith's case, and seemed to have no will apart from his. It flattered him to picture to himself, this proud and stately woman doing the honours of his house, and chilling his guests after his own manner.
Egad. That Edith's mother's perfidy should have subjected her to this.
Is there any chance at all that Edith can actually find any happiness in this marriage? Or is her life destined to be one of perpetual emptiness and, if not misery, at least lack of any vestige of happiness?
Everyman wrote: "From Chapter 27, Dombey and Edith:So unmatched were they, and opposed, so forced and linked together by a chain which adverse hazard and mischance had forged: that fancy might have imagined the p..."
I know I have mentioned it before in these posts but I cannot recall Dickens's writing be strong and forceful. He seems to carry the reader forward in great moments of prose. Truly remarkable.
Everyman wrote: "The passages of Mrs. Skewton being prepared for bed were totally gruesome. I like the Major, and now I have to hope that he never actually marries this woman who is such a completely false front f..."Three cheers for Everyman! Finally somebody who, like me, likes the Major. Not that we misunderstand each other: I don't like him in a way that I would actually want to spend time with him and count him among my friends, but I like him as a character in a book: His discourse is entertaining, his enrapturedness with himself is a travesty of Dombey's stiff pride and haughtiness, and a ludicrous comment on it, his passages are written in a very funny vein, and his mean little plots add momentum to the story and make him one of the rather important side characters.
As to Mrs. Skewton's being prepared for the night, I think this memento mori can also be read as some kind of foreshadowing of Mr. Dombey's downfall. Mrs. Skewton prides herself on her looks, which are mere appearance in two senses of the word, and Mr. Dombey preens himself on his wealth and his position in society, but he is nearly as void of any humaneness as Mrs. Skewton, who is just a painted old skeleton.
Peter wrote: "The fact that we have learned from Susan Nipper at the beginning of chapter 28 that Dombey is totally dependant on Carker makes this reconstruction of the house sit very precariously on its foundation."Peter,
a very good observation, and an example of how carefully and fittingly Dickens adds information and makes the reader connect certain things. It's just that the reader subconsciously sees Carker as the foundation of Dombey's firm and then expects its downfall or at least some terrible event in the future.
Peter wrote: "Tristram wrote: "Dear Fellow Pickwickians,shadows, shadows, shadows, and some ray of light at the end - this is what these three chapters hold in store for Florence (and the sympathetic reader).
..."
One thing I thought when Carker was playing all those games with the Major (again, in two senses of the words), was that maybe a man as self-centred and egoistic as the Major would resent losing game after game, and therefore it would be clever of Carker to let the Major win at chess or at cards. However, Carker seems to be able to impress people in a positive way even when he makes them lose a game.
Everyman wrote: "I stopped my Dickens quote too soon. It goes on a few lines later: 'I took the liberty of waiting on her,' said Carker, 'to inquire if she could charge me with any little commission. I am not ..."
By saying that Florence did not have any other commission for him to convey to her father but her dear love, he creates the impression of indifference on Florence's part, thus widening the gulf between father and daughter. I wonder if he does that on purpse, i.e. if he knows about Dombey's cold attitude towards his daughter.
Peter wrote: "Ah, Shakespeare"False face must hide what the false heart doth know"
I wonder how broad were Macbeth's smiles towards Duncan?
If Carker takes even one tiny step towards Florence he will have bo..."
Can we ever exhaust Shakespeare? Here's another one for Carker: "Look like th'innocent flower / But be the serpent under't"
Just note Carker's fantasies about treading on faces when he is alone in his room.
Tristram wrote: "Everyman wrote: "I stopped my Dickens quote too soon. It goes on a few lines later: 'I took the liberty of waiting on her,' said Carker, 'to inquire if she could charge me with any little comm..."
Sadly, I think Carker knows all. Along with his smile and feline sensibilities I think he knows, stores and then will use all his "gathered" information to pounce when he is sure of his prey and his advantage.
A good chess player is always thinking a few moves ahead. Carker is a very evil person.
Tristram wrote: "Three cheers for Everyman!" Oh please, now my headache is starting all over again. I think I'll go hit something.
Peter wrote: "The mention of Carker gaining power over people is further reinforced when we find out he enjoys playing chess."Not only that, but that he plays ALL games, and plays them well:
"Carker plays at all games, I believe," said Mr. Dombey, laying himself on a sofa like a man of wood without a hinge or joint in him; "and plays them well."
It gives the reader a sense that no matter what plan Carker sets out to take, he will complete it to his satisfaction.
BTW, I love the image of Mr. Dombey laying on the sofa so stiffly.
Everyman wrote: "The passages of Mrs. Skewton being prepared for bed were totally gruesome."This was absolutely my favorite passage. Here it is so I can come back to it easily. :)
Thus they remained for a long hour, without a word, until Mrs Skewton's maid appeared, according to custom, to prepare her gradually for night. At night, she should have been a skeleton, with dart and hour-glass, rather than a woman, this attendant; for her touch was as the touch of Death. The painted object shrivelled underneath her hand; the form collapsed, the hair dropped off, the arched dark eyebrows changed to scanty tufts of grey; the pale lips shrunk, the skin became cadaverous and loose; an old, worn, yellow, nodding woman, with red eyes, alone remained in Cleopatra's place, huddled up, like a slovenly bundle, in a greasy flannel gown.
Everyman wrote: " I like the Major, and now I have to hope that he never actually marries this woman who is such a completely false front for what she truly is."When I read the exchange between the Major and Mrs. Skewton, it seemed that the Major was just as conniving to get Dombey and Edith married so that he could enjoy the spoils just as much as Mrs. Skewton. Although, doesn't the Major already enjoy Dombey's wealth already, so what's in it for him? The thought that he had eyes for Mrs. Skewton had not crossed my mind. Anyway, I was a little confused here, wondering if the Major and Mrs. Skewton had been planning in advance of introducing Dombey to the ladies.
'Dombey, Ma'am,' said the Major, 'is a great catch.'
'Oh, mercenary wretch!' cried Cleopatra, with a little shriek, 'I am shocked.'
'And Dombey, Ma'am,' pursued the Major, thrusting forward his head, and distending his eyes, 'is in earnest. Joseph says it; Bagstock knows it; J. B. keeps him to the mark. Leave Dombey to himself, Ma'am. Dombey is safe, Ma'am. Do as you have done; do no more; and trust to J. B. for the end.'
'You really think so, my dear Major?' returned Cleopatra, who had eyed him very cautiously, and very searchingly, in spite of her listless bearing.
'Sure of it, Ma'am,' rejoined the Major. 'Cleopatra the peerless, and her Antony Bagstock, will often speak of this, triumphantly, when sharing the elegance and wealth of Edith Dombey's establishment. Dombey's right-hand man, Ma'am,' said the Major, stopping abruptly in a chuckle, and becoming serious, 'has arrived.'
Everyman wrote: "Is there any hope for this marriage at all, assuming it actually comes off?But Dombey seems satisfied with a loveless marriage."
As long as she bears him a son, I would think he got as much out of the marriage as he was hoping for. As for Edith's feelings, it doesn't look like he cares one way or another how happy or not she is in the marriage. We never see him ask her anything personally that would show he is interested in her as a companion, wife, mother, or anything - besides that she can "look" the part by being accomplished.
Tristram wrote: "As to Mrs. Skewton's being prepared for the night, I think this memento mori can also be read as some kind of foreshadowing of Mr. Dombey's downfall. Mrs. Skewton prides herself on her looks, which are mere appearance in two senses of the word, and Mr. Dombey preens himself on his wealth and his position in society, but he is nearly as void of any humaneness as Mrs. Skewton, who is just a painted old skeleton."Excellent!
Peter wrote: "Edith is a most interesting character. She is enigmatic, and yet candid and practical. She comments to her mother "you know he has bought me" .... but there are tender moments when she first meets Florence. It is the first instant that Edith has shown any true emotion. As haughty as Edith appears externally, there is within her feelings and tenderness."Edith is definitely a sympathetic character now. To know why she appears cold was heartbreaking, yet there is hope that she can find some personal friendship and real love in Florence. When Florence went to Edith and hugged her and Edith showed compassion in return was a big surprise to me, and it was almost as an emotional a scene as when Florence's mother died.
Linda wrote: "Peter wrote: "Edith is a most interesting character. She is enigmatic, and yet candid and practical. She comments to her mother "you know he has bought me" .... but there are tender moments when sh..."My wife and I are flying out of Seattle tomorrow on a brief holiday. I'll keep my eye open for anyone reading D&S. I like to think of you, Everyman and myself as the west coast connection to Dickens.
Peter wrote: "The fact that we have learned from Susan Nipper at the beginning of chapter 28 that Dombey is totally dependant on Carker makes this reconstruction of the house sit very precariously on its foundation. "Well, I took that passage with a sizable grain of salt, though maybe I shouldn't have. But it is, after all, servant's gossip. And Susan, if I'm right, isn't that old -- we are told when she first appears (shortly after Paul's birth) that she is only 14 when Florence was six, so now that Florence is 14, Susan is 22. Not an old retainer by any means!
It makes me wonder, though, how old Carker is. Are we ever told? If I'm right that he has his eye on Florence, he can't be all that old. And the House of Dombey and Son has been going on for quite awhile.
So overall, I'm not sure I put all that much credence in Susan's evaluation. Though we will probably find out in time.
Peter wrote: "Sadly, I think Carker knows all. Along with his smile and feline sensibilities I think he knows, stores and then will use all his "gathered" information to pounce when he is sure of his prey and his advantage."But what IS his prey? What is he up to? Something, for sure, but I don't see Dickens giving us even a clue, other than maybe interest in marrying Florence.
Kim wrote: "Tristram wrote: "Three cheers for Everyman!" Oh please, now my headache is starting all over again. I think I'll go hit something."
Start with that 43 inch monstrosity of a "snowflake." Take a sledgehammer and hit it over and over again until it's smashed into at least 100 pieces. You'll feel much better.
Linda wrote: "As long as she bears him a son, I would think he got as much out of the marriage as he was hoping for."That, and an ornament for his table and to entertain his guests. I think pretty much a trophy wife with hopes for a son. You're certainly right in that.
But the idea of these two frigid beings actually trying to couple to produce offspring -- the mind boggles.
Linda wrote: "When Florence went to Edith and hugged her and Edith showed compassion in return was a big surprise to me..."And to me. I think there is more to Edith than has yet been disclosed to us.
Everyman wrote: "Kim wrote: "Tristram wrote: "Three cheers for Everyman!" Oh please, now my headache is starting all over again. I think I'll go hit something."
Start with that 43 inch monstrosity of a "snowfla..."
Don't forget, that 43 inch three dimensional snowflake.
Peter wrote: "My wife and I are flying out of Seattle tomorrow on a brief holiday. I'll keep my eye open for anyone reading D&S. I like to think of you, Everyman and myself as the west coast connection to Dickens.":) Have a good flight and holiday! I drive along the north end of the runways each day on the way to daycare and back, many time right under the planes which are landing. I'll hold up my copy of D&S as I drive by tomorrow. Well, maybe not hold up as I'll be driving, but I'll give the copy a good pat next to me in the passenger's seat.
Peter wrote: My wife and I are flying out of Seattle tomorrow on a brief holiday."If you head North, glance out the window and wave -- if you tell me when you're going to be overhead, I'll wave back.
Everyman wrote: "Peter wrote: My wife and I are flying out of Seattle tomorrow on a brief holiday."If you head North, glance out the window and wave -- if you tell me when you're going to be overhead, I'll wave b..."
Thanks Everyman. We leave Victoria at 11:00am so we'll be overhead shortly after. I'll signal with my e-reader.
Everyman wrote: "Peter wrote: My wife and I are flying out of Seattle tomorrow on a brief holiday."If you head North, glance out the window and wave -- if you tell me when you're going to be overhead, I'll wave b..."
If I happen to fly by someday will you wave at me too?
This novel of Dickens isn't grabbing me -- Dombey himself is too hard to believe as a character, (and so is Florence). And since that basic tension between Dombey and Florence seems too unrealistic to me, it isn't appealing to me as a story. I'm fine with the idea of exaggerated characters in Dickens. They can be great. And I like the ones that he writes that are more complex and realistic like the Father of the Marshallsee.
But Dombey is not an exaggeration so much as he is an impossibility, a square circle. Perhaps if Dickens presented him as a sociopath that would explain it. Or described how Dombey was raised by his own father in a similar way and gave some backstory. Or said Dombey hates women for some reason and showed him more fond of little Paul than he really was except as a future business partner. Something that could explain this non-entity of a character.
And Florence is difficult to believe because she has no reason to love Dombey so much -- he has never done anything for her other than cause her pain by neglect. Dombey was never affectionate to his own son for that matter or to Florence's mother, so why should Florence love him? If anything she should be angry with him or just flat in her affect towards him. You could tell that little Paul didn't care much for his father - why should he? But why should Florence?
Dickens can present a girl like Jenny Wren who has affection for her father although he is a drunk and doesn't deserve it. And it seems totally natural, though sad.
Anyway, not my favorite Dickens novel, sorry. I like some of his supporting characters here. Carker is an interesting villain although maybe Dickens makes too much of the teeth. And little Paul was definitely a very interesting child with all his foreboding and looking out to sea and bald assertions. I think little Paul is my favorite character in this novel so far. And he's gone.
Kim wrote: If I happen to fly by someday will you wave at me too? "Certainly. But I might not wave with all five fingers.
Mark wrote: "This novel of Dickens isn't grabbing me -- Dombey himself is too hard to believe as a character, (and so is Florence). And since that basic tension between Dombey and Florence seems too unrealisti..."I agree partly with you, but partly not.
I agree that Florence can be hard to believe as a character. She is such a wimp that I just want to shake her and tell her to get a life. But I think it is not her father that she loves, but the concept of parent, and he's the only one she has. She obviously adored her mother, and I think she is desperate to believe that the relationship she had with one parent she could find in the other if she only tried hard enough. Dickens was enough of a lay psychologist to recognize that children often blame themselves when things in their family don't go right, so I think she is realistic in blaming herself for her father not loving her. I just wish she would get over it.
Dombey I don't have the same problem with since some of my older English relatives I met when I was still a lad were very much in that mold -- stiff upper lip, don't show emotion, duty above all, very traditional Brits.
I don't have your fondness for Carker. But I do agree that the teeth are becoming too much.
There are enough plot lines to keep me interested (and guessing a bit). And as Tristram has pointed out, it contains some of Dickens's best writing to this point.
Kim wrote: " I think I'll go hit something."I you start hitting somebody instead of something, I'm going to send you a list of people ;-)
Peter wrote: "Tristram wrote: "Everyman wrote: "I stopped my Dickens quote too soon. It goes on a few lines later: 'I took the liberty of waiting on her,' said Carker, 'to inquire if she could charge me wit..."
And yet, Peter, it has not really become clear what he is up to, i.e. if his motives are mercantile or simply bloody-minded. But then a good chess player also has to hide his strategy.
Linda wrote: "Anyway, I was a little confused here, wondering if the Major and Mrs. Skewton had been planning in advance of introducing Dombey to the ladies. "Might that not have been possible after all? Was it not the Major's suggestion for Mr. Dombey to leave London and get his mind off things? Major Bagstock might well have arranged with Mrs. Skewton to meet Dombey as a possible marriage candidate for her daughter.
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shadows, shadows, shadows, and some ray of light at the end - this is what these three chapters hold in store for Florence (and the sympathetic reader).
In Chapter 26, we witness Major Bagstock and Mrs. Skewton continue their scheme of uniting Dombey and Edith in wedlock, and it is quite clear they are doing this for mercantile reasons. Mr. Carker makes the acquaintances of Edith and her mother, and he seems to be taken aback at the thought of his employer marrying anyone but an older woman. Is he afraid there might be another son one day yet?
In the next chapter, Carker happens to find out that Edith is not at all happy about the impending marriage, that she is resigning herself to it rather than embrace it. Since he manages to make Edith tacitly understand that he has seen more than her being accosted by the old fortune teller, whom I take to be none other than Good Mrs. Brown - what would a Dickens novel be without chance re-appearances of its characters? -, he even gains some power over her, which he might come to use one day. We also get some background knowledge as to Edith's motivation for her cool and scornful demeanour on the one hand, and her complying with her mother's schemes on the other. Mr. Dombey, unware of the knowledge Carker has got of the situation, revels in the display of Edith as well as in that of his power over Carker.
All these events do not seem to bode well for Florence, but then in Chapter 28 when she returns home and finds the old home being renovated - where are her mother's picture and Paul's little bed? -, there is a final scene between Edith and Florence that makes us draw hope as to Florence no longer being an outcast in her own home. By the way, Carker also seems to try and achieve power over Florence by intimating to her that he knows very well about how anxiously she awaits any news of the ship.