Brown, Daniel James - The Boys in the Boat - Informal Buddy Read; Start December 7

[Margaret]

Sarah....I should had checked the prices for the kindle on this book....duh! I have been waiting for ages and I could have just bought it. I usually always check but I didn't. I am second on line to borrow but I think that I'll buy it and start it today. What is an ED nurse? I imagine that the E stands for emergency but what about the D? I know, too many questions. :)

[Margaret]

I have just started where (view spoiler)[Joe's brother has just gotten a job in Nez Perce, Idaho and Joe is headed for that town. Funny, I was born in Orofino Idaho just 50 miles from there. I love the writing and I am pulled right into the story so easily. I was hoping that I would love this book. Setting up the story is brilliantly handled and I think I'll be reading most of the evening. (hide spoiler)]

[Srividya]

Margaret -(view spoiler)[I simply loved the writing in this book. I agree it does suck you in! I loved the descriptions of the different places that is talked about in this book. Looking forward to seeing how all of you find it - specifically whether it is still the same way or is it more beautiful than this etc. Reading this book makes me want to visit the US immediately! Lol (hide spoiler)]

[Margaret]

Srividya wrote: "Margaret -[spoilers removed]"

And you can come and visit me on your trip lol :)

[Sarah]

Margaret wrote: "Sarah....I should had checked the prices for the kindle on this book....duh! I have been waiting for ages and I could have just bought it. I usually always check but I didn't. I am second on line t..."

ED = Emergency Department = ER

[Srividya]

Lol.. don't give such open invitations to me Margaret, I might just take you up on this one! :)

[Sarah]

Margaret wrote: "Srividya wrote: "Margaret -[spoilers removed]"

And you can come and visit me on your trip lol :)"

And me, I am in Portland, Oregon, about 3 hour drive from Seattle, Washington.

[Sarah]

Srividya wrote: "Lol.. don't give such open invitations to me Margaret, I might just take you up on this one! :)"

Well I want to visit you in India.

[Margaret]

Me too! I'll tag along with you Sarah lol

[Srividya]

Sure Sarah and Margaret - the pleasure will be all mine if you come to visit me in India :)

[Margaret]

I have just read up to Part 1 Chapter 5 (view spoiler)[I am amazed by this book and especially the abandonment of Joe! I can't wrap my brain around the fact that his father made a choice to kick out Joe and then choosing his wife over his son! My mother had done something similar when she choose her husband (my father)over her first two children (ages 3 & 5)in which she gave them up for adoption. I have in the last 9 years found them and without a doubt they both have been damaged by their abandonment. Joyce's mother is an oddball and talk about putting Joyce in this horrible invalidating position. It is hard to read about these situations in both Joe and Joyce's backgrounds. I am so intrigued by this story! I especially love reading about this era and it does feel and sound correct. My mother was born in 1922 and she remembered the depression vividly and her stories coincide with a lot of what I am reading about in this book. (hide spoiler)]

[Srividya]

Margaret (view spoiler)[I just couldn't wrap my head around that! I know that it happens in some cases but I just couldn't fathom how a father could abandon his child for a wife! I guess it is the Indian societal instincts in me that makes me feel worse, for here, it is usually that the father takes on a wife to help him take care of his son/child.. but most particularly if its a son. Leaving or abandoning children, especially in such cases is not the norm here. Of course, times and things have changed but it still is the mother, usually unwed at that, who gives up her child and never the father.

I felt bad for Joyce as well. However, I have met a few mothers like hers, especially those of my friends' who believed that. In fact, one of my friends mother actively tried to get me converted into Christianity. She felt that her daughter should not have non Christian friends as they would lead her astray! Needless to say that my friend did not share the same opinion and shares a good relationship with me even today. However, the fact still remains that there are some people who think that doing things their way is the BEST way and other ways are all paths to evil and sin!

I am glad to hear that the picture of the Depression has been accurately portrayed. It is wonderful in its writing, horrifying in its experience. Despite having known poverty here, there is something about that time, which makes it bleaker than ever. And to think of all those who survived those times and grew up - well all I can say is hats off to them, they are truly survivors! (hide spoiler)]

[Stacey]

I swear, I'm getting further into this today. I should finish up my other BR and will jump in. From the little I've read, I'm excited to get to it.

[Margaret]

Srividya wrote: "Margaret I just couldn't wrap my head around that! I know that it happens in some cases but I just couldn't fathom how a father could abandon his child for a wife! I guess it is the Indian societal..."

(view spoiler)[Well, good, somewhere in the world abandoning children is not the norm, thank goodness! I hate that to no end! My having personal experience with it has driven those feelings deep. I was 9 years old when I was told that my mother had given two of her children away; and then to top that off, I found out that I was named after my mother's first daughter who was given away! Regarding Christianity beliefs, well, to totally separate yourself is hard in this world. I truly feel Christians take it too much to heart and there is a judgment about others that is not correct. Your friend's mother was taking it all out of text, in my humble opinion. Joyce's mother's religion is considered a cult and many Christians frown upon Christian Science. That belief about the inner and outer Joyce was very weird! Nothing to do with the Bible or Christianity! (hide spoiler)] I can't wait to get back to reading, I'll be gone all done until late and I am not sure if I'll have the time to read :( poor me!

@Stacey....I can't wait to hear your thoughts :)

[Sarah]

Srividya wrote: "Margaret I just couldn't wrap my head around that! I know that it happens in some cases but I just couldn't fathom how a father could abandon his child for a wife! I guess it is the Indian societal..."

I have read so many books from around the world that portray very difficult times with poverty, war torn countries, slavery, devastating conditions etc... not just The Depression. They all have touched me deeply. Some are of India - and . China - . Afghanistan - and . USA (slavery) - and on my tbr I am looking forward to and . The Congo - . France (the French Revolution) . These all are really amazing books, and it is amazing what the human spirit can live through and endure and rise above.

[Margaret]

I love your list Sarah! I have read three of them....does have a vivid rape scene? I vaguely remember hearing that. If so, not for me :) I'll have to check them all out. Which ones were your favorites?

[Sarah]

Margaret wrote: "I love your list Sarah! I have read three of them....does have a vivid rape scene? I vaguely remember hearing that. If so, not for me :) I'll have to che..."

It has violence against women for sure, but I think the vivid rape scene you are referring is from his other book - The Kite Runner, because I have heard about it too, but I haven't read that one yet. All of these are really great books, but absolutely on my top 10 list of all time are The Poisonwood Bible, A Fine Balance, Les Miserables, and The Invention of Wings

[Srividya]

I agree with you Sarah. I have also read some of the books that you have listed while having some on my TBR for the coming year and yes the books that I have read have touched me as well.

The Poisonwood Bible was so horrifyingly beautiful that it took me weeks to finish it as I just could not move ahead. Am planning to read The Invention of Wings and Twelve Years a Slave soon.

I remember reading The Good Earth long back, when I was in school. Looking forward to reading that one again from an adult perspective. And of course Les Miserables is my dream, just not sure when I will get the time and space to read that one. Lets hope I do read it in the coming year.

[Sarah]

If you gals haven't read it is a must read, which somehow reminds me of TBITB. I have been reading more. I just can't believe how beautiful, artistic, and poetic the sport of rowing is portrayed in the book. It is mesmerizing. And I am right there cheering on the sophomore team.

[Srividya]

Sarah wrote: "If you gals haven't read it is a must read, which somehow reminds me of TBITB. I have been reading more. I..."

I have that book Sarah and have been meaning to read that one as well! Sigh there are just too many books and too little time these days!

[Sarah]

Srividya - my heart was pumping during the sophomore race on the East Coast. I was giggling and shouting "They got their swing, they got their swing back" and right after I yelled that it was written "By the end of the first mile, they found their swing and surged into the lead."

But anyway, when do you want to start Still Alice with me? Thursday work? That is Christmas Day.

[Srividya]

I totally get you Sarah. I felt the same way!! I did a small whoop and couldn't scream as it was the middle of the night and everyone was fast asleep here, lol! The writing is superb, it simply draws you in, in such a manner that their every victory and defeat as well as their pain and happiness become your own!

Sure Thursday is perfect. I can start then.

[Sarah]

It is a date.

[Srividya]

Sarah wrote: "It is a date."

:) :)

[Margaret]

Are you ladies referring to Unbroken? It also has rowing in the storyline? I will be tacking this one when it comes up as a BR. I can't wait!

@Sarah, you are right, it is Kite Runner that I heard about the "event" even Amanda has warned me about it, she knows that I wouldn't like it.

[Sarah]

Margaret wrote: "Are you ladies referring to Unbroken? It also has rowing in the storyline? I will be tacking this one when it comes up as a BR. I can't wait!

@Sarah, you are right, it is Kite Runner that I heard..."

It doesn't have rowing in it - Unbroken - but still feels similar in the writing and the time period. But totally different story. Don't want to give anything away. But it is also such a great story

[Sarah]

See, everything just ties together. Ulbrickson feeds a certain diet to his athletes which leads a horse racer to find hay for his horse with similar nutrient content - the horse being the famous Seabiscuit. Now Seabiscuit: An American Legend was written by Laura Hillenbrand who also wrote Unbroken: A World War II Story of Survival, Resilience, and Redemption. See how that works?

Plus the final line up for the boat was March 21st, my birthday, the day the last rower was placed and the last switch was made with Joe getting into boat 2 - the day the magic started to happen.

[Srividya]

I noticed that about the Seabiscuit. I want to read that book as well! It does seem connected doesn't it - I loved that aspect a lot, these little tidbits of information, which make you curious about another book!

Wow.. that's a nice connection with your birthday :)

[Sarah]

I think the connection to all the books is the same time period, plus both Unbroken and The Boys are true stories involving the Berlin Olympics. Both these books are equally good, sooooo good, but still quite different.

[Stacey]

I'm late to the party, but finally finished Part 1--hopefully there are still some of you reading or interested in talking about it. I am finding that it is not a quick read as I want to get every little detail and remember it because it all feels so important.

My education of the depression was very poor when I was in school--we spent so much time in history class getting up to the Civil War and WW 1 that there wasn't much time left for anything more recent. It is truly amazing to listen to what it was like out there for those folks--just one thing after another.

It's also interesting to see how much more independent the children were then--either on purpose or because they were abandoned by their parents (I hope I never see Joe's father show up in this book again, but I have a bad feeling). But even the Pocock boys--leaving their country with nothing at the age of 18 is an amazingly brave thing to do. Most 18 y.o. that I know now wouldn't have the courage to take that on.

I'm excited to meet the rest of the boat over the next few hundred pages. :)

[Srividya]

Stacey you are not late. In fact, everyone is still reading it. I had to finish it because I just couldn't put it down. However, I am waiting eagerly for all of you to finish so that we can discuss.

I agree with you on the independence part. They do seem to be more mature and courageous. However, I feel it has to do more with the way times were during that period. It was tough and you had the choice of either facing it upfront or totally losing it.

[Margaret]

Hi Stacey, I am reading the book on my Kindle and I haven't made note as to where I am currently other than 32% into the story. So, I'll be around to discuss the book with you.

I agree with you most 18 year olds nowadays wouldn't attempt such a feat. I truly feel the reason that children were more independent back then was because of the hard times. I remember my mother telling me that at the age of 5 she was standing on a box making breakfast and washing dishes and she also cared for a younger brother about the same time. Milking cows and general farm chores were the general fare of her upbringing, and she said it was hard work. I truthfully can't imagine it.

[Sarah]

Times have changed, and I think we value this idea of adolescence. People had to grow up a lot sooner in the past and were expected to work and contribute to the family.

[Sarah]

Page 280 (view spoiler)[So the boys in the Boat won there first race at the pre Olympic whatever and so did California. But they are worried because they were slower on their time and now they will race at as most California, because in their race it seemed like they still had a lot of reserve left to me. (hide spoiler)]

[Stacey]

I'm finally up to the last part. I'm still enjoying it, but getting to the point where I just want to get to the Olympics already! Tell me who is going to be in the boat! :)

I think I'm enjoying--if such a thing is possible--learning about the Depression as much as the main story.

[Sarah]

They are sailing across the Atlantic. I have a feeling they are on the same ship as Loius Zamperini from was.

[Sarah]

OMG, I was just thinking how much Louis Zamperini pigged out on this voyage and yes he finally made an appearance. (view spoiler)[ It mentioned that no one ate as much as the row team, except Louis Zamperini - the long distance runner from Torrance, CA. Joe Rantz couldn't even out eat him. Ha ha. They both grew up in poverty and not a lot of food. (hide spoiler)]

[Srividya]

Stacey that's the beauty of this story. Despite being a very depressing subject (pun totally unintended!), it manages to capture your imagination and curiosity, without leaving any room for anything else. And I remember that part.. in fact the entire book simply builds your curiosity and increases your yearning to know!

Sarah - Haha.. I got the Zamperini reference after I read the blurb for Unbroken! I want to read that one as soon as I can, not to mention Seabiscuit! Lets hope I get to it soon.

[Srividya]

Incidentally Sarah - we are still on for right? Am planning to start it today.

[Sarah]

Yes - I have just been multitasking:-)

[Stacey]

Srividya wrote: "Stacey that's the beauty of this story. Despite being a very depressing subject (pun totally unintended!), it manages to capture your imagination and curiosity, without leaving any room for anythin..."

It's building up very nicely. I was able to get a little further last night, so I now have the "boat" established. Now to just get to the Olympics! Even though I know they win, its terribly exciting. :)

[Margaret]

oh man....I can't wait till I am up to where they are headed out for the Olympics, hope to get a lot of reading done today.

[Sarah]

Stacey wrote: "Srividya wrote: "Stacey that's the beauty of this story. Despite being a very depressing subject (pun totally unintended!), it manages to capture your imagination and curiosity, without leaving any..."

Even though you suspect they win, nothing can prepare you, what an amazing race regardless - I finally got through the Olympics. I haven't enjoyed watching (while reading I guess) sports like this ever. Every race has been so exciting. But nothing like the Olympic race - OMG.

This book just breaths so much life into this heroic story. Truely amazing.

[Srividya]

I agree with you Sarah. The sheer beauty of this book lies in how the entire journey has been built, right up to the Olympics and even during the race! Despite not having seen a rowing race in the Olympics, I could easily visualise it completely and feel that edge that exists during races. It is truly amazing.. I just can't stop thinking about the book or the way in which this author has written it! You nailed it when you said that he has breathed life into a heroic story!!

[Margaret]

Well...I have zipped through the book and finished it. I found the endless details a bit dry for my taste but that is me my attention really perked up when (view spoiler)[the story went into detail about how Joe dealt with his father and his step-mother. I never really understood how his family had constantly abandoned him. I especially enjoyed the epilogue and found out what happened to each of them. (hide spoiler)]

[Srividya]

Somehow I loved the bits about rowing. I guess I am very fascinated by these things, especially water sports!

(view spoiler)[I just couldn't accept that part of the story! To me it simply hurt every time Joe had to deal with abandonment! However, i loved how he rose from all that and became a winner, as a person. Loved how Joyce (I hope I got the name right) stayed with him throughout! I loved the epilogue as well. It had that feel good factor about it. (hide spoiler)]

[Sarah]

(view spoiler)[ I really feel that Joe healed his relationship with his father and that his father redeemed himself and they became family again. It also said his father was a great grandfather to his grand children. Life does work out that way sometimes. Parents can make really big mistakes but sometimes children grow up and are able to forgive and heal the relationship with their parents and go on to have a relationship in adult life. (hide spoiler)]

[Margaret]

Sarah wrote: "[spoilers removed]"

So true Sarah (view spoiler)[I think that Joe's father Harry and wife really brought up some memories regarding my own family (a long list) and I had a hard time feeling empathy for them, especially when Harry expectantly lost his wife. For Joe to come in and rally around his father and his siblings was just what a person should do when a tragedy happens. He managed to do that even though he had been hurt and abandoned many times by them. He put his own feelings aside and did the right thing. I agree, I think then the healing was able to start and continued. (hide spoiler)]

[Stacey]

Hooray! I finished last night. Such a good book. Now I can't wait to watch the rowing in the next Olympics, :)

I enjoy the tiny details about rowing and crew. I don't think I knew there was quite so much to it. Sadly, I think I thought they just got in and pulled as hard and fast as they could, so it was fun to learn all about the technical stuff involved. I could have done without the Germany information, although thankfully that was kept to a minimum until the end.

Regarding the Joe's family--I loved that Joe was always loyal to his step-brothers and sisters and helping them out even when he wasn't really involved with his father or Thula. I loved that he could separate them from the issues that he had with the adults and be a good big brother. And I have to admit I kind of wanted Joyce to give Harry a piece of her mind at some point, but I suppose it worked out for the best that she didn't. Revenge is much better in books than real life. ;)

[Srividya]

I agree Stacey. The rowing information was really interesting. I was also under the same impression that you just got in and rowed! I guess that's why it was so fascinating.

About Germany, I guess it was necessary to build the atmosphere. History is one of my favorite genres in reading, so i kind of enjoy finding little tidbits of historical information in each book and seeing how they match with others, especially if they are with regard to the same timeline. So with that background, I personally would have loved a little more about German history but it wouldn't have fit that well in this book, so I am also glad that it was kept to the minimum and in the background, so to speak.

With regard to Joe and his family - I agree with all of you. It is indeed admirable on Joe's part to be able to keep his feelings for his father and Thula separate from his siblings.