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The Winter Palace
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Buddy Read in December for the Winter Palace
I finished The Winter Palace last night. I think I should wait a few days before posting my review, even though it is condensed and broad. I really enjoyed the book and have been considering the sequel but it does not have the greatest of reviews.
Rachel wrote: " ... I have no desire to cruise to islands, beaches, and hot weather. If I am going to cruise I would do a Mediterranean Cruise or something like what you did. reply | flag *
.."
I was thinking the same thing. My pictures from beach vacations are rather boring. I've been dreaming of a trip to Italy (partly for the art), but there are so many places to see. The architecture in Russia is amazing.
I'm getting back to the book now. (I finally finished Fellowship of the Ring and I need something completely different. This should do it. )
For some reason Libby has been giving me problems in the last few days. I can't get the audio book to open even though I listened to part of it before.
Rachel wrote: "I finished The Winter Palace last night. I think I should wait a few days before posting my review, even though it is condensed and broad. I really enjoyed the book and have been considering the se..."Well, good to hear you liked it Rachel. I started it 2 days ago, and am only managing 10-12 pages a day-hoping it gets better for me
Joanne wrote: "Rachel wrote: "I finished The Winter Palace last night. I think I should wait a few days before posting my review, even though it is condensed and broad. I really enjoyed the book and have been con..."
it was definitely a slower start for me but I did like it. Of course, I love the history in it and that helped of course.
it was definitely a slower start for me but I did like it. Of course, I love the history in it and that helped of course.
Is Libby an audio machine or device like Alexa? Or is she a character in the book? I’m almost 40% through Stardust, and then I’m gonna start this one next.
It’s a library app, Amy - linked to Overdrive
Rachel wrote: "That is so funny you said that about hot weather and beaches. I just was telling my friend last night of your trip and pictures and I told her I was odd because I have no desire to cruise to islands, beaches, and hot weather. If I am going to cruise I would do a Mediterranean Cruise or something like what you did....."Ok, I've done 6 cruises, only one of them to the Caribbean. Here are some other options for you (btw, Mediterranean would likely be pretty warm, but it is one I wouldn't mind doing!):
- Alaska (I've gone twice)
- Scotland/Ireland
- Canada/New England (in the fall)
- Baltic
I would also like to do a Norwegian cruise. :-)
For another warm-weather option, in addition to Mediterranean (I'd like to see Croatia, and Venice, in particular on that one), I'd also like to cruise through the Panama Canal.
I'm not sure where you live (might go see if you list it on your profile!), so I'm not sure what might be appealing, but there are actually more options than you might think!
I see someone else has finished. Once a few people are in agreement, I will also post my review. :-)
LibraryCin wrote: "Rachel wrote: "That is so funny you said that about hot weather and beaches. I just was telling my friend last night of your trip and pictures and I told her I was odd because I have no desire to c..."
I assumed the Mediterranean would be warm. I think what appeals to me is the locations. Seems so much better than the Caribbean. But you know what, I shouldn't judge a place I haven't been!! I think it just doesn't appeal to me.:) Canada/New England would be a great cruise in the fall.
I live in Northern Arizona, where we have 4 seasons. I moved here in April from Phoenix. I lived in Phoenix for 3 miserable years!! They have two seasons, hellish hot and winter, which is windy and balmy.:) I think I am still recovering from the extreme heat so maybe I will change my mind. Although fall and winter are my favorite seasons. I am an oddball I think.
Alaska would be great! I love hearing of your travels!
I assumed the Mediterranean would be warm. I think what appeals to me is the locations. Seems so much better than the Caribbean. But you know what, I shouldn't judge a place I haven't been!! I think it just doesn't appeal to me.:) Canada/New England would be a great cruise in the fall.
I live in Northern Arizona, where we have 4 seasons. I moved here in April from Phoenix. I lived in Phoenix for 3 miserable years!! They have two seasons, hellish hot and winter, which is windy and balmy.:) I think I am still recovering from the extreme heat so maybe I will change my mind. Although fall and winter are my favorite seasons. I am an oddball I think.
Alaska would be great! I love hearing of your travels!
You made me laugh out loud, Kate! Gotcha!
Rachel wrote: "Alaska would be great! I love hearing of your travels!..."Rachel, are you on facebook? Feel free to "friend" me there, if you are (you can use the photo album link). I have albums for all my cruises (though my first Alaska one, in 2007, was before I got a digital camera, so I don't have as many - the friend I went with borrowed her mom's digital, so most of the photos are from it; I also had her scan a few of my photos - though not many - so I could add them in, as well.
If any of the rest of you want to friend me at f/b, as well, that would be great. Just let me know who you are. :-)
ETA: Oh, and spring, I think, is my favourite season. It's changed over the years, but I love rain. Summer is too "hot" here (though not as hot as most of you south of me would experience!) and winter, I don't mind. I prefer the cold, but I don't like the snow/ice. I've fallen twice and injured each knee.
I returned to this book today (I had to start over to clear other books from my head), and I'm really enjoying the characters and the story so far. I've actually been craving an espionage book for quite some time, so this was a happy surprise. It's reminding me of the Game of Thrones, with all the "little birds" that spy for various people. Royal life is dangerous.I really like that Barbara has been able to use her skills to help somewhat in the education of the prince. I'm hoping to see more of how the adults try to shape his attitudes, morality, thinking about other countries, etc.
I'm at the part where Barbara is getting to know young Sophie (Catherine), and i wonder if this will lead to a true friendship or a betrayal. I really like the reader's voice. It's soothing enough that I can read it while falling asleep.
I'm into the book and enjoying the story but I'm listening to the audio a lot since I've been busy with some sewing and other things that allow the time to listen but not read. The audio is deadly :-( The reader may be Russian or Eastern European. She has the accents down pat but she reads so very, very slow. It's killing me. I don't get much book reading time in so this could take a while. I wish the device I'm using would allow me to speed up the reading. I studied Russian history in college and was able to take a trip there with a group of students and the professor back in the late 80s. That is certainly adding to my enjoyment of the book.
LibraryCin wrote: "Oh, St. Petersburg is amazing!It was a large mass-market cruise that I did (Celebrity Cruises, I think... I've done a few with Celebrity, Royal Caribbean, and one with NCL, so I sometimes forget ..."
Your pictures brought back so many memories of my trip. I can tell by your comments that not much has changed about the tourist thing in Russia since I was there. Stay with a group, booked for only InTourist hotels, restaurants, and stores, etc. When we did the Hermitage, it was practically a run through. We really weren't allowed much time. You'd have to spend years there to see every item in the collection. I was totally blown away by the Monet paintings though and, of course, the palace itself was amazing.
Barbara wrote: "I'm into the book and enjoying the story but I'm listening to the audio a lot since I've been busy with some sewing and other things that allow the time to listen but not read. The audio is deadly ..."I'm listening too, and I while I like her voice, I agree that it's very slow. It's about two hours longer than other books of this size would take. I can increase the speed, but it sounds too abrupt.
Amy wrote: "Is Libby an audio machine or device like Alexa? Or is she a character in the book? I’m almost 40% through Stardust, and then I’m gonna start this one next."Libby is a newer variation of Overdrive. It's linked to my public library's website. I use it for audiobooks that I borrow from the library. Don't you love how they give all these tech things women's names? Like hurricanes and boats.
I'm almost done listening to the book, but I have to find the print copy because I could swear they missed a section in the audio.
I started two days ago, but I have had barely a moment to read. I think I’m still under 20 pages in! May not make100 books this year after all. But once on vacation, you never know!
LibraryCin wrote: "Rachel wrote: "Alaska would be great! I love hearing of your travels!..."
Rachel, are you on facebook? Feel free to "friend" me there, if you are (you can use the photo album link). I have albums ..."
I just sent you a friend request.:)
Rachel, are you on facebook? Feel free to "friend" me there, if you are (you can use the photo album link). I have albums ..."
I just sent you a friend request.:)
Rachel wrote: "I finished The Winter Palace last night. I think I should wait a few days before posting my review, even though it is condensed and broad. I really enjoyed the book and have been considering the se..."I just finished, and I haven't started writing a review yet. I gave it a 4 for Varvara/Barbara and the book glow I felt at the end, but it's not as good as the many 4's I gave this year.
SPOILER ALERT. I'm not revealing anything about the end yet, but if you haven't read the first third of the book, stop now.
What I liked: I liked Barbara, thanks in part to the narration of the audio, even though it was too slow. The accent sounded just right to me and made me feel like I knew her. A British or American voice would not do. I enjoyed listening to her every night as I went to sleep. I liked her honesty and loyalty, despite the fact that she was doing work that was inherently dishonest. As she grew older (view spoiler)
The descriptions of the Chancellor were so detailed, I could almost feel his creepy nasty breath.
I liked Sophie/Catherine even though I don't think we get to know her well in this book. I would have preferred knowing more of her point of view and strategies as the story advanced. We know that she was very smart, read a great deal about everything, and probably thought more deeply about the world than Empress Elizabeth or Peter. From a young age it was clear that she would make a better leader than Peter.
The reputations of Catherine and Elizabeth.
(view spoiler)
Nancy, it is good to hear that you liked this book. I gave it a 4 star as well and I agree with you, it is not as good as some other 4 stars I gave but I did believe the book deserved this. I plan to put my review up the end of this weekend I think. I can't wait to talk about this book.
Deliberately not reading anymore of your reviews and comments until I can I can finish this book! I’ve been under 20% for days. But starting my vacation tomorrow and should get some time in on the flight. Really excited about the book and I’m only on like page 60 something.
I have about 100 pages left-I am stuck at 3 stars right now-but the last 50 pages were good, so it could go up
I'm getting close to finishing as well and I have to admit it hasn't been my favorite book but I'm hoping the end will make me feel differently.
Ok, I'll post my review now, as well, but (as most of you probably know), mine are usually pretty vague!3.5 stars
This book primarily follows Polish orphan Varvara, who has come to Russian Empress Elizabeth’s court after her father died. She ends up doing some spying for the chancellor, then the Empress herself, before she becomes friends with Prussian princess, Sophie, who would later become Catherine the Great. This follows the time frame from just before Sophie’s arrival to shortly after she becomes Empress of Russia.
I liked it. Not quite as much as I’d hoped I would, but I still enjoyed it. There is a sequel that I will definitely plan to read. I was disappointed, though, that there was no author’s note, which I always appreciate in any historical fiction I read.
LibraryCin wrote: "Ok, I'll post my review now, as well, but (as most of you probably know), mine are usually pretty vague!3.5 stars
This book primarily follows Polish orphan Varvara, who has come to Russian Empre..."
Sounds like my thoughts-I too missed the author's notes-and I also want to read the follow-up(I will explain when I finish.)
Hit 35% today! Trudging along!
Page 224 (50%) Wait, what!!!!!!!!!
I just shuddered and went cold!
I really enjoyed this book and discovered there is a sequel to this but the rating is lower than this one. So now I don't know what to do.:) Here is my review. I gave this book 4 stars.
The Winter Palace is an epic tale of Catherine the Great’s rise to power in Russia. It is told by a palace maid named Varvara. After being orphaned, Varvara becomes a ward of the Empress Elizabeth of Russia but spends her days as a menial servant, forgotten about within the Winter Palace until she is discovered by the Chancellor who views her as a prospective spy. He has Varvara trained to pick locks, listening attentively to everything, and above all else, wait for every opportunity. She is now loyal to only him and the Empress, who places her in an ideal position as a maid to her nephew, the Grand Duke and heir to the Russian throne. But all these changes when Catherine arrives to be married to the Grand Duke, suddenly throwing Varvara's loyalties into question.
This is just as much Varvara's story as it is Catherine’s, as Varvara becomes Catherine’s confidant and dear friend. This novel demonstrates two young women, rising to power amid a cast of very well-developed characters. (view spoiler)
The Winter Palace is an epic tale of Catherine the Great’s rise to power in Russia. It is told by a palace maid named Varvara. After being orphaned, Varvara becomes a ward of the Empress Elizabeth of Russia but spends her days as a menial servant, forgotten about within the Winter Palace until she is discovered by the Chancellor who views her as a prospective spy. He has Varvara trained to pick locks, listening attentively to everything, and above all else, wait for every opportunity. She is now loyal to only him and the Empress, who places her in an ideal position as a maid to her nephew, the Grand Duke and heir to the Russian throne. But all these changes when Catherine arrives to be married to the Grand Duke, suddenly throwing Varvara's loyalties into question.
This is just as much Varvara's story as it is Catherine’s, as Varvara becomes Catherine’s confidant and dear friend. This novel demonstrates two young women, rising to power amid a cast of very well-developed characters. (view spoiler)
I am planning to read the sequel. I am disappointed that its not rated as highly, since i rated this one "only" 3.5 stars (good).
I have the same concerns. I wonder if it would be better to read one of the other books about her? I like the personal stuff, but I also want to know more about her bigger leadership decisions and strategies, a I don't think we'll get that from this author. There was a great book like that on Queen Elizabeth long ago.
NancyJ wrote: "I have the same concerns. I wonder if it would be better to read one of the other books about her? I like the personal stuff, but I also want to know more about her bigger leadership decisions and ..."Nancy I agree, and I went searching for something else on these subjects-there are 2 are added to me shelf
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/5...
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1...
Ok I finished-My review is in "Other Books" Are we still waiting on anyone? Magda, I think?
Don't worry about waiting for me if you want to have a deeper discussion. I'm almost done and I'll just skim over the comments that have spoilers. I look forward to reading all of your reviews when I finish. :)
LibraryCin wrote: "I am planning to read the sequel. I am disappointed that its not rated as highly, since i rated this one "only" 3.5 stars (good)."
I am thinking to read the sequel as well. I am only disappointed by the reviews. But now I just need to finish.:)
I am thinking to read the sequel as well. I am only disappointed by the reviews. But now I just need to finish.:)
Sigh. It's been only 10 days since I finished the book but it feels like a month. I've already forgotten half the things I wanted to talk about - details we don't usually put in reviews. Is Amy still reading the book?
OK - here is one thing. It was disappointing that we don't really know how the coup was planned, because Catherine didn't involve Barbara in it. I think she didn't fully trust her - or anyone else for that matter.
Because I was listening and not reading, it was harder to go back and check on things, such as character's names, so I wonder if I missed some big clues. At the end Barbara finds out that there were other spies - or at least one key spy that helped Catherine as well. Did the author say or hint who it was? Barbara kept some secrets so I wonder if Catherine was more careful because she knew it.
Was the chancellor working with Catherine more than we thought? One of the books that Joanne found names a man who she eventually married. Was he Catherine's lover in our book? Grigory? Was that Potenkin?
Also Barbara was getting scared and paranoid at times. Did she have good reason to be?
Completed and reviewed, although I forgot to put my review here. Here’s my lingering question, that you shouldn’t read if you haven’t finished.Was Barbara right to feel used? Obviously, not being the only spy made her feel un-special and unloved. She worked extremely hard to balance two alliances and save herself and her daughter, and she did great. Was she naive? Was she truly beloved by either the Empress or Catherine? Can true love or friendship really exist in a court situation? I have always wondered about that. Can one ever have a true friend or true love, when politics, warring factions, religion, power, and succession is on the line?
Excellent questions Amy. I felt like Barbara was being a little sensitive. How can the Empress or Catherine only have one spy? Especially back then. At times I felt that she was naive. I do think that Catherine regarded her as a beloved friend but at the same time, Catherine really had to watch her back in a sense. She had to have more than one voice to tell her what was always happening around her. But can an Empress really have a true, deep friendship? I always wonder how they can really trust anyone.
I too thought her reaction was sensitive. But it was part of the character development. She was really quite broken by the fact that one could be loved and still political at the same time. It doesn’t make it any less real. And in fact she was the same. She also loved and was political. And in some ways she hated it during those years where she was out of the court scene. She longed to be back there with all the intrigue and lavish lifestyle. But it does come with a cost. In many ways she lost her parents young, I never really had a chance to grow up. Even her mother and father were balancing that line between being loving to her and also political. Wanting her to have a future and be safe. It’s not just at the court that that was going on. You could see it in their family life as well. That’s what intrigues me the most. That end in my review I spoke about the way children are treated as a commodity, and in fact abused all while being trained to be royal, and have wars fought on their behalf and in their name when they didn’t quite matter. In fact if you look at the fits of temper of the Empress, you must’ve thought about how she was raised and used as a child to have gained those behaviors and quick temperament change. That was stunning that a woman of such royal fitting would behave so.
NancyJ wrote: "Sigh. It's been only 10 days since I finished the book but it feels like a month. I've already forgotten half the things I wanted to talk about - details we don't usually put in reviews. Is Amy s..."
Yes Nancy Potenkin is Grigory -I don't think he was ever referred to by this name in this book.
I agree with all you said, although the last few chapters I think were the best of the entire book, which is why I gave it an extra 1/2 star.
I was disappointed because I was expecting a little more on Catherine-Yet the story did peak my interest on Elizabeth and I would also like to find some works about her.
I agree with you Rachel that Barbara was overly sensitive, or naive as you stated. I think that maybe this was because she, if you think about it, was not really raised at Court-she came in as young woman, and had to learn the ins and outs on her own and what the Chancellor permitted her to know .
I also think Catherine thought of her as a friend, but she had to be careful because of her precarious situation.
I am sorry, I have to ask, was anyone else just wanting Elizabeth to die and have the story move on?
Joanne wrote: "NancyJ wrote: "Sigh. It's been only 10 days since I finished the book but it feels like a month. I've already forgotten half the things I wanted to talk about - details we don't usually put in revi..."
Oh Nancy, I felt this way and felt horrible about it! But I was ready, as was Russia for the next thing.
Oh Nancy, I felt this way and felt horrible about it! But I was ready, as was Russia for the next thing.
Losing her parent shaped her as an individual and also made her the strong woman she grew into I think. What happened to her early on was so sad. I really do feel that Catherine loved her so deeply as a friend and almost as a sister. Considering that Catherine had who she had as a husband, then the Empress herself, I am sure Catherine learned so quickly to trust few and even those you do trust, can you really trust? I can't imagine what life would have been like in these courts. It would be difficult to fully trust anyone, even when your heart desired this. For all of them, it seemed to be a fine balance. I loved Catherine far more than the Empress. She seemed like a spoiled brat to me. Catherine, I believe was only trying to survive.
It was so striking that they were orphaned girls together. Hard to forget how Catherine started. They both learned quickly. Thrown into marriages with self-absorbed men, who were surprisingly good fathers.
I still need to catch up with all my December reviews and comments, not to mention finishing two books before New Year's eve. When I write this review, I need to post it in the Other December books folder, AND the Flurries folder, correct? And I might as well post it to the general review area for the book. All without spoilers.But there are some SPOILERS ahead:
The book Joanna found on Grigory might tell us a lot more about both the early days and later days of Catherine's rule. If the Russia culture tag comes up, I'd like to read more on Catherine.
But then again, modern times and mid 20th century are very interesting too. Child 44 (I think that's the title) tells us a lot about the insane power of conformity to the party line (and control of speech). (They said communism is perfect, so there can be no such thing as a serial killer in our perfect society.)
--
Elizabeth could be so loving to children, but so cruel too to take Catherine's child from her, and to turn him against her. I didn't quite understand why she turned on Catherine so fully. It was almost as though a fortune teller told her that Catherine would end up ruling and would be much more successful and famous than Elizabeth.
--
Now that I think about it, I think Barbara made out very well. She was afraid the intrigue would endanger her daughter, but I think Catherine protected them in some ways when she kept Barbara away.
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Did anyone else think that the Duke was gay when he wouldn't/couldn't consummate his marriage for so many years? The audio performer also gave him a whiny and girly voice when he was young. If it really was a problem with anatomy, it's too bad they couldn't figure it out earlier.
Amy wrote: "I too thought her reaction was sensitive. But it was part of the character development. She was really quite broken by the fact that one could be loved and still political at the same time. It does..."Doesn't it make you happy to NOT be in a political or royal family? (Or if you are, you're smart not to tell us!) It used to be very dangerous because you could get murdered or imprisoned. Years ago I saw a film about the boy in the iron? mask and I was skeptical that it could be true. Little did I know how vicious that world was. It makes Game of Thrones seem more realistic.
Now, you would have no privacy and you couldn't go on social media without reading hate speech about you or your family. I'll bet everyone in the Trump family wished they said no three years ago when they were asked if he would run. (Not that it would matter I suppose. Ivanka might be the only one who might have been able to stop him.)
Funny you ask that because I wondered that for some time. But then he ended up with a lover. Were they just too young? Was it just because they really did not love one another? I kept wondering if they would address it. So I did some research. They really did not like one another. he was not attracted to her whatsoever, and they thought him to be an idiot. Now while back then there was often not love in the royal marriages, we can assume there was still a sexual attraction. It seems there was none with these two. What I found fascinating was that they couldn't work this out. Creating an heir was always such a big deal. You would think they could get over this.:)
Rachel wrote: "Funny you ask that because I wondered that for some time. But then he ended up with a lover. Were they just too young? Was it just because they really did not love one another? I kept wondering if ..."(view spoiler)
I know. Sometimes I do wonder how in the world historians can figure some of this out. When I dug into different aspects of this book there were a variety of different theories for so many things. It always fascinates me when it comes to monarchies. It really does resemble much of today's democracies. So much. Regardless of your political affiliations, the truth is there is always spying, wondering who to trust, who will betray you. But the monarchy fascinates me more than modern times. I think because they didn't have the benefits of technology. What they had to do to survive was so much more intense.
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Glad to hear it, Amy!
And thank you all re: the photos - hard to go wrong with such beautiful thing..."
That is so funny you said that about hot weather and beaches. I just was telling my friend last night of your trip and pictures and I told her I was odd because I have no desire to cruise to islands, beaches, and hot weather. If I am going to cruise I would do a Mediterranean Cruise or something like what you did.