THE Group for Authors! discussion
The Craft
>
Question for non-native English writers
date
newest »
newest »
message 1:
by
Harini
(last edited Aug 06, 2014 06:16AM)
(new)
Aug 06, 2014 06:15AM
I'm interested in how other non-native English speakers write dialogue in English. I know so many writers who get it right, and quite a few who don't. I'm a hit-or-miss case myself, and am unable to analyze the successes and failures to find out if there's a formula to nail it every time. Please see my blog post on the topic (https://www.goodreads.com/author_blog...) and leave your comments and suggestions.
reply
|
flag
I don't have a formula, but I'm often praised by readers for my dialogue. Main thing is that I'm verbally skilled myself and I tend to have the sort of dry wit that is sometimes recognized, but doesn't matter if it isn't.What I most often do is write pages and pages of dialogue before I start culling the pages back to paragraphs. I'm a stickler for verisimilitude, so I tend to write dialogue that's close to the real thing.
However, dialogue has a function in fiction, so I remove the quotidian from the verbiage and keep that which hints or tells something about the situation or the perspective of the character, as well as moving the plot forward.
I dislike 'exposition', but you can inform the reader in dialogue without info dumps if you infer rather than inform. So hint at stuff, instead of explaining things outright.
Another thing is that in real life, people rarely say what they mean. So that's important to keep in your fictional dialogue--sometimes people are direct, other times they're circumspect. Some characters are blunt, others tend to be more sophisticated.
An example from my current WIP, In Pocket. Wolfgang the pickpocket visits his fence to cash in his plastic:
I slipped into the booth, ignored the smoke from his cigar smouldering in the chipped glass ashtray, and placed a stack of credit cards in front of him. Mink sifted through the cards, refused three and pocketed the rest. His pudgy hand reappeared with cash and a gold-plated necklace, the lock broken to make it appear snatched.
“Two hundred retail,” Mink said. “Yours for twenty.”
“I don’t wear jewellery.”
He dangled the necklace from his thick fingers. “It’s a woman’s.”
“Don’t have a woman.”
I stuffed the money he gave me in my breast pocket, not eager to let him know where I stash my cash.
Mink smoothed the necklace on the table. “You should get out more.”
“If that advice had come from someone who didn’t live inside a dingy bar stuffed in a back alley, I might’ve taken it.”
“Always the smart mouth.” Mink shook his head. “One day you’ll learn that moving around isn’t the same as moving up.”
“Is that the voice of experience?”
He steepled his stubby fingers. “Don’t push your luck.”
“Respect goes two ways,” I said, “Don’t insult my intelligence pushing that gold-plated crap on me.”
Grinning, Mink put the necklace away. “You’re right, I should’ve known better.”
I got up to leave, but he flapped a pudgy hand. “Sit back down, we need to talk.”
“We do?” I sat back down, even though I didn’t really want to. Mink is connected and while I don’t want him to disrespect me, I also don’t want to piss him off.
Mink leaned back and drew on the stub of his cigar. “You work hotels?”
“Lobbies, on occasion. Sometimes hotel restaurants at breakfast time.”
He blew a plume of smoke at the ceiling. “But no further?”
“Not much to gain from venturing into the corridors.”
“Not for a pickpocket.” Mink ground out the cigarette in the ashtray with a savage twist. I heard somewhere that he used to have a highly volatile temper. “But that doesn’t mean you can’t be useful.”
I didn’t respond. Sometimes it’s better not to talk.
“I’m putting together a small crew for hotel burglaries,” Mink said. “You’d be a good addition.”
“I’m not into team sports, Mink.”
“I’m talking about a crew, not a team.”
“There’s a difference?”
“Members of a team all work towards the same goal, although there can be different tasks. A crew unites members with diverse specialties to work together as a cohesive unit.” He steepled his fingers. “You’d be part of a three-man crew. One stays by the door while two work the room. You have a good eye for valuables.”
I pointed at his pocket. “That necklace was a test?”
“You’d be in charge. I have passkeys, maps of the rooms, floor plans of the hotels. Three-way split. You, me and them.”
I shook my head. “Three people triple the risk.”
“I forgot, you don’t like to take risks.” Mink grinned, but his eyes stayed dead. “Let me know if you change your mind.”
I left the bar, glad to be back in the sunlight again.
Martyn V. (aka Baron Sang Froid) wrote: "I don't have a formula, but I'm often praised by readers for my dialogue. Main thing is that I'm verbally skilled myself and I tend to have the sort of dry wit that is sometimes recognized, but doe..."Thanks, Martyn! There's a lot of helpful stuff there to think about and try out. Your dialogue is terrific -- crisp, real, gives you a good picture of the characters, and makes you want to read more. Point taken about verisimilitude -- read the blog post and am taking notes!
What you say about people not saying directly what they mean is very true, I need to work on that too. Thanks again!
You're welcome, Harini. If you check my blog, there are also some other blogs I follow because they often contain excellent advice. For instance, this blog by Elle Todd: https://elletodd.wordpress.com/2014/0...
These are my notes on dialogue. Hope they help.Fiction is real life condensed and highlighted by using only events relevant to the story.
Dialogue is essential to the rhythm of the story. A story filled with heavy narrative is less appealing than one which is broken by stretches of short (purposeful) conversational exchanges between characters.
Fiction dialogue is real life conversation without its general commentary and extraneous clutter (How are you? Fine. How are you? How many sugars in your tea? etc). Dialogue is the condensed essence of real life conversation.
In fiction every line must advance the story and dialogue must play its part by either revealing character or relationships between characters, indicating the setting, building up mood and atmosphere, conveying background information, or carrying the plot forward. But be careful when using dialogue to advance the plot. Readers can tell when characters talk about things they already know, or when the speakers appear to be having a conversation for our benefit. You never want one character to imply or say to the other, “Tell me again, Bruce: What are we doing next?” Dialogue should not spew information all over the page, it should sneak in facts so that the readers is almost unaware.
Too much irrelevant dialogue will slow the pace of the story. The reader should be fed just enough information to follow the action.
Each character should have a distinctive dialogue. The reader should be able to recognize who is speaking without the help of the dialogue tag. Dialogue can provide revealing glimpses into a character that cannot be supplied through description, such as a witty remark or thoughtful observation.
The dialogue should be balanced with gestures or actions, or reactions
Very interesting and thoughtful list, Jan, thanks so much! I specially like the bit about not having characters have a conversation for the readers' benefit. I wonder if I will ever get to a stage where I can do all this instinctively, like changing gears! An accomplished writer-friend of mine, Usha KR, always tells me not to 'use' the characters to say what I have to say, but rather let them express themselves. The dialogue should give the characters life and let them move ahead in their own way, not to advance your plot. I think that is advice worth remembering too.
Interesting and enjoyable thread - Thank you.
Honestly: I tried once and it was terrible :) Being able to get through the net is completely different than writing a good story in english. So I decided to stay at my mothers tonque.
E.n., glad you are enjoying the thread. Ole, you are funny! You should try your hand at humour in English. But actually, your comment very closely touches my own. I always have the feeling that my dialogue sounds artificial because English is not my mother tongue: this even though like many English-educated Indians I speak and think primarily in English. It just sounds different when it's written down. I try to write it with the same mix of Indian words that we use, but am still dissatisfied with the result. There are a few Indian writers, though, who have nailed it. Am trying to study them to see what they do, but it's hard to figure out, and harder still to find your own unique style. I've just finished a book, "Those Pricey Thakur Girls" by Anuja Chauhan, that has me green with envy and purple with admiration!
Harini,Your writing style and expression are lovely and enjoyable. Have you published any ebooks?
Thanks, E.n.! I'm sending you a message about my books.
Harini wrote: "I'm interested in how other non-native English speakers write dialogue in English. I know so many writers who get it right, and quite a few who don't. I'm a hit-or-miss case myself, and am unable t..."Watch English (British) soaps - best source of contemporary language
Alp wrote: "Watch English (British) soaps - best source of contemporary language."And if you want to spice up your language, watch a Malcolm Tucker swearfest on The Thick of It.
Thanks, Alp and Martyn. Your suggestions don't really help me, though. My problem is writing dialogue with an Indian flavour for Indians, especially children, who are as confused as I am about the vast variety of English we are exposed to, including Indian, British and American.
I watch the soaps to tune my ear to the language, tone, stress and intonation patterns - that helps with writing 'authentic' dialogue in English - I'm sorry, I guess I didn't understand your question.Alp
Harini,Maybe you could let your characters hash out some of the language confusion. It could be relatable and funny.
Harini wrote: "Thanks, Alp and Martyn. Your suggestions don't really help me, though. My problem is writing dialogue with an Indian flavour for Indians, especially children, who are as confused as I am about the ..."I like your blog.
You may have to interview or eavesdrop on dialogue to capture the core of the confusion.
E.n., that's what I've tried to do, to some extent, in 'The Smile of Vanuvati. My readers will have to tell me how far I succeeded. Since then I've been writing fantasy and haven't been worried by the problem of contemporary slang.Jane, thank you for your kind remarks. I recently read about 'character interviews' as a writing tool, and am trying to interview all my characters so as to get to know them better, specially how they speak. Yes, it's important to hear a lot of speech of the kind you want to reproduce. Unfortunately I don't know too many middle grade children. I guess more school visits are in order!
It's been quite difficult for me since english isn't my first language so I mainly write in spanish first and translate later by myself, but I usually watch and listen a lot of vlogs from youtubers to get a grasp of normal speaking.
